Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Fuzzy Avatars Solved! Please re-upload your avatar if it was fuzzy!

There is No MMO Without Microtransactions

1356

Comments

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Indianapolis, INPosts: 120Member
    Originally posted by Caldrin

    There are a few out there with no micro transactions and they are usually the better MMORPGs..

     

    The bottom will fall out of the f2p market soon and publishers will soon realise the old sub method was a lot better for steady income. The one thing they need to realise is that they cant compete with wow and they need to stop trying to copy wow.. Once they realise that and actually make a decent game they will be able to make money from subs again..

     

    I am not saying f2p and microtransactions will go away.. sadly they are here to stay but the quality of those games is jsut not very good..

    As I said before, though, subscriptions and microtransactions are no longer mutually exclusive.  If a surge of good MMOs came out that warranted subscriptions, there's no reason to believe that in today's world they wouldn't still incorporate microtransactions to some degree.

  • hfztthfztt GlostrupPosts: 839Member Uncommon

    I guess the point is that a bad game will remain bad, no matter the payment scheme.

    And it takes a special kind of incompetence to kill a good game with bad payment scheme.

    But to say that a game is good or bad solely based on its payment scheme is just silly.

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,314Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Onomas
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Onomas
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Onomas

    So you like throwing your money away for virtual trinkets that expire and forced to buy more? Havent you knoticed that the cash shops are starting to get even worse with their prices. Hell even mounts now cost just as much as an expansion. No thanks!

    Sub fee or nothing from me, i will not keep paying outrageous prices for stuff that should be provided free and everyone have the same ability to earn, gain, or make said items.

    Cash shops are the worst thing to hit the industry hidding behind the "free to play" BS.

    The point I wanted to make is that the two are very far from being mutually exclusive - even if the pro-sub, nay-RMT crowd insists otherwise.  Subscriptions aren't keeping companies from implementing RMTs into their games, so that means if there is indeed a RMT problem then subscriptions aren't part of the solution.

    10 million screaming wow fanatics can disagree. 10 milion at 15$ a pop is a huge amount of $$$. They added cash transaction for only one reason...........greed.

    If other game companies would get off WOW's coat tails and make some good mmorpg's and stop cattering to the konsole kiddies then there wouldnt be an issue.

     

    Even 400k subs will bring in more than your average cash shop. But see cahs hsops were not to bad when they first popped up. 5$ here and there... no biggie. But now mounts, bags, skills, and even basic things like healing potions cost a ton now and even in some cases are only rented to you for awhile. Pure greed.

     

    Compared to 30-50 cents a day, its a no brainer.

    Do you understand a business's goal in a free market economy?  It's to maximize profits - maximize being the key word here.  Why should Blizzard have to be content with $15 a month if they can charge more for anything and get people to pay for it?  Companies have anways been "greedy" in the literal sense; that's not really anything nearly as new as you're making it out to be.  If any sort of empiral evidence had suggested that there was money to be made on microtransactions going back as far as Ultima Online's launch, I can assure you that microtransactions would be as old as MMOs are.  Or do you honestly believe there was ever a point in time where someone in a publishing company said, "We could make more money, but we're not going to try."?

    Greed is what drives every human, sure. But to have people come on here and state that f2p and transactions are a better coarse because its cheaper is just a down right fib. That is what my points are against.

    But to be honest, if they wanted more money they could have raised the monthly fee. The standard 14.99/month has never been touched in a decade. The lesser of two evils is not micro-transactions. Because microtransactions are by far not the cheapest route.

    12.99 per month is what i pay for a mmo (12 months at a discount) -40 cents per day 120-160 a year/

    I get unlimted clothing, armor, wepaons, loot, speeders, mounts, make my own stuff and sell, always have everything i need for storage, housing, and everything else.

     

    You pay 0-60$ for the game

    15-40$ for a single mount

    10-30$ for one extra bag of storage * 3-5 slots (30-150$)

    ~~right here you already passes what i paid~~

    Armor and weapon upgrades (which fail 50% of the time)

    Class and skill upgrades

    Pets

    Housing decore

    Costumes (really?)

    healing potions

    booster potions

    name and sex changes

    guild registration and/or name changes

    dyes to color your armor

    extra content

    extra dungeons and maps

    paid tickets to get into events

    paid tickets to get into pvp (which game did that, i forget was pretty sad)

    Mystery boxes........ .0001% chance to win that elite magic item .......after 9999 boxes you still ahvent won anything ;)

    I know im missing a few dozen more things............................

     

    Really is your game that "free" with micro-transactions? Even buying one or 2 here and there in the long run, i pay less, much much less.

    And for 40 cents a day, about how much it costs me to start my car up in the morning, i enjoy the entire game, all of its content, and never have to worry about when i need to buy the next "must have" item that everyone else has. And have you noticed how f2p games with cash shops get updated more often....... but 95% of the time its dealing with the cash shop.

    Sub game are more superior in concept, just to bad companies arent making good mmorpg's any longer.

    If you buy all those things then I agree with you, however the person that does that is kinda silly.

    Most of those things are available in games, some of them are no different than expansions.

    The only one that might be different is bags and they usually offer far far more space than something in game.  And I have them for life.

    So I buy 3 bags spend 30 bucks, get everything else in game or with expansions.  In 3 months I've spent less than you did on a sub and have the exact same stuff and I don't have to pay 15 dollars the next month.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Indianapolis, INPosts: 120Member
    Originally posted by Onomas

    Greed is what drives every human, sure. But to have people come on here and state that f2p and transactions are a better coarse because its cheaper is just a down right fib. That is what my points are against.

    But to be honest, if they wanted more money they could have raised the monthly fee. The standard 14.99/month has never been touched in a decade. The lesser of two evils is not micro-transactions. Because microtransactions are by far not the cheapest route.

    12.99 per month is what i pay for a mmo (12 months at a discount) -40 cents per day 120-160 a year/

    I get unlimted clothing, armor, wepaons, loot, speeders, mounts, make my own stuff and sell, always have everything i need for storage, housing, and everything else.

     

    You pay 0-60$ for the game - You pay this with most subscription games

    15-40$ for a single mount - A little bit of an exaggeration; in my experience you usually pay $10-$20, maybe up to $30

    10-30$ for one extra bag of storage * 3-5 slots (30-150$)

    ~~right here you already passes what i paid~~

    Armor and weapon upgrades (which fail 50% of the time) - You pay this in most subscription games in the form of expansion packs

    Class and skill upgrades - You pay this in most subscription games in the form of expansion packs

    Pets

    Housing decore

    Costumes (really?)

    healing potions

    booster potions

    name and sex changes - You pay this with most subscription games if it's an option

    guild registration and/or name changes

    dyes to color your armor

    extra content - You pay these in most subscription games in the form of expansion packs

    extra dungeons and maps - You pay these in most subscription games in the form of expansion packs

    paid tickets to get into events

    paid tickets to get into pvp (which game did that, i forget was pretty sad)

    Mystery boxes........ .0001% chance to win that elite magic item .......after 9999 boxes you still ahvent won anything ;)

    I know im missing a few dozen more things............................

     

    Really is your game that "free" with micro-transactions? Even buying one or 2 here and there in the long run, i pay less, much much less.

    And for 40 cents a day, about how much it costs me to start my car up in the morning, i enjoy the entire game, all of its content, and never have to worry about when i need to buy the next "must have" item that everyone else has. And have you noticed how f2p games with cash shops get updated more often....... but 95% of the time its dealing with the cash shop.

    Sub game are more superior in concept, just to bad companies arent making good mmorpg's any longer.

    I don't have empirical evidence to suggest one way or the other what's going to be more expensive for the player (although I will admit that all likelihood does point towards the more restictive MMOs with extensive cash shops), but we are in all likelihood passed the days when publishers were keen to take a subscription and let that be that.  Furthermore there's really no empirical evidence to suggest that microtransactions are inherently bad for MMOs.  In all honesty cash shops, subscriptions, and payment models in general seem to have very slight to no correlation at all to quality.

  • OnomasOnomas Rock Hill, SCPosts: 1,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by VengeSunsoar
    Originally posted by Onomas
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Onomas
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Onomas

    So you like throwing your money away for virtual trinkets that expire and forced to buy more? Havent you knoticed that the cash shops are starting to get even worse with their prices. Hell even mounts now cost just as much as an expansion. No thanks!

    Sub fee or nothing from me, i will not keep paying outrageous prices for stuff that should be provided free and everyone have the same ability to earn, gain, or make said items.

    Cash shops are the worst thing to hit the industry hidding behind the "free to play" BS.

    The point I wanted to make is that the two are very far from being mutually exclusive - even if the pro-sub, nay-RMT crowd insists otherwise.  Subscriptions aren't keeping companies from implementing RMTs into their games, so that means if there is indeed a RMT problem then subscriptions aren't part of the solution.

    10 million screaming wow fanatics can disagree. 10 milion at 15$ a pop is a huge amount of $$$. They added cash transaction for only one reason...........greed.

    If other game companies would get off WOW's coat tails and make some good mmorpg's and stop cattering to the konsole kiddies then there wouldnt be an issue.

     

    Even 400k subs will bring in more than your average cash shop. But see cahs hsops were not to bad when they first popped up. 5$ here and there... no biggie. But now mounts, bags, skills, and even basic things like healing potions cost a ton now and even in some cases are only rented to you for awhile. Pure greed.

     

    Compared to 30-50 cents a day, its a no brainer.

    Do you understand a business's goal in a free market economy?  It's to maximize profits - maximize being the key word here.  Why should Blizzard have to be content with $15 a month if they can charge more for anything and get people to pay for it?  Companies have anways been "greedy" in the literal sense; that's not really anything nearly as new as you're making it out to be.  If any sort of empiral evidence had suggested that there was money to be made on microtransactions going back as far as Ultima Online's launch, I can assure you that microtransactions would be as old as MMOs are.  Or do you honestly believe there was ever a point in time where someone in a publishing company said, "We could make more money, but we're not going to try."?

    Greed is what drives every human, sure. But to have people come on here and state that f2p and transactions are a better coarse because its cheaper is just a down right fib. That is what my points are against.

    But to be honest, if they wanted more money they could have raised the monthly fee. The standard 14.99/month has never been touched in a decade. The lesser of two evils is not micro-transactions. Because microtransactions are by far not the cheapest route.

    12.99 per month is what i pay for a mmo (12 months at a discount) -40 cents per day 120-160 a year/

    I get unlimted clothing, armor, wepaons, loot, speeders, mounts, make my own stuff and sell, always have everything i need for storage, housing, and everything else.

     

    You pay 0-60$ for the game

    15-40$ for a single mount

    10-30$ for one extra bag of storage * 3-5 slots (30-150$)

    ~~right here you already passes what i paid~~

    Armor and weapon upgrades (which fail 50% of the time)

    Class and skill upgrades

    Pets

    Housing decore

    Costumes (really?)

    healing potions

    booster potions

    name and sex changes

    guild registration and/or name changes

    dyes to color your armor

    extra content

    extra dungeons and maps

    paid tickets to get into events

    paid tickets to get into pvp (which game did that, i forget was pretty sad)

    Mystery boxes........ .0001% chance to win that elite magic item .......after 9999 boxes you still ahvent won anything ;)

    I know im missing a few dozen more things............................

     

    Really is your game that "free" with micro-transactions? Even buying one or 2 here and there in the long run, i pay less, much much less.

    And for 40 cents a day, about how much it costs me to start my car up in the morning, i enjoy the entire game, all of its content, and never have to worry about when i need to buy the next "must have" item that everyone else has. And have you noticed how f2p games with cash shops get updated more often....... but 95% of the time its dealing with the cash shop.

    Sub game are more superior in concept, just to bad companies arent making good mmorpg's any longer.

    If you buy all those things then I agree with you, however the person that does that is kinda silly.

    Most of those things are available in games, some of them are no different than expansions.

    The only one that might be different is bags and they usually offer far far more space than something in game.  And I have them for life.

    So I buy 3 bags spend 30 bucks, get everything else in game or with expansions.  I've spent much less than on a sub and have the exact same stuff.

    Thats you, and you telling me you never bought anything but bags? And at the rate people jump from game to game...... 30 here, 30 there, 30 more on that one............ eventualy you will surpass my $$$ paid out.

    Many people buy ungodly amounts of stuff from cash shops. In average the sub price is by far the cheaper route if you wish to get the full extent of your gaming experience. Because most F2P games I have played minus maybe aion and tera are by far gimped. And you never get the full experience in most without diggin in your pckets.

  • OnomasOnomas Rock Hill, SCPosts: 1,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jalexbrown

     

    You pay 0-60$ for the game - You pay this with most subscription games

    Normal for almost every game....

    15-40$ for a single mount - A little bit of an exaggeration; in my experience you usually pay $10-$20, maybe up to $30

    Neverwinter charging 40$ for mounts right now, EQ2 last i looked had 25$ mounts, and many other ones have 204+ mounts, some I have seen as high as 50% for rare ones.

    name and sex changes - You pay this with most subscription games if it's an option

    Was never a min option in older games, that came along with paid transactions and now part of the norm. Cant recall many older games having that up front. Though i can be mistaken.

    guild registration and/or name changes

    dyes to color your armor

    extra content - You pay these in most subscription games in the form of expansion packs

    Expansion packs came maybe once a year or two. Not every other mnth and call them DLC's or special content packs. And charge you a lot for them.

    extra dungeons and maps - You pay these in most subscription games in the form of expansion packs

    No, you get these part of the expansion pack, not pay for the expansion and then pay for the rest of the content via packs or dlc's. Like D&D for example.............

     

     

  • moosecatlolmoosecatlol Boring, TXPosts: 1,171Member Uncommon

    Ending VengeSunsoar's baby fit, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Micropayment

    Hasn't WoW had a cash shop since Vanilla, I forget what the start was, but I think it was paid character transfers.

     

     

    The more interesting thought is when you add value to in game currency, every item that you spend said in game currency on becomes by definition becomes a micro-transaction. Every single game that has an online economy has micro-transaction. Then again that's just my opinion, as I'm a person who find Time to be a valued commodity.

  • maplestonemaplestone Ottawa, ONPosts: 3,099Member
    Originally posted by hfztt

    But to say that a game is good or bad solely based on its payment scheme is just silly.

    You have been jailed for using the pick pocket skill.  Please confirm your payment of a $0.25 fine to continue playing.

  • LithuanianLithuanian vilniusPosts: 203Member Uncommon

    About Istaria: it does not have any microtransactions. Just absolutely no option to buy additional plot of land of have Great Shiny Armor of Owning for lame 99.99$,. Yes, they do have 3 subscription plans: 1 standard "Plot owner" and 2 for budget players. However, I do not consider having subscription plans being a microtransaction.

    In my mind microtransaction is: a) having game shop; b) encouraged by devs option to buy stuff for real-life cash. Istaria lacks both.

  • SulaaSulaa nPosts: 1,151Member Common
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    This.  OP question solved.

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Indianapolis, INPosts: 120Member
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    This.  OP question solved.

    I've seen no evidence to support this claim except the honor system of the people that hate microtransactions.  You're answering a question (indirectly through Quizzical) to which I responded with a separate but equally valid supposition of my own.  Factually speaking the question hasn't been answered and probably never will, but that's why we can discuss it instead of ending the thread after the first supposition comes along.

  • akiira69akiira69 San Diego, CAPosts: 590Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    I've given a lot of thought to the topic of microtransactions, how much a segment of the MMO community hates them, and what we could (should?) do about them.  What I've discovered in my thinking is that I cannot currently come up with an MMO on the market that has no microtransactions.  Now I'm sure somebody will point to some obscure, niche MMO  where you pay the subscription and that's that - except it isn't, really; because even when developers aren't facilitating microtransactions, players are finding ways to initiate their own microtransactions.  Essentially the players become the cash shop.  Diablo 2, for instance, had no officially sanctioned RMTs, and yet we all know there was definitely a large community of people selling items for real-world cash.  So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    World of Warcraft, Asheron's Call 2 MMO's that dont have Microtransactions. Never state a definitive someone will always prove you wrong.

    "Possibly we humans can exist without actually having to fight. But many of us have chosen to fight. For what reason? To protect something? Protect what? Ourselves? The future? If we kill people to protect ourselves and this future, then what sort of future is it, and what will we have become? There is no future for those who have died. And what of those who did the killing? Is happiness to be found in a future that is grasped with blood stained hands? Is that the truth?"

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Indianapolis, INPosts: 120Member
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    I've given a lot of thought to the topic of microtransactions, how much a segment of the MMO community hates them, and what we could (should?) do about them.  What I've discovered in my thinking is that I cannot currently come up with an MMO on the market that has no microtransactions.  Now I'm sure somebody will point to some obscure, niche MMO  where you pay the subscription and that's that - except it isn't, really; because even when developers aren't facilitating microtransactions, players are finding ways to initiate their own microtransactions.  Essentially the players become the cash shop.  Diablo 2, for instance, had no officially sanctioned RMTs, and yet we all know there was definitely a large community of people selling items for real-world cash.  So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    World of Warcraft, Asheron's Call 2 MMO's that dont have Microtransactions. Never state a definitive someone will always prove you wrong.

    World of Warcraft has cosmetic mounts and pets, which are microtransactions.

    EDIT: And if Asheron's Call 2 is anything like Asheron's Call, there are plenty of players facilitating their own microtransactions.

  • MagnetiaMagnetia SydneyPosts: 1,029Member Uncommon

    I would rather play a game for free, then have the choice to pay rather than the subsciption fee. Quite frankly no MMO is worth any subsciption fee. Are they putting out $60 worth of content every few months? No.

    Name me an MMO where the subscription is worth it in terms of content, not subjective personal fun value.

    Developers need to eat and gamers are poor. When I paid for WoW i felt obligated to play rather than played for my enjoyment. After realising that I quit and haven't picked up another sub. 

    I would rather pay 10 dollars for an extra character slot than $15 per month to do the same content over and over again.

    Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  • SulaaSulaa nPosts: 1,151Member Common
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    This.  OP question solved.

    I've seen no evidence to support this claim except the honor system of the people that hate microtransactions.  You're answering a question (indirectly through Quizzical) to which I responded with a separate but equally valid supposition of my own.  Factually speaking the question hasn't been answered and probably never will, but that's why we can discuss it instead of ending the thread after the first supposition comes along.

    You're making a claim that it's impossible to privide evidence either way.  Not to mention that since you started thread and made a claim it does fall upon you to provide an evidence.

    Last but not least. Those players who are creating market of microtransactions by i.e. selling gold are not really hating microtransactions.  Of course you will propably find player who's vocal about microtransactions and do sell gold on the side at same time - but then he is really not hating them in his game he's playing - even if he claims otherwise.

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Indianapolis, INPosts: 120Member
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    This.  OP question solved.

    I've seen no evidence to support this claim except the honor system of the people that hate microtransactions.  You're answering a question (indirectly through Quizzical) to which I responded with a separate but equally valid supposition of my own.  Factually speaking the question hasn't been answered and probably never will, but that's why we can discuss it instead of ending the thread after the first supposition comes along.

    You're making a claim that it's impossible to privide evidence either way.  Not to mention that since you started thread and made a claim it does fall upon you to provide an evidence.

    Last but not least. Those players who are creating market of microtransactions by i.e. selling gold are not really hating microtransactions.  Of course you will propably find player who's vocal about microtransactions and do sell gold on the side at same time - but then he is really not hating them in his game he's playing - even if he claims otherwise.

    There's no burden of evidence on a statement that is safely assumed to be an unprovable supposition.  That said, there is all kinds of evidence found in both the real world as well as research that demonstrates pretty much absolutely that hypocrites exist and are quite common.

  • StonesDKStonesDK SomewherePosts: 1,805Member
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    This.  OP question solved.

    I've seen no evidence to support this claim except the honor system of the people that hate microtransactions.  You're answering a question (indirectly through Quizzical) to which I responded with a separate but equally valid supposition of my own.  Factually speaking the question hasn't been answered and probably never will, but that's why we can discuss it instead of ending the thread after the first supposition comes along.

    You're making a claim that it's impossible to privide evidence either way.  Not to mention that since you started thread and made a claim it does fall upon you to provide an evidence.

    Last but not least. Those players who are creating market of microtransactions by i.e. selling gold are not really hating microtransactions.  Of course you will propably find player who's vocal about microtransactions and do sell gold on the side at same time - but then he is really not hating them in his game he's playing - even if he claims otherwise.

    There's no burden of evidence on a statement that is safely assumed to be an unprovable supposition.  That said, there is all kinds of evidence found in both the real world as well as research that demonstrates pretty much absolutely that hypocrites exist and are quite common.

    You really don't need research for that lol

    Any parent will tell you they are a hypocrite hence the words "do as I say, don't do as I do"

  • SulaaSulaa nPosts: 1,151Member Common
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by Sulaa
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    This.  OP question solved.

    I've seen no evidence to support this claim except the honor system of the people that hate microtransactions.  You're answering a question (indirectly through Quizzical) to which I responded with a separate but equally valid supposition of my own.  Factually speaking the question hasn't been answered and probably never will, but that's why we can discuss it instead of ending the thread after the first supposition comes along.

    You're making a claim that it's impossible to privide evidence either way.  Not to mention that since you started thread and made a claim it does fall upon you to provide an evidence.

    Last but not least. Those players who are creating market of microtransactions by i.e. selling gold are not really hating microtransactions.  Of course you will propably find player who's vocal about microtransactions and do sell gold on the side at same time - but then he is really not hating them in his game he's playing - even if he claims otherwise.

    There's no burden of evidence on a statement that is safely assumed to be an unprovable supposition.  That said, there is all kinds of evidence found in both the real world as well as research that demonstrates pretty much absolutely that hypocrites exist and are quite common.

    Lol world is filled with hypocrites and I doubt there is any person in the world that have not acted as hypocrite at some point in his or her life.   You don't need an thread on this forum or any research to know that haha.   That's the diffrence between people only claiming  that they have some principle and people that actually act on their principles.  In a matter of f2p, p2p, microtranactions, RMT, cheating, etc  - you'll find people with all technically possible configurations of behaviour towards those matters.

    "People who say that hate official microtransactions do sell gold"

    "People who say that they hate official microtransactions do not sell gold"

    "People who say they love official microtransactions do sell gold"

    "People who say they love official microtransactions do not sell gold"

     

    None of 4 above claims in citations is true. 

  • hfztthfztt GlostrupPosts: 839Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by maplestone
    Originally posted by hfztt

    But to say that a game is good or bad solely based on its payment scheme is just silly.

    You have been jailed for using the pick pocket skill.  Please confirm your payment of a $0.25 fine to continue playing.

    He, he. But you ahve tken that slightly out of context.

    But in any case that is more about bad game design than a bad payment scheme, imho. :o)

  • GardavsshadeGardavsshade Cedar Springs, MIPosts: 756Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Quizzical
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    Because the players who hate microtransactions aren't the ones that create the secondary market for them.

    Exactly what Quizzical said.

    "We" (those who hate and oppose MT and RMT) want to see all of it gone from MMOs (generally speaking). We are not the ones creating any kind of scondary player market for RMT.

    Myself, if I had my way.... all MT and RMT would be made illegal and punishable by Law. Real World Law. No more screwing around with Gold Farmers and crap.

    But that would mean inviting real world Governments to establish the Laws and Enforce them... and I distrust real world governemts even more that some of the players that are making money on RMT right now.

    So my idea would be worse.

    There is no easy answer. But for me allowing RMT and making it official is not the answer.

     

  • akiira69akiira69 San Diego, CAPosts: 590Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    I've given a lot of thought to the topic of microtransactions, how much a segment of the MMO community hates them, and what we could (should?) do about them.  What I've discovered in my thinking is that I cannot currently come up with an MMO on the market that has no microtransactions.  Now I'm sure somebody will point to some obscure, niche MMO  where you pay the subscription and that's that - except it isn't, really; because even when developers aren't facilitating microtransactions, players are finding ways to initiate their own microtransactions.  Essentially the players become the cash shop.  Diablo 2, for instance, had no officially sanctioned RMTs, and yet we all know there was definitely a large community of people selling items for real-world cash.  So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    World of Warcraft, Asheron's Call 2 MMO's that dont have Microtransactions. Never state a definitive someone will always prove you wrong.

    World of Warcraft has cosmetic mounts and pets, which are microtransactions.

    EDIT: And if Asheron's Call 2 is anything like Asheron's Call, there are plenty of players facilitating their own microtransactions.

    Ive been playing Asherons Call since 2001 there are NO Microtransactions for the game not player created or Developer Created.

    "Possibly we humans can exist without actually having to fight. But many of us have chosen to fight. For what reason? To protect something? Protect what? Ourselves? The future? If we kill people to protect ourselves and this future, then what sort of future is it, and what will we have become? There is no future for those who have died. And what of those who did the killing? Is happiness to be found in a future that is grasped with blood stained hands? Is that the truth?"

  • CalmOceansCalmOceans BergenPosts: 2,273Member

    FFXIV doesn't have microtransactions.

    Rift doesn't have them either last I played it.

    WoW is debatable.

     

    Those are 3 major games that are just P2P.

  • GravargGravarg Harker Heights, TXPosts: 3,332Member Uncommon
    MMOs started with microtransactions....Neverwinter Nights back in 1991 made you buy time to play...
  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,314Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    I've given a lot of thought to the topic of microtransactions, how much a segment of the MMO community hates them, and what we could (should?) do about them.  What I've discovered in my thinking is that I cannot currently come up with an MMO on the market that has no microtransactions.  Now I'm sure somebody will point to some obscure, niche MMO  where you pay the subscription and that's that - except it isn't, really; because even when developers aren't facilitating microtransactions, players are finding ways to initiate their own microtransactions.  Essentially the players become the cash shop.  Diablo 2, for instance, had no officially sanctioned RMTs, and yet we all know there was definitely a large community of people selling items for real-world cash.  So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    World of Warcraft, Asheron's Call 2 MMO's that dont have Microtransactions. Never state a definitive someone will always prove you wrong.

    World of Warcraft has cosmetic mounts and pets, which are microtransactions.

    EDIT: And if Asheron's Call 2 is anything like Asheron's Call, there are plenty of players facilitating their own microtransactions.

    Ive been playing Asherons Call since 2001 there are NO Microtransactions for the game not player created or Developer Created.

    This thread says there is a black market RL money system for AC

    https://www.asheronscall.com/en/forums/showthread.php?51231-Asheron-s-Call-Cash-Shop&s=7e29e68b235c6ad232e8095e3c11125e

    and this one

    https://www.asheronscall.com/en/forums/showthread.php?5473-Cannot-Turbine-do-anything-about-bots-selling-for-real-money

    and this actual goldsite website

    http://stern.aen.walkerart.org/gold.html

     

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • jalexbrownjalexbrown Indianapolis, INPosts: 120Member
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    Originally posted by akiira69
    Originally posted by jalexbrown
    I've given a lot of thought to the topic of microtransactions, how much a segment of the MMO community hates them, and what we could (should?) do about them.  What I've discovered in my thinking is that I cannot currently come up with an MMO on the market that has no microtransactions.  Now I'm sure somebody will point to some obscure, niche MMO  where you pay the subscription and that's that - except it isn't, really; because even when developers aren't facilitating microtransactions, players are finding ways to initiate their own microtransactions.  Essentially the players become the cash shop.  Diablo 2, for instance, had no officially sanctioned RMTs, and yet we all know there was definitely a large community of people selling items for real-world cash.  So what I'm wondering is this: Why do the players that hate microtransactions find these MMOs and then end up creating a market of microtransactions?

    World of Warcraft, Asheron's Call 2 MMO's that dont have Microtransactions. Never state a definitive someone will always prove you wrong.

    World of Warcraft has cosmetic mounts and pets, which are microtransactions.

    EDIT: And if Asheron's Call 2 is anything like Asheron's Call, there are plenty of players facilitating their own microtransactions.

    Ive been playing Asherons Call since 2001 there are NO Microtransactions for the game not player created or Developer Created.

    You must not play on Darktide, because I can tell you people buy and sell MMDs and even gear in some instances all the time.

Sign In or Register to comment.