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So where are MMOs heading...

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  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 26,601Member Rare
    Originally posted by nethervoid
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by nethervoid
    To be honest MMOs are gradually heading toward a COD style game, which means they're fusing with lobby games. Which means they're basically going to become a thing of the past if this keeps up. Hell Neverwinter has more in common with D3 than it does UO, SWG, or EVE.

    Yeah .. and i would count that as a positive.

    How is this a positive? You want all MMOs to disappear? MMOs used to be about epic achievements in a world you could actually impact and see a physical affect on. If you don't like that then don't play them.

    No. I want new fun games. D3 is a fun game to me. NWO is also fun .... particularly because of the ARPG elements. So of course it is a positive.

    And how is one game going the direction of D3 means that MMO is disappearing?

    Oh, of course i don't play games i don't like. MMOs are about queuing up dungeons, and raids, and arenas now. Did you get the memo?

     

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 6,211Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ozmono
    Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
     

    When you start talking about world design (which I think is a pretty broad thing) and talking about pve and players devouring content I hope you have no idea where MMO's are heading. As far as I am concerned it's the wrong way of looking at it. Players providing content for each other just by playing the game (not via some foundry or anything like that) is where I hope it will go. Faction wars, politics, deeper economies etc, all potentially provide content that will never be able to be completely devoured.

     

    I'm not saying dynamic events or quality NPC interactions via good AI or voiceacting or whatever isn't important to me at all but I am saying that I hope by focusing on such things you will be proven to be way off base. I hope worlds are designed with the intent of players providing content for each other first. Ofcourse, what I hope and what will happen might be two different things.

    If you expect players to provide content for themselves you first need to have a solid game first. Something these "world oriented" MMOs have always struggled with without exception. For example, no player is going to fight any wars if combat is not fun.

    Ironically, combat tends to be far more entertaining in MMOs which do not focus on "the world" as much.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • nethervoidnethervoid xanex, CAPosts: 528Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by nethervoid
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by nethervoid
    To be honest MMOs are gradually heading toward a COD style game, which means they're fusing with lobby games. Which means they're basically going to become a thing of the past if this keeps up. Hell Neverwinter has more in common with D3 than it does UO, SWG, or EVE.

    Yeah .. and i would count that as a positive.

    How is this a positive? You want all MMOs to disappear? MMOs used to be about epic achievements in a world you could actually impact and see a physical affect on. If you don't like that then don't play them.

    No. I want new fun games. D3 is a fun game to me. NWO is also fun .... particularly because of the ARPG elements. So of course it is a positive.

    And how is one game going the direction of D3 means that MMO is disappearing?

    Oh, of course i don't play games i don't like. MMOs are about queuing up dungeons, and raids, and arenas now. Did you get the memo?

     

    Because when MMOs move toward lobby games MMOs disapear. Then all we have left are lobby games. The two are merging but the lobby game is not picking up any traditional MMO elements.

    Who is to blame? Mainly the industry for doing a money grab with the larger COD market. And now secondly the people who have come from lobby games want to further dilute MMOs to be more like lobbies.

    nethervoid - Est. '97
    [UO|EQ|SB|SWG|PS|HZ|EVE|NWN|WoW|VG|DF|SWTOR]
    13k subs YouTube Gaming channel

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member Common


    Originally posted by nethervoid
    Originally posted by nariusseldon Originally posted by nethervoid Originally posted by nariusseldon Originally posted by nethervoid To be honest MMOs are gradually heading toward a COD style game, which means they're fusing with lobby games. Which means they're basically going to become a thing of the past if this keeps up. Hell Neverwinter has more in common with D3 than it does UO, SWG, or EVE.
    Yeah .. and i would count that as a positive.
    How is this a positive? You want all MMOs to disappear? MMOs used to be about epic achievements in a world you could actually impact and see a physical affect on. If you don't like that then don't play them.
    No. I want new fun games. D3 is a fun game to me. NWO is also fun .... particularly because of the ARPG elements. So of course it is a positive. And how is one game going the direction of D3 means that MMO is disappearing? Oh, of course i don't play games i don't like. MMOs are about queuing up dungeons, and raids, and arenas now. Did you get the memo?  
    Because when MMOs move toward lobby games MMOs disapear. Then all we have left are lobby games. The two are merging but the lobby game is not picking up any traditional MMO elements.

    Who is to blame? Mainly the industry for doing a money grab with the larger COD market. And now secondly the people who have come from lobby games want to further dilute MMOs to be more like lobbies.




    That's the same faulty logic that leads to thinking that blonds or redheads are dying out. Blonds are not going to disappear, and neither are red heads. MMOs will not disappear.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 26,601Member Rare
    Originally posted by nethervoid
     

    Because when MMOs move toward lobby games MMOs disapear. Then all we have left are lobby games. The two are merging but the lobby game is not picking up any traditional MMO elements.

    Who is to blame? Mainly the industry for doing a money grab with the larger COD market. And now secondly the people who have come from lobby games want to further dilute MMOs to be more like lobbies.

    "blame"? You blame companies to fill a demand? You blame people playing games the way they want? They are doing exactly what they are supposed to in a free market.

    Why would lobby games be picking up traditional MMO elements? Do these elements make the game more fun for most of the players?

    I don't think there is anything to blame here. No one says traditional MMO needs to survive in the market place. It is survival of the financially fittest.

     

     

  • GreyfaceGreyface Detroit, MIPosts: 390Member

    Like everything else, MMOs are fragmenting.

    WoW is bleeding subscribers with no heir apparent.  The initial failure of SWToR (and TSW to a lesser extent) is already scaring publishers away from big budget subscription themeparks.  If TESO flops, it'll be the last nail in that particular coffin  I think you'll see this genre go in three different directions: 

    1. Big-budget, lobby-based action games that owe more to Diablo than EQ.  I expect these games to largely be b2p with micro-transactions, and to move away from PC toward PS4 and Xbox 1.  The next Halo will be an MMO.  

    2. F2P games that are actually developed as F2P games, rather than retrofits of failed subscription titles.  Most of it will be shovelware, but not all.  These games will stay on PC because consoles are banned in China.

    3. Niche indies. These will stay on PC and will probably keep some version of the subscription model alive.  Crowdfunding, cheap bandwidth, and cloud computing make lower-budget MMOs feasible.  These games will be targeted to very specific groups of players (RPers, PvPers, etc) and won't need 1 million subscribers to survive.  The next EVE will come from this group of games, and a lot of notable flops.

  • nethervoidnethervoid xanex, CAPosts: 528Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by nethervoid
     

    Because when MMOs move toward lobby games MMOs disapear. Then all we have left are lobby games. The two are merging but the lobby game is not picking up any traditional MMO elements.

    Who is to blame? Mainly the industry for doing a money grab with the larger COD market. And now secondly the people who have come from lobby games want to further dilute MMOs to be more like lobbies.

    "blame"? You blame companies to fill a demand? You blame people playing games the way they want? They are doing exactly what they are supposed to in a free market.

    Why would lobby games be picking up traditional MMO elements? Do these elements make the game more fun for most of the players?

    I don't think there is anything to blame here. No one says traditional MMO needs to survive in the market place. It is survival of the financially fittest.

     

     

    I guess my question to you would then be why are you on a site dedicated to MMOs if you like lobby games? Is there no Lobby.com?

    nethervoid - Est. '97
    [UO|EQ|SB|SWG|PS|HZ|EVE|NWN|WoW|VG|DF|SWTOR]
    13k subs YouTube Gaming channel

  • Beatnik59Beatnik59 Chicago, ILPosts: 2,376Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Greyface
    Like everything else, MMOs are fragmenting. WoW is bleeding subscribers with no heir apparent.  The initial failure of SWToR (and TSW to a lesser extent) is already scaring publishers away from big budget subscription themeparks.  If TESO flops, it'll be the last nail in that particular coffin  I think you'll see this genre go in three different directions:  1. Big-budget, lobby-based action games that owe more to Diablo than EQ.  I expect these games to largely be b2p with micro-transactions, and to move away from PC toward PS4 and Xbox 1.  The next Halo will be an MMO.   2. F2P games that are actually developed as F2P games, rather than retrofits of failed subscription titles.  Most of it will be shovelware, but not all.  These games will stay on PC because consoles are banned in China. 3. Niche indies. These will stay on PC and will probably keep some version of the subscription model alive.  Crowdfunding, cheap bandwidth, and cloud computing make lower-budget MMOs feasible.  These games will be targeted to very specific groups of players (RPers, PvPers, etc) and won't need 1 million subscribers to survive.  The next EVE will come from this group of games, and a lot of notable flops.

    I tend to agree with most of this prediction.

    I also predict a round of cancellations in the next few years, specifically for games on the margins.

    __________________________
    "Its sad when people use religion to feel superior, its even worse to see people using a video game to do it."
    --Arcken

    "...when it comes to pimping EVE I have little restraints."
    --Hellmar, CEO of CCP.

    "It's like they took a gun, put it to their nugget sack and pulled the trigger over and over again, each time telling us how great it was that they were shooting themselves in the balls."
    --Exar_Kun on SWG's NGE

  • skyexileskyexile MelbournePosts: 692Member Common

    Soon we will all be playing free to play lobby based, MMO's fully integrated with facebook for the social communication aspects of them. Developers will still try to include more "action" or "modern combat" features into their game to be more "innovative" but at the end of the day they will no doubt be dashes for cash where they try to appeal to as wide of an audience as possible and the games will continue to be easy and boring button mashes, with very little content as they're designed for casual audiences.

    Id honestly rather play a holy trinity asian grinder than any of the turds that have been pushed out recently.

    SKYeXile
    TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
    Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

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