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So where is the money?

Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,065Member Uncommon

 

So would it be fair to conclude that they want people to spend their money on kits to harvest resource nodes and on potions?

 

Where else do they plan to make money through the store?

 

((Making money is not an evil thing, its what keeps the world and also these gaming worlds turn round and round))

Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

Comments

  • SevenwindSevenwind Somewhereville, TXPosts: 2,198Member Uncommon

    If they only give you two character slots then they will get some money for me to unlock more slots. I enjoyed a lot of the classes. I'm that way with a lot of MMOs, a lot of alts.

     

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  • DraemosDraemos Antartica, AKPosts: 1,469Member
    Cosmetic items, mounts, companions, inventory, character backgrounds, respec tokens, character slots,  fluff items, titles, new classes, new races, dyes, weapon/armor cosmetic effects/auras.  
     
    More generic stuff like potions, experience boosts, "starter packs", etc.
     
    Probably some stuff tied into crafting as well.
     
    Wouldnt be surprised if they partially monetized aspects of the Foundry as well.  Things like asset unlocks and additional quest slots, etc
     
    You can definitely tell this game was designed with a cash shop in mind.  They'll use a system similar to STO with Lockboxes and a Lobi store for the best stuff like really nice mounts and companions.
  • ranncoreranncore omaha, NEPosts: 93Member

    The only way to resurrect in the game is to buy a scroll from the zen store. It's going to be a huge barrier of entry for f2p players in end-game content. Personally, even as someone who COULD afford them, I'll find better things to spend my money on. Like a subscription to Rift again. There's a whole lot of things I like about Neverwinter, but there's a few things that I dislike so vehemently I doubt I'll be able to look past them. Like gouging for things no other game besides SWTOR would dream of gouging for, like identify scrolls and resurrection. Seriously - I have never played a game before where the healer couldn't resurrect. 

    Before someone says it, yes, you can help fallen teammates up within 10 seconds, no, it's not even worth attempting past level 30, you'll just get yourself killed. 

  • ranncoreranncore omaha, NEPosts: 93Member
    Originally posted by Draemos

    Wouldnt be surprised if they partially monetized aspects of the Foundry as well.  Things like asset unlocks and additional quest slots, etc

    They've been pretty adamant about not limiting artistic vision within the foundry by the confines of money. It's been stated multiple times that they will never charge for anything foundry related. 

    http://www.f2p.com/exclusive-qa-with-the-developers-of-neverwinter/

    "Q. Can we buy Foundry assets with Astral Diamonds? 

    A. No! I don’t want a single barrier between the content you want to make and you being able to make it."
  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,065Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ranncore
    Originally posted by Draemos

    Wouldnt be surprised if they partially monetized aspects of the Foundry as well.  Things like asset unlocks and additional quest slots, etc

    They've been pretty adamant about not limiting artistic vision within the foundry by the confines of money. It's been stated multiple times that they will never charge for anything foundry related. 

    http://www.f2p.com/exclusive-qa-with-the-developers-of-neverwinter/

    "Q. Can we buy Foundry assets with Astral Diamonds? 

    A. No! I don’t want a single barrier between the content you want to make and you being able to make it."

    I could have lived if the foundry would have worked like the iStore... people selling their stuff they made themselves (they could allways decide to give it away for free) and  the developers taking 20 cents from every dollar made this way, <<

     

    just sounds fair to me...

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • dorksmetaldorksmetal troy, MIPosts: 77Member
    at least its not pay to win

    image

  • Lord.BachusLord.Bachus Den HelderPosts: 9,065Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by dorksmetal
    at least its not pay to win

    With full healing potions on a 10 seccond CD, it is if you can aquire them for real money...directly or indirectly

    Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)

  • DraemosDraemos Antartica, AKPosts: 1,469Member
    Originally posted by ranncore
    Originally posted by Draemos

    Wouldnt be surprised if they partially monetized aspects of the Foundry as well.  Things like asset unlocks and additional quest slots, etc

    They've been pretty adamant about not limiting artistic vision within the foundry by the confines of money. It's been stated multiple times that they will never charge for anything foundry related. 

    http://www.f2p.com/exclusive-qa-with-the-developers-of-neverwinter/

    "Q. Can we buy Foundry assets with Astral Diamonds? 

    A. No! I don’t want a single barrier between the content you want to make and you being able to make it."

    Saying something and doing something are two different things.

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    Limiting the Foundry is pretty much the stupidest thing they could do. It's the main feature of this game. Good Foundry quests will make them money by drawing players in.
  • koboldfodderkoboldfodder Danbury, DEPosts: 390Member Uncommon

    Loot drops, but it is not identified.  But you can purchase ID scrolls from the store with Astral Diamonds.  There is a huge thread on the official forums basically calling it a blatant attempt at cash grab. 

     

    This is why the game is not really F2P, and why F2P are bad for a game in terms of design philosophy.  Because you are going to have to pay for basic things in the game.

  • ranncoreranncore omaha, NEPosts: 93Member
    Originally posted by Draemos
    Originally posted by ranncore
    Originally posted by Draemos

    Wouldnt be surprised if they partially monetized aspects of the Foundry as well.  Things like asset unlocks and additional quest slots, etc

    They've been pretty adamant about not limiting artistic vision within the foundry by the confines of money. It's been stated multiple times that they will never charge for anything foundry related. 

    http://www.f2p.com/exclusive-qa-with-the-developers-of-neverwinter/

    "Q. Can we buy Foundry assets with Astral Diamonds? 

    A. No! I don’t want a single barrier between the content you want to make and you being able to make it."

    Saying something and doing something are two different things.

    True enough. Like I said earlier, they said they wouldn't be selling power in the store, only cosmetics and convenience, but resurrection scrolls and stones of full health seem pretty damn powerful to me. In dungeons where the boss can 1-shot most characters, resurrection scrolls go beyond convenience and power and become a necessity. 

    I really have no idea what they were thinking not giving clerics a resurrection spell. Other than, you know, blatant cash grab. 

  • ArconaArcona VanlosePosts: 1,185Member
    Astral Diamonds are easy to get, so you dont have to spend money
  • DoogiehowserDoogiehowser ParisPosts: 1,873Member
    Originally posted by Arcona
    Astral Diamonds are easy to get, so you dont have to spend money

    People have to spend money on something so that they can keep the game up and running.

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  • HironHiron BristolPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by Draemos
    Originally posted by ranncore
    Originally posted by Draemos

    Wouldnt be surprised if they partially monetized aspects of the Foundry as well.  Things like asset unlocks and additional quest slots, etc

    They've been pretty adamant about not limiting artistic vision within the foundry by the confines of money. It's been stated multiple times that they will never charge for anything foundry related. 

    http://www.f2p.com/exclusive-qa-with-the-developers-of-neverwinter/

    "Q. Can we buy Foundry assets with Astral Diamonds? 

    A. No! I don’t want a single barrier between the content you want to make and you being able to make it."

    Saying something and doing something are two different things.

    Agreed. Remember how they said Drow would be free upon launching? It was even in their faq. WAS....because they ninja edited it. Scumbags....To make people who bought the 200 dollar pack feel special they took out the drow and made it limited only for pack buyers. For 2 months only though.

  • ranncoreranncore omaha, NEPosts: 93Member
    Originally posted by Arcona
    Astral Diamonds are easy to get, so you dont have to spend money

     

    The conversion ratio right now is 400AD for 1 zen. Now, just for the sake of argument, let's say it gets all the way down to 80-1. Which is lower than I've ever seen it in STo. That would mean that it's 40,000 AD for 1 rez scroll (500zen). So let's say instead of getting 1k AD once a day from prayer, you get it EVERY time from prayer. And, just for the sake of argument, you get 1k AD EVERY time you do a skirmish, instead of just sometimes. If you pray and do a skirmish once per hour, it will only take you 5 days at 4 hours of play time to afford ONE REZ SCROLL.

    Now, do you really want to farm for 5 days to afford a rez scroll so that you can remain competitive in dungeons where bosses can easily 1-shot party members? And don't give me the help-up crap. That mechanic only works before level 20. At level 35, when you're fighting against the Mad Dragon and his 20+ summons, if a party member goes down, he is DOWN, and going into the red splat and swarms of monsters to save him is only going to result in 2 deaths instead of 1.

    They could easily implement a resurrection spell for clerics while still making these items valuable.

  • DraemosDraemos Antartica, AKPosts: 1,469Member
    Originally posted by Scalpless
    Limiting the Foundry is pretty much the stupidest thing they could do. It's the main feature of this game. Good Foundry quests will make them money by drawing players in.

    The whole resurrection scroll thing they have going on in the cash shop is pretty damn stupid too, and the players are going to rail against it.  It's about at P2W as it gets, and they promised no P2W stuff.  Hasn't stopped them yet.

  • kyssarikyssari Tipton, IAPosts: 142Member

    So far in my experience I don't see ressurection scrolls as being to big a deal. The only thing they are used for is rezzing yourself instantly in combat just like Revive Orbs in GW2. Playing all the way through 50 and doing all the dungeons to that point I can't say there was a single fight where rezz scrolls were needed. There were some fights we all wiped a few times sure but we learned from our experience and mistakes, ressed at the nearest campfire together (does not take a scroll) and went back in and got the job done. Overall they are more of a convenience item than anything that is by no means required.

     

    Potions and kits aren't really an issue either. So far in the game you can buy your basic mount and companion for ingame gold but after that I saw literally nothing else to spend gold on other than potions and kits.. I quickly found myself hauling around 50+ potions and 20+ of every kit at all times and still making more gold than I was spending. This was actually one of the things I didn't like about Neverwinter as the ease of getting and keeping so many kits completely ruins the uniqueness of each classes unique ability (arcana, thievery, etc) and makes these nodes no better than just another standard treasure chest anyone and everyone can open.

     

    The only p2w I see going on here is spending Zen to buy astral diamonds... Pretty much everything in the game of any worth takes AD to buy or do and some people say AD is easy to get, well I am not seeing it. So far the only ingame sources for AD I have seen besides the AH are Praying and Skirmishes during the Skrimish event. Well at max your going to get 4-5k AD from Skirmishes, 1k per skirmish and you can only squeeze so many in during that hr event which typically only happens once a day. As for praying you typically only make 1-2k a day before you stop getting AD from praying for the day unless you happen to get a crit for 2k+ AD which rarely happens.

     

    That being said even if you do get more you can still only refine 22k AD a day. Sounds like a lot until you take into account that most basic stuff takes 50k+ and a lot of stuff costs anywhere from 400k - 4million AD... Most of it may not be paying for power specifically but with the current system it'd take you over 6 months to acquire the cheapest top lvl mount by just refining AD you earn in game for example..

     

    The only other way to earn AD is by selling stuff on the AH for AD but even then most people aren't going to be able to go spending much on the AH when they need so much AD to do everything else they need to do and the acquisition rate is so low without buying AD with Zen. We can only hope the costs and daily refining limit get adjusted more before launch, nothings set in stone yet so we'll see what happens, but so far its looking like it may end up being even more restrictive than STO is :

     

     

  • WickedjellyWickedjelly Yahoo, COPosts: 4,990Member
    Originally posted by Scalpless
    Limiting the Foundry is pretty much the stupidest thing they could do. It's the main feature of this game. Good Foundry quests will make them money by drawing players in.

    Yeah I agree.

    While anything is certainly possible limiting Foundry creation would only hurt themselves in the long run. Doesn't make good business sense.

    Then again considering what mmo companies have done lately it is rather questionable how much of that sense folks calling the shots on these matters have.

     

    1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

    2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

    3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  • kyssarikyssari Tipton, IAPosts: 142Member
    I also don't really see them limiting the Foundry creation  at all either cause why would they? It's a pure win win situation for them. Unlimited amounts of new content for the game that they themselves don't have to work on at all, only host on their servers. Let the players create all the new content for them for free while they focus their attention elsewhere.
  • jdnycjdnyc Long Island City, NYPosts: 1,696Member

    Money will be from:

    Mounts

    Companions

    Character Slots

    Zen to AD  (AD for ID scrolls and such)

    Cosmetics (Dyes, Fashion Outfits)

    Special Races and Classes (Main classes and races will be free.  Example Drow free, Menzoberranzan need to be a hero founder)

    edit- 

    potions and rez stuff as well.  most of that stuff is PvE only however.

  • RoinRoin Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,927Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Draemos
    Originally posted by Scalpless
    Limiting the Foundry is pretty much the stupidest thing they could do. It's the main feature of this game. Good Foundry quests will make them money by drawing players in.

    The whole resurrection scroll thing they have going on in the cash shop is pretty damn stupid too, and the players are going to rail against it.  It's about at P2W as it gets, and they promised no P2W stuff.  Hasn't stopped them yet.

    So how is a resurrection scroll an automatic Pay 2 Win? I think alot of people like to use the term. Without fully understanding what it means. Items that would make you invincible would fall under pay 2 win. Weapons/Armors that are equal or better then drops/quest rewards/crafted items of same level, falls under pay 2 win. Rare items for quest in the cash shop would also be pay 2 win. XP and Health consumables are arguable. Personally XP items I have no problems with, unless it's an open pvp system attached to game.  Health items I do myself believe they are P2W items.

    Mounts are not pay to win. Unless they are faster then anything else obtainable in game. Doesn't matter if it can be used at a lower level or not.  The only time this would be an exception is a game based solely around PvP and/or Mounted PvP combat.

    Comestic items are not pay to win. Just because someone else has it, and you can't get it. Does not make it pay to win. This also includes recoloring versions of a comestic item found in game. Then later placing it in Cash shop.

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  • sibs4455sibs4455 manchesterPosts: 357Member
    Originally posted by Sevenwind

    If they only give you two character slots then they will get some money for me to unlock more slots. I enjoyed a lot of the classes. I'm that way with a lot of MMOs, a lot of alts.

     

    huh? , you just make multiple accounts.

  • kyssarikyssari Tipton, IAPosts: 142Member
    Originally posted by Roin
    Originally posted by Draemos
    Originally posted by Scalpless
    Limiting the Foundry is pretty much the stupidest thing they could do. It's the main feature of this game. Good Foundry quests will make them money by drawing players in.

    The whole resurrection scroll thing they have going on in the cash shop is pretty damn stupid too, and the players are going to rail against it.  It's about at P2W as it gets, and they promised no P2W stuff.  Hasn't stopped them yet.

    So how is a resurrection scroll an automatic Pay 2 Win? I think alot of people like to use the term. Without fully understanding what it means. Items that would make you invincible would fall under pay 2 win. Weapons/Armors that are equal or better then drops/quest rewards/crafted items of same level, falls under pay 2 win. Rare items for quest in the cash shop would also be pay 2 win. XP and Health consumables are arguable. Personally XP items I have no problems with, unless it's an open pvp system attached to game.  Health items I do myself believe they are P2W items.

    Mounts are not pay to win. Unless they are faster then anything else obtainable in game. Doesn't matter if it can be used at a lower level or not.  The only time this would be an exception is a game based solely around PvP and/or Mounted PvP combat.

    Comestic items are not pay to win. Just because someone else has it, and you can't get it. Does not make it pay to win. This also includes recoloring versions of a comestic item found in game. Then later placing it in Cash shop.

    Well said Roin and as I also mentioned I never found a single encounter in any dungeon/skirmish or solo quest all the way to 50 where a Ressurection Scroll was needed at all. Only group wipes were when we went into a fight not knowing what to exect but after said wipe we learned, adapted, and won, just like any and everyother mmo out there lol.

     

    Only way Ressurection Scrolls could really be pay2win at all is if they were usable in PVP which I am pretty sure they aren't though I can't say as I could care less about PVP and didn't try it out this weekend.

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