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Originally posted by Dren_Utogi One word that I use to describe WAR, is "Stale." I just logged and the evironments are "ok" but the world itself is lifeless. Log into LotrO and see vivid illumination in the world, creatures and Ai that are responsive , and frankly a world that is more immersive. I would not look at DAoC or War for inspiration for any future of the genre, and I wouldn't look to WoW or LotrO either cause those titles have already been made. IF CU can't create something that is innovative and fresh, it will just be "another" mmo crowding an already crowded shelf.
Disagree, most of those are your characters following a storyline.
daoc and what I hope CUbecomes aren't ink the storytelling niche
Originally posted by Father_Jack Originally posted by TheHavok Originally posted by Father_Jack Played DAoC from release, Played on Andred/Morder till Shadowbane opened then went back to Morderd for a bit. Played WAR for over a year in Beta and six months after release. I really loved WAR, I think to much scorn was heaped on WAR to be honest I always had fun in it. WAR did a lot of things right. It wasn't perfect but I know from being in the Beta so long that many of the issues were out of the control of Mythic.
I was in closed and open beta as well. I'm curious, what issues were out of the control of Mythic? I know they ran out of money and that EA made them agree to a deadline if they wanted to receive funding - but what else was out of their control?
I think that was a major one, there was also a lot of pressure on them from EA to do things a certain way, despite what they were saying publicly at the time. But somehting else that was fundemental to the game and i think really impacted gameplay was 2 vs 3realms, that was dictated by GW because of the IP. If I remember right there was a lot of other bending around the IP aswell, or at least that was the excuse I was told when asked about certain things.
I was really excited for Warhammer - I bought the collector's edition the day it was announced. But I couldn't overlook a lot of the issues. I know EA probably rushed Mythic but at the same time, a lot of the coding was just bad. It felt like they cut a lot of corners. I remember jumping on a fence as my level 1 Witch Hunter and watching him wobble up and down the fence while he was falling. I know this is really minor but it was kind of a omen of things to come.
Btw: Having a large amount of AOE abilities is lazy design. It lets bad players with good gear get away with just spamming abilities in pvp without every really having to target people.
I will say, one thing Mythic did very well is their design of healing. To have a friendly target and an enemy target at the same time was really helpful and it allowed healers to play a lot more aggressively. Healing in pvp was probably my favorite part in Warhammer.
Played both daoc and war. Played war from release for about 1-3 months. Unfortunately small, funneled open rvr maps did not support anythign other than zerg action (for the most part) the fact that instead of a daoc like realm abilities /realm rank progression they went with a gear from pvp progression (it did require realm rank, and I guess rr did give some bonuses) then made both gear and the biggest sorce of rps come from capturing keeps... sorry, playing "keep flip" where two zergs would move and flip undefended keeps (no rewards for defending) wasn't my idea of rvr. The availability of bgs also didn't do anythign to help casual, none zerg none keep flipping pvp.
War had some nice concepts, the classes were pretty cool too, but the end game just didn't deliver what it was supposed to be (why they couldn't just copy emain from daoc and leave it at that I'll never know)
Hopefully CU does a better job of having large, open spaces where people can rvr, and make the best rewards come from killing players, not taking keeps or some other stuff. (do it like daoc, kill players for rps, take keeps for df access & realm wide bonuses. Gives purpose to both actions without making one inferior to the other)
I played both DAOC and WAR. Started DAOC just before DF was patched in and stopped just after Darkness Rising was released.
Played WAR from closed beta until about 6 months after the release.
Honestly , i played WAR and I dont understand how can anyone be excited for anything from same creator anymore ...
If anything WAR was total sucess in one thing and one thing only :
Thought people learn from their mistakes....
Originally posted by Lobotomist Honestly , i played WAR and I dont understand how can anyone be excited for anything from same creator anymore ... If anything WAR was total sucess in one thing and one thing only : HYPE Thought people learn from their mistakes....
People do learn from thier mistakes, but they have to be given a chance to do so. Everything I've seen come out of CU convinces me they have.
So far WAR and CU have that in common! Yay!!
i played DAOC free trial, and then WAR free trial.
DAOC is too clunky for me to pay a sub for it. WAR is too meh to justify the sub.
If they remove the sub i would purchase both. Other than the box price i dont see my self paying for that when better games are out there (i dont do pvp so im talking about pve)
Originally posted by rojo6934 i played DAOC free trial, and then WAR free trial. DAOC is too clunky for me to pay a sub for it. WAR is too meh to justify the sub. If they remove the sub i would purchase both. Other than the box price i dont see my self paying for that when better games are out there (i dont do pvp so im talking about pve)
I totally get that. I only like to pvp so those games were really fun expereiences fore me. I leveled characters in both just off pvp. Horses for course.
I've played DAoC for 4 years straight from launch and then every so often for 2 years after that. I also played WAR from launch for about 3 months. I don't do a lot of research so I never knew why Mythic Entertainment joined EA, but than I'm not sure why BioWare joined EA either and look at that mess. WAR was nothing like DAoC, but since I wasn't part of the design team, I'll never know why it was made the way it was. All I know is, ME made DAoC and rocked it, then along with EA, they made WAR which basically blew. Maybe the fact SWTOR didn't live up to it's hype initially as well shows that maybe it's not ME or BioWare, but EA.
I don't know if CU will succeed, no one does. All I know is its Tri-Realm PvP which is the best kind of PvP and it has well designed crafting mechanics which is another favorite of mine. I guess if CU does succeed than that alone will prove to me that EA should probably buyout Funcom so they can create hotmess MMO's more efficiently.
Originally posted by Xobdnas
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
PLayed WAR for about half a year and I kind of like it..then the same thing happend as in all the other new games..people/my guild went back to WoW and then..well me2..
Maybe WAR was to much as a WoW clone..I dont know but yes many of my guildies was old DAoC players and they wanted WAR to be DAoC with new graphic etc...
"I dont understand ? everything but shadowbane and eve have been storylines, DAoC has a storyline, I'm not sure what mythical version you played of the game, but a big clue is... it;s called Dark age of Camelot... hend a story that unfold abiout the realms, the people... quests = storyline....
Unless i missed the big puicture of DAoC, it is just like Eq but with realmed pvp"
That's like saying that Halo is just like Street Fighter except you use guns to kill stuff.
Daoc (and frankly EQ) had camping - you go to a dungeon and you kill mobs there over and over for about 5 levels, then you move on to some other place and stay there for 5-10 levels. Although quests existed in daoc, no one did them (except epic quests) Then when spell crafting came out, people didn't even do epic quests (sc'ed gear was better) Then when Shrouded Iseles expansion came out you'd do a handful of quests at lvl 45+ to speed up leveling and get a few items of nice gear (again, no more than 10-15 quests)
Considering that most people put the best time in daoc during the SI expansion 9and before ToA) I don't see how you could call daoc's pve experience be called a storyline. That doesn't even account for the fact most people played daoc for pvp, pve was just something you had to do to get to RvR (and occasional dragon or legion raid was fun.)
The PvE/leveling experience in DAOC was nothing like what it is in wow or similar games. Not to mention the fact that nowdays (and somewhere around ToA's release) people started to power level their toons with an alt (since everyone had a buffbot account) So you just go to a lvl 50+ place and power level your new toon with a lvl 50 to lvl 48-50. Then you run a couple quests for the key quests for the nice items, maybe do some master level quests/artifacts and you are off to rvr. No matter how you look at it, daoc is not a storyline, quest driven game, even the pve part of it is not.
FYI, The later Expansions of DAoC did have a clear story to follow.
I played DAoC for about 3 months but had no friends in the game & never really gelled with it, spent 6 months in WAR until the break-up of my guild I had many good times but the game-engine was ultimately what killed my fun.
CU looks like a worthy project with sensible goals & I hope it establishes itself early & grows, I like the direction it is taking & hope to try it out once it's released but I'm not prepared to throw down cash on a kickstarter for it because I want to see it hit 6 months of steady growth before I'll commit, I'm very burned out on being an early adopter right now.
"FYI, The later Expansions of DAoC did have a clear story to follow."
Well, ToA had quests but once the novelty wore off no one did them, you were of course still stuck with Master levels and artifacts, though not really a storyline (pl;us it's a max level content.) Catacombs did have quests with hubs ala wow, but I think that was Mythic's way to get some of the players from wow to try daoc. Don't think darkness rising or Lotm had any storylines (although darkness rising might've had some storyline, but I can't even remember if it did, so how important could it be?)
At the end of the day, you either powerlevel yourself a a char to lvl 50, or solo task dungeons (with maybe some catacombs quests) then do quests for dragon armor/weapon, grab what artifacts/master levels you can and it's off to rvr 9buy ml's and artifacts with bounty points) So even after 5 expansions adding pve content, and several free updates (dragon armor for instance) the game is still not storyline driven in pve. Certainly not 1-49, some stuff at lvl 50 does have a storyline (dragon armor, master levels) but meh.
Plus, the end goal is always RvR. So it's way different than wow or EQ's never ending quest for uber gear.
I played WAR for most of its life until that terribad expansion.
Overall, WAR had a lot going for it:
Combat system was excellent. Easily one of the best to date. Best balance of range, melee, magic, mobility, CC (after the major CC patch), teamwork, debuffs, buffs. WAR also had several very unique combat mechanics (transfer heals, Guard, Taunt, Detaunt, all the resource systems for each class). Morale ability system was good. Tactic swapping was good.
WAR also had some of the best game subsystems -- guild/alliance system, group/warband, looting/autolooting/autorolling.
Too bad the city sucked for most of the game's life, and the 2-faction constraint caused a lot of population swings to the detriment of the game.
It was also plagued by engine issues at the start of the game.
WAR did a lot of things very right though and there's a lot to be learned from it.
Cancelled the first month... never bothered again with it.