The Tamriel map as we know it. How are the Alliances going to work any other way then how the Dev's have placed them?
If they went free roam everywhere then the dev's would have to scrap 6 YEARS of work and start over. Do we really want that? Or, make it every race for themselves, which stil means recoding a major chuck of the game.
Something to think about.
6 years of work would not be wasted.
It's impossible to say how much work would be involved to apply changes unless you work for the company.
TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development
The Tamriel map as we know it. How are the Alliances going to work any other way then how the Dev's have placed them?
If they went free roam everywhere then the dev's would have to scrap 6 YEARS of work and start over. Do we really want that? Or, make it every race for themselves, which stil means recoding a major chuck of the game.
Something to think about.
Have the Factions be Independent Groups, with no ties or affiliations to any of the Nations or Races specifically. These 3 Factions are fighting to control the Nation of Cyrodiil. Not too different than how they have it now.
Players of any Race or Nationality could choose to join one of the Independant Faction groups if they choose to fight.
Maybe even have some (or all) the other Nations secretly supporting one of the Factions, but publicly denying any involvement.
They wouldnt have to scrap 6 years of work. They would have to make some changes yes, but nothing so drastic as you claim.
*edit. When you look at that map, you can totally see how Firor took one look at it and saw how he could squeeze DAOC to fit into Tamriel.
Ill bet he even got wood.
Bringer of Eternal Darkness and Despair, but also a Nutritious way to start your Morning.
The Tamriel map as we know it. How are the Alliances going to work any other way then how the Dev's have placed them?
If they went free roam everywhere then the dev's would have to scrap 6 YEARS of work and start over. Do we really want that? Or, make it every race for themselves, which stil means recoding a major chuck of the game.
Something to think about.
Have the Factions be Independent Groups, with no ties or affiliations to any of the Nations or Races specifically. These 3 Factions are fighting to control the Nation of Cyrodiil. Not too different than how they have it now.
Players of any Race or Nationality could choose to join one of the Independant Faction groups if they choose to fight.
Maybe even have some (or all) the other Nations secretly supporting one of the Factions, but publicly denying any involvement.
They wouldnt have to scrap 6 years of work. They would have to make some changes yes, but nothing so drastic as you claim.
Again so you basically want the same failed concept as been done in almost every MMO the last 7-8 years.
Theres a reason why there is a RvR style PvP system complete with locked factions, because it's the only model that has worked and it is the only model that has been done 1 other time. PvP plays no part in the inner workings of an Elder Scrolls Game so keep the PvE model how it was in Skyrim/Morrowind/Oblivian and implement a PvP system that is fresh by all standards.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Originally posted by asmkm22 People keep acting like the dev's just blundered into the currect design, but nobody seems to consider that maybe they designed it this way for a reason?
DING DING DING we have a winrar.
Yea and that reason is WRONG. It doesn't fit TES at all and if you going to use the name you have to be faithful to the IP. Also the reasoning they are using is turning ESO into more of DAoC which means PvP is their main focus and everything else secondary and that is not TES at all. So, I say it again:
DOWN WITH FACTION LOCK ZONES and RACES, UP WITH FREEDOM a la "braveheart-style" haha
War is different than a game of chess. There is no way that I would believe that someone is going to unite 3 races just to beat another faction. That doesn't make sense.
This is quite normal in fantasy lore. Even in reality periods of 100's of years can see the rise and fall of many different factional/racial relationships or wars. There are many both real and fictional examples of mortal enemies uniting in common causes. Look at slave armies as just one example, many people uniting (many not even sharing a common tongue) to fight a common enemy.
I like many sci-fi / fantasy novels but some of the normal ones can be a litthe cheesy. I could see a revenge type plot or maybe Molag wanting to kill everyone but zenimax states that a Nord High King, a Breton Merchant Lord and an Altmer Queen are fighting for the ruby throne.
There is no reason why a Nord HIgh King wouldn't buy a group of orc slaves and put them on the frontlines or make/repair weapons. He's already accepted the Dunmers and Argonians, do you think he'll turn down a fully trained Redguard Swordsman! Those guys are legendary ~ or what about a Breton Battlemage who rebelled against the Merchant Lord. Granted he might not be fully trusted but he could do some dirty work.
There are both real and fictional examples of mortal enemies uniting in common causes. I am a Altmer and I'm outraged that my Queen, who isn't even old enough to wax her own bow, allied with those filthy flu infested Khajiit. Those beasts are beneth us as well as those Bosmer... they eat their own kind. I hear the Merchant Lord offers gold in exchange for information, perhaps the half-elves will welcome my company.
There are many things that don't make sense with this set-up, that would not work in any story outside of one contained in a video game. Like the every two week nature of crownings, why it's a random footman being crowned and not faction heads etc.. The alliance thing is a non-factor in comparison.
I feel like the 'faction pride' wouldn't be affected if they allowed players to choose their faction while in the gaming world. There are many things that don't make sense, there's no need to limit the players while you're doing it.
The Tamriel map as we know it. How are the Alliances going to work any other way then how the Dev's have placed them?
If they went free roam everywhere then the dev's would have to scrap 6 YEARS of work and start over. Do we really want that? Or, make it every race for themselves, which stil means recoding a major chuck of the game.
Something to think about.
Can someone explain (w/bevity), what exactly are we discussing?
To me, it seems like many things... all at once? What would be wasted for 6 years..?
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
Have the Factions be Independent Groups, with no ties or affiliations to any of the Nations or Races specifically. These 3 Factions are fighting to control the Nation of Cyrodiil. Not too different than how they have it now.
1) How did the independent group form? 2)Where are they based in the above map? 3)Why did they form in the first place if they have no ties to anyone or anything? How much programming rework would this setup require to implament? Can it be done without stacking the numbers in one groups favor? I could go on, however will not.
Players of any Race or Nationality could choose to join one of the Independant Faction groups if they choose to fight.
1) So what happens to all of the voice acting they have already done? 2)What happens to all of the quest lines already programmed in? 3)How about the 3 Allince story arcs that now have to be rewriten?
Maybe even have some (or all) the other Nations secretly supporting one of the Factions, but publicly denying any involvement.
1)How would it be done to keep from imbalancing? 2)What kind of story work would be envoled to implement this change? 3) Is there a backlash for being discovered? 4) If so,Then what form does it take and how is it implemented?
They wouldnt have to scrap 6 years of work. They would have to make some changes yes, but nothing so drastic as you claim.
Taking in to consideration how far along they are,and the above questions, if answered relisticly, can you not see just how much of an undertaking it would be?
*edit. When you look at that map, you can totally see how Firor took one look at it and saw how he could squeeze DAOC to fit into Tamriel.
I imagine that the only way to another territory is through Cyrodiil. Skyrim and Morrowind will be separated by mountains.
I say if you want to join another faction you have to run there, through Cyrodiil, as a level 1, with a big fat PvP target on your head. If you can make it to the other side, you can join that faction. It's a win/win for both sides: the RvR fans they get to murder, spawn camp and harass anyone trying to join another faction & 'hardcore' TES fans have a way to pick a faction.
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
I imagine that the only way to another territory is through Cyrodiil. Skyrim and Morrowind will be separated by mountains.
I say if you want to join another faction you have to run there, through Cyrodiil, as a level 1, with a big fat PvP target on your head. If you can make it to the other side, you can join that faction. It's a win/win for both sides: the RvR fans they get to murder, spawn camp and harass anyone trying to join another faction & 'hardcore' TES fans have a way to pick a faction.
Skyrim and Morrowind are the same faction so no they wouldn't be seperated by mountains nor would you have to go through Cryodill to reach it. Now Skyrim is probably seperated from Hammerfell by something because they are opposite factions.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Just make an alt. That's a far FAR simpler solution than the ugly bloody bandaid the OP suggested.
Simpler? Yes. Do I want to do that? No. Should I have to do that? No. Is it impossible to allow it? No.
And I don't want the devs to have to reconfigure the game to suit someone who is too lazy to make a second character.
And I don't want to have players from an enemy realm walking through my home, eating my food, adventuring with my friends, when all the lore of the game tells me that we should be enemies and killing one another.
Because rewarding a single person for a group effort does not go over well when the vast majority of your playerbase are selfish twats.
Isn't that the same thing the Emporer system is doing? This is a group game, a player isn't going to be the top ranked player by playing by himself.
Different rewarding someone with a temp title over giving them a power boots in PvP. If you missed it on the last page it works like this... When a battle over Cyrodiil is won, they take up a tally of the winning side. DPS, Healing and what ever metrics they use to work that out, who ever gets the highest score is Emperoro. I think its kinda cool. I know I wont play enough to have that happen to me but would be cool IMO.
A solo player has as much chance of winning the title as a team player.
hmmmm that's intriguing though weird.
I would say fair over weird. Why should solo or grouped or guildied members be rewarded better then the other group. Should be skill based IMO.
I wonder if it's also time based or only for hardcore players. It just seems like this system is rewarding only a small percent of the population.
Plus, why doesn't the faction leaders want to be Emperor - I thought that was the whole reason for the war.
How does that drive or reward the players who took over Cyrodill? I dont know maybe I am wrong but you have to admit it would be cool to win that title and maybe have something dumb like in your main factions city a statue of you there for all to see. Or something that says... I was the MVP of that battle.
No-one will have the slightest respect for any of the 'mayfly' emperors which will exist in the game.
"Who's Emperor THIS week?.... who the hell cares..."
You might as hand out lollipop or gold stars for all the good it will be to have the title.
Will you be able to do ANYTHING a real emperor could?
Command armies?
Give orders to your minions?
Have people executed?
Give out land to your favoured cronies?
Order an increase in taxation and pocket the gold?
Have someone assassinated?
No...
It's a gimmick which doesn't fit, makes no sense and makes a mockery of the supposed aims of the NPC faction leaders.
Even if they have made it worth something - you really think an algorithm and nothing else is the way to go? If a large guild has a profound effect on the fighting but it then goes to someone who simply camped the area rouind the clock, then it will rightly piss people off!
In any scenario where faction pride flies in the face of guild pride - don't expect this to work 'as intended'...
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
It is beyond ridiculous to ASSUME that all, or even the majority of PvE content in each faction area is faction only material.
There has never been an MMO that was so focussed on one aspect of play experience - even in those whose personal or factional stories were important.
So according to you there will be no random ancient tombs, no peasants needing wolves run off, no haunted ruins populated by undead, no mages/fighters/rogues etc, guild quests, no wandering mobs in any terrain anywhere who will attack 'anyone', no random events that have nothing to do with the war, no lairs of dangerous monsters, no bandit ambushes, no gangs of thieves, no buried treasure chest hunts, no sunken ships, no raiding trolls from the mountains, IN FACT - no way of interacting with any content whatesoever unless you are a card-carrying faction member..?
Are you seriously trying to say this!?
Your standpoint is absolutely ridiculous, and you simply refuse to acknowledge the reasons why.
Exactly why would a guard/town/merchant want to sell anything or not just kill an enemy from another faction in their lands. Pretty sure in most wars they do not allow enemy nationals behind the lines without trying to remove them
Exactly why would a guard/town/merchant want to sell anything or not just kill an enemy from another faction in their lands. Pretty sure in most wars they do not allow enemy nationals behind the lines without trying to remove them
Read my post - there is no point using logic to try to explain Zenimax's plot as it stands NOW - so adding another minor inconsistency has no significant bearing on the matter.
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
It is beyond ridiculous to ASSUME that all, or even the majority of PvE content in each faction area is faction only material.
There has never been an MMO that was so focussed on one aspect of play experience - even in those whose personal or factional stories were important.
So according you you there will be no drop-in dungeons, no peasants needing wolves run off, no haunted ruins populated by undead, no mages/fighters/rogues etc, guild quests, no wandering mobs who will attack 'anyone', no random events that have nothing to do with the war, no lairs of dangerous monsters, no bandits, no thieves, IN FACT - no way of interacting with any content unless you are a card-carrying faction member..?
What a crock!
Your standpoint is absolutely ridiculous, and you simply won't be shown otherwise.
Astounding...
No just said a large %, lets says 25% of the quests and story are about the war. Would that 25% be all around one part of the map? Or would it be organicly spread out thoughtout the land? How do you root that out with ease? This is no quantum leap. Its like when we found out there is tanks in the game. The jump that I am going to need a healer at some point is not a big jump but follows logic. My point is this is not as easy to remove as many of you claim it to be. Also even if only 25% of the quests and stories are about the war, what about the other quests the tie into that, point to that, or are part of a chain of quests? They also would need to be rewriten. Not ridiculous just simple logic you cant grasp.
Exactly why would a guard/town/merchant want to sell anything or not just kill an enemy from another faction in their lands. Pretty sure in most wars they do not allow enemy nationals behind the lines without trying to remove them
Read my post - there is no point using logic to try to explain Zenimax's plot as it stands NOW - so adding another minor inconsistency has no significant bearing on the matter.
So besically you want their stupidity gone and only yours to remain. Sorry no thanks. Rather have the one now than some idiot from another factor picking flowers in my backyard.
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
It is beyond ridiculous to ASSUME that all, or even the majority of PvE content in each faction area is faction only material.
There has never been an MMO that was so focussed on one aspect of play experience - even in those whose personal or factional stories were important.
So according you you there will be no drop-in dungeons, no peasants needing wolves run off, no haunted ruins populated by undead, no mages/fighters/rogues etc, guild quests, no wandering mobs who will attack 'anyone', no random events that have nothing to do with the war, no lairs of dangerous monsters, no bandits, no thieves, IN FACT - no way of interacting with any content unless you are a card-carrying faction member..?
What a crock!
Your standpoint is absolutely ridiculous, and you simply won't be shown otherwise.
Astounding...
No just said a large %, lets says 25% of the quests and story are about the war. Would that 25% be all around one part of the map? Or would it be organicly spread out thoughtout the land? How do you root that out with ease? This is no quantum leap. Its like when we found out there is tanks in the game. The jump that I am going to need a healer at some point is not a big jump but follows logic. My point is this is not as easy to remove as many of you claim it to be. Also even if only 25% of the quests and stories are about the war, what about the other quests the tie into that, point to that, or are part of a chain of quests? They also would need to be rewriten. Not ridiculous just simple logic you cant grasp.
You really think the people who took six years to make the game - mapped out in detail every questline and designed the entire non-factional and faction questlines etc. DON'T KNOW where they are!!??
Well I think that's the last time I feel the need to say anything on the matter to you Nan - you just holed your own ship below the waterline... and at this stage I think it would be fair to conclude that like the leader of Hy Brasil in Eric the Viking, you will still be denying you are drowning as the water goes over your head!
... my grasp of logic is just fine - you need to do some reading on what 'projection' means in this partcular context if you don't already know...
Exactly why would a guard/town/merchant want to sell anything or not just kill an enemy from another faction in their lands. Pretty sure in most wars they do not allow enemy nationals behind the lines without trying to remove them
Read my post - there is no point using logic to try to explain Zenimax's plot as it stands NOW - so adding another minor inconsistency has no significant bearing on the matter.
So besically you want their stupidity gone and only yours to remain. Sorry no thanks. Rather have the one now than some idiot from another factor picking flowers in my backyard.
My 'stupidity'?
I will respond with restraint as you have chosen the well worn path of insulting the intelligence of someone you don't agree with...
... do you think you could try to put together a coherent argument about the issue instead of spouting useless, lazy insults.
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
It is beyond ridiculous to ASSUME that all, or even the majority of PvE content in each faction area is faction only material.
There has never been an MMO that was so focussed on one aspect of play experience - even in those whose personal or factional stories were important.
So according you you there will be no drop-in dungeons, no peasants needing wolves run off, no haunted ruins populated by undead, no mages/fighters/rogues etc, guild quests, no wandering mobs who will attack 'anyone', no random events that have nothing to do with the war, no lairs of dangerous monsters, no bandits, no thieves, IN FACT - no way of interacting with any content unless you are a card-carrying faction member..?
What a crock!
Your standpoint is absolutely ridiculous, and you simply won't be shown otherwise.
Astounding...
No just said a large %, lets says 25% of the quests and story are about the war. Would that 25% be all around one part of the map? Or would it be organicly spread out thoughtout the land? How do you root that out with ease? This is no quantum leap. Its like when we found out there is tanks in the game. The jump that I am going to need a healer at some point is not a big jump but follows logic. My point is this is not as easy to remove as many of you claim it to be. Also even if only 25% of the quests and stories are about the war, what about the other quests the tie into that, point to that, or are part of a chain of quests? They also would need to be rewriten. Not ridiculous just simple logic you cant grasp.
You really think the people who took six years to make the game - mapped out in detail every questline and designed the entire non-factional and faction questlines etc. DON'T KNOW where they are!!??
Well I think that's the last time I feel the need to say anything on the matter to you Nan - you just holed your own ship below the waterline...
... my grasp of logic is just fine - you need to do some reading on what 'projection' means in this partcular context if you don't already know...
... wow..!
Ok, just be honest for a min, as the lead writer of this game. Given the 2 major themes of the game, your soul taken (personal story) and 3 faction wars with each faction being locked to each map(global scale). How would you have directed your writers to write the quests and story? 99% Generic quests and stories?
Originally posted by Nanfoodle So what do you do once you can wander anywhere? By your suggestion there would be no PvP, if I read right you cant enter the other factions dungeons. Quests and story are writen for the faction that map is made for? So were there just to look around?
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
It is beyond ridiculous to ASSUME that all, or even the majority of PvE content in each faction area is faction only material.
There has never been an MMO that was so focussed on one aspect of play experience - even in those whose personal or factional stories were important.
So according you you there will be no drop-in dungeons, no peasants needing wolves run off, no haunted ruins populated by undead, no mages/fighters/rogues etc, guild quests, no wandering mobs who will attack 'anyone', no random events that have nothing to do with the war, no lairs of dangerous monsters, no bandits, no thieves, IN FACT - no way of interacting with any content unless you are a card-carrying faction member..?
What a crock!
Your standpoint is absolutely ridiculous, and you simply won't be shown otherwise.
Astounding...
No just said a large %, lets says 25% of the quests and story are about the war. Would that 25% be all around one part of the map? Or would it be organicly spread out thoughtout the land? How do you root that out with ease? This is no quantum leap. Its like when we found out there is tanks in the game. The jump that I am going to need a healer at some point is not a big jump but follows logic. My point is this is not as easy to remove as many of you claim it to be. Also even if only 25% of the quests and stories are about the war, what about the other quests the tie into that, point to that, or are part of a chain of quests? They also would need to be rewriten. Not ridiculous just simple logic you cant grasp.
You really think the people who took six years to make the game - mapped out in detail every questline and designed the entire non-factional and faction questlines etc. DON'T KNOW where they are!!??
Well I think that's the last time I feel the need to say anything on the matter to you Nan - you just holed your own ship below the waterline...
... my grasp of logic is just fine - you need to do some reading on what 'projection' means in this partcular context if you don't already know...
... wow..!
Ok, just be honest for a min, as the lead writer of this game. Given the 2 major themes of the game, your soul taken (personal story) and 3 faction wars with each faction being locked to each map. How would you have directed your writers to write the quests and story? 99% Generic quests and stories?
I'll respond in this one instance as I added to my post whilst you were responding to the lesser version.
I work with people who manipulate statistics for their own ends with skill.
You on the other hand can't make up your mind whether it's 75% one minute, or 99% the next.
The numbers are as hopelessly confused as your argument...
Comments
6 years of work would not be wasted.
It's impossible to say how much work would be involved to apply changes unless you work for the company.
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Have the Factions be Independent Groups, with no ties or affiliations to any of the Nations or Races specifically. These 3 Factions are fighting to control the Nation of Cyrodiil. Not too different than how they have it now.
Players of any Race or Nationality could choose to join one of the Independant Faction groups if they choose to fight.
Maybe even have some (or all) the other Nations secretly supporting one of the Factions, but publicly denying any involvement.
They wouldnt have to scrap 6 years of work. They would have to make some changes yes, but nothing so drastic as you claim.
*edit. When you look at that map, you can totally see how Firor took one look at it and saw how he could squeeze DAOC to fit into Tamriel.
Ill bet he even got wood.
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Again so you basically want the same failed concept as been done in almost every MMO the last 7-8 years.
Theres a reason why there is a RvR style PvP system complete with locked factions, because it's the only model that has worked and it is the only model that has been done 1 other time. PvP plays no part in the inner workings of an Elder Scrolls Game so keep the PvE model how it was in Skyrim/Morrowind/Oblivian and implement a PvP system that is fresh by all standards.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Yea and that reason is WRONG. It doesn't fit TES at all and if you going to use the name you have to be faithful to the IP. Also the reasoning they are using is turning ESO into more of DAoC which means PvP is their main focus and everything else secondary and that is not TES at all. So, I say it again:
DOWN WITH FACTION LOCK ZONES and RACES, UP WITH FREEDOM a la "braveheart-style" haha
I like many sci-fi / fantasy novels but some of the normal ones can be a litthe cheesy. I could see a revenge type plot or maybe Molag wanting to kill everyone but zenimax states that a Nord High King, a Breton Merchant Lord and an Altmer Queen are fighting for the ruby throne.
There is no reason why a Nord HIgh King wouldn't buy a group of orc slaves and put them on the frontlines or make/repair weapons. He's already accepted the Dunmers and Argonians, do you think he'll turn down a fully trained Redguard Swordsman! Those guys are legendary ~ or what about a Breton Battlemage who rebelled against the Merchant Lord. Granted he might not be fully trusted but he could do some dirty work.
There are both real and fictional examples of mortal enemies uniting in common causes. I am a Altmer and I'm outraged that my Queen, who isn't even old enough to wax her own bow, allied with those filthy flu infested Khajiit. Those beasts are beneth us as well as those Bosmer... they eat their own kind. I hear the Merchant Lord offers gold in exchange for information, perhaps the half-elves will welcome my company.
I feel like the 'faction pride' wouldn't be affected if they allowed players to choose their faction while in the gaming world. There are many things that don't make sense, there's no need to limit the players while you're doing it.
Can someone explain (w/bevity), what exactly are we discussing?
To me, it seems like many things... all at once? What would be wasted for 6 years..?
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I imagine that the only way to another territory is through Cyrodiil. Skyrim and Morrowind will be separated by mountains.
I say if you want to join another faction you have to run there, through Cyrodiil, as a level 1, with a big fat PvP target on your head. If you can make it to the other side, you can join that faction. It's a win/win for both sides: the RvR fans they get to murder, spawn camp and harass anyone trying to join another faction & 'hardcore' TES fans have a way to pick a faction.
Why do you insist on believing that every dungeon, ever questline and every damn thing you can dop in each faction area is keyed to faction members alone?
You have NO basis for this assumption.
Sure - the story stuff will be.
But Zenimax have made it very clear indeed that there is stuff to explore for and stumble across - just like TES, where, by the way, there is lot on non-factional, non-main-storyline, non-specific stuff to do.
It would this content that could be acessed by all - and unless this is tte FIRST MMO in history to have entirely factional-focussed content and personal storyline with their PvE content, then there would be plenty to do.
Everywhere you post your contentions that touching the game would be like kicking a pil of Jenga blocks; that the whole thing in each factional area is all inextricably tied up with targetted plots that 'wouldn't work' if used by others.
This is 100% assumption on your part Nan...
Skyrim and Morrowind are the same faction so no they wouldn't be seperated by mountains nor would you have to go through Cryodill to reach it. Now Skyrim is probably seperated from Hammerfell by something because they are opposite factions.
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
'too lazy'...
Ah yes of course - THAT'S what we are...
No-one will have the slightest respect for any of the 'mayfly' emperors which will exist in the game.
"Who's Emperor THIS week?.... who the hell cares..."
You might as hand out lollipop or gold stars for all the good it will be to have the title.
Will you be able to do ANYTHING a real emperor could?
Command armies?
Give orders to your minions?
Have people executed?
Give out land to your favoured cronies?
Order an increase in taxation and pocket the gold?
Have someone assassinated?
No...
It's a gimmick which doesn't fit, makes no sense and makes a mockery of the supposed aims of the NPC faction leaders.
Even if they have made it worth something - you really think an algorithm and nothing else is the way to go? If a large guild has a profound effect on the fighting but it then goes to someone who simply camped the area rouind the clock, then it will rightly piss people off!
In any scenario where faction pride flies in the face of guild pride - don't expect this to work 'as intended'...
Ok, lets look at it with a simple line of thinking. You are a writer, you are given the lore of ESO, the player has lost his soul (personal level) and there is a war between 3 factions (global game scale). Here is your faction your writing for and the map it will take place on. (this is the core of development for 6 years) If you are even just a little bit creative what would you do? Write generic quests any faction could do? Or would you be writing a story (with VO) that showed how this war affected your faction and your char? Would you be so shallow a writer as to ignore this common thread? As a writer would you ignore the 2 biggest points of the game in your writing? Only reason you fail to see this is your hope to break this down to it being simple to change the faction lock. Think for a few min as a writer and tell me what you would have done as a writer with the lore handed to you?
It is beyond ridiculous to ASSUME that all, or even the majority of PvE content in each faction area is faction only material.
There has never been an MMO that was so focussed on one aspect of play experience - even in those whose personal or factional stories were important.
So according to you there will be no random ancient tombs, no peasants needing wolves run off, no haunted ruins populated by undead, no mages/fighters/rogues etc, guild quests, no wandering mobs in any terrain anywhere who will attack 'anyone', no random events that have nothing to do with the war, no lairs of dangerous monsters, no bandit ambushes, no gangs of thieves, no buried treasure chest hunts, no sunken ships, no raiding trolls from the mountains, IN FACT - no way of interacting with any content whatesoever unless you are a card-carrying faction member..?
Are you seriously trying to say this!?
Your standpoint is absolutely ridiculous, and you simply refuse to acknowledge the reasons why.
Astounding...
Exactly why would a guard/town/merchant want to sell anything or not just kill an enemy from another faction in their lands. Pretty sure in most wars they do not allow enemy nationals behind the lines without trying to remove them
Read my post - there is no point using logic to try to explain Zenimax's plot as it stands NOW - so adding another minor inconsistency has no significant bearing on the matter.
No just said a large %, lets says 25% of the quests and story are about the war. Would that 25% be all around one part of the map? Or would it be organicly spread out thoughtout the land? How do you root that out with ease? This is no quantum leap. Its like when we found out there is tanks in the game. The jump that I am going to need a healer at some point is not a big jump but follows logic. My point is this is not as easy to remove as many of you claim it to be. Also even if only 25% of the quests and stories are about the war, what about the other quests the tie into that, point to that, or are part of a chain of quests? They also would need to be rewriten. Not ridiculous just simple logic you cant grasp.
So besically you want their stupidity gone and only yours to remain. Sorry no thanks. Rather have the one now than some idiot from another factor picking flowers in my backyard.
You really think the people who took six years to make the game - mapped out in detail every questline and designed the entire non-factional and faction questlines etc. DON'T KNOW where they are!!??
Well I think that's the last time I feel the need to say anything on the matter to you Nan - you just holed your own ship below the waterline... and at this stage I think it would be fair to conclude that like the leader of Hy Brasil in Eric the Viking, you will still be denying you are drowning as the water goes over your head!
... my grasp of logic is just fine - you need to do some reading on what 'projection' means in this partcular context if you don't already know...
... wow..!
My 'stupidity'?
I will respond with restraint as you have chosen the well worn path of insulting the intelligence of someone you don't agree with...
... do you think you could try to put together a coherent argument about the issue instead of spouting useless, lazy insults.
Thank you.
Ok, just be honest for a min, as the lead writer of this game. Given the 2 major themes of the game, your soul taken (personal story) and 3 faction wars with each faction being locked to each map(global scale). How would you have directed your writers to write the quests and story? 99% Generic quests and stories?
I'll respond in this one instance as I added to my post whilst you were responding to the lesser version.
I work with people who manipulate statistics for their own ends with skill.
You on the other hand can't make up your mind whether it's 75% one minute, or 99% the next.
The numbers are as hopelessly confused as your argument...