Clearing up the new Faction Lock

WellzyC · March 2013

Some of you, like me, heard about the new easing of the faction lock and had a very angry knee jerk reaction to it. They announced that players would be allowed to enter the other faction’s territories, and some of us PvPers and DAOC players started to dig out our pitch forks and torches from our garages and go marching on Zinimax’s headquarters.

But before we decide to storm their office’s let me explain how this is going to work, and you will see that that is actually a pretty brilliant compromise.

I took the time to watch all the interviews and read all the articles on this subject, from every source I could find, and wrote down the facts and put it all together on how this is going to work.

Let’s clear up the confusion:

1) How to get access to other factions: In order to actually go into another factions territories a players must be cap at lvl 50 and have completed all your alliances pve content (faction completion basically). Once done you will have the choice to pick a zone of the opposing faction to enter. Once that zone is complete, you will be given another opportunity to pick another zone to venture into.

2) But I don’t want to see that Scum in my land! You won’t: If you have your faction completed and want to enter another faction’s territory, you are basically joining the PVE elitist club. When you are in another faction’s territory you will ONLY see players of your faction and the other players you see are ones that have also done the faction completion pre requisite in your realm.

3) No agitators and race mixers here: When you are leveling up and going about your business in your land, at no point will you see anyone from the opposing faction. No one gets flagged for pvp or anything like that. Like I stated before, enemies exploring your territory will be in a “their faction only” copy of it. Really this is just to appease people who only want to explore the game without sacrificing the segregation of the factions.

4) PvPers won’t even notice: If you are like me and don’t care too much about faction completion, you will probably forget that this feature even exists; you will be locked to your faction, never seeing anyone from the opposing faction except in the AvA zone. You won’t see an orc with his pants off at your supermarket.

So in closing I think this is a pretty decent compromise to people who want faction lock, and people who don’t. When you achieve faction completion and chose to enter another faction’s territory, the enemies land becomes a “your faction only extension” where you are still not able to see or interact anyone from the opposite team.

Hope this clears things up a bit.

Ryowulf · March 2013

brilliant compromise?

Its terrible. I want to pick my race and pick my faction. At least give me a questline to change factions (like eq2). I want to be able to play with my friends who might be another faction from 1 to cap not just at 50.

I don't think this zone is going to feel like the 'real' zone when I am playing. How can it? A mostly people free zone to run around in doing the bits of 50 lvl content they tossed in there.

WellzyC · March 2013

A mostly people free zone is the point. People who want to experience the content and explore can, and us who want faction pride and faction lock (sort of) get that too.

plus all the town npcs and quests are intact, so its not like it will be en empty zone by any means

how can you say this isnt a good compromise?

Tuktz · March 2013

IT's basically just the PVE players equivalent of factional warfare.

It turns the other two factions lands into PVE endgame content.

The big distinction though, is that say you're faction A, and you can go to B or C at endgame for more PVE.

The B or C zones will basically be redisnged specifically for A to come to for endgame PVE. You won't see real B or C players, and the zones will be different than actual real B or C players see them (since to B or C players, those are leveling up zones, not endgame zones).

It's an interesting way to both appease exploreres that want to see the whole world, as well as a creative way to create endgame content.

Doesn't please the open world PVPers that want to see enemy players everywhere in the world, and the minority that also wants to be able to attack them anywhere in the world.

I was fine with how things were to begin with though, so this news is more just kind of "shrug, interesting...." to me.

tokini · March 2013

Originally posted by WellzyC
A mostly people free zone is the point. People who want to experience the content and explore can, and us who want faction pride and faction lock (sort of) get that too.

plus all the town npcs and quests are intact, so its not like it will be en empty zone by any means

how can you say this isnt a good compromise?

wouldnt it create more 'pride' to actually defend your lands, or invade others in the name of your faction?

im not trying to argue, i just dont get how this method they are using somehow solidifies 'faction pride'. just the mere idea of seeing an enemy faction player diminishes pride?

shouldnt all the npc's be extremely hostile, as well? why would they give any sort of quest to an enemy faction member?

WellzyC · March 2013

com·pro·mise

/?k?m

pr??ma?z/ Show Spelled [kom-pruh-mahyz] Show IPA noun, verb, com·pro·mised, com·pro·mis·ing.

noun

1. a settlement of differences by mutual concessions; an agreement reached by adjustment of conflicting or opposing claims, principles, etc., by reciprocal modification of demands.

2. the result of such a settlement.

3. something intermediate between different things: The split-level is a compromise between a ranch house and a multistoried house.

it's not compromising if one side is getting their way. people want to do all the content in Tamriel, others want a sense of faction lock and faction pride. I think that letting the hardcore pvers do their thing sort of off the beated path from the main faction content and pvp is pretty darn fair.

WellzyC · March 2013

Originally posted by tokini
Originally posted by WellzyC
A mostly people free zone is the point. People who want to experience the content and explore can, and us who want faction pride and faction lock (sort of) get that too.

plus all the town npcs and quests are intact, so its not like it will be en empty zone by any means

how can you say this isnt a good compromise?

wouldnt it create more 'pride' to actually defend your lands, or invade others in the name of your faction?

im not trying to argue, i just dont get how this method they are using somehow solidifies 'faction pride'. just the mere idea of seeing an enemy faction player diminishes pride?

shouldnt all the npc's be extremely hostile, as well? why would they give any sort of quest to an enemy faction member?

You don't see enemy players, thats my point. Please read the entire post

Buccaneer · March 2013

I don't understand why people are worrying over faction pride in this game. I could understand it if the game was going to have the classic servers, but its not, it's going to be one big mega server. The pvp zone is going to have loads of instances of it running simultaneously, and from what I can gather, the player will have the option of transfering between instances. It looks like nothing will be in place to stop players in a losing battle transfering to a different instance. Where's the pride in that? With the mentality of todays MMO players, you just know they will take the easy option instead of facing the difficult option of trying to turn the tide of battle.

jfoytek · March 2013

This is horrible!!!

Epicent · March 2013

So in a nutshell it really doesnt matter at all what faction you choose since you will see all the content anyway. This also demeans the importance of your faction. Honestly, I wasnt super excited about this mmo but now............well now........if this is the stupid direction development is going.....then I hope this piece of shit burns with the rest of them.

rygard49 · March 2013

From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

SysFail · March 2013

Whoever thought up and think mega servers are a good idea, deserves a golf clap.

Phry · March 2013

Originally posted by rygard49
From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

Sounds more like the OP misunderstood what Sage was saying. Once you reach 50, you can then explore the rest of Cyrodil effectively, when you go into the other areas, it won't be just with other members of your own faction, i don't really know where the OP got that from tbh, the fact that you can group up with members of other factions just clarifies that at 50 you will be able to play with other level 50 members of different factions, in their, or your own zones for dungeon runs etc, any interaction in other faction areas will be of the none PVP kind, regardless of level.

jfoytek · March 2013

This is a crock, Every faction should have resources more prevalent in there area and we should have to take risks to enter there area to harvest these resources to make the best crafted items....

They should see us clear as day and make every attempt to kill us....

Our deaths should warp us back to our home land far from where we were killed.... And a certain amount of items in your inventory like atleast resources should drop and be lootable....

This is how you create good open world pvp that translates into never ending end game content...

But no lets Instance copy these worlds and only allow access to certain kingdoms so all the PvE carebears can have lots of content!

Skooma2 · March 2013

Before: 1/3 world pve map. Get to level 50 and pvp in Cyrodil or roll an alt.

Now: 100% world pve map. Get to level 50 and a) pvp in Cyrodiil, b) roll an alt, c) explore other alliance areas.

Before: Disappointed TES fan vowing not to buy the game.

Now: Going to pre-order as soon as it can be done.

Livnthedream · March 2013

Where is the almighty lore push for perma death that every TES game that has come before has had?

immodium · March 2013

Originally posted by Livnthedream
Where is the almighty lore push for perma death that every TES game that has come before has had?

When the lore push to include the option to save your progress at any given time, like previous TES games.

Livnthedream · March 2013

Originally posted by immodium
Originally posted by Livnthedream
Where is the almighty lore push for perma death that every TES game that has come before has had?

When the lore push to include the option to save your progress at any given time, like previous TES games.

Oh I see, mechanics that eliminate things you do not like due to impracticality are ok, but mechanics that enforce things you don't are not. I absolutely love how "lore friendly" gets used as just another term for "something I do not like". The absurdity of the fanatics will never cease.

azarhal · March 2013

Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by rygard49
From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

Sounds more like the OP misunderstood what Sage was saying. Once you reach 50, you can then explore the rest of Cyrodil effectively, when you go into the other areas, it won't be just with other members of your own faction, i don't really know where the OP got that from tbh, the fact that you can group up with members of other factions just clarifies that at 50 you will be able to play with other level 50 members of different factions, in their, or your own zones for dungeon runs etc, any interaction in other faction areas will be of the none PVP kind, regardless of level.

The OP took his information from a video interview with one of the dev, where the dev especially said that you will only see players of your faction in those level 50+ zones. I don't remember which of the video this was, but I clearly remember it being mentioned.

The massively previewer missunderstood.

immodium · March 2013

Originally posted by Livnthedream
Originally posted by immodium
Originally posted by Livnthedream
Where is the almighty lore push for perma death that every TES game that has come before has had?

When the lore push to include the option to save your progress at any given time, like previous TES games.

Oh I see, mechanics that eliminate things you do not like due to impracticality are ok, but mechanics that enforce things you don't are not. I absolutely love how "lore friendly" gets used as just another term for "something I do not like". The absurdity of the fanatics will never cease.

I don't mind if there's perma death, as long as it's an option. Like in previous TES games. I highly doubt it be included though. Like I doubt it would of been included if you coudln't save your progress in the single player games.

Nikopol · March 2013

Originally posted by azarhal
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by rygard49
From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

Sounds more like the OP misunderstood what Sage was saying. Once you reach 50, you can then explore the rest of Cyrodil effectively, when you go into the other areas, it won't be just with other members of your own faction, i don't really know where the OP got that from tbh, the fact that you can group up with members of other factions just clarifies that at 50 you will be able to play with other level 50 members of different factions, in their, or your own zones for dungeon runs etc, any interaction in other faction areas will be of the none PVP kind, regardless of level.

The OP took his information from a video interview with one of the dev, where the dev especially said that you will only see players of your faction in those level 50+ zones. I don't remember which of the video this was, but I clearly remember it being mentioned.

The massively previewer missunderstood.

Yep, in the interview by Yogscast, creature combat designer Maria Aliprando very specifically said what the OP said in his post. That's first-hand info. So either the massively previewer misunderstood, or there's indeed conflicting information from the developers.

Nanfoodle · March 2013

Originally posted by Livnthedream
Where is the almighty lore push for perma death that every TES game that has come before has had?

LOL permadeath MMO. Ya thats an option every MMOer is looking for. 3 years playing a char all geared up with crafting all done and you lag out and die to a level 10 wolf. Thats what every MMO needs lol.

Nanfoodle · March 2013

Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by rygard49
From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

Sounds more like the OP misunderstood what Sage was saying. Once you reach 50, you can then explore the rest of Cyrodil effectively, when you go into the other areas, it won't be just with other members of your own faction, i don't really know where the OP got that from tbh, the fact that you can group up with members of other factions just clarifies that at 50 you will be able to play with other level 50 members of different factions, in their, or your own zones for dungeon runs etc, any interaction in other faction areas will be of the none PVP kind, regardless of level.

This has been cleared up in a few interviews that came out yesterday. You can not team with other factions. Only players of your faction that have earned the right to goto the other factions map will be the people you can team with.

rygard49 · March 2013

Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by rygard49
From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

Sounds more like the OP misunderstood what Sage was saying. Once you reach 50, you can then explore the rest of Cyrodil effectively, when you go into the other areas, it won't be just with other members of your own faction, i don't really know where the OP got that from tbh, the fact that you can group up with members of other factions just clarifies that at 50 you will be able to play with other level 50 members of different factions, in their, or your own zones for dungeon runs etc, any interaction in other faction areas will be of the none PVP kind, regardless of level.

This has been cleared up in a few interviews that came out yesterday. You can not team with other factions. Only players of your faction that have earned the right to goto the other factions map will be the people you can team with.

If that's the case, then faction lock remains intact. This pleases me.

Nanfoodle · March 2013

Originally posted by rygard49
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by rygard49
From the Massively interview:

"Sage assuaged most of my fears, however, when he mentioned that once you hit level 50 and decide to play in another alliance's areas, you'll be able to play with friends in that faction. So at the endgame, things begin to open up and you can group up, chat, and run dungeons with players of other factions. The one area where things remain separate is, of course, the Alliance War in Cyrodiil."

Seems like conflicting information to me.

Sounds more like the OP misunderstood what Sage was saying. Once you reach 50, you can then explore the rest of Cyrodil effectively, when you go into the other areas, it won't be just with other members of your own faction, i don't really know where the OP got that from tbh, the fact that you can group up with members of other factions just clarifies that at 50 you will be able to play with other level 50 members of different factions, in their, or your own zones for dungeon runs etc, any interaction in other faction areas will be of the none PVP kind, regardless of level.

This has been cleared up in a few interviews that came out yesterday. You can not team with other factions. Only players of your faction that have earned the right to goto the other factions map will be the people you can team with.

If that's the case, then faction lock remains intact. This pleases me.

Yup, I was about to drop this game. This makes me very happy as well, faction pride and AvA remains intact.

Mardukk · March 2013

I hated the idea of faction lock as I have no love for DAOC or PvP. This seems like a fairly nice idea as something for PvE'rs to work towards. This new idea appears to be a good middle ground for both parties.

I'll never understand why everyone hates open world PvP (both PvPer's and PvE people seem to hate it)...I don't mind it.

This was a very smart move on their part as this may help the devs with content creation or lack there of. The never ending challenge for themepark PvE.

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