I could care less about reviews, only if I play a beta or a free trial and like it. So I just voted show me. I do not have high hopes for it, so if I did like it, that would be a bonus, but I will see. I don't think I am buying anything anymore without trying it first. MMOs have been rather disappointing for 5-6 years+ for the most part.
I actually prefer p2p, then their is no feeling of them begging for my money for bag space and any other little thing that shouldn't need to be bought. I also feel p2p can develop content better than f2p, still up in the air on b2p, but I imagine it would be in the middle.
Red: Thats the point. There are so many quality games and if you are going to pay 15 bucks a month you most likely will stick with 1 game. You are a customer a lot of MMOs are missing out on. You played 2 games at onc when you were not being charged 15 bucks a month for 2 games. What if you could pay for when you only played? How many online games would you be playing now? Play WoW when it gets an update and back to FFX when they get new content. Jump online thur night to hang with your guild who is doing your fav raid in Linage 2.
Because in life sometimes you have to make choices?
Such as "I could go out on Friday to a great dinner and a great dessert place afterwards/I could go out on Saturday to a pub with friends, bowling afterwards and then end up in some late night diner, but
I can't do both
So you make a choice.
I could buy a sports car/I could buy a motorcycle but I can't do both
I recognize that game companies are faced with a dilemma where, if they make their game p2p, they risk losing some customers who have to make that very choice and don't make the choice in their favor.
Make your game with a budget that forsees less players but players who would be more engaged in your game and make that game good.
This way you can have less subscribers but they will be so involved in your product that they will want to choose it.
To the players I say "If you can't always get what you want, choose your poison".
It's not a "right" to be finanacially able to play every game just like it's not a right to be able to have everything you want. You pick what you can afford and hopefully you've made the right choice.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Red: Thats the point. There are so many quality games and if you are going to pay 15 bucks a month you most likely will stick with 1 game. You are a customer a lot of MMOs are missing out on. You played 2 games at onc when you were not being charged 15 bucks a month for 2 games. What if you could pay for when you only played? How many online games would you be playing now? Play WoW when it gets an update and back to FFX when they get new content. Jump online thur night to hang with your guild who is doing your fav raid in Linage 2.
Because in life sometimes you have to make choices?
Such as "I could go out on Friday to a great dinner and a great dessert place afterwards/I could go out on Saturday to a pub with friends, bowling afterwards and then end up in some late night diner, but
I can't do both
So you make a choice.
I could buy a sports car/I could buy a motorcycle but I can't do both
I recognize that game companies are faced with a dilemma where, if they make their game p2p, they risk losing some customers who have to make that very choice and don't make the choice in their favor.
Make your game with a budget that forsees less players but players who would be more engaged in your game and make that game good.
This way you can have less subscribers but they will be so involved in your product that they will want to choose it.
To the players I say "If you can't always get what you want, choose your poison".
It's not a "right" to be finanacially able to play every game just like it's not a right to be able to have everything you want. You pick what you can afford and hopefully you've made the right choice.
You sound like an old-fart just like me
I agree with you.
I also want to add that even though I could afford to have monthly subs to more than a couple of them, I only ever sub to one at any given time. When I play an MMO I enjoy it much more if I can commit my play time to it. I like to get really into them and learn how to play them as best as I can.
If I do that, I'm willing to pay a sub fee so I don't have to worry about paying for all the forced inconveniences non-sub games have. If something is rare I want it to be so for a gameplay reason not a thinly disguised cash-shop motive.
But even though I can afford it, the sub amount also has to make sense. I'm highly skeptical of the $15 sub since most MMOs regardless of quality or population numbers seem to use it as their pay-by-the-month standard. The amount is so ubiquitous that it has no credibility from either a required maintenance nor fair-profit perspective.
Maintenance and content development being equal (I know they are not but bare with me) a niche game with a smallish population would need to have a higher sub fee than one with 10,000,000 players. But they don't. I'm willing to make some allowances for the increased infrastructure demands of more server boxes and more server maintenance required but not to the point that results in the same sub cost for both.
$15 a month for DF UW makes sense to me and I would pay it if I was into that game. Small dev...small population. The same amount for WOW is just greed. They could easily lower it to $5 and still make a good profit.
It'd be nice to see ESO come in with a sub of $9.99 a month or less for 3-month or 6-month purchases. I would gladly pay that. I'd probably also pay $15 but I would roll my eyes and grumble about it.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
I won't be touching this game if it has a subscription. Without a subscription, I'm going to take a very close look at it. But a subscription will cause me even more to ignore this game. It doesn't have any where near the features of a subscription based game MMORPG. Do your investigation on what the developers have stated are in the game and draw your own conclusion. Don't base anything about what you see on these forums if the information is not from the gaming company, Zenimax Studios.
After the SWOTR debacle I think wait and see is the proper route, subs are good for the game in terms of longetivity and subs give a sense of ownership, helping to combat the hacks and punks out there. Let's face it, if the game is FTP it's really hard to remain loyal when bad things happen. Though that being said if the company doesn't take in input or handle cheaters it's all moot.
Only once I get a chance to play it can I decide if it's worth box + sub. Hopefully I get into beta and can see if it's fun, if it is, then I'll buy and sub. Simple. No play no pay.
Its about all those other fun games that are f2p... and when you play them all they want to do is either force you to sub, or somehow force you to spend money on other things...
In the end, it doesnt matter, all those games are probably just as expensive, or ruined by the fact that f2p does not give you enough room..
So basically, you should play what you want, as the cost are only minor as long as you stick to a single game at a time.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
If it's a great game, of course I will... and so will everyone else. They'd be stupid not to. The value of that $15 is based on what the game is like.. it the game is really good then that's great value.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
I'm too poor for a sub price thats what a lot of companies don't seem to get many people can not afford $15 a month I can barely afford the gas to get myself to school. I highly prefer buy to play with expansions for a premium MMO. I do not think I could ever do more than $10 a month and that would be pushing it.
I will pay $15 a month if I enjoy it. it's simple as that.
Movie ticket for one movie is about that prize right now.
Where on Earth do you live? It's like $7.50 here 4.50 for a matinee and then upwards of $15 for Imax 3D. I also can say I have not gone to see a movie in over a year again simply because some of us can not afford those luxuries.(Being a college student sucks)
Honestly, I can't bring myself to buy subscription based games anymore. I will certainly buy MMOs that you only need to buy the box to play (like Guild Wars 2), but I believe that i am off subscription games for life.
Originally posted by Shauneepeak Originally posted by Sevenstar61I will pay $15 a month if I enjoy it. it's simple as that.Movie ticket for one movie is about that prize right now.
Where on Earth do you live? It's like $7.50 here 4.50 for a matinee and then upwards of $15 for Imax 3D. I also can say I have not gone to see a movie in over a year again simply because some of us can not afford those luxuries.(Being a college student sucks)
in the city i live in its $12 a ticket, plus if you want popcorn and a soda you are looking at $8 more.
never mind that, how about going to the bar on Saturday night? i can spend $60 easily on food and drinks.
in the end mmo's are entertainment, just like anything else.
i would argue its far cheaper to spend $15 on a sub and not go out as much.
Little misleading I think - The general estimates so far seem to be around the $12 mark but we'll see.
There are billions of these polls out there - you need to take a look on the forums etc. What I've seen so far though is that in most of them 70% of players actually WANT a subscription game.
If those numbers actually pan out, I wouldn't expect it to EVER be free to play - or at least you guys will be waiting a good few years
It'll be subscription based and will charge the going subscription rate. As long as the game is fun I won't mind playing it, when it ceases to be such I'll stop.
I can understand that people want a free (or relatively free) game, but it's wishful thinking. The budget of the game itself rules out F2P models as their return is not guaranteed to a budget this size, and though B2P could be an option with a supporting cash shop it's still unclear as to whether a game with this cost would be better served as P2P or B2P (Guild Wars concurrent user information is still nowhere to be seen, and it's sustainability still being watched by other companies).
I understand money is tight for many people (it is for me too!), but P2P MMOs are still one of the cheapest forms of entertainment for me at the moment for the amount of enjoyment I can garner from them. Their cost over the last 12 years has risen more slowly than any other form of entertainment (one price rise in over 12 years and most of that was a change to tax legislation for the UK).
I also don't find pure F2P games that entertaining for more than timewasting when bored, many are very restrictive or mind numbingly grindy (far more so than games such as EQ back in their day, that were demonised for such), and I find 'freemium' to be little more than a trial, as you will sub (or pay through the nose) if you play long enough.
For me, it's all down to how RvR will play out (and the announced lack of dedicated healer/support class is already a big no in my book, but I'll keep an open mind for now).
I'll see with my own eyes in open beta, there's no such thing as "professional review" - I do my own reviews and decide if it's worth of my money or not. And this comes from a F2P hater.
I ALMOST did with TERA, but jumped ship. This game would have to be EXTREMELY good to warrant a Steam Collection per month (i.e. GTA IV + DLC, Vice City, San Andreas, and GTA III are on sale for 12.98)
That does not mean the game won't be good or even excellent in quality and support. My dollar simply can go farther elsewhere in the gaming world.
"As you read these words, a release is seven days or less away or has just happened within the last seven days those are now the only two states youll find the world of Tyria."...Guild Wars 2
Comments
I could care less about reviews, only if I play a beta or a free trial and like it. So I just voted show me. I do not have high hopes for it, so if I did like it, that would be a bonus, but I will see. I don't think I am buying anything anymore without trying it first. MMOs have been rather disappointing for 5-6 years+ for the most part.
I actually prefer p2p, then their is no feeling of them begging for my money for bag space and any other little thing that shouldn't need to be bought. I also feel p2p can develop content better than f2p, still up in the air on b2p, but I imagine it would be in the middle.
Because in life sometimes you have to make choices?
Such as "I could go out on Friday to a great dinner and a great dessert place afterwards/I could go out on Saturday to a pub with friends, bowling afterwards and then end up in some late night diner, but
I can't do both
So you make a choice.
I could buy a sports car/I could buy a motorcycle but I can't do both
I recognize that game companies are faced with a dilemma where, if they make their game p2p, they risk losing some customers who have to make that very choice and don't make the choice in their favor.
To that I say this to the game companies:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/jimquisition/7121-Dark-Souls-and-Dark-Sales
Make your game with a budget that forsees less players but players who would be more engaged in your game and make that game good.
This way you can have less subscribers but they will be so involved in your product that they will want to choose it.
To the players I say "If you can't always get what you want, choose your poison".
It's not a "right" to be finanacially able to play every game just like it's not a right to be able to have everything you want. You pick what you can afford and hopefully you've made the right choice.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
You sound like an old-fart just like me
I agree with you.
I also want to add that even though I could afford to have monthly subs to more than a couple of them, I only ever sub to one at any given time. When I play an MMO I enjoy it much more if I can commit my play time to it. I like to get really into them and learn how to play them as best as I can.
If I do that, I'm willing to pay a sub fee so I don't have to worry about paying for all the forced inconveniences non-sub games have. If something is rare I want it to be so for a gameplay reason not a thinly disguised cash-shop motive.
But even though I can afford it, the sub amount also has to make sense. I'm highly skeptical of the $15 sub since most MMOs regardless of quality or population numbers seem to use it as their pay-by-the-month standard. The amount is so ubiquitous that it has no credibility from either a required maintenance nor fair-profit perspective.
Maintenance and content development being equal (I know they are not but bare with me) a niche game with a smallish population would need to have a higher sub fee than one with 10,000,000 players. But they don't. I'm willing to make some allowances for the increased infrastructure demands of more server boxes and more server maintenance required but not to the point that results in the same sub cost for both.
$15 a month for DF UW makes sense to me and I would pay it if I was into that game. Small dev...small population. The same amount for WOW is just greed. They could easily lower it to $5 and still make a good profit.
It'd be nice to see ESO come in with a sub of $9.99 a month or less for 3-month or 6-month purchases. I would gladly pay that. I'd probably also pay $15 but I would roll my eyes and grumble about it.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
I won't be touching this game if it has a subscription. Without a subscription, I'm going to take a very close look at it. But a subscription will cause me even more to ignore this game. It doesn't have any where near the features of a subscription based game MMORPG. Do your investigation on what the developers have stated are in the game and draw your own conclusion. Don't base anything about what you see on these forums if the information is not from the gaming company, Zenimax Studios.
I will pay $15 a month if I enjoy it. it's simple as that.
Movie ticket for one movie is about that prize right now.
Sith Warrior - Story of Hate and Love http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxKrlwXt7Ao
Imperial Agent - Rise of Cipher Nine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBBj3eJWBvU&feature=youtu.be
Imperial Agent - Hunt for the Eagle Part 1http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQqjYYU128E
If I deem an MMO worthy enough of the sub,then yes,I dont mind paying monthly.
Games like STWOR,GW2,PS2,TERA......not so much.
I would pay for TSW,VG, CU looks promising...to me though,ESO isnt cutting it for me.
Its not about the $15 a month...
Its about all those other fun games that are f2p... and when you play them all they want to do is either force you to sub, or somehow force you to spend money on other things...
In the end, it doesnt matter, all those games are probably just as expensive, or ruined by the fact that f2p does not give you enough room..
So basically, you should play what you want, as the cost are only minor as long as you stick to a single game at a time.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Where on Earth do you live? It's like $7.50 here 4.50 for a matinee and then upwards of $15 for Imax 3D. I also can say I have not gone to see a movie in over a year again simply because some of us can not afford those luxuries.(Being a college student sucks)
Since when is Tuesday a direction?
Nope. But that's not a comment on ESO's quality or content. I'm just not inclined to spend a monthly fee on online games.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
in the city i live in its $12 a ticket, plus if you want popcorn and a soda you are looking at $8 more.
never mind that, how about going to the bar on Saturday night? i can spend $60 easily on food and drinks.
in the end mmo's are entertainment, just like anything else.
i would argue its far cheaper to spend $15 on a sub and not go out as much.
Little misleading I think - The general estimates so far seem to be around the $12 mark but we'll see.
There are billions of these polls out there - you need to take a look on the forums etc. What I've seen so far though is that in most of them 70% of players actually WANT a subscription game.
If those numbers actually pan out, I wouldn't expect it to EVER be free to play - or at least you guys will be waiting a good few years
i doubt they'll make it sub-based.
a big portion of TES fans play single player games and not mmos.
all of them would play a Buy-to-Play TESO, but only a few a Pay-to-Play.
smart thing to do is have it B2P with a cash shop. (not selling RvR-related items of course)
Im a TES fan not TESO fan so i'll wait untill its completely free two play.
Hope to build full AMD system RYZEN/VEGA/AM4!!!
MB:Asus V De Luxe z77
CPU:Intell Icore7 3770k
GPU: AMD Fury X(waiting for BIG VEGA 10 or 11 HBM2?(bit unclear now))
MEMORY:Corsair PLAT.DDR3 1866MHZ 16GB
PSU:Corsair AX1200i
OS:Windows 10 64bit
It'll be subscription based and will charge the going subscription rate. As long as the game is fun I won't mind playing it, when it ceases to be such I'll stop.
I can understand that people want a free (or relatively free) game, but it's wishful thinking. The budget of the game itself rules out F2P models as their return is not guaranteed to a budget this size, and though B2P could be an option with a supporting cash shop it's still unclear as to whether a game with this cost would be better served as P2P or B2P (Guild Wars concurrent user information is still nowhere to be seen, and it's sustainability still being watched by other companies).
I understand money is tight for many people (it is for me too!), but P2P MMOs are still one of the cheapest forms of entertainment for me at the moment for the amount of enjoyment I can garner from them. Their cost over the last 12 years has risen more slowly than any other form of entertainment (one price rise in over 12 years and most of that was a change to tax legislation for the UK).
I also don't find pure F2P games that entertaining for more than timewasting when bored, many are very restrictive or mind numbingly grindy (far more so than games such as EQ back in their day, that were demonised for such), and I find 'freemium' to be little more than a trial, as you will sub (or pay through the nose) if you play long enough.
ESO 15/month:
hmm, if it's a sandboxy game, I might if it's good. if it is themepark based with instances and another gear grinder, definately no.
"going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"
For me, it's all down to how RvR will play out (and the announced lack of dedicated healer/support class is already a big no in my book, but I'll keep an open mind for now).
I'll see with my own eyes in open beta, there's no such thing as "professional review" - I do my own reviews and decide if it's worth of my money or not. And this comes from a F2P hater.
I wouldn't be there day 1 if their is a subscription
I wouldn't be there day 10 if their is a subscription
I'd watch the game a while.....and evaluate the pluses and minuses found by the pioneers
I'm really getting tired of being taken.My trust of any game company is gone.
I simply cannot justify paying a sub for a game
I ALMOST did with TERA, but jumped ship. This game would have to be EXTREMELY good to warrant a Steam Collection per month (i.e. GTA IV + DLC, Vice City, San Andreas, and GTA III are on sale for 12.98)
That does not mean the game won't be good or even excellent in quality and support. My dollar simply can go farther elsewhere in the gaming world.
"As you read these words, a release is seven days or less away or has just happened within the last seven days those are now the only two states youll find the world of Tyria."...Guild Wars 2