Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

One character - all classes

2

Comments

  • MagiknightMagiknight Member CommonPosts: 782
    If you agree that an MMO should have a degree of permanence, then one toon is the best way to go. It makes you more invested in your single character. You will spend all your time working on this one character so you're invested in it. Also, everyone knows who you are. You wont want to start over with a new character because you've invested so much time and effort into this one character. If you're starting a character over again then all of the sudden you're a stranger to everyone. Starting over should be strongly discouraged in a persistent world.
  • YaevinduskYaevindusk Member RarePosts: 2,094

     

    There's still a reason to make alts if that's your sort of thing.  When you pick what Nation you want to start in, you'll most likely have Nation Specific quests to contend with for a short while as well.  Then there's the fact that Levequests were allotted to each character on something like a six Levequest per eight hour ratio or something.  It's likely lower than that, but this was mainly because you could earn expensive crafting materials or significant amounts of gil by doing them.  I'm not able to say how it is in Beta, but if the first version is any indication, the more characters you have the more Levequests you have access to and the more money you can make.  Though this isn't anything new, as it's a matter of how much work you put into something and the rewards you get from it.  

    Hard work = guaranteed extra spoils.

    In some games hard work does not always mean extra spoils, which makes me sad.  You could spend all night at something just for a chance to get an item that doesn't sell for much and you felt like you wasted the entire evening.  The less RNG something has, and the more hard, honest work it requires the better in my opinion.  Hard work will likely be well received if there is a proper reward to go hand and hand with it.

    Due to frequent travel in my youth, English isn't something I consider my primary language (and thus I obtained quirky ways of writing).  German and French were always easier for me despite my family being U.S. citizens for over a century.  Spanish I learned as a requirement in school, Japanese and Korean I acquired for my youthful desire of anime and gaming (and also work now).  I only debate in English to help me work with it (and limit things).  In addition, I'm not smart enough to remain fluent in everything and typically need exposure to get in the groove of things again if I haven't heard it in a while.  If you understand Mandarin, I know a little, but it has actually been a challenge and could use some help.

    Also, I thoroughly enjoy debates and have accounts on over a dozen sites for this.  If you wish to engage in such, please put effort in a post and provide sources -- I will then do the same with what I already wrote (if I didn't) as well as with my responses to your own.  Expanding my information on a subject makes my stance either change or strengthen the next time I speak of it or write a thesis.  Allow me to thank you sincerely for your time.
  • AlberelAlberel Member Posts: 1,121
    Originally posted by Yaevindusk

     

    There's still a reason to make alts if that's your sort of thing.  When you pick what Nation you want to start in, you'll most likely have Nation Specific quests to contend with for a short while as well.  Then there's the fact that Levequests were allotted to each character on something like a six Levequest per eight hour ratio or something.  It's likely lower than that, but this was mainly because you could earn expensive crafting materials or significant amounts of gil by doing them.  I'm not able to say how it is in Beta, but if the first version is any indication, the more characters you have the more Levequests you have access to and the more money you can make.  Though this isn't anything new, as it's a matter of how much work you put into something and the rewards you get from it.  

    Hard work = guaranteed extra spoils.

    In some games hard work does not always mean extra spoils, which makes me sad.  You could spend all night at something just for a chance to get an item that doesn't sell for much and you felt like you wasted the entire evening.  The less RNG something has, and the more hard, honest work it requires the better in my opinion.  Hard work will likely be well received if there is a proper reward to go hand and hand with it.

    I thought they removed the limits on leves?

  • nbtscannbtscan Member UncommonPosts: 862
    Originally posted by Alberel
    I thought they removed the limits on leves?

    In 1.0 you could accumulate up to 99 of them, but they still accrued at the rate of 4 every 12 hours.  They haven't announced how it's changed in ARR yet.

  • aesperusaesperus Member UncommonPosts: 5,135
    Originally posted by BadSpock

    You know, I am starting to think more and more that the way FFXI and FFXIV do the whole "one character, switch to any combination of class/builds etc." is really the way to go.

    I've got like... 3 level 85's and a level 89 in WoW I'm trying to level to 90 - but I keep finding myself seeing another player and being all like... "Man, I should level my Paladin..." or "Man, I should level my Priest..."

    It's SO much work, and it is nothing but 100% redundant / nausia inducing tedium to level multiple toons through the same content over, and over, and over again.

    Not to mention gearing them up, building reputation, and for the love of Jesus grinding through professions and secondaries...

    I hate it.

    And in the end, I want a character that heals like a Priest, Tanks like a Paladin, and DPS' like a Elemental Shaman.

    #firstworldproblems I know

    But I'm starting to really, really like the idea of "one character to rule them all" if anything just for the consistency.

    You do realize that the difference between lvling multiple characters through the same content (WoW), and lvling 1 character through the same content repeatedly (FFXI) is actually quite minimal. Either way you are still repeating the same content to lvl up each class.

    I do like FFXI's system, but it sounds like what you're looking for might be closer to what GW1 had. Lvl up once, and be free to customize whatever class you want. While I did enjoy FFXI's class system, it was one of the most tedious & grindy forms of class progression.

    - Really the biggest difference between having one character or many, is storage space.

  • sketocafesketocafe Member UncommonPosts: 950
    I love this. My first MMO was MXO and I still don't get why most devs want me to make a completely different character just to do something different. Freedom is a good thing.
  • AlberelAlberel Member Posts: 1,121

    Originally posted by nbtscan

    Originally posted by Alberel
    I thought they removed the limits on leves?

    In 1.0 you could accumulate up to 99 of them, but they still accrued at the rate of 4 every 12 hours.  They haven't announced how it's changed in ARR yet.

    Ah yes, I remember now, thanks for clarifying.

    Originally posted by aesperus

    You do realize that the difference between lvling multiple characters through the same content (WoW), and lvling 1 character through the same content repeatedly (FFXI) is actually quite minimal. Either way you are still repeating the same content to lvl up each class.

    I do like FFXI's system, but it sounds like what you're looking for might be closer to what GW1 had. Lvl up once, and be free to customize whatever class you want. While I did enjoy FFXI's class system, it was one of the most tedious & grindy forms of class progression.

    - Really the biggest difference between having one character or many, is storage space.

    In terms of basic gameplay yes it's not much different.

    However you seem to be overlooking the fact that you never have to repeat storyline content, you never have to fight the same boss for the same drop, you are instantly recognised by everyone you meet because you still have the same name and every additional job you levelled on one character unlocked new sub-job possibilities across the board. That's all ignoring the psychological effect of always playing the same character which helps with immersion and makes the player more invested in the game.

    The benefits of the system may be subtle but there are nothing but benefits. There's honestly no reason why every MMO shouldn't adopt the same system as it's just plain superior.

  • Keitaro333Keitaro333 Member UncommonPosts: 36
    Originally posted by Alberel

    However you seem to be overlooking the fact that you never have to repeat storyline content, you never have to fight the same boss for the same drop, you are instantly recognised by everyone you meet because you still have the same name and every additional job you levelled on one character unlocked new sub-job possibilities across the board. That's all ignoring the psychological effect of always playing the same character which helps with immersion and makes the player more invested in the game.

    The benefits of the system may be subtle but there are nothing but benefits. There's honestly no reason why every MMO shouldn't adopt the same system as it's just plain superior.

    Oh but it does have a disadvantage - i'll never play the game because i'll be stuck on the character creation screen not knowing what to pick. And when i'll say screw it, it doesnt matter that much and finally play, i'll later hate myself for not picking "that other thing". :D

    I know, its just race and gender but its fun to have different ones with different armor designs and all that.

    But yeah, the single character thing has many advantages.

    And speaking of boss drops, how was it done in FFXI/XIV 1.0 in dungeons when looting? Do you "need" all items because theyre all theoretically usable by you? (even if you dont have said class leveled yet)  Cuz we can all see how this could be a problem in some parties.

    O is it restricted by the game itself that you cant take a BOP item if you dont have the class yet?

  • AlberelAlberel Member Posts: 1,121
    Originally posted by Keitaro333
    Originally posted by Alberel

    However you seem to be overlooking the fact that you never have to repeat storyline content, you never have to fight the same boss for the same drop, you are instantly recognised by everyone you meet because you still have the same name and every additional job you levelled on one character unlocked new sub-job possibilities across the board. That's all ignoring the psychological effect of always playing the same character which helps with immersion and makes the player more invested in the game.

    The benefits of the system may be subtle but there are nothing but benefits. There's honestly no reason why every MMO shouldn't adopt the same system as it's just plain superior.

    Oh but it does have a disadvantage - i'll never play the game because i'll be stuck on the character creation screen not knowing what to pick. And when i'll say screw it, it doesnt matter that much and finally play, i'll later hate myself for not picking "that other thing". :D

    I know, its just race and gender but its fun to have different ones with different armor designs and all that.

    But yeah, the single character thing has many advantages.

    And speaking of boss drops, how was it done in FFXI/XIV 1.0 in dungeons when looting? Do you "need" all items because theyre all theoretically usable by you? (even if you dont have said class leveled yet)  Cuz we can all see how this could be a problem in some parties.

    O is it restricted by the game itself that you cant take a BOP item if you dont have the class yet?

    I don't know how it was in XIV but in XI it was usually just down to the groups to set their own loot rules ahead of time. Typically you were only given priority on loot for your 'main' job, which was usually the job you were playing at the time, though different linkshells operated differently. It was rare to see PUGs form for slaying a boss for a specific drop though; it was nearly always a linkshell farming it for a specific member.

    I'm hoping that XIV has different loot rulesets that the party leader can set at the start. In XI you played nice because if you didn't you'd probably never get another party. XIV is a little less harsh in that respect which means the game needs stronger systems in place to prevent ninja-looting.

  • XiaokiXiaoki Member EpicPosts: 3,823


    Originally posted by Epic1oots
    One character all class is the best! rather than working multiple jobs on a account, you can just focus on your character and build his/her story. I also had multiple classes for wow, and it sure was lame to have to do the same achievements twice, thrice, heck 8 times!! especially when theres rewards for certain achievements!
    Yeah, and that character's story is the same as everyone elses "jack of all trades, master of none".


    Your character has no identity and no personality because you can freely swap between all classes.


    Your character is not "Grock Highshield the Immovable Tank" its actually more like "Grock Whatever the It Doesnt Matter".

  • MuruganMurugan Member Posts: 1,494
    Originally posted by Xiaoki

     


    Originally posted by Epic1oots
    One character all class is the best! rather than working multiple jobs on a account, you can just focus on your character and build his/her story. I also had multiple classes for wow, and it sure was lame to have to do the same achievements twice, thrice, heck 8 times!! especially when theres rewards for certain achievements!

    Yeah, and that character's story is the same as everyone elses "jack of all trades, master of none".

     


    Your character has no identity and no personality because you can freely swap between all classes.


    Your character is not "Grock Highshield the Immovable Tank" its actually more like "Grock Whatever the It Doesnt Matter".

    Not even close sounds like you have never even played FFXI or FFXIV.

     

    Your character is what you make it, if you make it the "immovable tank" then great, if you manage to not only cap all jobs but play them extremely well and have them equipped then you would be "Grock Whatever the legendary badass".

     

    You seem to be confusing it with Rift or another branching game where one class can do everything... no it is not this, but one person given the dedication to do all the work to level a new class can without having to abandon their character.

     

    It doesn't take anything away... unless it totally ruins your immersion while you role play an individual who is physically limited to only do one thing ever no matter how much time and effort they put in.  In which case that is a role playing issue and can be solved by putting on your wizard hat and pretending.  The rest of us can enjoy the freedom to change classes if we want, without having to create an entirely different identity in order to do so.

  • TheocritusTheocritus Member LegendaryPosts: 9,739
    Doesn't one character all classes pretty much eliminate the need for other people?
  • MuruganMurugan Member Posts: 1,494
    Originally posted by Theocritus
    Doesn't one character all classes pretty much eliminate the need for other people?

    In what way?  You can't play them all at the same time, you can't switch in battle or in instances, and you aren't able to clone yourself.

     

    In every other MMO people create alts to play other classes the only difference is one forces you to log out, create another identity, then redo all content you have already completed in addition to leveling the new class you want to play.  It's pretty stupid actually considering there is no good reason for it other than to force people to replay content if they ever change their mind about what class they want to play.

  • taus01taus01 Member Posts: 1,352
    Originally posted by BadSpock

    You know, I am starting to think more and more that the way FFXI and FFXIV do the whole "one character, switch to any combination of class/builds etc." is really the way to go.

     

    It was always the way to go not only because it makes sense, but also because you actually develop a real connection with your character and not with a bunch of "toons". It's also a big plus for a community for obvious reasons.

    Why on earth no other game has ever adapted either the one Character all classes or the class/subclass combo system is a mystery to me. It's superior to anything else out there and the subclassing offers so much customization and individuality adding a whole new layer to the meta game.

    Probably one of the reasons FFXI still has 500k+ subscribers in a world where subscription MMOS are pretty much dead.

    "Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

    image
  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332

    It most certainly is the way to go,i don't like the idea of alts at all.

    It is possible however to ruin the design,FFXI did an amazing job with the sub class design.

    The next game i played that TRIED to do it was ROM,i think they  did an ok job considering it was most likely rushed because it is f2p.However it did fail big time in comparison to FFXI.

    The next game i tried  that did it was Rift,again it just seemed like little effort was actually put into the thought process.I was barely into the game and already had several options,imo i had too many and didn't deserve or earn any of it.

    When FFXI did it,they really thought it out to make sure you didn't break the game with any one sub class.They also made sure to keep the actual class as the important role by cutting the sub class in half.

    Really what this whole design does,is keep your player relevent for a MUCH longer time,this way people are not racing to end level in 3 weeks and crying about end game nonsense.

    There is of course more to the whole design,you have to make sure all the classes are fun to play and offer something unique,that way players WANT to play various classes instead of feeling the need to.

    The only con to this design is that it spoiled me in a big way.I have a really hard time accepting games now that put out less effort into the whole Character design.I look more for versatility and depth of combat than worrying about facial tattoos or scars or blue hair.

     

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • WizardryWizardry Member LegendaryPosts: 19,332
    Originally posted by rojo6934

    one character, all classes? i think Final Fantasy 5 did that. I love that.

    THis is brilliant. However, if i can switch to any class with one character, i assume they offer some sort of character customization in game? Im an altoholic so if i wont create more characters i expect to be able to change my appearance in game. Otherwise ill just keep gaming many characters with different looks :)

    FFXI is actually a direct copy/design of FFV.It started the whole sub class idea.You wil lnotice that one of the new classes the Geomancer is also from FFV.

    Well you can of course wear different gear/weapons that are appropriate to your class.

    It would actuall ybe silly to look liek a ttoally different player because well,your NOT a different player,youi are the same player.Al lthey do is allow you to learn more than one skill,it makes sense no reason why shouldn't be able to.

    Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.

  • PurutzilPurutzil Member UncommonPosts: 3,048

    I liked the way they did it with FFXI. I HATE how it is in 14. The whole 'attached to weapon' deal ruined what I view to be an amazing class system that 11 did having the cross classes and all.

     

    FFXIV had plenty of issues, but one of the biggest killers to me is they replaced the class system with one that just feels so icky... just feels tacked on and ruins the feeling of being a 'class' tacking it onto gear instead.

  • taus01taus01 Member Posts: 1,352
    Originally posted by Magiknight
    If you agree that an MMO should have a degree of permanence, then one toon is the best way to go. It makes you more invested in your single character. You will spend all your time working on this one character so you're invested in it. Also, everyone knows who you are. You wont want to start over with a new character because you've invested so much time and effort into this one character. If you're starting a character over again then all of the sudden you're a stranger to everyone. Starting over should be strongly discouraged in a persistent world.

    ^This! Could not have said it better.

    "Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

    image
  • JimmyYOJimmyYO Member UncommonPosts: 519
    Originally posted by BadSpock

    You know, I am starting to think more and more that the way FFXI and FFXIV do the whole "one character, switch to any combination of class/builds etc." is really the way to go.

    I've got like... 3 level 85's and a level 89 in WoW I'm trying to level to 90 - but I keep finding myself seeing another player and being all like... "Man, I should level my Paladin..." or "Man, I should level my Priest..."

    It's SO much work, and it is nothing but 100% redundant / nausia inducing tedium to level multiple toons through the same content over, and over, and over again.

    Not to mention gearing them up, building reputation, and for the love of Jesus grinding through professions and secondaries...

    I hate it.

    And in the end, I want a character that heals like a Priest, Tanks like a Paladin, and DPS' like a Elemental Shaman.

    #firstworldproblems I know

    But I'm starting to really, really like the idea of "one character to rule them all" if anything just for the consistency.

     

    I hate 1 character able to do everything because people consistently try to force you into roles you hate playing else you don't get in the group. Was a bad problem in FFXI that will be even worse in XIV since you can change on the spot.  Hard to even argue with them at this point it's just so easy to switch.

  • ThorkuneThorkune Member UncommonPosts: 1,969
    Does anyone have any information on how the old accounts work now? I had a collector's edition account prior to the reboot.
  • nbtscannbtscan Member UncommonPosts: 862
    Originally posted by Thorkune
    Does anyone have any information on how the old accounts work now? I had a collector's edition account prior to the reboot.

    It's been confirmed that unused buddy passes can be registered.  My assumption is that means unused main install codes should work too.

    They've also mentioned giving CE accounts a new redeemable item code.

  • redcloud16redcloud16 Member UncommonPosts: 220

    Originally posted by Thorkune
    Does anyone have any information on how the old accounts work now? I had a collector's edition account prior to the reboot.

    Originally posted by Epic1oots

    Originally posted by Thorkune
    Does anyone have any information on how the old accounts work now? I had a collector's edition account prior to the reboot.

    I am curious myself because If i have to rebuy FFXIV for ARR then I might rebuy it, seeing how it is very quest base lvling at least for the first job/class. And also I dont like my original sign-in account name i made, wish it was just base on email!!!. If we  could use the old FFXIV registration code then great, then i can make a new account. But if not.. idk, well see.

    If you bought the original game and had a service account, you will get a free download of ARR and free 30 days game time. As well as having your version 1.0 characters carried over (and a one time free recustomization). 

     

    It was mentioned in the last Live Letter that they are considering offering some sort of incentive to people who bought the original CE (but they did not go into any specifics), and they also mentioned they were going to have a new CE. 

     

    *Keep in mind that if you wish to play on PS3 with the same account, you will need to buy a copy for the PS3 version (PS3 and PC play together)

    image

  • ShortspellShortspell Member UncommonPosts: 78
    Originally posted by Yaevindusk

     

    Each job has it's own unique Artifact armor, in addition to the various armors within the game available through dungeons, boss fights, NPCS, the auction house, questing, levequests, Grand Company Seals and of course crafting.  Pretty much only Artifact armor is exclusive to jobs.  If your class is able to wear plate, it should be able to wear any type of plate.  You are also able to wear specific crafting gear that may look like fancy cloth and the like.  In the past you were able to pretty much wear any type of armor, even if you were the right level for it.  It just wouldn't be very effective since you didn't specialize in it.  I can't remember if that changed or not by 1.23, but I think it did start to restrict level and armor type with the new items that were introduced thenceforth.

     

     

     Do you have to have a different set of armour for every class/job you change to?  How would that work with bag space etc? 

     

  • RalstlinRalstlin Member UncommonPosts: 234
    Originally posted by Shortspell

     Do you have to have a different set of armour for every class/job you change to?  How would that work with bag space etc? 

    New client will have a system called: Armoury Board

    This system work as predefined gear sets, and because you change your class changing your weapon, this work too to change your class. So in the end, you only have to choose your gear set, and u will change your class and all your gear.

  • redcloud16redcloud16 Member UncommonPosts: 220
    Originally posted by Shortspell

     Do you have to have a different set of armour for every class/job you change to?  How would that work with bag space etc? 

    In version 1.0 you had to carry around your gear which was a pain, but IN believe in version 2 they said that you can have gear sets, that when equipped and saved into a set it doesn't take inventory space anymore. or something. 

     

    As the poster above me said, the Armory Board

    image

Sign In or Register to comment.