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Aventurine making returning players buy the game AGAIN!

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  • jfoytekjfoytek tigard, ORPosts: 150Member
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     


    Originally posted by DAS1337

    Originally posted by Ichmen isnt DF 2.0 just a huge content patch built off DF 1.0? but was too content heavy that they viewed it as a new game while it really isnt? i can see paying for halflife 1 then paying again for half life 2 as both are by all accounts totally different games. but from what i saw of DF 1.0 and 2.0.. they are the same :/ just ui overhaul and upgrade/tweeks O_o or did they replace the entire game core eng and mechanics?
    Not really.  The entire world was rebuilt.  All of the cities.  All of the characters.  The entire UI.  Entire portions of the game removed and added.  The combat system is different.  Crafting is different.  This wasn't just a content patch.  I've never seen a content patch change the game this dramatically in the 18 years that I've been playing video games online.

    Why would anyone assume that they could get into this game for free even if it was just an expansion? WoW expansions aren't free for existing WoW players. EQ2 wasn't free for EQ players. Bioshock Infinite wasn't free for Bioshock players.

    Don't get me wrong, it would be nice if it were free, but why would anyone expect it to be free?

     

     

     

    WoW expansions are volunary the entire game does not shut down and people still have access to the service they purchased without buying the expansion!

    I know nothing about EQ as it was a theampark game I hated.... 

    Most MMO's do not force there customer base to re-buy the game  With EQ did the Original EQ game server shut down?  and the only way to play EQ was to buy the new game???  if thats the case then you were wronged!!!!

    Normally MMO's that do what AV has done provide there old customers free access to the new game world IE you dont have to buy the entire game again but you do have to pay the Subscription.... 

    Its Ethically the right thing to do, otherwise your charging a person for the same service twice and the first time the loss of sevice was of no fault to the customer!!!

    UO,Shadowbane,SWG,Darkfall,MO,Wurm Online,Secretworld,GW,GW2,PotBS,LotR,Atlantica Online,WWII Online,WoT,Battlestar Galactica,Planetside2,Perpetuum,Fallen Earth,Runescape,WoW,Eve,Xsylon,Dragon Prophet, Salem

  • CaldrinCaldrin CwmbranPosts: 4,533Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    Everyone keeps bringing up this Discount!

     

    Which mind you the only people that new about said discount were the people involved in the beta process.....

     Not true AV spammed peoples accounts for months with this offer, and it was also one of the msot asked questions about DF:UW on their forums and here.

    For those of us who didnt want to be involved with the Beta Fiasco and who waited for the release of the game we get the shaft?  Sure it was common knowledge for the 5 months of beta in which a target group (The Beta Players knew about the offer)

     Again this was not just offered to people on the forums or who beta tested but was E-Mailed out to anyone that had some ponit registered a darkfall acconut.. hell even one of my old email accounts that never had an active darkfall account got the emails.

    But all of that is MOOT

     

    As Darkfall is Darkfall the map is the same its the same Overall game world we purchased originally and were promised!  Would be FREE....  When the new game released!!!

    Game world is actually different, yes its a similar shape but a lot has changed..

    They promised that the exp pack DF2010/arena would be free.. but they stopped making that and instead decided to be a totally new game.

     

    At the end of the day this offer was well known for a very long time.. and not just on the darkfall forums.

  • DAS1337DAS1337 Parma, OHPosts: 2,404Member
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    My generation? 

     

         When you enter into a contract for a service the customer expects to recieve the service!

    I purchased Darkfall already, the developers could not make the content changes to the game world that they wanted with a patch or expansion so THEY SHUT DOWN the service I payed for....

     

    Additionally AV stated on many occasions that the new game would be FREE to RETURNING PLAYERS....

     

    So they took away the service they promised to provide with no refund. They then released a similiar service and did not give me access, as they intended to DOUBLE CHARGE me for the same service... IE the Darkfall game world!!!

    Many games shut down their servers.  It's pretty common.  They obviously don't have the resources to run two games at the same time.  Instead of whining, play the new game.  If you don't want to, don't.  They have the right to do whatever they want with their game.  They didn't promise to provide it, they just said they may keep those servers open.  May and promise are very different in meaning.

  • KatlaOdindottirKatlaOdindottir essexPosts: 144Member
    I bought gta 1 and 2, why didn't I get the third one free? LOL

    www.daneslaw.com

    @GamerKurisu

    Awaiting Darkfall Unholy Wars

  • DAS1337DAS1337 Parma, OHPosts: 2,404Member
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     


    Originally posted by DAS1337

    Originally posted by Ichmen isnt DF 2.0 just a huge content patch built off DF 1.0? but was too content heavy that they viewed it as a new game while it really isnt? i can see paying for halflife 1 then paying again for half life 2 as both are by all accounts totally different games. but from what i saw of DF 1.0 and 2.0.. they are the same :/ just ui overhaul and upgrade/tweeks O_o or did they replace the entire game core eng and mechanics?
    Not really.  The entire world was rebuilt.  All of the cities.  All of the characters.  The entire UI.  Entire portions of the game removed and added.  The combat system is different.  Crafting is different.  This wasn't just a content patch.  I've never seen a content patch change the game this dramatically in the 18 years that I've been playing video games online.

    Why would anyone assume that they could get into this game for free even if it was just an expansion? WoW expansions aren't free for existing WoW players. EQ2 wasn't free for EQ players. Bioshock Infinite wasn't free for Bioshock players.

    Don't get me wrong, it would be nice if it were free, but why would anyone expect it to be free?

     

    PRetty sure that people can play WoW without expansion this and that still.

    And this is far worse,if you made 70 level palading in WoW for example  and buy next expansion,they would delete your character ? does that even make sense,AV did exactly this.

     

    DF:DW is not an expansion.  It is a new game.  It may look like the old game, but it is not.  WoW expansions are content updates to an already existing game.  

  • jfoytekjfoytek tigard, ORPosts: 150Member
    Originally posted by Caldrin
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    Everyone keeps bringing up this Discount!

     

    Which mind you the only people that new about said discount were the people involved in the beta process.....

     Not true AV spammed peoples accounts for months with this offer, and it was also one of the msot asked questions about DF:UW on their forums and here.

    For those of us who didnt want to be involved with the Beta Fiasco and who waited for the release of the game we get the shaft?  Sure it was common knowledge for the 5 months of beta in which a target group (The Beta Players knew about the offer)

     Again this was not just offered to people on the forums or who beta tested but was E-Mailed out to anyone that had some ponit registered a darkfall acconut.. hell even one of my old email accounts that never had an active darkfall account got the emails.

    But all of that is MOOT

     

    As Darkfall is Darkfall the map is the same its the same Overall game world we purchased originally and were promised!  Would be FREE....  When the new game released!!!

    Game world is actually different, yes its a similar shape but a lot has changed..

    They promised that the exp pack DF2010/arena would be free.. but they stopped making that and instead decided to be a totally new game.

     

    At the end of the day this offer was well known for a very long time.. and not just on the darkfall forums.

    Well this offer never once reached my email!!!

    You think thats all people do is surf the web to find out if Dark fall is going to have a special offer! 

    Whenever I surfed the web in regards to Darkfall it was to learn the release has been pushed back another month and another month and another month.... never did I see any special offers!

    UO,Shadowbane,SWG,Darkfall,MO,Wurm Online,Secretworld,GW,GW2,PotBS,LotR,Atlantica Online,WWII Online,WoT,Battlestar Galactica,Planetside2,Perpetuum,Fallen Earth,Runescape,WoW,Eve,Xsylon,Dragon Prophet, Salem

  • jfoytekjfoytek tigard, ORPosts: 150Member
    Originally posted by DAS1337
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     


    Originally posted by DAS1337

    Originally posted by Ichmen isnt DF 2.0 just a huge content patch built off DF 1.0? but was too content heavy that they viewed it as a new game while it really isnt? i can see paying for halflife 1 then paying again for half life 2 as both are by all accounts totally different games. but from what i saw of DF 1.0 and 2.0.. they are the same :/ just ui overhaul and upgrade/tweeks O_o or did they replace the entire game core eng and mechanics?
    Not really.  The entire world was rebuilt.  All of the cities.  All of the characters.  The entire UI.  Entire portions of the game removed and added.  The combat system is different.  Crafting is different.  This wasn't just a content patch.  I've never seen a content patch change the game this dramatically in the 18 years that I've been playing video games online.

    Why would anyone assume that they could get into this game for free even if it was just an expansion? WoW expansions aren't free for existing WoW players. EQ2 wasn't free for EQ players. Bioshock Infinite wasn't free for Bioshock players.

    Don't get me wrong, it would be nice if it were free, but why would anyone expect it to be free?

     

    PRetty sure that people can play WoW without expansion this and that still.

    And this is far worse,if you made 70 level palading in WoW for example  and buy next expansion,they would delete your character ? does that even make sense,AV did exactly this.

     

    DF:DW is not an expansion.  It is a new game.  It may look like the old game, but it is not.  WoW expansions are content updates to an already existing game.  

    It is an expansion they took the old world offline too do a total rework because they couldnt do it in an expansion none the less DARKFALL IS DARKFALL its the same damn game has the same damn name!!!  And they are scewing over there old players!

    UO,Shadowbane,SWG,Darkfall,MO,Wurm Online,Secretworld,GW,GW2,PotBS,LotR,Atlantica Online,WWII Online,WoT,Battlestar Galactica,Planetside2,Perpetuum,Fallen Earth,Runescape,WoW,Eve,Xsylon,Dragon Prophet, Salem

  • PAL-18PAL-18 AnachronoxPosts: 802Member
    Originally posted by KatlaOdindottir
    I bought gta 1 and 2, why didn't I get the third one free? LOL

    they uninstalled your gta 1 and 2 ?

    So, did ESO have a successful launch? Yes, yes it did.
    By Ryan Getchell on April 02, 2014.
    **On the radar:http://cyberpunk.net/**

  • DAS1337DAS1337 Parma, OHPosts: 2,404Member

    So, has AV allowed you to play their game for free yet?  Is the pissing and moaning working?  No?  Sorry bro.  

     

    You can learn just about everything from a game (good and bad) by coming to these forums.  Information about the beta, pre-orders, discounts and everything about the game itself.  You can't have everything for free, it's just as simple as that.  I paid $15 for my game.  I then purchased a copy for a friend for the full $30 because he hadn't played the original.  No one else here is complaining over buying it.  Most MMO's are between $50-$60.  Darkfall was half of that without the discount.  All I'm seeing is a bunch of whining.

     

    Pay, play, or don't.  No one is forcing you.  Though, I can tell you one thing, you definitely are annoying the people here.  That's for sure.

  • DAS1337DAS1337 Parma, OHPosts: 2,404Member
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by KatlaOdindottir
    I bought gta 1 and 2, why didn't I get the third one free? LOL

    they uninstalled your gta 1 and 2 ?

    You didn't need online servers to play GTA 1 and 2.

     

    They shut the servers down.  Get over it.  It happens all the time to MMO's.

  • DAS1337DAS1337 Parma, OHPosts: 2,404Member
    Originally posted by jfoytek
    Originally posted by DAS1337
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by lizardbones

     


    Originally posted by DAS1337

    Originally posted by Ichmen isnt DF 2.0 just a huge content patch built off DF 1.0? but was too content heavy that they viewed it as a new game while it really isnt? i can see paying for halflife 1 then paying again for half life 2 as both are by all accounts totally different games. but from what i saw of DF 1.0 and 2.0.. they are the same :/ just ui overhaul and upgrade/tweeks O_o or did they replace the entire game core eng and mechanics?
    Not really.  The entire world was rebuilt.  All of the cities.  All of the characters.  The entire UI.  Entire portions of the game removed and added.  The combat system is different.  Crafting is different.  This wasn't just a content patch.  I've never seen a content patch change the game this dramatically in the 18 years that I've been playing video games online.

    Why would anyone assume that they could get into this game for free even if it was just an expansion? WoW expansions aren't free for existing WoW players. EQ2 wasn't free for EQ players. Bioshock Infinite wasn't free for Bioshock players.

    Don't get me wrong, it would be nice if it were free, but why would anyone expect it to be free?

     

    PRetty sure that people can play WoW without expansion this and that still.

    And this is far worse,if you made 70 level palading in WoW for example  and buy next expansion,they would delete your character ? does that even make sense,AV did exactly this.

     

    DF:DW is not an expansion.  It is a new game.  It may look like the old game, but it is not.  WoW expansions are content updates to an already existing game.  

    It is an expansion they took the old world offline too do a total rework because they couldnt do it in an expansion none the less DARKFALL IS DARKFALL its the same damn game has the same damn name!!!  And they are scewing over there old players!

    So because EQ 2 has the same name as EQ1, it should be free to those players too?  We can do this forever, and forever you'd be wrong.

  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INPosts: 3,734Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Necroneus

    Simply comparison:

    Buy game - Buy car

    Pay suscription - Pay fuel

    When a new version of a car appears, if you want it you will buy it. What kind of problem do you have with a game that cost less? Why don't you go to show your hate against car's companies?

     That has to be the worst analogy ever.....Your comparing something that costs thousands of dollars to soemthing that often in this industry is free or very cheap.....Aventurine is alot like SOE....They are trying to make money every single opportunity they can....This may be right or wrong, but it is what it is.

  • PAL-18PAL-18 AnachronoxPosts: 802Member
    Originally posted by DAS1337
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by KatlaOdindottir
    I bought gta 1 and 2, why didn't I get the third one free? LOL

    they uninstalled your gta 1 and 2 ?

    You didn't need online servers to play GTA 1 and 2.

     

    They shut the servers down.  Get over it.  It happens all the time to MMO's.

    could you please tell us which games did this,closed their game and then tried to sell that again if it happens all the time to MMO´s and somehow people are getting over it ?

     

    So, did ESO have a successful launch? Yes, yes it did.
    By Ryan Getchell on April 02, 2014.
    **On the radar:http://cyberpunk.net/**

  • SupportPlayerMMSupportPlayerMM Lufkin, TXPosts: 310Member
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by Jayaris
    A discount was offered and advertised for a long time. Your bad, in my opinion.

     

    You think that its customers fault because they did not pre-order product which is still in alpha stage when its launched?

     

    They offered and advertised this product long time ago ,and you dont see the problem ?

     

     

    Then what're you crying about? If you do not want to play the game it comes off as you're crying for the sake of crying.

  • PAL-18PAL-18 AnachronoxPosts: 802Member
    Originally posted by SupportPlayerMM
    Originally posted by PAL-18
    Originally posted by Jayaris
    A discount was offered and advertised for a long time. Your bad, in my opinion.

     

    You think that its customers fault because they did not pre-order product which is still in alpha stage when its launched?

     

    They offered and advertised this product long time ago ,and you dont see the problem ?

     

     

    Then what're you crying about? If you do not want to play the game it comes off as you're crying for the sake of crying.

    i only understand from your post that you use word crying alot.

    So, did ESO have a successful launch? Yes, yes it did.
    By Ryan Getchell on April 02, 2014.
    **On the radar:http://cyberpunk.net/**

  • Landon2068Landon2068 MunichPosts: 6Member Common
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    Simple Basic Business ethics, you give your returning customer the game for free after all he is PAYING A SUBSCRIPTION!!!

    This would only make sense if Aventurin believe that you money they get from you via subscriptions fee are higher then costs of the box. E.g. they bet now that you most probably don't play more then 3 months.
  • jfoytekjfoytek tigard, ORPosts: 150Member

    Guys you can call me a whiner if you wish you can say I am crying!

     

    Facts are I played Darkfall from early 2009 till it shut down I loved the game....

    I payed retail price for the original game and my month subs to have the game I loved shut down, the rug pulled out from under me!

    I have waited for the game to release patiently, eager and ready to resub!

     

    BUT I WILL NOT BUY THE GAME TWICE.....  You can call it a new game but its not!!!  Its the same game the dev's were trying to make the first time, the re-worked it, changed the graphics but its DARKFALL... 

    AND

    I would likely love it BUT

    I WILL NOT BUY A GAME TWICE.... its the principal of the deal !!!  Where is AV's business ethics, this is wrong a blind man could see it!!!

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  • SupportPlayerMMSupportPlayerMM Lufkin, TXPosts: 310Member
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    Guys you can call me a whiner if you wish you can say I am crying!

     

    Facts are I played Darkfall from early 2009 till it shut down I loved the game....

    I payed retail price for the original game and my month subs to have the game I loved shut down, the rug pulled out from under me!

    I have waited for the game to release patiently, eager and ready to resub!

     

    BUT I WILL NOT BUY THE GAME TWICE.....  You can call it a new game but its not!!!  Its the same game the dev's were trying to make the first time, the re-worked it, changed the graphics but its DARKFALL... 

    AND

    I would likely love it BUT

    I WILL NOT BUY A GAME TWICE.... its the principal of the deal !!!  Where is AV's business ethics, this is wrong a blind man could see it!!!

    actually I'm going to use my detective intuition to call you a Liar, everyone else who "loved" the game so much pre-ordered for 15$, they didn't wait until weeks after it relaunched. I call BS sir, good day with your fabricating truth in hopes of pity.

    There's just simply no way someone so enthralled with a product would ignore the entire year get the game for free pre-order.

  • ReizlaReizla AlkmaarPosts: 3,299Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    Well it would seem that Aventurine does not have good business ethics....

     

    Customer buys a game,  game is shut down and remade, customers wait for the new product.

    New Product is released and AV says sorry this is a new game you must pay us again???  Hold the phone we bought the first version of Dark Fall?  Whats to say you wont shut this one down in another year and make us buy the third version etc... etc....

     

    Simple Basic Business ethics, you give your returning customer the game for free after all he is PAYING A SUBSCRIPTION!!!

     

    ***I refuse to buy the new version and will not return until they figure out the mistake they are making***

    I have voiced this already at the announcement of DF:UW. Both the fact that returning players have to pay again for the client (which is indeed an update on the old DF) as well as the fact that in 2 years Adventurine will most likely do it again with the next major update they make to DF.

    For those that compare GW with GW2 in this case... WRONG GW is still available and GW2 is a totally other game compared to GW.

    If I'd have bought DF, I'd skil DF:UW for sure. Since I didn't buy it, I'm not gonna buy DF:UW because of the chance that in 2 years those servers will be put off-line again and I have to repurchase the updated DF3 client...

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  • jfoytekjfoytek tigard, ORPosts: 150Member

    I guess this is where i have to defend myself?  Because obviously I am a liar....

     

    I am Sulfurblade a Wolf that joined the game in Jan 2009....  I was one of the first shipbuilders in the game, I could craft pretty much everything in the game...

    I was a member of Pirates of Skara Brae and after that Orks

     

    I am sure there are many old school Darkfall players who knew me or of me and will gladly back my statement....

     

    As for the preorder I had ZERO knowledge of it....  and as for launch everytime it said it was going to launch it got pushed back and pushed back and pushed back.... so no I didnt sit at my computer wondering if this would be the day Darkfall would finally release....  I simply checked this sight every few weeks...

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  • CerthaxCerthax AnkaraPosts: 5Member

    Aventurine is scammer group, no doubt.

     

    We paid for a game once, now they show us same game with different features and this cant be NEW game. 

  • SupportPlayerMMSupportPlayerMM Lufkin, TXPosts: 310Member
    Originally posted by jfoytek

    I guess this is where i have to defend myself?  Because obviously I am a liar....

     

    I am Sulfurblade a Wolf that joined the game in Jan 2009....  I was one of the first shipbuilders in the game, I could craft pretty much everything in the game...

    I was a member of Pirates of Skara Brae and after that Orks

     

    I am sure there are many old school Darkfall players who knew me or of me and will gladly back my statement....

     

    As for the preorder I had ZERO knowledge of it....  and as for launch everytime it said it was going to launch it got pushed back and pushed back and pushed back.... so no I didnt sit at my computer wondering if this would be the day Darkfall would finally release....  I simply checked this sight every few weeks...

    And you have an entire post history of talking about every sandbox you can; yet not once mentioning Darkfall until this very thread, You actually proclaim your enjoyment to games you hadn't played in years but not once mention Darkfall which you LOVED from start to finish, Stop being a troll posting your fake hate threads.

     

    Everyone move along...

  • BiskopBiskop AvalonPosts: 709Member

    Personally I couldn't care less about having to buy the game again. After all, it's a major update, more like a hybrid between an expansion and a new game, and then it's pretty common practice to pay for it. Besides it's not like the amount of money involved is staggering.

    What matters to me is the quality of the game and the professionalism of the company, and DFUW lost both those races by a wide margin, a long time ago.

    I was pretty hyped for it, back in October. Then came the launch fiasco. And then the other launch fiasco, where they announced a "beta" the same day the game was supposed to launch. By then I abandoned all remaining hope for this company and their game - which had already started to look like less of a game than DF1.

    Some reports from the "beta" have reached my ears and it all sounded terrible - major bugs and instabilties, dumbed down systems, lazy design (like artificial safe zones in a FFA game), missing content, sub par graphics and animations, and so on.

    I liked DF1, in spite of its shortcomings. It needed some major fixes, no doubt. But to me it looks like DFUW has fixed nothing, just dumbed it down and made it even more about deathmatch style PvP and even less about sandbox features. AV are still telling lies, acting like morons, and generally being very unprofessional about their game and their customer relations.

    In short: if anything has changed, it has changed for the worse. The game could cost $1 for all I care, I still wouldn't bother with it.

     

  • jfoytekjfoytek tigard, ORPosts: 150Member

    Darkfall was not better then Ultima Online pre trammel nor was it better then SWG pre NGE....

     

    But those games no longer exist and Darkfall for a long time was the best game remaining was it perfect or everything I wanted NO but it was better then the rest of the theampark crap games with crap PVP....

     

    infact if you look at my post history and my love of Crafting and Sandbox games it would only make sense I enjoyed Darkfall....

    Not to mention its in my signature aswell!!!

    UO,Shadowbane,SWG,Darkfall,MO,Wurm Online,Secretworld,GW,GW2,PotBS,LotR,Atlantica Online,WWII Online,WoT,Battlestar Galactica,Planetside2,Perpetuum,Fallen Earth,Runescape,WoW,Eve,Xsylon,Dragon Prophet, Salem

  • JimmyYOJimmyYO Columbus, OHPosts: 520Member
    Actually FFXIV is a new game if you've been in beta; in fact, it's alot newer then Darkfall UW is so this is quite the cash grab considering how unfinished the game still is.
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