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Originally posted by Yamota no reason for faction lock? are you serious? The factions are at war, you think you could stroll into germany during world war 1? Wake up. You people are destorying the fun of the game when you whine about this stuff.. it doesn't make sense anymore.
Nice example, because there was a lot of germans who defected and there were right extremists in many Allied countries who did the same.
Actually your example shows why faction LOCK is an artifical boundary set by lazy devs who cant come up with a system to have people in different factions fighting each other but not locking them in place.
And reading this thread, it is actually you who dont make any sense. There are rules so therefore you should not complain about it?[mod edit]
Defecting would make sense, like having an open setup where all areas are open could make sense, if we're talking about a game featuring open PVP. Yet in the current setup, an allowance for all to go every where, interact with all things or people, do every quest, etc..etc..etc... would make little sense at all.
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lmfao.. Just because we have rules doesn't mean we need more of them..
Originally posted by WellzyC [mod edit]
Um "yeah", I saw your previous little rant on that and it was beyond ridiculous.
There is not one thing that anyone is asking for who wants this game to be more like "an elder scrolls game" that even remotely points to casual.
Open world? Not casual.
picking your own factions? Not casual.
there is no direct corellation. At all.
The fact that you posted this again shows you are still on the same rant.
You know, better yet... "rules have been around since you were 7 years old playing candy land.. get over it."
So if they change the rules again before launch you can feel free to follow your own advice.
Originally posted by wordiz Funny, nobody complained about WoW not being more like Warcraft 3.
probably because warcraft 3 was a... oh god nevermind..
You are a casual gamer if you like all these rules...rules are designed for the casual gamer to direct and hand hold them...casual gamers like limitations because it makes it easier to choose what to do so they could do something fast before they go to work or something. I recall another thread where the OP was asking is ESO going to be more like WoW and less like Skyrim/Morrowind because he was lost in skyrim and worse in Morrowwind and he only did the main quest-line and didnt understand why the game didnt end...lol. SWG or Age of Wushu now those are more hardcore and doesnt limit your exploration.
Originally posted by WellzyC In real life there are rules.. In games there are rules.. Race limitation, Faction locks are rules.. Rules make games fun, without rules there is no game.. Quit complaining about race limitation, and faction lock,... rules have been around since you were 7 years old playing candy land.. get over it. Thx, have a great day.
So all rules are good? since you wanna make comparison to real life than are you saying you would have no problem living in a communist society?
Sorry OP. You got owned. Just admit it. Not all rules are good rules just because you think they are good rules. Most ES players don't want faction locks. It's really as simple as that.
And who are you to tell people what to do? You are nobody. So quit YOUR complaining and get over it =P
See what I did there?
OP is right. EveryTHING, not just every game, has rules.
Even the universe has a set of rules (called Mathematics) in which matter and energy works along, otherwise nothing will be formed.
Absolute chaos cannot build systems.
Games are construct of science - because all games are based on mathematical principle in some way, all games can be represented by mathematical modelling, and that is in itself is because games are modelling of one part of the real world or another.
The only question is whether the representation was feasible/workable or not, in turn which determine whether the game rules was good or bad.
Obviously, the OP likes those rules. I suspect he would have similar 'realm pride' if the game was structured around the Red, Green, and Blue Empires.
The gold rule is the one that matters though. If Bethesda thinks that a significant portion of their audience will be turned off by the rules, and not spend money on the game, then the rules will get looked at.
And of the six people I've talked to this week who are interested in the game...none of them are interested in RvR. That's a problem of this project being entitled Elder Scrolls Online, and not Dark Age of Red, Green and Blue!
If you are holding out for the perfect game, the only game you play will be the waiting one.
Originally posted by WellzyC Originally posted by Drakynn Your arguement won't find traction here.I myself somewhat agree because I actually like the way choosing a faction has some consequence in ESO,but then I thogujht the worst thing to happen in WoW was when they gave the Horde Paladins and the Alliance shamans,frankly I'm suprised they haven't made all races avaialble to both factiosn too yet. Today's MMORPG audience wants access toe verything and are willing to pay so they can get it without actually playing the game and earn anything but thne also complain how the MMORPG genre has becoem generic,easy and bland. ----------------
This is why they fail.
What does that have to do with being able to explore the rest of the world of TESO? No one here is even talking about pay win...I thought we were talking about the issue of faction locks.
Originally posted by Arglebargle Obviously, the OP likes those rules. I suspect he would have similar 'realm pride' if the game was structured around the Red, Green, and Blue Empires. The gold rule is the one that matters though. If Bethesda thinks that a significant portion of their audience will be turned off by the rules, and not spend money on the game, then the rules will get looked at. And of the six people I've talked to this week who are interested in the game...none of them are interested in RvR. That's a problem of this project being entitled Elder Scrolls Online, and not Dark Age of Red, Green and Blue!
Yeah, same here. I am the only one of my friends who is actually interested in the PvP and RvR part of the game. But my friends won't buy the game unless they can do the PvE part together while playing their favorite race.
Let's examine this contention with some stark illustrations.
Rules in 11th century Scotland;
Your wife must have sex with the local English lord on your wedding night if he wants it.
Rules in 18th century Caribbean;
If you are coloured, you are property and have no rights.
Rules in Revolutionary France;
If anyone accuses you of being anti-revolutionary then you get a 5 minute show trial, no lawyer and your head chopped off in front of a baying crowd.
Yes - a game is not nearly so serious, but the idea that all rules should be followed 'just because' is logic fit only for sheep (and not even all sheep...).
Bad rules should be challenged - and what the OP is referring to are not even rules - they are design decisions.
It's very simple for those who don't like the ruleset being implemented for TESO.
DON'T PLAY THE GAME.
I like the idea of factions. Builds a sense of pride, makes me want to make more friends to annihilate those other "dirty" factions. Bring it on!
Originally posted by ZombieFeast It's very simple for those who don't like the ruleset being implemented for TESO. DON'T PLAY THE GAME.
It's very simple...
the final "rules" aren't set in stone yet. The game is still in development.
Once they are in fact set and the game is done then your point is valid.
Actually there's nothing wrong with voicing differing opinions and criticism of design decisions. We all come to mmorpg.com to read, discuss and debate MMOs and that's what we enjoy doing. It's healthy for people to have different opinions, just like it's a natural part of life to accept that not everyone will agree with you. Also many people have valid viewpoints on design of MMOs having played many of them over 14 years or so.
Of course, people who whine and moan and, even worse, people who wish the game to fail should think before they post.
I don't like the direction TESO is going in. That's just my opinion because I would like a different kind of TES game. However I'll still try it and if I don't like it that sucks for me. I still wish it success and for those who like it to enjoy it for a long while.
Making meaningful choices and the opportunity cost of those choices is part of what makes gaming fun - and makes for more replay value.
So many people these days want free open access to absolutely everything and just HATE the idea of making choices and NOT being able to do/get something because of that choice.
Choice paralysis is a major, major issue with young people these days.
Too many young people have grown up with almost instant, free access to just about everything they could want via the Internet, so when they are told they have to choose one thing or another, they have trouble accepting that they can't have both.
Also known as Analysis paralysis or decision paralysis.
People on this site seem to forget how complex MMORPGs really are becuase we are so well versed in them.
I agree. Besides it's stupid to even think that there's your "own people" fighting against you in every faction, the faction identity is quickly lost and faction pride becomes a weird thing when you arent even united in this sense. It's like having the same amount of russians and german on both sides of the line in world war 2.
I understand there's some people who might be traitors or work on other sides for whatever reason, but if it's something you can freely choose and when everyone wants to be the unique flower not following rules of their own kingdom then it just becomes un immersive mess. Better with rules and faction locks to prevent it all going stupid.
Originally posted by BadSpock Making meaningful choices and the opportunity cost of those choices is part of what makes gaming fun - and makes for more replay value. So many people these days want free open access to absolutely everything and just HATE the idea of making choices and NOT being able to do/get something because of that choice. Choice paralysis is a major, major issue with young people these days. Too many young people have grown up with almost instant, free access to just about everything they could want via the Internet, so when they are told they have to choose one thing or another, they have trouble accepting that they can't have both. Also known as Analysis paralysis or decision paralysis. People on this site seem to forget how complex MMORPGs really are becuase we are so well versed in them.
What you say is very true.
However, when you take a game with the last 3 incarnations revolving around choice it's understandable when those choices are taken away and people ask "why"?
The funy thing is, people want rulles in game, but not consequence for breaking them.
Fallen Earth, if player from your faction shoot at you he/she has no penalty for doing so, and people don't want to implement friendly-fire on, or, large penalty.
Why crafting has to be limited? why can't one master all skills if spent enough time?
Why demending FFA-PVP but no penalty for killing low level players or civiliance?
If you want rulles? then you have to have consequence, otherwise, there is no point to have rulles in the first place.
How many different race individuals are in the US? still, they have conflict with almost any nation.
Limitting faction to race is a bad choice.
You can only choose one faction but not limited to race, you can not fight for both factions at the same time, but you can be a different race, if you are born in the US you are a US citizen, but you happen to be other rase, will you go against you kind in time of war? or you will give-up your US stats and fight against your birth country?
I play football, what would that game be like with people picking what rules they dont like? Rules are what defines the game. Rules are what gives us comfort that when we play we know what we will face off against. There are some rules in football I would like to change but I am sure many others would like to as well but if they listened to everyone and changed every rule to fit everyone, would it be football any more. Rules define the game! ESO has been set up to be a very specific game. If you dont like the rules then maybe this is not the game for you.
Faction lock must stay but races maybe something that changes like in SWToR. Earn new races to make them uncommon and fun. You have to remember this is a MMO with years of growth to come and updated. The only core to this game when it comes to AvA is the faction locks to keep realm pride and to give pure PvEers their space to. Is there others ways to do that? Maybe, but no one has done that better then the DAoC model. The rules tell you game you are playing.
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Originally posted by Nanfoodle I play football, what would that game be like with people picking what rules they dont like? Rules are what defines the game. Rules are what gives us comfort that when we play we know what we will face off against.
Do you have any idea how many times the "rules" of Football have changed since the games inception?
Hell even now it seems they change some rule or two every year.
Rules are ment to be bent, twisted, broken and changed
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