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A true compromise on 30 day subscriptions.

OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member

Here's my idea.

You buy a 30 day sub.

You login.

You have 30 "tokens" on your login/character screen.

You click the tokens and one is used.

You now have 24 hours to play with that one token, logging in/out as many times as need throughout that 24 hours.

Can't play tomorrow? No prob, your remaining 29 days are waiting for whenever you want to use them.

At $15 per 30days of tokens, you are spending $.50 for each 24 hour block.

You get all the benefits of the subscription, without feeling you've "lost" your money by only playing a few hours a week.

EA CEO John Riccitiello's on future microtransactions: "When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging."

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Comments

  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Nevada, MOPosts: 2,732Member
    Sign me up.

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member
    Well, I figure the biggest reason people, especially casual players, give for preferring "F2P" to subs is not having time to get a good enough return on their $15 investment. So I figured this would be a great compromise for that. It changes nothing for the player who plays every day of the month ( still paying that $15 a month for access to everything ) while making things more palatable for those who only have time to play a few hours a day or only on weekends, or whatever.

    EA CEO John Riccitiello's on future microtransactions: "When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging."

  • silvermembersilvermember saint paul, MNPosts: 531Member

    how is that different from a sub? 

    The reason F2p and b2p exist is because a lot of players believe most MMO are not worth a sub. What you are suggesting is simply fixing a symptom of a much bigger problem. It still doesn't change the fact that I have to buy the game and keep paying money for it. The most important thing for me, is that if I don't feel playing I lose access to my character, while in other models I can still reasonably play with no issues.

    Also your token model, sucks because that means people will feel the need to play in other to maximize their tokens, but I suppose that is more of a personal problem.

    added: with your model, i still have to buy game+ pay sub or token+pay expansion. how it is any different from having to buy game+pay sub+ expansion? Ultimately, your suggestion doesn't really fix anything or offer any suggestions that will benefit the majority of MMORPG which is not the same as the population that post on forums like these. All it does is make people that stupidly think a sub AUTOMATICALLY makes a game better or people that have an irrational hatred of f2p, happy.

     

    td;dr

    You suggestion doesn't fix or even understand the reason sub games are not popular and it is simply most MMORPG are not worth their subs. 

  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member
    Originally posted by silvermember

    how is that different from a sub? 

    The reason F2p and b2p exist is because a lot of players believe most MMO are not worth a sub. What you are suggesting is simply fixing a symptom of a much bigger problem. It still doesn't change the fact that I have to buy the game and keep paying money for it. The most important thing for me, is that if I don't feel playing I lose access to my character, while in other models I can still reasonably play with no issues.

    Also your token model, sucks because that means people will feel the need to play in other to maximize their tokens, but I suppose that is more of a personal problem.

    What the hell are you talking about? Those tokens never expire, you paid for them. You don't feel like playing, you haven't lost anything because THE TOKENS/TIME IS STILL THERE FOR WHEN YOU DO FEEL LIKE PLAYING. You haven't "lost access" to anything.

     

    td;dr

    You suggestion doesn't fix or even understand the reason sub games are not popular and it is simply most MMORPG are not worth their subs. 

    Every mmo has a beta and a free trial. If you end up paying for a game that "isn't worth a sub" to you, that's your fault.

    All you've said is you don't like paying money for things that cost money. You haven't invalidated anything I said or proven my idea "sucks" in any way.

    EA CEO John Riccitiello's on future microtransactions: "When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging."

  • bubalubabubaluba LjubljanaPosts: 434Member
    Awesome idea :)
  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Yes that would be great.

    Pay per day

    Let's you play a few mmos at once too, everyone's a winner.
  • AeliousAelious Portland, ORPosts: 2,854Member Uncommon
    Great idea and I just got that iconic collect call message "please insert two dollars to continue this call" hehe.

    I do believe that there would still be a cash shop tied in but anything that gives people flexibility while allowing the devs to keep the lights on works. You could even trade them like PLEX and Khrono
  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Silver
    Because there's not one mmo to rule them all.

    With this proposed system.

    I could play a mmo that's good at pvp 4 days a week
    And a mmo that's good at pve 1 or 2 days a week.

    With a sub I'm not going to pay a sub for a game I only play once a month.

    With a cash shop setup I keep getting oined to buy shit that I need to play like bags or whatever.

    Ops idea is really bloody good I like it.
  • ZeymereZeymere Somewhere, VAPosts: 203Member Uncommon

    At first I agree, this sounds like an awesome Idea.  But...

    Most games are moving towards things happening while you are gone/not playing, like auctions, sending your people out while you are away, EVE lets you skill up in Real Time.  I am sure there are more issues like this.  Any thoughts on how those would be handled?

    Z.

  • SeelinnikoiSeelinnikoi LONDONPosts: 661Member Uncommon

    How about 60 tokens per 15 bucks?

    Each token 12 hours, because very few people would spend all that 24 hour tokens :P

  • monstermmomonstermmo Glendale, CAPosts: 1,062Member
    Originally posted by OG_Zorvan

    Here's my idea.

    You buy a 30 day sub.

    You login.

    You have 30 "tokens" on your login/character screen.

    You click the tokens and one is used.

    You now have 24 hours to play with that one token, logging in/out as many times as need throughout that 24 hours.

    Can't play tomorrow? No prob, your remaining 29 days are waiting for whenever you want to use them.

    At $15 per 30days of tokens, you are spending $.50 for each 24 hour block.

    You get all the benefits of the subscription, without feeling you've "lost" your money by only playing a few hours a week.

    Excellent idea!

    Jeremiah 8:21 I weep for the hurt of my people; I stand amazed, silent, dumb with grief.
    Join me on Raptr Steam Facebook Twitter Gameverse

  • Sevenstar61Sevenstar61 Centreville, VAPosts: 1,690Member Uncommon

    I like it.  It means though less money for companies from subscribers who would sub anyway, but it would bring most likely more people to games. Cash shop would have to be probably a must though as there is a lot of uncertainty how much money companies would be able to earn.

    Overall good idea though.

    image
    Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
    Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
    Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E

  • SulaaSulaa nPosts: 1,151Member Common

    Idea is not bad (althrough I can already see way to exploit it) but I don't think game companies would want to sell 30 day-passes for 15$.   If you would be ready to pay 25-30$ then I think companies may actually start to consider agreeing to it.

    I personally would like a system that combine those:

    1. 30-day for X price

    2. 30 x 24h for 2X price

     

    or something like that.  Maybe even being able to convert those both ways.

     

    Althrough  - I personally won't play any subsciption game with any microtransactions (even vanity ones).  I am done with playing sub + microtransaction games, even if that mean I am done with playing mmorpg's.

  • Shadowguy64Shadowguy64 Rohnert Park, CAPosts: 848Member

    Would you pay more if the tokens were broken down unto smaller time lots? so instead of 30 24 hours tokens for $15, how about 60 12-hour tokens for $20 or 120 6-hour tokens for $25?

     

    You pay a premium, but "waste" less time with the smaller tokens.

  • TimothyTierlessTimothyTierless Columnist M, ORPosts: 2,163Member Uncommon
  • monstermmomonstermmo Glendale, CAPosts: 1,062Member
    Originally posted by Sulaa

    Idea is not bad (althrough I can already see way to exploit it) but I don't think game companies would want to sell 30 day-passes for 15$.   If you would be ready to pay 25-30$ then I think companies may actually start to consider agreeing to it.

    I personally would like a system that combine those:

    1. 30-day for X price

    2. 30 x 24h for 2X price

     

    or something like that.  Maybe even being able to convert those both ways.

     

    Althrough  - I personally won't play any subsciption game with any microtransactions (even vanity ones). 

    Some of you seem to be completely missing the point.

    If i had to pay $25-$30 for 30 days in this form then i would simply pay the normal $15 for the regular way it's done.

     

    With the OP's idea i would definitely be more inclined to subscribe to games that i want to play casually.

    Jeremiah 8:21 I weep for the hurt of my people; I stand amazed, silent, dumb with grief.
    Join me on Raptr Steam Facebook Twitter Gameverse

  • SulaaSulaa nPosts: 1,151Member Common
    Originally posted by monstermmo
    Originally posted by Sulaa

    Idea is not bad (althrough I can already see way to exploit it) but I don't think game companies would want to sell 30 day-passes for 15$.   If you would be ready to pay 25-30$ then I think companies may actually start to consider agreeing to it.

    I personally would like a system that combine those:

    1. 30-day for X price

    2. 30 x 24h for 2X price

     

    or something like that.  Maybe even being able to convert those both ways.

     

    Althrough  - I personally won't play any subsciption game with any microtransactions (even vanity ones). 

    Some of you seem to be completely missing the point.

    If i had to pay $25-$30 for 30 days in this form then i would simply pay the normal $15 for the regular way it's done.

     

    With the OP's idea i would definitely be more inclined to subscribe to games that i want to play casually.

    I am not missing the point. I know what you mean.  I just have an opinion that game companies won't sell what you want for price that you want., because that mean less money for them.

    They will simply either go normal 30 day sub or / and Cash Shop / f2p model, instead of even considering decreasing their revenue with OP proposal at 15$ price.

  • monstermmomonstermmo Glendale, CAPosts: 1,062Member

    Let me put it to you this way. I quit WoW after 6 years of loving it. I've returned a few times over a couple years to see new content and stuff but i don't want to play it enough to pay the subscription fee so i simply do not play it.

    With this idea i actually would play the game. I may be able to use that time over a four month period if i wanted to, it would keep me playing and paying rather than not playing or paying a single cent which is what's happening now. They would not be losing money.

    It's a really excellent idea and i would probably for the first time "subscribe" to multiple games under this kind of payment option.

    Jeremiah 8:21 I weep for the hurt of my people; I stand amazed, silent, dumb with grief.
    Join me on Raptr Steam Facebook Twitter Gameverse

  • SulaaSulaa nPosts: 1,151Member Common
    Originally posted by monstermmo

    Let me put it to you this way. I quit WoW after 6 years of loving it. I've returned a few times over a couple years to see new content and stuff but i don't want to play it enough to pay the subscription fee so i simply do not play it.

    With this idea i actually would play the game. I may be able to use that time over a four month period if i wanted to, it would keep me playing and paying rather than not playing or paying a single cent which is what's happening now. They would not be losing money.

    It's a really excellent idea and i would probably for the first time "subscribe" to multiple games under this kind of payment option.

    Yes, but I don't think game companies care about that.  Unless market would very badly crash - I don't think companies would agree to sell 30x24h for 15$.   If they would think they need more flexible model then they would go f2p or freemium or other microtransaction model instead of OP proposal for price OP suggest.


    I say that as a person that pferer P2P model myself.

  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member
    Originally posted by Zeymere

    At first I agree, this sounds like an awesome Idea.  But...

    Most games are moving towards things happening while you are gone/not playing, like auctions, sending your people out while you are away, EVE lets you skill up in Real Time.  I am sure there are more issues like this.  Any thoughts on how those would be handled?

    Z.

    Auctions wouldn't be a problem as long as there's no time limit placed on the mail system ( so you'd lose no items/gold you obtained while away ).

    For a game where you skill up over time, like EvE, it'd be tricky, as you could very easily exploit the system. You'd either have to pay a "normal" $15/30 day consecutive sub like now, or have some kind of "ala carte" deal for those on tokens to keep their skills going when not playing. I really can't see a way for that to work without it making those on tokens "second class citizens", so I don't think it would really work with that type of game mechanic unfortunately.

    EA CEO John Riccitiello's on future microtransactions: "When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging."

  • OG_ZorvanOG_Zorvan Fresno, CAPosts: 615Member
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by monstermmo

    Let me put it to you this way. I quit WoW after 6 years of loving it. I've returned a few times over a couple years to see new content and stuff but i don't want to play it enough to pay the subscription fee so i simply do not play it.

    With this idea i actually would play the game. I may be able to use that time over a four month period if i wanted to, it would keep me playing and paying rather than not playing or paying a single cent which is what's happening now. They would not be losing money.

    It's a really excellent idea and i would probably for the first time "subscribe" to multiple games under this kind of payment option.

    Yes, but I don't think game companies care about that.  Unless market would very badly crash - I don't think companies would agree to sell 30x24h for 15$.   If they would think they need more flexible model then they would go f2p or freemium or other microtransaction model instead of OP proposal for price OP suggest.


    I say that as a person that pferer P2P model myself.

    They're selling you 30x24hours for $15 now in sub games. That's been the system for years. The only difference is you don't get to choose which 30 days you play.

    And you could still have a hybrid "F2P" option like mmos do now ( EQ2, SWTor, ETC. ), so you'd still make money from those who want to play "free" but have to pay to get anywhere like now. My system is just to make the sub option more palatable.

    Basically, when thinking this up, I looked for a haflway point between the old, old system back in the day of paying by the hour and the more standard system of $15 per month and ended up with this.

     

    EA CEO John Riccitiello's on future microtransactions: "When you are six hours into playing Battlefield and you run out of ammo in your clip, and we ask you for a dollar to reload, you're really not very price sensitive at that point in time...We're not gouging, but we're charging."

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,209Member Uncommon
    No thanks.  I can afford the subscription, and often do subscribe to sub-free games that offer the option.  I have no plans on renting temporary access to my games anymore. 
  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,783Member Uncommon

    The fundamental problem with ideas like this is that from a player's perspective, you think, "I'll pay less to get the same access, so I like it."  From a game publisher's perspective, you make less money off of the players who were going to subscribe anyway--and probably a lot less.  If it's an idea of how games could bring in less revenue, then it will be dismissed out of hand.

    The only way this works is if you can make up that revenue and more from people who will pay for this, but would have refused to subscribe.  You'd need a lot of such players.  If you're hoping to pick up casuals who will only play for a few days per month anyway, then you need a whole lot of them to replace one normal subscription--and most likely, at least one of them would have paid a $15/month subscription if that was the only option, anyway.

    Remember also that the subscription model gets a significant fraction of its revenue from people who have quit but haven't yet canceled.  This is why subscription games push so hard to get you to enter a credit card so that they can charge a recurring monthly fee until you cancel.  It's one of the ingenious things about a subscription model, as it lets you charge more money while all of your players think that it will only ever be paid by someone else.  So you'd have to replace this revenue, too, not just what you'd lose from $15 lasting players 40 or 50 days rather than 30.

    -----

    Another problem with this model is that it creates the likelihood of many small payment disputes.  What happens if someone logs in, then the server goes down for maintenance shortly after that?  They used up a token, but basically didn't get to play.  What happens if someone's account is stolen and tokens get used when they thought they weren't playing?  Players probably won't compare this to a $15/month subscription and think it's a good deal.  They'll compare it to not having wasted a token and think that the company robbed them of $0.50.  You'll get the same sort of resentment that item malls breed, but without the revenue from the whales.

    There's also the issue that token management will be a pain.  What happens if a token expires while you're logged in?  If it kicks you out or brings up a menu asking you to use another token, it will be really annoying if that happens in the middle of combat.

    Having it spend another token automatically only changes the problem.  Some people will think, I used a token at 7 pm yesterday, so I need to log off by 7 pm today or I waste $0.50.  Some people will think that they did log off on time and the game improperly used a token anyway, and so you get payment disputes again.

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,995Member Uncommon

    Not a half bad idea, could still have the standard sub model for those who prefer it, but this would let people with less free time (and a strong desire to play multiple MMOs), well done OP.

    image

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Nevada, MOPosts: 2,732Member
    Originally posted by Torvaldr
    No thanks.  I can afford the subscription, and often do subscribe to sub-free games that offer the option.  I have no plans on renting temporary access to my games anymore. 

    Isn't that what a sub is? Renting temporary access to your game on a month-to-month basis. Or do I not understand your post?

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

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