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The Sandbox Resurrection?

emistzemistz Miami, FLPosts: 54Member

I'm a big fan of sandbox games...a BIG fan.  So I have been looking for new and interesting sandbox games for years now...without much luck.  But all of the sudden as 2013 starts rolling I start to hear about all kinds of new sandbox mmos coming out.

Off the top of my head I can name:

  1. Darkfall UW
  2. Black Desert
  3. Greed Monger
  4. Project Theralon
  5. Repopulation
  6. Archage
  7. Starforge
all coming out in 2013 and I'm probably forgetting some.
 
What gives? Has the market for sandboxes suddenly exploded because people have grown tired of the same old same old theme park mmorpgs, or are investors all of the sudden taking a concerted gamble at a piece of the market that does not have the best track record?
 
What do you think?

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Comments

  • FilterheadzFilterheadz BuzauPosts: 127Member
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...
  • darker70darker70 stokePosts: 813Member

    Just a few more to throw in the mix.

    Origins of Malu

    Divergence

    Planet Explorers  (Has Multi player so included this) image

    EQ Next                  (supposedly a sandbox )

     

    image

  • JamesPJamesP Portland, MEPosts: 435Member Uncommon

    Your list contains some great games that I'm really looking forward to though I'm more then a little biased toward one of them but they are all great none the less. I have worked with the team behind the Repopulation. I was going to do the AI for the Repopulation but at the time I joined the team they weren't ready for me to start in on the AI and other projects sort of took it's place. They are a great group of guys though. And well now I'm the Team Lead/Lead Programmer for Greed Monger so I guess I'm biased toward a couple of those games on your list. 

    But I must say there are some great looking Sandbox MMOs slated for release here soon and I'm looking forward to seeing how they all do.

    Company Owner
    MMO Interactive
    Greed Monger

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Not really Filter, EQNEXT and TITAN are both going to hybrid Sandbox Themepark MMOs next year.  So really Sandbox is making a come back.  

    image

  • ScambugScambug TortugaPosts: 389Member
    Originally posted by emistz
    Has the market for sandboxes suddenly exploded because people have grown tired of the same old same old theme park mmorpgs?

    Yes I believe this to be the main reason why we're seeing a shift towards more player driven MMOs. However I think most devs are going to keep doing the same mistake they always have: trying to please everyone.

    So instead of full on sandboxes I think we're going to see more and more hybrid games with a bit of everything in them (like ArcheAge, Darkfall and most probably EQ Next).

  • darker70darker70 stokePosts: 813Member
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years following and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    image

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Pie_Rat
    Originally posted by emistz
    Has the market for sandboxes suddenly exploded because people have grown tired of the same old same old theme park mmorpgs?

    Yes I believe this to be the main reason why we're seeing a shift towards more player driven MMOs. However I think most devs are going to keep doing the same mistake they always have: trying to please everyone.

    So instead of full on sandboxes I think we're going to see more and more hybrid games with a bit of everything in them (like ArcheAge, Darkfall and most probably EQ Next).

    I agree too that the next generation MMOs will be Hybrid themepark Sandbox games.  

    image

  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,058Member Uncommon

    They are ok but only if the core gameplay elements consist of the following:

    1. Non-Linear world
    2. Non-Linear Class (skill based)
    3. PvE Centric, none of the FFA PvP crap
    4. Exploration and Discovery
    5. Lootable gear worthy of actually killing mobs (prefer Dynamic Loot system like Asheron Call)
    6. Player Housing and Guild Halls
     
    You can make a Sandbox that doesnt rely on building, crafting and free for all PvP as its core design.  If the core design has any or all of those 3 elements then I hate them.

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • MogusMogus Anderson, OHPosts: 169Member

    Everquest 1 was my 2nd love after Ultima Online, so I have to be honest in saying I'm looking forward to seeing what EQ Next has to offer even though I swore off SOE after the SWG fiasco (Droid Engineers for the win!).

    I'm eager to play EQ Next, Elder Scrolls Online (though not a Sandbox) and of course Greed Monger. All will offer something different.

     

    www.greedmonger.com
    Did you like Ultima Online? Then you'll LOVE Greed Monger!

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years folllowing and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    2013 is going to be the worst year for MMOs.  The problem is the current return to Sandbox is trying to use old school Sandbox rules.  Developers do not understand that will not work.  EQNEXT and TITAN will change that in 2014.

    image

  • doodphacedoodphace Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,815Member
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Not really Filter, EQNEXT and TITAN are both going to hybrid Sandbox Themepark MMOs next year.  So really Sandbox is making a come back.  

    Source?

  • doodphacedoodphace Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,815Member
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years folllowing and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    2013 is going to be the worst year for MMOs.  The problem is the current return to Sandbox is trying to use old school Sandbox rules.  Developers do not understand that will not work.  EQNEXT and TITAN will change that in 2014.

    Are you talking about Blizzard's next MMO? Where on earth did you hear that it would be a sanbox, or varriation of?

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by azzamasin

    They are ok but only if the core gameplay elements consist of the following:

    1. Non-Linear world
    2. Non-Linear Class (skill based)
    3. PvE Centric, none of the FFA PvP crap
    4. Exploration and Discovery
    5. Lootable gear worthy of actually killing mobs (prefer Dynamic Loot system like Asheron Call)
    6. Player Housing and Guild Halls
     
    You can make a Sandbox that doesnt rely on building, crafting and free for all PvP as its core design.  If the core design has any or all of those 3 elements then I hate them.

    Agreed.  They could do a UO type of PVE PVP centric game where 1 world is full PVP and 1 world is PVE rules.  That would work.  It worked very well in UO because you choosen the style of play you wanted to be apart of.

    image

  • darker70darker70 stokePosts: 813Member
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by Pie_Rat
    Originally posted by emistz
    Has the market for sandboxes suddenly exploded because people have grown tired of the same old same old theme park mmorpgs?

    Yes I believe this to be the main reason why we're seeing a shift towards more player driven MMOs. However I think most devs are going to keep doing the same mistake they always have: trying to please everyone.

    So instead of full on sandboxes I think we're going to see more and more hybrid games with a bit of everything in them (like ArcheAge, Darkfall and most probably EQ Next).

    I agree too that the next generation MMOs will be Hybrid themepark Sandbox games.  

    Well The Repopulation won't be the only theme park element is a tutorial to get you started with a little boost before you hit the complete sandbox world once out of the tutorial there is no going back,all the info is on their site and was in the featured Mo chat not long back with Josh.

    image

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years folllowing and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    2013 is going to be the worst year for MMOs.  The problem is the current return to Sandbox is trying to use old school Sandbox rules.  Developers do not understand that will not work.  EQNEXT and TITAN will change that in 2014.

    Are you talking about Blizzard's next MMO? Where on earth did you hear that it would be a sanbox, or varriation of?

    Just watch on Nov 5th and 6th at Blizzcon.  

     

    http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/blizzards-project-titan-rumors-facts/

     

    Put together the little that is known of Titan like the facts that they will have a dual life plus that housing will be in games with vendors.  

    Then take the fact that EQ2 and WOW are both themepark and designed the same way in 2004 its not hard to image or figure out that Blizzard and SOE are going to be releasing the same type of MMO as they did before in 2004.  Just think about it.  They know that Themepark will not work.  

    image

  • FilterheadzFilterheadz BuzauPosts: 127Member
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years following and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    Oh please stop tickleling me... do tell 1 just 1 succesful sandbox game other then eve online over the past years ?

    Right... i know nostalgia will kick in for some people and i DO HOPE we do get a decent sandbox out there but as long as the leading gaming market promotes > press 1 + 2 + 3 and u win ... not having high hopes is what i am trying to say.

  • NetSageNetSage Lake Geneva, WIPosts: 1,040Member Uncommon
    Until release I don't believe anything is a sandbox.
  • emistzemistz Miami, FLPosts: 54Member
    Originally posted by NetSage
    Until release I don't believe anything is a sandbox.

    I can tell you're optimistic... :-p

    image

  • fat_taddlerfat_taddler Wanaque, NJPosts: 286Member

    My first MMO was a sandbox so it really formed my perception of what a MMO should be.   Over the years I've played almost every mainstream MMO released but always missed my first MMO.

    Recently, I got the opportunity to go back and play my first MMO in it's original state (can't say anymore than that due to forum rules) and I was completely bored within a couple of hours.

    I think that a lot of people have fond memories of the older, more sandbox style games not because they were good but because the MMO genre and basic concepts were new and exciting to us at that time.

    The latest focus on resurrecting the sandbox style games is coming from two sources, indie devs who are trying to recapture the magic of the older style MMO's (Repopulation, Divergence, CU) and some larger developers who are looking cash in on the current desperation of players who are sick of themeparks. 

    Either way, it won't fill the void that many of us have, not because the games will be bad but because there will be nothing really new about them except maybe the graphics.

     

     

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years following and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    Oh please stop tickleling me... do tell 1 just 1 succesful sandbox game other then eve online over the past years ?

    Right... i know nostalgia will kick in for some people and i DO HOPE we do get a decent sandbox out there but as long as the leading gaming market promotes > press 1 + 2 + 3 and u win ... not having high hopes is what i am trying to say.

    Both UO and SWG were successful in their times.  

    image

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by fat_taddler

    My first MMO was a sandbox so it really formed my perception of what a MMO should be.   Over the years I've played almost every mainstream MMO released but always missed my first MMO.

    Recently, I got the opportunity to go back and play my first MMO in it's original state (can't say anymore than that due to forum rules) and I was completely bored within a couple of hours.

    I think that a lot of people have fond memories of the older, more sandbox style games not because they were good but because the MMO genre and basic concepts were new and exciting to us at that time.

    The latest focus on resurrecting the sandbox style games is coming from two sources, indie devs who are trying to recapture the magic of the older style MMO's (Repopulation, Divergence, CU) and some larger developers who are looking cash in on the current desperation of players who are sick of themeparks. 

    Either way, it won't fill the void that many of us have, not because the games will be bad but because there will be nothing really new about them except maybe the graphics.

     

     

    Thats why I could only play UO for a few hours was because it still has the old rule sets.  If we were to change the old SandBox rule sets to todays standards we would see a return to sandbox as long as some themepark is involved.  Problem is too mand Sandbox developers are going with old PVP centric sandbox rules.  Thats why 2013 games will basically just be a year to build til the next generation of MMO

     

    image

  • Ice-QueenIce-Queen USA, GAPosts: 2,451Member Uncommon
    I'd love an modernized version of Ultima Online and Asheron's Call...I'd play the hell out of them :)

    image

    What happens when you log off your characters????.....
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
    Dark Age of Camelot

  • doodphacedoodphace Vancouver, BCPosts: 1,815Member
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years folllowing and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    2013 is going to be the worst year for MMOs.  The problem is the current return to Sandbox is trying to use old school Sandbox rules.  Developers do not understand that will not work.  EQNEXT and TITAN will change that in 2014.

    Are you talking about Blizzard's next MMO? Where on earth did you hear that it would be a sanbox, or varriation of?

    Just watch on Nov 5th and 6th at Blizzcon.  

     

    http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/blizzards-project-titan-rumors-facts/

     

    Put together the little that is known of Titan like the facts that they will have a dual life plus that housing will be in games with vendors.  

    Then take the fact that EQ2 and WOW are both themepark and designed the same way in 2004 its not hard to image or figure out that Blizzard and SOE are going to be releasing the same type of MMO as they did before in 2004.  Just think about it.  They know that Themepark will not work.  

    Lol, im sorry, but that is wishfull thinking at its finest....literally nothing released or rumared thus far implies it will be a sandbox, or even close to one.

    BTW, the only "housing" they even mentioned is "guild" housing, which also does not indicate sandbox in the least.....Rift has player housing, and is by no means a related to a sandbox.

  • danwest58danwest58 Cincinnati, OHPosts: 993Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by danwest58
    Originally posted by darker70
    Originally posted by Filterheadz
    Sandbox games are dead ... wow and the 90% of the gaming market out there has done way to much damage...

    Damn I just wasted 2 years folllowing and been involved with The Repopulation one of the most anticipated games of 2013.

    Planet Explorers KS took 137k  and hit Greenlight in record time with 78% up vote.

    Yeah think I will now delete both accounts as thanks to your sage wisdom these games are dead as obviously non linear based game play is a dead duck, but wait isn't Skyrim a sandbox especially modded on PC yep better delete one of the biggest games ever to hit the PC don't want any of that sandbox in my PC as it's as dead as a dodo. image

    2013 is going to be the worst year for MMOs.  The problem is the current return to Sandbox is trying to use old school Sandbox rules.  Developers do not understand that will not work.  EQNEXT and TITAN will change that in 2014.

    Are you talking about Blizzard's next MMO? Where on earth did you hear that it would be a sanbox, or varriation of?

    Just watch on Nov 5th and 6th at Blizzcon.  

     

    http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/blizzards-project-titan-rumors-facts/

     

    Put together the little that is known of Titan like the facts that they will have a dual life plus that housing will be in games with vendors.  

    Then take the fact that EQ2 and WOW are both themepark and designed the same way in 2004 its not hard to image or figure out that Blizzard and SOE are going to be releasing the same type of MMO as they did before in 2004.  Just think about it.  They know that Themepark will not work.  

    Lol, im sorry, but that is wishfull thinking at its finest....literally nothing released or rumared thus far implies it will be a sandbox, or even close to one.

    BTW, the only "housing" they even mentioned is "guild" housing, which also does not indicate sandbox in the least.....Rift has player housing, and is by no means a related to a sandbox.

    Just wait until Nov at Blizzcon.  Blizzard is going to do what SOE does.  WoW and EQ2 are themepark games released one after the other because they knew what each other was doing and were competing head to head.  Dont think it will happen again.  Wait and see.  

    image

  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by doodphace
    Originally posted by danwest58

    Just watch on Nov 5th and 6th at Blizzcon.  

    http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/blizzards-project-titan-rumors-facts/

    Put together the little that is known of Titan like the facts that they will have a dual life plus that housing will be in games with vendors.  

    Then take the fact that EQ2 and WOW are both themepark and designed the same way in 2004 its not hard to image or figure out that Blizzard and SOE are going to be releasing the same type of MMO as they did before in 2004.  Just think about it.  They know that Themepark will not work.  

    Lol, im sorry, but that is wishfull thinking at its finest....literally nothing released or rumared thus far implies it will be a sandbox, or even close to one.

    BTW, the only "housing" they even mentioned is "guild" housing, which also does not indicate sandbox in the least.....Rift has player housing, and is by no means a related to a sandbox.

    This ^

    Blizzard's legacy has been built off of their ability to copy other games, and polish the crap out of them. Thanks to WoW, they've essentially killed most of their pool to steal from. I don't think we're really going to see much original from WoW on the MMO front (which is what the genre needs). Heck, look at their last major announcement. People got all stoked for a new IP, and what they got was a Magic: The Gathering knock off centered around WoW.

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