"Westernizing" the game.

Sheanix · April 2013

I'm curious about the term they use when talking about importing the game to North America. The term "westerize".

Im basically curious as to what it is meant when they say "westernize" a game. A lot of the complaints about western games recently is the about how they are all so similar and a lot of hype has already been generated around this game based on what players have seen (which is the game "un-westernized")

Is a "westernized" game just a matter of translation? Or will they be changing things that may change the views of potential buyers?

BeansnBread · April 2013

Probably mostly translation and the UI. Even though there is a substantial difference between the way western and eastern audiences view things, I doubt they are going to change the structure of the game significantly.

It already works and is a game. If it ain't broke, don't fix it and all that nonsense.

rojoArcueid · April 2013

westernize can be good and bad. Good because it while it still a grindfest it doesnt feel as heavy as an eastern mmo. And bad because its dumbed down to fit the majority of the western audience. And the company wants lots of money so... yeah.

Sheanix · April 2013

Fair enough. I guess we'll just have to see what changes are made. I do hope they go the "if it isn't broke, don't fix it route". Last thing the MMO world needs is an incredible looking game being reduced to the status quo of what the standard MMO is today.

Fingers crossed..

Scalpless · April 2013

They're unlikely to do any significant changes, because that would make updating the Western version more difficult. It'll most likely be just some numeric changes here and there, like increased drop rates of Loot X, better rewards for Activity Y, etc.

Could include some censorship, too, but AA doesn't seem to have any half-naked 10 years olds.

Hedeon · April 2013

they have already said they would be making changes to the game, though not talked specifics and claimed the changes they were going to make for the game, wouldnt just be for the western version, but for the korean version as well.

but will see what will happen, no matter how small changes there is implemented in a game, there will be someone who feel like it is a game changer, that always happen eventually no matter if it were trion, XLgames or any other publisher.

aRtFuLThinG · April 2013

Westernizing = allowing profanity and include a profanity filter for the kids.

GrayGhost79 · April 2013

Originally posted by Sheanix
I'm curious about the term they use when talking about importing the game to North America. The term "westerize".

Im basically curious as to what it is meant when they say "westernize" a game. A lot of the complaints about western games recently is the about how they are all so similar and a lot of hype has already been generated around this game based on what players have seen (which is the game "un-westernized")

Is a "westernized" game just a matter of translation? Or will they be changing things that may change the views of potential buyers?

Sadly in the past "Westernized" has meant a lot of things. One of the things it has meant rather often is turning the game into a quest heavy game. I hate this with a passion. A lot of eastern games are basically mob grinders, to westernize them they take the mob grind and convert it into quest hubs which of course kills the game for many.

Then you have the standard stuff. Censorship, Translations, Business Model, etc.

TribeofOne · April 2013

i do hope they "westernize" the Ui some.. I hate asian style uis.. i sometimes think there is ONLY 1 asian mmo UI and they incorparate it into to everygame they make. Horrible chat systems, no /ignore feature, pop ups, banners 2 dozen little flashing buttons around the minimap..etc

ugh

Sheanix · April 2013

From the sounds of it, there is legitimacy in my concern for the "westernization" of this game. It seems to be a pretty broad concept, from fixing the little things to changing the focus of the game.

I still think they should be very limited in the changes they make.. it has generated a ton of hype the way it is now and it would be very risky to change too much.

JimmyYO · April 2013

Whatever happened to just making a solid game? Making the game a themepark and a yearlong grindfest are both equally offensive.

Sheanix · April 2013

I agree. Having the best of both worlds would be nice but is highly unlikely. Endless grinding gets tiresome, and questing central games pretty much set every player down the same line distracting from other aspects of the game.

Personally, from what I've seen anyways, I wouldn't mind seeing it shipped as is in english.

CyclopsSlayer · April 2013

The only confirmed change announced so far Trion will be making, is adding some more 'Western' facial options in the char creator.

Beyond that, who knows...

Sheanix · April 2013

Originally posted by CyclopsSlayer
The only confirmed change announced so far Trion will be making, is adding some more 'Western' facial options in the char creator.

Beyond that, who knows...

Okay, visual and decorative things are okay. I wonder how the conversations go when discussing things of that nature..

"Okay, so.. we'd like to make the characters look... less... mmm.... asian..."

Siveria · April 2013

Westernizing the game usually ends up making it crap, they should just leave it how it is, as someone said in the thread "If it ain't broken don't try to fix it" because when they try to fix something that isin't broken they usually end up screwing it up.

Siveria · April 2013

Originally posted by Sheanix
Originally posted by CyclopsSlayer
The only confirmed change announced so far Trion will be making, is adding some more 'Western' facial options in the char creator.

Beyond that, who knows...

Okay, visual and decorative things are okay. I wonder how the conversations go when discussing things of that nature..

"Okay, so.. we'd like to make the characters look... less... mmm.... asian..."

Good goddess no, they do that and we'll end up with the generic muscle-bound moron male chars US devs are so fond of. Why not just add the faces insted of removing/replacing them.

Karteli · April 2013

There was this bit from a recent Q&A

http://www.mmoculture.com/2013/03/archeage-interview-with-trion-worlds-for-upcoming-epic-title/

In this interview, I will be looking to ask Trion Worlds some brief questions, such as why choose ArcheAge, the possible challenges and how the company is going to ramp up its services for this MMORPG epic.

Q: Are there plans to “change” any part of ArcheAge’s content during localization? Or is “westernization” a more appropriate word to use?

A: There’s a lot of conversation going on between Trion and XLGAMES on what makes sense to change. We don’t want to change the essence of the game, but we definitely want to give the Western audiences a game that is more … well .. Western

We’ve found out that XLGAMES had many of the same thoughts as us, so many of the changes will be game wide, not just for the West. We are also working with XLGAMES on some Western-specific changes, such as character creation options, which our players are expecting.

They say they aren't changing the essence of the game, which is a big plus.

Murugan · April 2013

Having regionalized versions of a game just seems to me like a terrible idea, whatever "weesternize" in this case means it means a different game from the original.

Especially for sub markets (like the western market is for ArcheAge) it is a huge disadvantage. I personally don't see why they can't run the same version of the game with multiple language options. This works for Final Fantasy's online games.

The end result is going to be poor support/updating, and a group of developers trying to "adapt" something "foreign", look at TERA/Aion for how well this works out for the "west"...

Sovrath · April 2013

Originally posted by Sheanix
I'm curious about the term they use when talking about importing the game to North America. The term "westerize".

Im basically curious as to what it is meant when they say "westernize" a game. A lot of the complaints about western games recently is the about how they are all so similar and a lot of hype has already been generated around this game based on what players have seen (which is the game "un-westernized")

Is a "westernized" game just a matter of translation? Or will they be changing things that may change the views of potential buyers?

It can depend.

One example that was given for Aion was a storyline that revolved around a son and a father. Might have been grandfather. It was explained that the deference for an elder wasn't quite as strong in Western cultures as it was in Eastern cultures. Because they didn't think Western audiences would feel the gravitas for the story, they changed it a bit.

My girlfriend who is of chinese heritage has told me that in chinese families, being the eldest, espcially as a son, has a greater importance. She also said that it's expected that the children, especially the oldest, have a duty to take care fo the parents, even if that meant paying their rent. Or something to that effect. So I can see them looking at cultural differences where there is story involved and realize that these detials might not resonate with western audiences.

Of course her family is mostly westernized but They still go to the cemetaries of their deceased elders and burn a dead chicken along with fake money.

Yup. they do that.

Murugan · April 2013

Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Sheanix
I'm curious about the term they use when talking about importing the game to North America. The term "westerize".

Im basically curious as to what it is meant when they say "westernize" a game. A lot of the complaints about western games recently is the about how they are all so similar and a lot of hype has already been generated around this game based on what players have seen (which is the game "un-westernized")

Is a "westernized" game just a matter of translation? Or will they be changing things that may change the views of potential buyers?

It can depend.

One example that was given for Aion was a storyline that revolved around a son and a father. Might have been grandfather. It was explained that the deference for an elder wasn't quite as strong in Western cultures as it was in Eastern cultures.

My girlfriend who is of chinese heritage has told me that in chinese families, being the eldest, espcially as a son, has a greater importance. She also said that it's expected that the children, especially the oldest, had a duty to take care fo the parents, even if that meant paying their rent. Or something to that effect.

Of course her family is mostly westernized but They still go to the cemetaries of their deceased elders and burn a dead chicken along with fake money.

Yup. they do that.

Thank god here in the west we just toss our parents out into the streets. I know I for one would not understand a story about a father and a son... I mean who cares about their stupid parents LOL.

/sarcasm

It is almost as insulting when Korean/Chinese developers talk about "western culture and gaming preferences" as it is when people on this forum go all racist over "Asian grinders!!!!".

Karteli · April 2013

Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Sheanix
I'm curious about the term they use when talking about importing the game to North America. The term "westerize".

Im basically curious as to what it is meant when they say "westernize" a game. A lot of the complaints about western games recently is the about how they are all so similar and a lot of hype has already been generated around this game based on what players have seen (which is the game "un-westernized")

Is a "westernized" game just a matter of translation? Or will they be changing things that may change the views of potential buyers?

It can depend.

One example that was given for Aion was a storyline that revolved around a son and a father. Might have been grandfather. It was explained that the deference for an elder wasn't quite as strong in Western cultures as it was in Eastern cultures.

My girlfriend who is of chinese heritage has told me that in chinese families, being the eldest, espcially as a son, has a greater importance. She also said that it's expected that the children, especially the oldest, had a duty to take care fo the parents, even if that meant paying their rent. Or something to that effect.

Of course her family is mostly westernized but They still go to the cemetaries of their deceased elders and burn a dead chicken along with fake money.

Yup. they do that.

I don't know enough about Korean customs and beliefs, but I do recall there had to be an Easternized version of WoW for the Chinese, because stuff like graveyards were taboo (with a curse?), and any reference to the Dead or the Living Dead had to be completely removed - skeletons, etc. Some other things too.

If it's kept just as culture changes to Westernize, that'd be OK. All the same, if that were the case, I wish they would just have said so

birdycephon · April 2013

I wish they would stop removing features from games. I cant give any examples in this game cuz I dont know any details, but there have been a number of asinine changes done to other games I'm vexxed about like screwing up or removing some character customization features just to name one.

Sovrath · April 2013

Originally posted by Murugan
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by Sheanix
I'm curious about the term they use when talking about importing the game to North America. The term "westerize".

Im basically curious as to what it is meant when they say "westernize" a game. A lot of the complaints about western games recently is the about how they are all so similar and a lot of hype has already been generated around this game based on what players have seen (which is the game "un-westernized")

Is a "westernized" game just a matter of translation? Or will they be changing things that may change the views of potential buyers?

It can depend.

One example that was given for Aion was a storyline that revolved around a son and a father. Might have been grandfather. It was explained that the deference for an elder wasn't quite as strong in Western cultures as it was in Eastern cultures.

My girlfriend who is of chinese heritage has told me that in chinese families, being the eldest, espcially as a son, has a greater importance. She also said that it's expected that the children, especially the oldest, had a duty to take care fo the parents, even if that meant paying their rent. Or something to that effect.

Of course her family is mostly westernized but They still go to the cemetaries of their deceased elders and burn a dead chicken along with fake money.

Yup. they do that.

Thank god here in the west we just toss our parents out into the streets. I know I for one would not understand a story about a father and a son... I mean who cares about their stupid parents LOL.

/sarcasm

It is almost as insulting when Korean/Chinese developers talk about "western culture and gaming preferences" as it is when people on this forum go all racist over "Asian grinders!!!!".

I think you are taking it to the wrong place.

It's not about "not caring about your parnets" and in the case of the particular story the details are fuzzy as it was a long time ago, but it dealt more with a level of shame and sense of duty and I believe "deference" to the elder. We in the west don't always feel that deference if at all.

so for instance, have you automatically started taking care of your parents? Assuming the bills and giving them an allowance because it's your place to do so? Even if they don't need it? Or do you wait until you think they need it and give them money, making sure they are ok. This is assuming they are eldery/retired.

You might even, automatically have them move in with you as a matter of course. This was explained to me as well. Also, in a chinese family a child is still a child (no matter the age) until they get married. I'm fuzzy about the details but I think they move out once they get married but stay in the household until then.

A friend of mine from Jordan once told me that not only was he expecting/expected to take care of his parents but he was going to build another level on their house so that his parents did not have to move and he could then make sure he was there to take care of all their needs.

What we are talking about here are not the larger points such as "kids love their parents and take care of them" but the details, the how and why. Sense of duty and sense of shame seems to be big over there. We obviouisly have duty and of course feel shame but it doesn't seem to be a deep seated cultural thing.

You'd have to ask someone who was asian and who had strong ties to traditioin to get a better explanation.

JimmyYO · April 2013

How do you Westernize character creation, make them fat? lol Ok that was in bad taste.

Vorthanion · April 2013

From past experience, most "Westernized" games were primarily translations, with maybe a tweak here and there. This time though, we have Trion doing the Westernizing and that could mean a much more robust tweaking of the game to better fit the target audience. One thing I can say about Trion is that they aren't a company of slackers. They are obviously willing to put in the extra effort required to make money.

Sovrath · April 2013

Originally posted by Murugan

Thank god here in the west we just toss our parents out into the streets. I know I for one would not understand a story about a father and a son... I mean who cares about their stupid parents LOL.

lol, and actually I've told my mother I'm putting her on an ice flow when the time comes.

It will be a cold day in hell before she moves in with me.

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