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You have to play other B2P (so called) MMOS to appreciate GW2.

BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon

Yes GW2 isn't perfect and has it flaws but when you look at the over all package bundled up in B2P model there is nothing like it on market. I would have never realised it if i had not played Defiance and TSW. 

GW2 is the most feature rich MMO and Anet certainly doesn't pull up any excuses while giving us all the basic features and more that MMO players have come to expect.

However, just simply copying GW2 B2P model isn't enough. Because that is not what made GW2 a success. Even if GW2 had a monthly fee i would happily pay for it. It is the content and the features which made it such a huge hit.

I am starting to think that other companies are simply copying the B2P model while forgeting that content and feature is more important and only because there is no monthly fee doesn't mean players will stick to it.well just because it is free on monthly basis.

What do you guys think? is simply making a small and lite game which is missing most of the features and put it on sale as B2P is enough? is B2P some how immune to the same 'fall in population' that we see in P2P MMOS after a month or so?

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Comments

  • pauly6478pauly6478 binghamton, NYPosts: 276Member
    I would argue that you would have to play GW1 to realize just how bad GW2 is :]
  • Squeak69Squeak69 Colorado Springs, COPosts: 956Member
    can you please give a decent list of other B2P MMOs

    F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used toimage
    Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

  • thecapitainethecapitaine West Chester, PAPosts: 401Member Uncommon

    I think you answered the question yourself by saying that you'd happily pay a sub for GW2.  In the end, the quality of the game has nothing to do with its payment model.  If the model sticks, and I assume it will, we will eventually find that games run the gamut from excellent to awful just as with all the other established ones.  Also, the suggestion that GW2 is somehow fully featured and other B2Ps like The Secret World and even Tera aren't is a bit of a false one to me.  (Defiance hardly counts as an MMO when compared to the rest, even if it may be fun for a bit).  And with B2P being so new, we're going to have to come up with new ways of measuring their longterm success since there aren't any firm month-to-month subscription numbers to rely on and gauging an MMOs retention has always been a spotty proposal.

     

    In the end, it will come down to what it's always come down to.  If enough people find the game enjoyable, the lights will stay turned on and the game will have continued development, no matter how they choose to earn their cash.

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by pauly6478
    I would argue that you would have to play GW1 to realize just how bad GW2 is :]

    depends on the player

     

    i personally enjoyed GW1 more but none of my friends liked GW1

    many of my friends enjoy GW2

  • jtcgsjtcgs New Port Richey, ILPosts: 1,777Member

    Actually, you only need to learn how to play GW2 to appreciate GW2.

    It IS possible to tank.

    It IS possible to heal and keep your party alive.

    It IS possible to DPS.

    You CAN do a hard dungeon and not die.

     

     

    And you can do it all without the handicap that is the holy trinity. More than enough to appreciate GW2...and that is without learning how to play a bunker elementalist, the single hardest class build to play effectively in any MMO ever made.

    “I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  • KanethKaneth Posts: 1,925Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by pauly6478
    I would argue that you would have to play GW1 to realize just how bad GW2 is :]

    I played GW1 and didn't like it much, but I really enjoy GW2.

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    I think I can appreciate GW2 just fine without buying any other B2P MMOs. I have both TSW and GW1, though, and they're fine games.
  • bugmenobugmeno Iowa, IAPosts: 85Member

    Played Guild Wars 1 for 8 Years, well 3++++ ;)= GW1 was a nice game, later it transformed into a "1337" Builds Game, were you either played the class and had a spot in a team or not.. GW2 is more casual friendly and in its state - Vanilla i believe it is the better product.

    GW1 had its own charme, nice simple 4v4 and "biutiful" world and got better with Factions (CM) and so on... GW2 is barely 10 Months old (less than that), runs on the same 8 year old -highly-tweaked engine, looks better, has more content to offer (GvG within Wv3, i know.. it sucks until they get their on Plazza), Wv3, strange 5v5/8v8, great PvE, JP, Crafting among the best and extrmely simple, fast paced and GW2 is the FIRST MMO : where you play any class and you will have fun with it.... unlike other MMO (like Loremaster LOTRO yikes! but is subjective).

    I hope they add some Naval Warfare, where Guild build Ships and fight each other, like in ArchAge (only good part of the game), knwoing Anet for nearly 1 decade :  They never have dissappointed anyone so far*, except the Hardcore-No_lifer-aka Raiders of the Past..

    * it aint perfect, but for 7 month old game, for 50$ you get a lot content :)

     

    image
  • RhazmuzRhazmuz Posts: 208Member Uncommon
    I would argue you only need to reach level 80 to see how boring and stale GW 2 is.
  • NBlitzNBlitz ZwollePosts: 1,904Member

    Why not appreciate something for what it is on its own instead of feeling the need to compare it to something else to validate your choice?

  • BigdaddyxBigdaddyx California, WAPosts: 1,985Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by NBlitz

    Why not appreciate something for what it is on its own instead of feeling the need to compare it to something else to validate your choice?

    Because sometimes you don't realize how good a game is till you play something bad? atleast in my case that is true. Now GW2 with all its flaws and shortcomings still comes ahead in all departments.

  • flizzerflizzer Manchester, NHPosts: 1,550Member Uncommon
    Well since this is Guild Wars 2 it is almost impossible not to compare it to Guild Wars.   I played Guild Wars briefly but never enjoyed it all that much. I find GW2 vastly superior. Of course,  this is my experience and opinion.  I understand there are some who prefer the original. 
  • JimmyYOJimmyYO Columbus, OHPosts: 520Member

    GW2 is certainly enormous value for your money, the problem is it doesn't feel like an MMO and really can't replace whatever your favorite MMO was before GW2(in most cases).

    It's more of a single player game with the occasional bot player that runs by to zerg an event then run off never speaking a word; in fact, theres no reason to chat to anyone in this game....ever.

  • flizzerflizzer Manchester, NHPosts: 1,550Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by JimmyYO

    GW2 is certainly enormous value for your money, the problem is it doesn't feel like an MMO and really can't replace whatever your favorite MMO was before GW2(in most cases).

    It's more of a single player game with the occasional bot player that runs by to zerg an event then run off never speaking a word; in fact, theres no reason to chat to anyone in this game....ever.

    Odd because I find myself chatting in this game as much or more than any other game Ive played, Maybe Im doing it wrong.

  • LeiloniLeiloni None of your beeswax, ALPosts: 432Member Uncommon

    GW2 certainly is a full featured game but it has it's problems. The combat for one thing leaves a lot to be desired. Sure, it's fun to play around with and while you level up to 80 and play through the various types of content it's fun, but as a long term MMO, the combat gets boring. It's not fun to do the dungeons at all, nor is the PvP (either structured BGs or WvW) fun long term. Not to mention, there is no sense of server community. Even as a solo player in other games, you get a fun sense of your server's community and you feel like you're a part of it. GW2 is a game to play casually up to 80 and then it gets old very fast.

     

    TSW has it's flaws as well but feels much more like a traditional MMO. The combat is different enough but still keeps to the traditional trinity enough to be fun in dungeons and group content. The storyline and questing model is one of the best and really is what makes this game. I haven't reached endgame yet but this is a game I'd come back to again and again. Not sure I'd make it my main game, but the fact that it's worth returning to already puts it above GW2. And I have spent money in their cash shop whereas I have never wanted to spend any money in GW2's cash shop.

     

    GW2 did a lot of interesting things but the wide variety of content is overshadowed by the sub par combat and lack of any community in the game. It could have been something really great, but they fell short. I'd rather play a game with less features but that has good combat and any sort of community, because those are the two things that make up an MMO. Number 1 is other people - playing with others is what makes an MMO an MMO and for me, it's what makes them fun and worth sticking around for. Secondly is the combat - that's what you are doing for the entirety of the game. If the combat isn't fun, it doesn't matter how much content they have if I can't even get myself to do it.

     

    That being said neither of those games are worth being your main game so I don't think the B2P model really has anything to do with it. I'll play a game if it's F2P or P2P as long as it's good.

  • JimmyYOJimmyYO Columbus, OHPosts: 520Member
    I think what you are doing wrong is an inefficient use of the block feature available at this website.  I'm sure everything you do in game is fine.

    At least I came with an opinion on the OP, you just came to add nothing but a sad troll attempt. Block is useful indeed.

  • JimmyYOJimmyYO Columbus, OHPosts: 520Member
    Originally posted by Leiloni

    GW2 certainly is a full featured game but it has it's problems. The combat for one thing leaves a lot to be desired. Sure, it's fun to play around with and while you level up to 80 and play through the various types of content it's fun, but as a long term MMO, the combat gets boring. It's not fun to do the dungeons at all, nor is the PvP (either structured BGs or WvW) fun long term. Not to mention, there is no sense of server community. Even as a solo player in other games, you get a fun sense of your server's community and you feel like you're a part of it. GW2 is a game to play casually up to 80 and then it gets old very fast.

     

    TSW has it's flaws as well but feels much more like a traditional MMO. The combat is different enough but still keeps to the traditional trinity enough to be fun in dungeons and group content. The storyline and questing model is one of the best and really is what makes this game. I haven't reached endgame yet but this is a game I'd come back to again and again. Not sure I'd make it my main game, but the fact that it's worth returning to already puts it above GW2. And I have spent money in their cash shop whereas I have never wanted to spend any money in GW2's cash shop.

     

    GW2 did a lot of interesting things but the wide variety of content is overshadowed by the sub par combat and lack of any community in the game. It could have been something really great, but they fell short. I'd rather play a game with less features but that has good combat and any sort of community, because those are the two things that make up an MMO. Number 1 is other people - playing with others is what makes an MMO an MMO and for me, it's what makes them fun and worth sticking around for. Secondly is the combat - that's what you are doing for the entirety of the game. If the combat isn't fun, it doesn't matter how much content they have if I can't even get myself to do it.

     

    That being said neither of those games are worth being your main game so I don't think the B2P model really has anything to do with it. I'll play a game if it's F2P or P2P as long as it's good.

    I thought the combat was a selling point of the game but I agree with the rest of your post. Lack of community in particular.

  • DragFireDragFire BarcelonaPosts: 16Member
    GW1 in much things. But I don't have the time to play sandboxes like EVE online or other grinding MMO and Guild Wars 2 is one of the few MMO with an interesting and fluent combat (NOT balanced) and without subscription.
  • waynejr2waynejr2 West Toluca Lake, CAPosts: 4,474Member Uncommon
    I remember when you would be able to play a game for a little while to tell if it was good enough to appreciate.  Then people said you had to play the game to cap.  Then you had to raid/pvp endgame all the way to appreciate it.  Have we really come to the point where we have to play other games in order to appreciate GW2's greatness?
  • observerobserver Houston, TXPosts: 3,006Member Uncommon
    Some of you are missing the point.  He's comparing the B2P model and it's content, not the gameplay, so to compare GW1's gameplay with GW2's isn't the issue.
  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Virginia, VAPosts: 2,131Member
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    (...)

    GW2 is the most feature rich MMO and Anet certainly doesn't pull up any excuses while giving us all the basic features and more that MMO players have come to expect.

    (...)

    For better or worse, MMO players have come to expect a proper LFD-system on release as a basic feature. So I disagree with your statement.

  • MaephistoMaephisto somewhere, DCPosts: 632Member
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    (...)

    GW2 is the most feature rich MMO and Anet certainly doesn't pull up any excuses while giving us all the basic features and more that MMO players have come to expect.

    (...)

    For better or worse, MMO players have come to expect a proper LFD-system on release as a basic feature. So I disagree with your statement.

    GW2 does have a LFG tool.  The fact it was made by the community and not Anet means little.

    It works great.  It fills the need for that function, leaving Anet to focus on other things.

     

    image

  • TwoThreeFourTwoThreeFour Virginia, VAPosts: 2,131Member
    Originally posted by Maephisto
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    (...)

    GW2 is the most feature rich MMO and Anet certainly doesn't pull up any excuses while giving us all the basic features and more that MMO players have come to expect.

    (...)

    For better or worse, MMO players have come to expect a proper LFD-system on release as a basic feature. So I disagree with your statement.

    GW2 does have a LFG tool.  The fact it was made by the community and not Anet means little.

    It works great.  It fills the need for that function, leaving Anet to focus on other things.

     

     

    The statement refers to what GW2 gives and thus implying to what Arenanet implemented in GW2, not what the community did. 

  • Bad.dogBad.dog Belleville, ONPosts: 1,108Member
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Maephisto
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    (...)

    GW2 is the most feature rich MMO and Anet certainly doesn't pull up any excuses while giving us all the basic features and more that MMO players have come to expect.

    (...)

    For better or worse, MMO players have come to expect a proper LFD-system on release as a basic feature. So I disagree with your statement.

    GW2 does have a LFG tool.  The fact it was made by the community and not Anet means little.

    It works great.  It fills the need for that function, leaving Anet to focus on other things.

     

     

    The statement refers to what GW2 gives and thus implying to what Arenanet implemented in GW2, not what the community did. 

    For every person who thinks a LFG tool is an important feature....there is another person that thinks a LFG tool is just a crutch  for the socially handicappped twitch society gamer .

  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Bad.dog
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Maephisto
    Originally posted by TwoThreeFour
    Originally posted by Bigdaddyx

    (...)

    GW2 is the most feature rich MMO and Anet certainly doesn't pull up any excuses while giving us all the basic features and more that MMO players have come to expect.

    (...)

    For better or worse, MMO players have come to expect a proper LFD-system on release as a basic feature. So I disagree with your statement.

    GW2 does have a LFG tool.  The fact it was made by the community and not Anet means little.

    It works great.  It fills the need for that function, leaving Anet to focus on other things.

     

     

    The statement refers to what GW2 gives and thus implying to what Arenanet implemented in GW2, not what the community did. 

    For every person who thinks a LFG tool is an important feature....there is another person that thinks a LFG tool is just a crutch  for the socially handicappped twitch society gamer .

    This ^.

    For starters many people attribute the LFG / LFR system to the downfall of WoW (the game which started that whole trend).

    Secondly, it's a design decision not neglect. Anet has repeatedly talked about why they are hesitant to put such a feature in the game. While they said they aren't completely opposed to putting in some form of the tool ingame, they actually don't want a full fledged LFG tool in the game. Why?

    Because LFG tools tend to turn games into lobby games. Just look @ WoW / TSW / Rift / Etc. People just sit in w/e the main city is, and wait for their que to pop. For a while, players did this in Lion's Arch while using the community based LFG tool. Now that Anet has adjusted how world bosses work, players are actually spending a lot of their time either in WvW or zone hoping around the world (which is exactly what Anet wants). They don't want everyone in one place, they want players spreading out around the world and experiencing the game in its entirety. This is exactly why dungeons exist in the newbie zones as well as the more obscure areas. They want players going to those areas to unlock the dungeons, and potentially helping out other people along the way.

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