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Off-Hours sieging: Part of the game or just lame?

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  • CaldrinCaldrin Member UncommonPosts: 4,505

    At the end of the day in Darkfall 1 we had siege protection shards that pushed the time of the siege back by a good few hours.. This was the perfect solution.. sure it cost gold but at least the defender could have some say in when the siege happened.

    They need to bring this back in... but saying that late night sieges hardly ever happened and if it did clans usually hired some mercs to help instead job done.

     

    its part of the game adapt..

  • linksalulinksalu Member Posts: 38
    Originally posted by zymurgeist
    Ultimately it's not  a question of realism or fairness. It's a factor of population. People put considerable time and effort into cities and they want a reasonable chance of defending them. Having lost a city under conditions they consider unsporting they often quit. The standard reply is a game is better off without them but no PvP game is better off with a sparse population.  

    I think this about sums it up. And going off Robo's suggestion, I think a slider is a good suggestion, but nothing excessive. 3 hours sounds pretty even. Let the attacker give the time they want to do, ie 3 am, and the defender can shift it to midnight if they want. 9 PM sieges can turn to 6 PM or midnight or stay at 9 PM, etc. A system like that would lend itself to more 'prime-time' sieges, imo.

    Originally posted by geldonyetich

    Wow, I knew you guys were pretty desparate to slam the game, but hacking the web page of a major game site so a user review masquarades as an official one? Pretty impressive.

    [Edit: no, after seeing there's an actual video associated with it, I guess not, despite the wierd way GameSpot distributes its content making it looks like the reviewer didn't even write this.]

  • DihoruDihoru Member Posts: 2,731
    Originally posted by linksalu
    Originally posted by zymurgeist
    Ultimately it's not  a question of realism or fairness. It's a factor of population. People put considerable time and effort into cities and they want a reasonable chance of defending them. Having lost a city under conditions they consider unsporting they often quit. The standard reply is a game is better off without them but no PvP game is better off with a sparse population.  

    I think this about sums it up. And going off Robo's suggestion, I think a slider is a good suggestion, but nothing excessive. 3 hours sounds pretty even. Let the attacker give the time they want to do, ie 3 am, and the defender can shift it to midnight if they want. 9 PM sieges can turn to 6 PM or midnight or stay at 9 PM, etc. A system like that would lend itself to more 'prime-time' sieges, imo.

    -facepalms- in EVE people, goonswarm chief among them, used that sort of system to troll people pretty hard during old sov system war days... in EVE a pos has a limited amount of reinforcement fuel, a pos hits reinforced mode after its HP drops to a certain point, at which point it enters reinforced mode and starts chugging its fuel, you can tweak the fuel amounts to have x number of hours up to a maximum of y and goonswarm would use spies to determine their adversaries standard fuel levels and use mercs (if need be) to reinforce the POSes such that they came out of reinforcement mode in the worse possible time for their enemies... the same will happen here I can vouch for that personally ergo people should buck up, make friends with people around the world so they don't sleep on the job the next day.

    image
  • linksalulinksalu Member Posts: 38
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    Originally posted by linksalu
    Originally posted by zymurgeist
    Ultimately it's not  a question of realism or fairness. It's a factor of population. People put considerable time and effort into cities and they want a reasonable chance of defending them. Having lost a city under conditions they consider unsporting they often quit. The standard reply is a game is better off without them but no PvP game is better off with a sparse population.  

    I think this about sums it up. And going off Robo's suggestion, I think a slider is a good suggestion, but nothing excessive. 3 hours sounds pretty even. Let the attacker give the time they want to do, ie 3 am, and the defender can shift it to midnight if they want. 9 PM sieges can turn to 6 PM or midnight or stay at 9 PM, etc. A system like that would lend itself to more 'prime-time' sieges, imo.

    -facepalms- in EVE people, goonswarm chief among them, used that sort of system to troll people pretty hard during old sov system war days... in EVE a pos has a limited amount of reinforcement fuel, a pos hits reinforced mode after its HP drops to a certain point, at which point it enters reinforced mode and starts chugging its fuel, you can tweak the fuel amounts to have x number of hours up to a maximum of y and goonswarm would use spies to determine their adversaries standard fuel levels and use mercs (if need be) to reinforce the POSes such that they came out of reinforcement mode in the worse possible time for their enemies... the same will happen here I can vouch for that personally ergo people should buck up, make friends with people around the world so they don't sleep on the job the next day.

    Oh, I wasn't saying that it should be a secret. There should be a window that the defender gets to adjust the time, and after that window, it's locked in. Everyone could see what time the siege was going to be. I don't think that part should change. Anyway, just a suggestion! Maybe there's a better idea out there.

    Originally posted by geldonyetich

    Wow, I knew you guys were pretty desparate to slam the game, but hacking the web page of a major game site so a user review masquarades as an official one? Pretty impressive.

    [Edit: no, after seeing there's an actual video associated with it, I guess not, despite the wierd way GameSpot distributes its content making it looks like the reviewer didn't even write this.]

  • BrownAleBrownAle Member Posts: 399
    Originally posted by Zooce
    If AV wants to reach a wider audience I suggest they limit siege vulnerability windows during the work-week.

     

    This makes no sense.  Whos time zone are you going to favor in limiting when people siege?  This will widen the games audience?  You do realize that there is a huge time zone difference on each server right?  Aussies have to play on the NA server for example.

     

     

    Naive comment.

     

     

    Someone sieges you at 3am on the weekday either hire an EU/OZ clan to defend (they exist on the NA server btw) or just take it back the next day.  Sieges are a big part of the game, if you are trying to avoid them then your doing DF wrong.

     

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,947
    Originally posted by BrownAle

    Originally posted by Zooce
    If AV wants to reach a wider audience I suggest they limit siege vulnerability windows during the work-week.

     

    This makes no sense.  Whos time zone are you going to favor in limiting when people siege?  This will widen the games audience?  You do realize that there is a huge time zone difference on each server right?  Aussies have to play on the NA server for example.

     

     

    Naive comment.

     

     

    Someone sieges you at 3am on the weekday either hire an EU/OZ clan to defend (they exist on the NA server btw) or just take it back the next day.  Sieges are a big part of the game, if you are trying to avoid them then your doing DF wrong.

     

     

    Its an NA server so those are the times the game should accommodate. The point is not to have someone ELSE fight for you but to do it yourself. Also you cannot "siege it back the next day" due to timers and lockout mechanics already in game.

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  • LahuzerLahuzer Member UncommonPosts: 782
    As irritating/lame as I think it is to get sieged at night, I think it belongs to a sandbox that it can happen at any time. So to me it's part of the game and should be as it is.
  • DihoruDihoru Member Posts: 2,731
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Originally posted by BrownAle
    Originally posted by Zooce
    If AV wants to reach a wider audience I suggest they limit siege vulnerability windows during the work-week.

     

    This makes no sense.  Whos time zone are you going to favor in limiting when people siege?  This will widen the games audience?  You do realize that there is a huge time zone difference on each server right?  Aussies have to play on the NA server for example.0

     

     

    Naive comment.

     

     

    Someone sieges you at 3am on the weekday either hire an EU/OZ clan to defend (they exist on the NA server btw) or just take it back the next day.  Sieges are a big part of the game, if you are trying to avoid them then your doing DF wrong.

     

     

    Its an NA server so those are the times the game should accommodate. The point is not to have someone ELSE fight for you but to do it yourself. Also you cannot "siege it back the next day" due to timers and lockout mechanics already in game.

    If the NA server is catering to a global audience then you're gonna get UTC +0 and by the sound of things the server is multinational not only NA due to a myriad of reasons (some of which aren't "EU TURDS COMING TO MAH SERVER AND TAKIN MAH JOB!!" but down to better pings and better playability, if the people who aren't from NA outnumber those who are then the server should cater to them, not you).

    image
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,947
    Originally posted by Dihoru
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Originally posted by BrownAle
    Originally posted by Zooce
    If AV wants to reach a wider audience I suggest they limit siege vulnerability windows during the work-week.

     

    This makes no sense.  Whos time zone are you going to favor in limiting when people siege?  This will widen the games audience?  You do realize that there is a huge time zone difference on each server right?  Aussies have to play on the NA server for example.0

     

     

    Naive comment.

     

     

    Someone sieges you at 3am on the weekday either hire an EU/OZ clan to defend (they exist on the NA server btw) or just take it back the next day.  Sieges are a big part of the game, if you are trying to avoid them then your doing DF wrong.

     

     

    Its an NA server so those are the times the game should accommodate. The point is not to have someone ELSE fight for you but to do it yourself. Also you cannot "siege it back the next day" due to timers and lockout mechanics already in game.

    If the NA server is catering to a global audience then you're gonna get UTC +0 and by the sound of things the server is multinational not only NA due to a myriad of reasons (some of which aren't "EU TURDS COMING TO MAH SERVER AND TAKIN MAH JOB!!" but down to better pings and better playability, if the people who aren't from NA outnumber those who are then the server should cater to them, not you).

    It's called the NORTH AMERICA server.  If the people who aren't from NA outnumber those who are... then the server should be somewhere else or there should be a new server for them.  That is not even remotely the situation though.

     

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

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  • sacredfoolsacredfool Member UncommonPosts: 849

    Give the siege stone some HP. Allow the defenders to make "counter attacks" every 4 hours that can lower it's HP by 34%. You need 3 successful counter attacks to destroy the siege stone.

     

    I totally did not steal the idea from EVE.


    Originally posted by nethaniah

    Seriously Farmville? Yeah I think it's great. In a World where half our population is dying of hunger the more fortunate half is spending their time harvesting food that doesn't exist.


  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,947

    Woohoo.. looks like Av is going to implement the idea I mentioned earlier in the thread to use Dominion points to help prevent off-hour sieges.

     

    From the May 10th update:

    More uses for Dominion / Increasing Holding importance: Player consensus is that there are not enough ways to spend Dominion and we agree. We will introduce ways to consume Dominion on Clan City upkeep, Guard tower special options and effects, holding siege protection timers, and maybe even on clan member boosters.
     

     

    NICE!

     

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

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  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Member CommonPosts: 10,910


    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Woohoo.. looks like Av is going to implement the idea I mentioned earlier in the thread to use Dominion points to help prevent off-hour sieges. From the May 10th update:More uses for Dominion / Increasing Holding importance: Player consensus is that there are not enough ways to spend Dominion and we agree. We will introduce ways to consume Dominion on Clan City upkeep, Guard tower special options and effects, holding siege protection timers, and maybe even on clan member boosters.  NICE! 

    I like this solution better than some of the others because it allows the players to build up a defense that works when players are offline, rather than just arbitrarily making keeps safe.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 16,947
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     


    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Woohoo.. looks like Av is going to implement the idea I mentioned earlier in the thread to use Dominion points to help prevent off-hour sieges.

     

     

    From the May 10th update:

    More uses for Dominion / Increasing Holding importance: Player consensus is that there are not enough ways to spend Dominion and we agree. We will introduce ways to consume Dominion on Clan City upkeep, Guard tower special options and effects, holding siege protection timers, and maybe even on clan member boosters. 

     

    NICE!

     

     



    I like this solution better than some of the others because it allows the players to build up a defense that works when players are offline, rather than just arbitrarily making keeps safe.

     

    It also requires that Clans WORK for their protection.  They will need the dominion points for city upkeep, guard towers and siege timers.   Not thrilled with the clan member booster idea, but other than that I really love the update as it will settle the whole off-hours siege issues in a fair and reasonable way.

     

    All time classic  MY NEW FAVORITE POST!  (Keep laying those bricks)

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    Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018

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  • KyleranKyleran Member LegendaryPosts: 43,435
    Originally posted by Robokapp
    Originally posted by linksalu

    but I couldn't be on for the actual siege at 3am...sorry, I have work.

    at 3am ? unlikely...

     

    since you knew 20 hours in advance, you could employ a combo between the "afternoon nap" and the "alarm clock".

     

    it would've worked fine and you could've done the siege and be at work on time if you really cared about your guild/clan/whatever.

     

    as assholish as this sounds, I run into your problem all the time in Eve. And I don't blame the game for it. I know it's my life choices that are getting in the way. If you can't accept this, perhaps Lego Universe might provide a more appropriate sandbox experience.

    Er, yeah, not sure those real life choices are really choices, have to work, have to sleep, have to keep the family happy, but like you said, that's not the game's fault, just the way it is.

    Which is why though I love EVE and played it almost 4 years I'm pretty much done unless I win the lottery or retire.  (will it still be around in 9 years, maybe?)

    In EVE you solve the problem by forming multi-region alliances so there is always someone to defend, but I always hated having to log (or be at work) when the best battles were on the schedule.

     

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  • NevulusNevulus Member UncommonPosts: 1,288
    Have you been to the EU server? It's a ghost town. I know a lot of oceanic players who playing on NA server, as well as Europeans who play on NA server.
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