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PvE in CU not completely axed?

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  • AdorianBladeAdorianBlade kalamazoo, MIPosts: 62Member
    Originally posted by Baleout

    Yes PvE is the same in every game  but PvP is the same in every game also.

    So with out both in the game it will fail in 6 months so i wont be wasting any time or money on this one.

    Good to know i guess, I was under the assumption there are still people playing DAOC and having played that game myself for many a year, it sure ain't for the PvE. 

     

    RVR / PvP evolves as every player behind a keyboard is constantly learning new tricts/skills/resoloutions to new problems. This coupled with a non-structured enviroment, ala open relam, gives players the unique chance to write a new story everytime they venture out into the realm.

     

    PvE by its very nature is scripted and the only time you have a story is when somebody makes a mistake or a bug facotrs into the event.

     

  • ZinzanZinzan NorthPosts: 1,351Member
    Originally posted by AdorianBlade

           First off let me preface this whole post by saying I’m excited for the direction of CU and am going to be funding the Kick Starter attempt.

            I wanted to ask if there was any post by MJ or CSE that states this game will have no PvE. I have read all the FP’s and nowhere is there a definitive answer to that question. Three is a definitive statement that says we won’t have class leveling determined by PvE which is cool and another post that states there will be damn few NPC’s in general which is also cool.  Enclosed below are the citations I’m referring to:

     

    “no PvE leveling/gear grind) because I believe that will make this a better game for our niche.” (FP1)

    Secondly, to make sure that the first point is followed, let’s just say that there are no NPC drops at all and damn few NPCs.” (FP2)

         

           What leads me to believe that this game will have some, albeit very little, PvE elements are the consistent hints to it throughout, and the lack of definitive clarification otherwise. While I understand this game will have no Traditional PvE, which is not to say it won’t have any I’m lead to conclude that we may have some more “oldschool” PvE, ala world raids and drops for maybe crafting? Citations are below highlighted in red to clarify my point.

               

     “no PvE leveling/gear grind) because I believe that will make this a better game for our niche.” (FP1)

    “The best way to accomplish this is to ensure that there are no drops of powerful items from NPCs.Secondly, to make sure that the first point is followed, let’s just say that there are no NPC drops at all and damn few NPCs.” (FP2)

    “You will get rewards for killing other players, other players’ helpers and some stuff in the world but it won’t be gear and we will also not offer tokens.”(FP2)

    “And if that is not enough, well, we will have some other things that you can do but we are an RvR-focused game”(FP2)

           

           There are quite a few points made that would lead one to believe no PvE at all, which for clarification doesn’t bother me in the least, however I’m not going to believe there won’t be any. I could easily see open world dragon raids taking place in the middle of a realm war for the chance to slay said dragon for his heart and scales to get to some artisan crafters. The rub of course being that dragons are rare and every other realm is trying to stop you from doing it because they want that blood, scales, and heart.

     

    “maybe there are some rather powerful beings that even do more than simply building and destroying structures.”(FP11)

     

    If someone has seen something definitive I’m all ears.

    TL;DR I don’t think PvE is 100% out only 98%

    How much time did you put into this nonsensical post? You wasted every second I'm afraid, as did I reading it.

    we all know there will be some form of pve but we simply don't know if it'll be as small as bashing down keep doors or something more.

    bottom line, it's a pvp game......until they change their philosophy.

    Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy :)

  • StrommStromm BrisbanePosts: 243Member
    Originally posted by Arbroath
    Originally posted by Daizedd
    I think there will definitely creatures around cuz otherwise forests/wilderness will look pretty darn lifeless. Once you have creatures there you gotta have the option of killing 'em, just wouldn't be realistic otherwise. Once you can kill 'em you gotta be able to skin 'em.

    Quite true. There will be, I'm sure, leather type armor. Of course the only way to get leather is by hunting/killing animals. Unless of course we will be raising cattle. Which to me seems quite boring. :) Also many games use bone as an early crafting mat. Of course that doesn't mean CU will be using any of this, but, it seems logical. I love the idea of the dragons being a raid type event as well. Just make sure I get the scales. I promise I'll make you something spectacular. OOh and the teeth, and claws, and blood. Ohh and the heart, I want the heart too. Im not sure what I'll make with it, but I want that too. 

    Such a carebear. :-) People are animals too no? Puts a whole new spin on racial crafting does it not?

    To quote Soylent Green, "Oh my god, it's people! It's made of people!".

     

  • BowbowDAoCBowbowDAoC Granby, QCPosts: 470Member

    Funny how many people come an debate on a game they dont believe in....i dont care about weightlfiters, butterflies and stamps, and i'll never go visit a web site about it, even less a forum to discuss those things.

     

    image

    Bowbow (kob hunter) Infecto (kob cave shammy) and Thurka (troll warrior) on Merlin/Midgard DAoC
    Thurka on WAR

    image

  • GishgeronGishgeron Princeton, KYPosts: 1,287Member

      I know this is off-topic...but it really blew me away for a second.  I've been around here for a really long time, and when I saw this thread title I seriously had to double check to make sure I hadn't stumbled into the SWG graveyard by accident.  This game is gonna give me flashbacks, I can see that now. 

      Carry on, sorry to intrude.

    image

  • tinuelletinuelle bergenPosts: 287Member Uncommon
    I'm sure There will be lots of PvE in CU like when you launch your CU-Brutalizor XXL 580 mm trebuchet straight at that keep you are siegeing. Now that is what i call PvE!!!

    image
  • OldskooOldskoo Minneapolis, MNPosts: 189Member
    Originally posted by BowbowDAoC

    Funny how many people come an debate on a game they dont believe in....i dont care about weightlfiters, butterflies and stamps, and i'll never go visit a web site about it, even less a forum to discuss those things.

     

    +1

    image

  • FoggyeFoggye Portland, ORPosts: 95Member
    Originally posted by PRX_sklurb
    I would expect there to be some hazards out on the playing field. NPC guards, patrols, I could even seen two zergs fighting each other and someone getting feared into a camp of grannies, training them back to the group.   ;)

    Oh the memories..

  • waynejr2waynejr2 West Toluca Lake, CAPosts: 4,474Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by BowbowDAoC

    Funny how many people come an debate on a game they dont believe in....i dont care about weightlfiters, butterflies and stamps, and i'll never go visit a web site about it, even less a forum to discuss those things.

     

     sad, but true.

  • StilerStiler Athens, TNPosts: 599Member

    I REALLY hope there's something unique about the PVE creatures and things in this game.

     

    Perhaps allow the GM's/Developers to control them from time to tiem and interact with the players?

     

    I believe MArk already mentioned about there being Dragon's.

     

    Imagine for example having a huuuuuuuge RVR battle going on and then a dragon swoops down from the skies and just starts laying waste to both sides, and then people have ot decide to keep fighting, run away, or fight the dragon.

     

    So many great elements that could happen if the epic npc creatures were handled by developers and did things like that.

     

    That's one thing I always thought would be fun, if you were a developer, being able to interact with your players and control creatures and do unique things (that players can't) , it'd be fun  not only for hte developer i'd think but the players as well. Since it'd be random, wouldn't happen all the time and would provide special content that you just don't get anywhere else.

  • binskkibinskki Bourbonnais, ILPosts: 153Member
    Originally posted by BowbowDAoC

    Funny how many people come an debate on a game they dont believe in....i dont care about weightlfiters, butterflies and stamps, and i'll never go visit a web site about it, even less a forum to discuss those things.

     

    What about weightlifters who collect butterfly stamps?  Now that would be a forum. ;)

  • belatucadrosbelatucadros Toronto, ONPosts: 263Member
    true story: I saw a weightlifter with a butterfly tramp stamp. Does that count?

    Eldritch, Nightshade, Warden, Druid, Mauler, Mentalist
    Sorcerer, Necromancer, Theurgist, Armsman, Cleric
    Healer, Warrior, Skald

  • GrayGhost79GrayGhost79 Webster, MAPosts: 4,813Member
    Originally posted by BowbowDAoC

    Funny how many people come an debate on a game they dont believe in....i dont care about weightlfiters, butterflies and stamps, and i'll never go visit a web site about it, even less a forum to discuss those things.

     

    Believe it or not there are a lot of old DAoC players that simply don't like what they've heard so far. Some sounds good, some sounds bad. Not believing in the current development philosophy does not equate to no interest in the game. I keep checking to see if the good for me out weighs the bad yet, until that happens I won't believe in the game but that doesn't mean I won't check in on it or discuss it. 

     

    As far as the topic goes, having next to no PvE content doesn't seem any better than no PvE content for those complaining about the lack of PvE in CU so in the end I think its a wasted effort. When you have to grasp at calling things like Doors and such the PvE content... well you might as well say PvE is non existent. 

  • meddyckmeddyck Athens, GAPosts: 1,140Member Uncommon

    It better be completely axed aside from gathering crafting mats. There's a reason "no PvE" is mentioned in FPs #1 and #2: it's that important to the game concept. If the game had significant PvE, it'd be just another WAR, GW 2, or TESO. I might still play a CU with PvE at release, but I damn well wouldn't donate more to Kickstarter for it than it would take to get a digital copy of the game. Or more likely I would wait to try it in beta before deciding to buy. But since no PvE is a crucial part of CU, I'll be donating a good bit more than the $25 minimum needed for a digital copy of the game.

    There are a number of games that target players who like RvR and PvE (listed above). CU is a game being made for those who primarily like RvR. It's targeting current players of DAOC and WAR along with some GW 2 WvWers and former DAOC players who look back on the RvR part of that game with nostalgia and wish there was a modern MMO that had something similar.

    This is no doubt not as large a population as the number of players who would like a new WOW. But that's okay. Blizzard is perfectly capable of creating WOW 2 when it's ready. In the meantime it's great that CSE is trying to create a game for the thousands of us who aren't into grinding quests to level cap then grinding instances or raids to get the best gear before we can go RvR.

    Camelot Unchained Backer
    DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  • DaizeddDaizedd Salon de ProvencePosts: 142Member
    Originally posted by meddyck

    It better be completely axed aside from gathering crafting mats. There's a reason "no PvE" is mentioned in FPs #1 and #2: it's that important to the game concept. If the game had significant PvE, it'd be just another WAR, GW 2, or TESO. I might still play a CU with PvE at release, but I damn well wouldn't donate more to Kickstarter for it than it would take to get a digital copy of the game. Or more likely I would wait to try it in beta before deciding to buy. But since no PvE is a crucial part of CU, I'll be donating a good bit more than the $25 minimum needed for a digital copy of the game.

    There are a number of games that target players who like RvR and PvE (listed above). CU is a game being made for those who primarily like RvR. It's targeting current players of DAOC and WAR along with some GW 2 WvWers and former DAOC players who look back on the RvR part of that game with nostalgia and wish there was a modern MMO that had something similar.

    This is no doubt not as large a population as the number of players who would like a new WOW. But that's okay. Blizzard is perfectly capable of creating WOW 2 when it's ready. In the meantime it's great that CSE is trying to create a game for the thousands of us who aren't into grinding quests to level cap then grinding instances or raids to get the best gear before we can go RvR.

    QFT!

    You want PvP + PvE, hell its been done umpteen times, go play those other games. Oh wait, you say PvP isn't that great in those other games? I wonder why?

    image
  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Boca Raton, FLPosts: 4,504Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by meddyck

    It better be completely axed aside from gathering crafting mats. There's a reason "no PvE" is mentioned in FPs #1 and #2: it's that important to the game concept. If the game had significant PvE, it'd be just another WAR, GW 2, or TESO. I might still play a CU with PvE at release, but I damn well wouldn't donate more to Kickstarter for it than it would take to get a digital copy of the game. Or more likely I would wait to try it in beta before deciding to buy. But since no PvE is a crucial part of CU, I'll be donating a good bit more than the $25 minimum needed for a digital copy of the game.

    There are a number of games that target players who like RvR and PvE (listed above). CU is a game being made for those who primarily like RvR. It's targeting current players of DAOC and WAR along with some GW 2 WvWers and former DAOC players who look back on the RvR part of that game with nostalgia and wish there was a modern MMO that had something similar.

    This is no doubt not as large a population as the number of players who would like a new WOW. But that's okay. Blizzard is perfectly capable of creating WOW 2 when it's ready. In the meantime it's great that CSE is trying to create a game for the thousands of us who aren't into grinding quests to level cap then grinding instances or raids to get the best gear before we can go RvR.

     One of the best features of early DAoC was Darkness Falls...

     

    What made DAoC special to me was that it got PvE and RvR done RIGHT!  The RvR had an impact on gameplay for the whole realm, either through relic bonuses or by access to Darkness Falls...

     

    "I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

    Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  • belatucadrosbelatucadros Toronto, ONPosts: 263Member
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Originally posted by meddyck

    It better be completely axed aside from gathering crafting mats. There's a reason "no PvE" is mentioned in FPs #1 and #2: it's that important to the game concept. If the game had significant PvE, it'd be just another WAR, GW 2, or TESO. I might still play a CU with PvE at release, but I damn well wouldn't donate more to Kickstarter for it than it would take to get a digital copy of the game. Or more likely I would wait to try it in beta before deciding to buy. But since no PvE is a crucial part of CU, I'll be donating a good bit more than the $25 minimum needed for a digital copy of the game.

    There are a number of games that target players who like RvR and PvE (listed above). CU is a game being made for those who primarily like RvR. It's targeting current players of DAOC and WAR along with some GW 2 WvWers and former DAOC players who look back on the RvR part of that game with nostalgia and wish there was a modern MMO that had something similar.

    This is no doubt not as large a population as the number of players who would like a new WOW. But that's okay. Blizzard is perfectly capable of creating WOW 2 when it's ready. In the meantime it's great that CSE is trying to create a game for the thousands of us who aren't into grinding quests to level cap then grinding instances or raids to get the best gear before we can go RvR.

     One of the best features of early DAoC was Darkness Falls...

     

    What made DAoC special to me was that it got PvE and RvR done RIGHT!  The RvR had an impact on gameplay for the whole realm, either through relic bonuses or by access to Darkness Falls...

     

    I wouldn't say DAOC's PVE was done 'right', especially once we start looking at expansions. And I don't think RVR impacted PVE all that much (unless you were doing it in the frontier, for which there was little reason)

    I've said it in other threads but I will repeat here: Yes, I have fond memories from PVEing. Lots of people say that when they hear there's not going to be any.

    HOWEVER, why were you PVEing to create those memories?

    - RVR imbalance (this covers many, many things)

    - Needed gear

    - Levelling someone/something

    Very rarely did "for the lulz" enter into the discussion of why I might PVE. Hell look at the people who exclusively play battlegrounds - or at least used to - they stop levelling as soon as they are able, then start over when they cap out.

    Assuming they don't just PL at redcaps or something, and get a group of friends together - they may well have fun levelling. But they'd have just as much fun if they could all RVR together, I wager - if not more

    Eldritch, Nightshade, Warden, Druid, Mauler, Mentalist
    Sorcerer, Necromancer, Theurgist, Armsman, Cleric
    Healer, Warrior, Skald

  • binskkibinskki Bourbonnais, ILPosts: 153Member
    Originally posted by belatucadros
    true story: I saw a weightlifter with a butterfly tramp stamp. Does that count?

    LOL. :)

     

    Quite seriously, though...anyone who thinks that PvP is necessarily the same over and over has been playing the wrong games.

     

    [edit for anoying typo]

  • AdorianBladeAdorianBlade kalamazoo, MIPosts: 62Member
    Originally posted by Slapshot1188
    Originally posted by meddyck

    It better be completely axed aside from gathering crafting mats. There's a reason "no PvE" is mentioned in FPs #1 and #2: it's that important to the game concept. If the game had significant PvE, it'd be just another WAR, GW 2, or TESO. I might still play a CU with PvE at release, but I damn well wouldn't donate more to Kickstarter for it than it would take to get a digital copy of the game. Or more likely I would wait to try it in beta before deciding to buy. But since no PvE is a crucial part of CU, I'll be donating a good bit more than the $25 minimum needed for a digital copy of the game.

    There are a number of games that target players who like RvR and PvE (listed above). CU is a game being made for those who primarily like RvR. It's targeting current players of DAOC and WAR along with some GW 2 WvWers and former DAOC players who look back on the RvR part of that game with nostalgia and wish there was a modern MMO that had something similar.

    This is no doubt not as large a population as the number of players who would like a new WOW. But that's okay. Blizzard is perfectly capable of creating WOW 2 when it's ready. In the meantime it's great that CSE is trying to create a game for the thousands of us who aren't into grinding quests to level cap then grinding instances or raids to get the best gear before we can go RvR.

     One of the best features of early DAoC was Darkness Falls...

     

    What made DAoC special to me was that it got PvE and RvR done RIGHT!  The RvR had an impact on gameplay for the whole realm, either through relic bonuses or by access to Darkness Falls...

     

    I liked these Feaures of DAOC however Passive PvE bonuses wont be needed as such, and DF is the only thing i will miss. but the scuttlebut is something similar may appear to DF, maybe as a crafting supplement and a supplement to open world RVR?

     

    Also in response to Meddyck, FP1 and 2 don't anywhere say no PvE, it says no PvE for leveling and few NPC's that is not the same and i'm fine with limited non traditional style PvE.

  • SpeelySpeely Seattle, WAPosts: 861Member
    As much as we all like to speculate about PvE and it's presence (or lack thereof) in CU, I think it's safe to say this is one issue where Mark and CSE might remain quiet because they are planning something unique in regard to this, whether it be a creative integration of dynamic PvE events into the overall framework of open-world RvR or a persistent, lore-based PvE threat from beyond the Veil that acts almost as a fourth faction (hello, dragons,) or any combination of those/any ideas. I feel like there will be something that the game world's lore will have to add to flavor and dynamics aside from background.

    I just don't think they are fessing yet, and likely won't until the latter stages of development, which is probably a good thing.

    This is all kinda derived from MJ's comment on these boards stating (paraphrased) that "maybe" there are powerful brings in the world not concerned with crafting or building (wish I could find the exact quote, but it was a fun lil teaser.)

    Of course, there is a very real chance that there will be none of this. We'll see how funding goes.
  • SpeelySpeely Seattle, WAPosts: 861Member
    "Powerful beings", not "brings." Ugh.
  • binskkibinskki Bourbonnais, ILPosts: 153Member
    There might be powerful brings in the world, too.  You never know. :)
  • SorninSornin Richmond, BCPosts: 1,133Member
    Originally posted by PerfArt
    As much as we all like to speculate about PvE and it's presence (or lack thereof) in CU, I think it's safe to say this is one issue where Mark and CSE might remain quiet because they are planning something unique in regard to this, whether it be a creative integration of dynamic PvE events into the overall framework of open-world RvR or a persistent, lore-based PvE threat from beyond the Veil that acts almost as a fourth faction (hello, dragons,) or any combination of those/any ideas. I feel like there will be something that the game world's lore will have to add to flavor and dynamics aside from background.

    I just don't think they are fessing yet, and likely won't until the latter stages of development, which is probably a good thing.

    This is all kinda derived from MJ's comment on these boards stating (paraphrased) that "maybe" there are powerful brings in the world not concerned with crafting or building (wish I could find the exact quote, but it was a fun lil teaser.)

    Of course, there is a very real chance that there will be none of this. We'll see how funding goes.

    It is funny you mention the "fourth faction" as an NPC faction. I think this is a very real possibility, depending on funding.

    I am not saying Firefall is a fantastic game, but for those who have played it and know what I am talking about, the concept of the Chosen as an enemy faction is sort of neat. They "randomly" attack and mix things up. Something like this could work in Camelot Unchained. It would not be grindy PvE in the traditional sense, but more of a fourth realm that is the wildcard.

    You could be going about your day, seemingly safe, when "something" from beyond the veil rips through and pandemonium ensues. Suddenly, you are no longer out collecting stuff for crafting, but running for your life as these creatures attack. Or, during a siege, some of these things show up and throw a wrench into the plans of both sides.

    Mark did mention chaos and such, well, there it is.

    image

  • OldskooOldskoo Minneapolis, MNPosts: 189Member
    Originally posted by binskki
    There might be powerful brings in the world, too.  You never know. :)

    Everyone knows "brings" are OP - that goes without stating ;)

    image

  • SpeelySpeely Seattle, WAPosts: 861Member
    Lol silliness :)

    @Sornin: interesting. I could see that being (bring?) a random chance that increases with population and map dominance. Lore-wise, it could be explained as entities from beyond the Veil being more likely to take notice of mortal threats the more dominant they become. It could actually be a notable part of the present lore, rather than backstory.

    I don't know how I feel about this, though, as I would rather not having underdog realms waiting for that kind of npc support in order to take back their lands, etc.

    All depends on implementation.
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