Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
You got some things right though for sure. The big siege battles are very chaotic - without a doubt. Also, in all of those videos one thing is for sure the melee combat is some of the clunkiest I have seen in a long while. THey need to revert back to the DF 1 melee system....
Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
Any game requiring actual aim will be of much higher skill to be good at then that of tab targeting skill rotations. This is just common sense.
1) The developers have not always been very good with keeping players informed, and with updating the game regularly.
2) DF1 did not deliver on a lot of the things that were promised throughout the development cycle.
3) The fact that DFUW (originally DF 2010) was supposed to be released in 2010
4) The fact that they originally had a November 2012 release date, then moved it to December, and then took the game back into beta a day before the release.
5) A lot of people do not like games with full loot and relatively open PvP
Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
Any game requiring actual aim will be of much higher skill to be good at then that of tab targeting skill rotations. This is just common sense.
So skill for you is moving your aim-cross to enemy model? It makes a lot of sense now, why you are making such statements. Maybe the reason why you prefer COD over chess is that you are more about reflexes than brainwork?
Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
Any game requiring actual aim will be of much higher skill to be good at then that of tab targeting skill rotations. This is just common sense.
So skill for you is moving your aim-cross to enemy model? It makes a lot of sense now, why you are making such statements. Maybe the reason why you prefer COD over chess is that you are more about reflexes than brainwork?
The original DF, while having it's issues, was not JUST twitch skill, but quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors. This was not obvious with ordinary players but was always present in the best players. For that reason, the skill ceiling was very high and a very good player could stand out from the crowd. Also, a good seige leader who may not be the best overall player could stand out. I played with some very good players and leaders, although I was never that great. I think that the ability to stand out is what makes the Darkfall premise so great and why I hold out hope that they will eventually turn Darkfall UW into a great game. It is, however, currently very far off the mark. Perhaps with their recent surge of motivation they can accomplish their goal. Time will tell.
Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
Any game requiring actual aim will be of much higher skill to be good at then that of tab targeting skill rotations. This is just common sense.
So skill for you is moving your aim-cross to enemy model? It makes a lot of sense now, why you are making such statements. Maybe the reason why you prefer COD over chess is that you are more about reflexes than brainwork?
The original DF, while having it's issues, was not JUST twitch skill, but quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors. This was not obvious with ordinary players but was always present in the best players. For that reason, the skill ceiling was very high and a very good player could stand out from the crowd. Also, a good seige leader who may not be the best overall player could stand out. I played with some very good players and leaders, although I was never that great. I think that the ability to stand out is what makes the Darkfall premise so great and why I hold out hope that they will eventually turn Darkfall UW into a great game. It is, however, currently very far off the mark. Perhaps with their recent surge of motivation they can accomplish their goal. Time will tell.
I'm not trying to blast DF and I think that you are close to right about the definition of a 'skill' with "twitch, quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors". Gonna try DFUW to see what this combat is about. I just can't stand shallow statements like 'aim combat always>>>tab', it really much more depends on other factors.
Originally posted by dekon But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Because most the MMO community want auto attack combat you can play with 1 hand, and pvp that is a contest of of time investment, not actual skill.
even if they say they want something different to wow, they dont. if they did they would buy this game despite its many flaws.
The one who wants to play a skill based game will never even consider MMO genre. NEVER.
The game gets shit, cause battles that people see in the videos are all about horribly tacticless runnig around, swinging your sword through the air with poor animations.
I've seen the videos, I do not think you are correct saying that it is tactless combat running around just swinging. Those actions take a high amount of stamina and stamina runs out fast. The animations don't lock you in place which i think is dumb in my opinion becaues you just constantly click to finish you're three hit combo or whatever. From the videos i've seen, there are players constantly commincating and talking at such a fast pace, the battles are so chaotic that if you are able to organize a good 5-10 people, they can take out 15 or more easily. These are the games that are very appealing because you can see the sense of skill required to execute these group fights.
Consequently, I am also not shitting on tab targetting games either. I just don't agree with people when they say that this game is just a bunch of people swinging their swords around hoping to get a hit. Just watching a good archer kiting a warrior who is running zig zags and is still hitting 3/6 shots on him, it just shows this game takes a good amount of skill.
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
Any game requiring actual aim will be of much higher skill to be good at then that of tab targeting skill rotations. This is just common sense.
So skill for you is moving your aim-cross to enemy model? It makes a lot of sense now, why you are making such statements. Maybe the reason why you prefer COD over chess is that you are more about reflexes than brainwork?
The original DF, while having it's issues, was not JUST twitch skill, but quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors. This was not obvious with ordinary players but was always present in the best players. For that reason, the skill ceiling was very high and a very good player could stand out from the crowd. Also, a good seige leader who may not be the best overall player could stand out. I played with some very good players and leaders, although I was never that great. I think that the ability to stand out is what makes the Darkfall premise so great and why I hold out hope that they will eventually turn Darkfall UW into a great game. It is, however, currently very far off the mark. Perhaps with their recent surge of motivation they can accomplish their goal. Time will tell.
I'm not trying to blast DF and I think that you are close to right about the definition of a 'skill' with "twitch, quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors". Gonna try DFUW to see what this combat is about. I just can't stand shallow statements like 'aim combat always>>>tab', it really much more depends on other factors.
At this time DFUW's combat is a bit of a mess, you should know that going in. They are working on balance and pace of combat. Personally it feels less skill based and more about the amount of people that you bring to the fight. I am, however, withholding judgement until they flesh it out a bit more. AV has been very active recently but I have seen other small periods of time in the past when they have done the same thing. They show up, say "Hi, sorry we have been asleep at the wheel for months, we'll do better, we promise!" Then they disappear a couple weeks later. I hope that changes but old habits die hard, as they have proven time and again.
Originally posted by dekon I personally havn't seen much attention lately from this game nor do i play it. However, when i think of this game, I think of how much flak and criticism it gets. But then i have seen some streams and vods of this game and it looks great. The game looks beautiful, runs well, and the pvp looks engaging, attractive, and really fun. But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Havent you learn from life that looks can be deceiving?
its true that melee combat in darkfall by itself is very shallow, but its wrong to assume that its the whole combat experience. df1 actually had alot of stratergy and depth aswell as the twitch skill, it wasn't just counterstrike, you had alot of abilities to manage and tactics, otherwise I would have been alot better at the game.
unholywars.. well we'll see it only has half the planned abilities in game atm.
Originally posted by dekon I personally havn't seen much attention lately from this game nor do i play it. However, when i think of this game, I think of how much flak and criticism it gets. But then i have seen some streams and vods of this game and it looks great. The game looks beautiful, runs well, and the pvp looks engaging, attractive, and really fun. But why does this game get so much shit from the MMO community?
Well...bottom line its hard for people to let go of the past. Aventurine in the past always had major communication problems, gave deadlines that not only would they not hit...but they would never happen. For example, Darkfall UW is what was suppose to be an expansion called Darkfall 2010. When I say was suppose to be, I mean the game literally went down to install the expansion, and when the servers came back up two days later, the expansion wasn't there. So..they made some HUGE mistakes. When DF 1 launched, people had bought accounts but couldn't log on for 6 to 8 months, lot of bad. In the end, the game was great...people that called it fail had the bad things happen to them, but the game really was a huge success. Always had a population...you hear some say it was dead, but it wasn't...the map was just huge and I think that's why the shrunk the map down.
So...with the new game, people were already hesitent, then they pushed launch back, then again, then the day before launch they said it's going to be beta instead and will launch next week. Got into beta and the game was really bad...as in..how could they even think it was close to launch. Then they said the debug mode would be turned off first week of March...still not off.
It's just all of these things together, I will say they are better this time around simply because of the communication. You will always have haters in this game as it is extremely hardcore, you'll notice some say the game sucks because of the community or being no rules...but that's what the hardcore crowd wants.
Incognito www.incognito-gaming.us "You're either with us or against us"
Comments
Yeah, i'm probably wrong about tactless and stuff, just an impression from absolutly chaotic movement in videos. For sure in DFUW you will gain some advantage in battle with teamplay and kiting. But the statement that this combat system is SOOOOO skill based in comparisment with tabed target, is laughable, in my opinion.
You got some things right though for sure. The big siege battles are very chaotic - without a doubt. Also, in all of those videos one thing is for sure the melee combat is some of the clunkiest I have seen in a long while. THey need to revert back to the DF 1 melee system....
Any game requiring actual aim will be of much higher skill to be good at then that of tab targeting skill rotations. This is just common sense.
hallo ~_~
1) The developers have not always been very good with keeping players informed, and with updating the game regularly.
2) DF1 did not deliver on a lot of the things that were promised throughout the development cycle.
3) The fact that DFUW (originally DF 2010) was supposed to be released in 2010
4) The fact that they originally had a November 2012 release date, then moved it to December, and then took the game back into beta a day before the release.
5) A lot of people do not like games with full loot and relatively open PvP
(Uzik ibnYaraq in game. Always willing to help.)
http://www.youtube.com/user/UzikAlJhamin
So skill for you is moving your aim-cross to enemy model? It makes a lot of sense now, why you are making such statements. Maybe the reason why you prefer COD over chess is that you are more about reflexes than brainwork?
The original DF, while having it's issues, was not JUST twitch skill, but quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors. This was not obvious with ordinary players but was always present in the best players. For that reason, the skill ceiling was very high and a very good player could stand out from the crowd. Also, a good seige leader who may not be the best overall player could stand out. I played with some very good players and leaders, although I was never that great. I think that the ability to stand out is what makes the Darkfall premise so great and why I hold out hope that they will eventually turn Darkfall UW into a great game. It is, however, currently very far off the mark. Perhaps with their recent surge of motivation they can accomplish their goal. Time will tell.
I'm not trying to blast DF and I think that you are close to right about the definition of a 'skill' with "twitch, quick decision making, situational awareness, strategy, and many more factors". Gonna try DFUW to see what this combat is about. I just can't stand shallow statements like 'aim combat always>>>tab', it really much more depends on other factors.
At this time DFUW's combat is a bit of a mess, you should know that going in. They are working on balance and pace of combat. Personally it feels less skill based and more about the amount of people that you bring to the fight. I am, however, withholding judgement until they flesh it out a bit more. AV has been very active recently but I have seen other small periods of time in the past when they have done the same thing. They show up, say "Hi, sorry we have been asleep at the wheel for months, we'll do better, we promise!" Then they disappear a couple weeks later. I hope that changes but old habits die hard, as they have proven time and again.
Havent you learn from life that looks can be deceiving?
its true that melee combat in darkfall by itself is very shallow, but its wrong to assume that its the whole combat experience. df1 actually had alot of stratergy and depth aswell as the twitch skill, it wasn't just counterstrike, you had alot of abilities to manage and tactics, otherwise I would have been alot better at the game.
unholywars.. well we'll see it only has half the planned abilities in game atm.
My blog:
Well...bottom line its hard for people to let go of the past. Aventurine in the past always had major communication problems, gave deadlines that not only would they not hit...but they would never happen. For example,
Darkfall UW is what was suppose to be an expansion called Darkfall 2010. When I say was suppose to be, I mean the game literally went down to install the expansion, and when the servers came back up two days later, the expansion wasn't there. So..they made some HUGE mistakes. When DF 1 launched, people had bought accounts but couldn't log on for 6 to 8 months, lot of bad. In the end, the game was great...people that called it fail had the bad things happen to them, but the game really was a huge success. Always had a population...you hear some say it was dead, but it wasn't...the map was just huge and I think that's why the shrunk the map down.
So...with the new game, people were already hesitent, then they pushed launch back, then again, then the day before launch they said it's going to be beta instead and will launch next week. Got into beta and the game was really bad...as in..how could they even think it was close to launch. Then they said the debug mode would be turned off first week of March...still not off.
It's just all of these things together, I will say they are better this time around simply because of the communication. You will always have haters in this game as it is extremely hardcore, you'll notice some say the game sucks because of the community or being no rules...but that's what the hardcore crowd wants.
Incognito
www.incognito-gaming.us
"You're either with us or against us"