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[Column] Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn: Dungeons in Final Fantasy XIV

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Comments

  • NaughtyPNaughtyP Edmonton, ABPosts: 793Member
    Originally posted by Ryahl
    Originally posted by NaughtyP

    I am going to probably get flamed for this, but I take issue with games that still design their content delivery this way:

    "While the outdoor game is, at least in beta, a very soloable experience, the dungeons require teammates working together."

    There is something fundamentally wrong with designing a multiplayer game that is predominantly solo content and only promotes working together when you want to do a dungeon. This kind of content delivery is what I expect from a 2001 game, not a 2013 game.

    Sorry. I get that a lot of people still want this, but to me it's... uninspired.

    I'm on the record (over at Eorzea) as agreeing with your sentiment.  I'd rather not see a soloable outdoor world with the dangerous stuff tucked into corners.

    I'd rather see a dangerous outdoor world with plenty of soloable stuff tucked into corners (city missions, etc.).

    But, I think your timeline is backwards.  A group oriented outdoor world is circa 2001... a soloable world is everything post 2008.

    To me, it's not even really about danger, it's about lack of community-building options/tools/gameplay. If the only reason I have to interact with someone is to destroy the hell out of some monsters minding their own business in a cave way off to the side... well it's kind of self-explanatory, is it not? It seems like a very dated way of getting me to interact with others.

    Enter a whole new realm of challenge and adventure.

  • nbtscannbtscan Phoenix, AZPosts: 774Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by BadSpock

    Did I read right that there will be a down ranking system?

    Hopefully they add some incentive for higher-level players down ranking to help out lowbies do runs like this.

    Nothing major, maybe something like increased gil ($) for the high level toon helping guildies/friends/randoms through the lowbie dungeon.

    There will be a level sync mechanic for dungeons and FATEs.  This is mostly for xp gain purposes.  If you're too high level for whatever content you're tackling, you won't gain xp for it, and in turn, those in your dungeon or FATE group will not either.  Level sync will scale your class level and your gear stats down to a level within the bounds of the content you're participating in.  It won't be like GW2 where if you go back to the starter area as a max level that you get capped down.  It only pertains to dungeons and FATEs.

     

    With the exception of dungeons formed from their content finder system, from what I gather you'll be able to still participate in the content without level sync if you choose to do so.  If you want to go into a lowbie dungeon with a few of your level 50 friends and smoke the place to get some gear for one of your lower level classes you'll have that option.  You can still participate in a FATE higher level than the content recommends, however you won't get the associated rewards.  It sounds like they're making level sync mandatory for content finder matched dungeons because dungeons are a primary source of xp in the game, so they don't want folks queuing up with a high level jobs and sapping everyone's xp.

  • NaughtyPNaughtyP Edmonton, ABPosts: 793Member
    Originally posted by nomad440

    to NaughtyP, I Agree with the point you make about 'Solo", but, also bear in mind that the FF "purists" that have stayed away from previous Final Fantasy MMO's, now also have an option. Having said that, in your defense (in the hopes of halting a flame war NOW), therein lie your choices.

    In addition, I'll ask you 1 question: What usually happens during the first 30 -240 min in a regular FF game? Answer that, and you'll have your "Solo" question answered, and your mind put at ease ^-^

     

    Considering my avatar is the box of FF1, I know full well what a single-player FF experience is!!! But I recognize that MMO and single-player are different types of games. The point I am trying to make is that watering down group content in favor of more solo gameplay simply detracts from the overall quality of a game. A healthy mix is needed, and group content solely built around combat provides little variety.

    Honestly, I'm not trying to pick of FF XIV. I love the franchise. It's just that I expect at some point the formula that we are seeing for MMOs will need to change because I can't see it working forever.

    Enter a whole new realm of challenge and adventure.

  • AldersAlders Jack Burton'sPosts: 1,857Member Uncommon
    Didn't like time restrictions on certain instances in XI and i don't like em here.  I understand why they had them in XI since players had to actually wait on other groups to finish certain instances (sounds crazy thinking back now), but there's no reason to have them in XIV.
  • WolfenprideWolfenpride San''doria, WIPosts: 3,988Member
    Originally posted by NaughtyP

    I am going to probably get flamed for this, but I take issue with games that still design their content delivery this way:

    "While the outdoor game is, at least in beta, a very soloable experience, the dungeons require teammates working together."

    There is something fundamentally wrong with designing a multiplayer game that is predominantly solo content and only promotes working together when you want to do a dungeon. This kind of content delivery is what I expect from a 2001 game, not a 2013 game.

    Sorry. I get that a lot of people still want this, but to me it's... uninspired.

    I feel ya. One instance every couple of levels to grind over and over again is just a sad excuse for group content in what is supposedly a multiplayer game. FFXIV ain't the first or last offender though, so I guess that's for another thread.

  • MuruganMurugan D, COPosts: 1,494Member
    Originally posted by Wolfenpride
    Originally posted by NaughtyP

    I am going to probably get flamed for this, but I take issue with games that still design their content delivery this way:

    "While the outdoor game is, at least in beta, a very soloable experience, the dungeons require teammates working together."

    There is something fundamentally wrong with designing a multiplayer game that is predominantly solo content and only promotes working together when you want to do a dungeon. This kind of content delivery is what I expect from a 2001 game, not a 2013 game.

    Sorry. I get that a lot of people still want this, but to me it's... uninspired.

    I feel ya. One instance every couple of levels to grind over and over again is just a sad excuse for group content in what is supposedly a multiplayer game. FFXIV ain't the first or last offender though, so I guess that's for another thread.

    We'll have to see how the new guildhest system introduces new (presumably phased) group content to open world.

  • rommellorommello calgary, ABPosts: 185Member

    the content is good, other than that the only awesome thing about this game is the engine which i hope they sell to other mmo developers coz i was amazed at the low performance cost of top notch graphics in this engine it was quite something

     

    but thats about it, i cud not tolerate tab tab tab 12345 click 12345 more tab & 12345

    sorry but near 30 levels of this in phase 1 was all i cud take

    hallo ~_~

  • ZizouXZizouX Burbank, CAPosts: 670Member
    Originally posted by Wolfenpride
    Originally posted by NaughtyP

    I am going to probably get flamed for this, but I take issue with games that still design their content delivery this way:

    "While the outdoor game is, at least in beta, a very soloable experience, the dungeons require teammates working together."

    There is something fundamentally wrong with designing a multiplayer game that is predominantly solo content and only promotes working together when you want to do a dungeon. This kind of content delivery is what I expect from a 2001 game, not a 2013 game.

    Sorry. I get that a lot of people still want this, but to me it's... uninspired.

    I feel ya. One instance every couple of levels to grind over and over again is just a sad excuse for group content in what is supposedly a multiplayer game. FFXIV ain't the first or last offender though, so I guess that's for another thread.

    There is going to be 16-18 dungeons AT RELEASE.

    Other group content will include, PvP battlegrounds and arena type... guildhests, primals, raids, group oriented FATES, group oriented Leves...

     

    There's going to be A LOT at launch....

  • drivendawndrivendawn montgomery, ALPosts: 1,240Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ZizouX
    Originally posted by Wolfenpride
    Originally posted by NaughtyP

    I am going to probably get flamed for this, but I take issue with games that still design their content delivery this way:

    "While the outdoor game is, at least in beta, a very soloable experience, the dungeons require teammates working together."

    There is something fundamentally wrong with designing a multiplayer game that is predominantly solo content and only promotes working together when you want to do a dungeon. This kind of content delivery is what I expect from a 2001 game, not a 2013 game.

    Sorry. I get that a lot of people still want this, but to me it's... uninspired.

    I feel ya. One instance every couple of levels to grind over and over again is just a sad excuse for group content in what is supposedly a multiplayer game. FFXIV ain't the first or last offender though, so I guess that's for another thread.

    There is going to be 16-18 dungeons AT RELEASE.

    Other group content will include, PvP battlegrounds and arena type... guildhests, primals, raids, group oriented FATES, group oriented Leves...

     

    There's going to be A LOT at launch....

    This ^ ^ ^  There will be plenty of group content not just dungeons. I am glad they are givng a balance of group and solo options.

  • Aldous.HuxleyAldous.Huxley Monticello, MNPosts: 418Member
    *Drool...
  • NobleNerdNobleNerd Wolcott, NYPosts: 671Member Uncommon
      I enjoyed your review. I have played through beta myself and many of your thoughts on the game are close to mine. One thing that can be mentioned is that the game pad functionality is by far the best I have seen in any game... mmo or otherwise! You can become quite fluid with it and as a long time caster/healer in almsot every mmo since FFXI I can say I was more than impressed with it's functionality!!! I healed that dungeon with ease using the game pad the whole time. They need an award for this feature alone. It has taken way too long to actually have someone figure a way to do this in an mmo.

    image

  • VorthanionVorthanion Laguna Vista, TXPosts: 2,117Member Uncommon
    Is this going to be yet another modern MMO with no public dungeons at all?  I understand the appeal of instancing, I don't understand the need to make everything instanced.

    image
  • RyahlRyahl Houston Metro, TXPosts: 47Member
    Originally posted by Xepo
      I enjoyed your review. I have played through beta myself and many of your thoughts on the game are close to mine. One thing that can be mentioned is that the game pad functionality is by far the best I have seen in any game... mmo or otherwise! You can become quite fluid with it and as a long time caster/healer in almsot every mmo since FFXI I can say I was more than impressed with it's functionality!!! I healed that dungeon with ease using the game pad the whole time. They need an award for this feature alone. It has taken way too long to actually have someone figure a way to do this in an mmo.

    You really have to give some praise to Square-Enix for designing separate UI's for the keyboard/mouse and controller groups. Neither player-type is being shoe-horned into the other ones UI.

    Ryahl - writer of eye-bleeders
    FFXIV Fansite | TSWGuides
    Follow me on Twitter

  • Br3akingDawnBr3akingDawn a City, CAPosts: 1,356Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Alders
    Didn't like time restrictions on certain instances in XI and i don't like em here.  I understand why they had them in XI since players had to actually wait on other groups to finish certain instances (sounds crazy thinking back now), but there's no reason to have them in XIV.

    uh maybe because the instanced server were full?? I think even big games like WoW back in the days have ques for dungeons because it was full.

    image

  • HeadseedHeadseed Santa Rosa, CAPosts: 1Member
    I believe that dungeon timers will stay but there will be no more speed run bonuses
  • RaxeonRaxeon cedar falls, IAPosts: 2,088Member Uncommon
    ending the nda at the start of phase 3 would be a bad idea maybe after a week or so in after any issues with the mass amount f content being added is fixed
  • RaxeonRaxeon cedar falls, IAPosts: 2,088Member Uncommon
    rom they are making combat changes for pahse 3 what we had in1 and 2 pahse wasnt the full combat system 
  • RazeeksterRazeekster Solon, MEPosts: 2,201Member Uncommon
    I actually loved the timers. They provided challenge and my party never found a problem finishing in time and finding and collecting all the chests. It looks like gamer's want to once again, take out the challenging aspects out of an MMO and make it a soulless copy-cat of every other themepark out there.

    Smile

  • MagiknightMagiknight McKinleyville, CAPosts: 782Member

    I quit reading when I read "instance."

     

  • MagiknightMagiknight McKinleyville, CAPosts: 782Member
    Yep
  • drivendawndrivendawn montgomery, ALPosts: 1,240Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Magiknight

    I quit reading when I read "instance."

     

     

    Oh well some people won't like it, hope you find a game that pleases you. ^.^

  • MagiknightMagiknight McKinleyville, CAPosts: 782Member
    Originally posted by drivendawn
    Originally posted by Magiknight

    I quit reading when I read "instance."

     

     

    Oh well some people won't like it, hope you find a game that pleases you. ^.^

    I'm trying.

  • MaquiameMaquiame Posts: 794Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Razeekster
    I actually loved the timers. They provided challenge and my party never found a problem finishing in time and finding and collecting all the chests. It looks like gamer's want to once again, take out the challenging aspects out of an MMO and make it a soulless copy-cat of every other themepark out there.

    I totally agree with this I hope they are at least put there for hard mode dungeon runs. Leaving regular runs without them. Personally I like them a lot. With the strategy of FFXIV battles they make total sense and make gamers better gamers. Should they be there for normal mode dungeon runs? No but they should be there for hard mode runs if you wish to choose them. Perhaps a voting system ala GW2/TOR?

    I also want to see loot associated with them based on different parameters, I mean why not? It doesn't have to be anything game breaking but why not a piece of material, some special dyes, or cosmetic gear or two? I don't see the problem.

    Kids stop trying to make these games so damn easy...please. Challenges like this help you learn how to play the game better, run these with friends and you will be fine.

    Good lord I could only imagine some of you playing the original FF or the first Legend of Zelda. Videogame players used to welcome challenges its like now they run away from them.

     

    And yes I love level scaling, running through grey mob areas sucks and makes no sense from a world perspective.

    When did videogame players become so squishy?

    image

    Any mmo worth its salt should be like a good prostitute when it comes to its game world- One hell of a faker, and a damn good shaker!

  • VesaviusVesavius BristolPosts: 7,636Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by NaughtyP

    I am going to probably get flamed for this, but I take issue with games that still design their content delivery this way:

    "While the outdoor game is, at least in beta, a very soloable experience, the dungeons require teammates working together."

    There is something fundamentally wrong with designing a multiplayer game that is predominantly solo content and only promotes working together when you want to do a dungeon. This kind of content delivery is what I expect from a 2001 game, not a 2013 game.

    Sorry. I get that a lot of people still want this, but to me it's... uninspired.

     

    I would actually say the opposite and that the solo/ group design they have now is very 'now' and open world grouping is very 2001 (ish).

     

    Not saying 'now' is better or anything, I don't believe it is personally with regards to these games, but FFXIV is doing what it needs to do to succeed with a broad modern audience. It's not uninspired, it's practical and necessary.

    Would I have it another way? Sure, I would prefer loads more group orientated content, but I think this game is good enough for me to still really enjoy it.

     

  • XandramasXandramas Scottsdale, AZPosts: 73Member
    A good counter for timers is to increase mobs in the dungeon as time progresses. Its a passive timer that will cause the dungeon to become too dangerous if the dungeon runners take too long. Maybe start sending no xp enemies from the boss room through the dungeons in search of the party.
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