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Elder Scrolls Online: Ask Us Anything Focuses on Combat

SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerThe Land of AZPosts: 16,610MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

The latest Elder Scrolls Online "Ask Us Anything" feature has been published. This time, the focus is on combat and the team answers questions from the community about all things fighting. 

Would you please explain the soft locking system in detail? For example, how does it interact with dodge? Does it apply to melee attacks, or just ranged? During missile travel time, is it possible for another target to intervene between you and your existing soft lock target to take the attack? – By Matt Feisthammel

You must be facing your target to hit it. However, soft locking allows you to pick a target out of a crowd to hit. It is possible that your target could be behind another target. You would hit the target you had soft-locked, provided you were aiming at them. Another target could not step in the way of the soft-locked target to prevent you from hitting your soft-locked target. As for dodging? The target can execute a roll dodge or evasion move to avoid attack. 

Read all of the questions and answers on the Elder Scrolls Online site.

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Comments

  • DauzqulDauzqul Detroit, MIPosts: 1,405Member Uncommon

    I understand the desire for "action-oriented combat". But when I have to stand perfecty still in order to swing my sword, it kills any type of "arcade" feeling. Stationary combat is boring.

    A dodging system worked in Unreal Tournament, as we were able to dodge on the move to avoid incoming projectiles.  The typical MMO dodge is slow and dumpy. Not only do we have to standing perfectly still before we can dodge, but there is usually a 1-second delay before the dodge even happens.

    I've never experienced dodging that worked in a MMO.

     

    I'm hoping that we'll be able to dodge and attack while on the move. If not, combat will be just as tame as tab-target / hotbar.

     
     
  • palulalulapalulalula vukovarPosts: 655Member
    It is most advanced and most complicated combat ever made in one mmorpg. I hope  they make this good.
     
  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,455Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dauzqul

    I understand the desire for "action-oriented combat". But when I have to stand perfecty still in order to swing my sword, it kills any type of "arcade" feeling. Stationary combat is boring.

    A dodging system worked in Unreal Tournament, as we were able to dodge on the move to avoid incoming projectiles.  The typical MMO dodge is slow and dumpy. Not only do we have to standing perfectly still before we can dodge, but there is usually a 1-second delay before the dodge even happens.

    I've never experienced dodging that worked in a MMO.

     

    I'm hoping that we'll be able to dodge and attack while on the move. If not, combat will be just as tame as tab-target / hotbar.

     
     

    I suppose this falls to taste.

    I was playing a bit of dark souls this weekend, It's more of an "action ortiented game in that you do have to swing your sword or aim. However, one can lock onto a target so there is that. It's not always a good idea. However, you are not guaranteed a hit as the enemy can dodge or jump back.

    You do :stop: and swing your sword and it feels very "real" in that you get the feeling that your sword has weight, that your armor is slowing you down, etc. You get caught in the animation of your sword "following through". It has a very "real" feel.

    It seems there are two camps for "action oriented" combat. Those who are more interested in a "real" feeling combat system where one has to stop and aim, has to stop and concentrate to cast a spell, has to take the time to swing a claymore, and the other camp that is interested in a non-stop ever moving combat system.

  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
    I really wanna try ESO, to see how the combat "feels". On paper it looks cool, but that means nothing.
  • adam_noxadam_nox hays, KSPosts: 2,035Member Uncommon

    Well this is a little dissapointing.  If anyone who matters reads this, get rid of soft locking, enemies and opposing players SHOULD BE ABLE TO STEP IN FRONT OF YOUR TARGET.  

     

    When you swing your weapon, or fire an arrow, or launch a fireball, it should hit what is in it's path.  In the case of large melee weapons, they should have an arc/cone damage area, with the first target struck taking full damage, and secondary targets taking less. 

    Different weapons should have different reaches as well.  But the slower a weapon, the easier to dodge, though armor would absorb less as a %.  Why don't these mmo devs get a little ambitious and get away from the stale mechanics of targetting (even soft reticle targetting) and dice rolls for everything (I like dice rolls for turn based grid games, and for dodge and damage variance, but not as the end all/be all in combat that takes place in real time.)

  • MaephistoMaephisto somewhere, DCPosts: 632Member

    Is it just me or did they choose to answer the most "softball" questions possible.

    "Ask us Anything" ........... answers 10 easy questions with common MMO buzzwords and little real info.

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  • black_isleblack_isle IstanbulPosts: 239Member Uncommon

    I'm really not a fan of exclusive skills for different weapons but other than that it all seems fine. I don't even have much problem with soft targeting but it's certainly a worthy debate between free targeting and soft targeting and i think both is viable with pros and cons.

     

    I like how item equipping works, how levelling, skill allocation and progression works and the fact that you can level up via world pvp (even tho it's a side thing for me). So come on TESO, you're my only hope!

  • Yeah, I'm going to have to try it before I can decide if I like it.
  • IllyssiaIllyssia LondonPosts: 1,524Member

    You can, everyone, see where the combat system has a problem...

     

    Dragonknight see mouse hides behind Huge Elephant. Dragonknight attacks soft locked mouse with long and mighty sword. Dragonknight misses Elephant with sword swing, but biggie sword slices mouse hiding behind it impacting a critical hit and leading to death. Elephant says to all around him. Thank goodness ESO isn't lifelike combat or that huge sword would have sliced off my trunk. 

     

    This type of stuff is normal for MMOs, but no way does it go for combat realism.

     

     

  • Mange1Mange1 Los Angeles, CAPosts: 198Member Uncommon
    They pretty much just told you it's tab targetting, move along people.  You clearly can't move out of the way of projectiles, just use a dodge mechanic.  Wildstar is looking even better.
  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,277Member Uncommon
    Not bad. From playing AoW, having an active block is HUGE. Not quite sure why, but the itemization talk left me a little lower the prior. Might be because I have real high hoopes for it.
  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    This soft look thing confuses me. Am I the only one thinking if someone steps in front of your Target, you should hit them?

    Seems odd to go action combat and smart ai and then not let a big tough mob stand in front of his squishy caster mate to protect him.
  • azarhalazarhal Somewhere, BCPosts: 761Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by ShakyMo
    This soft look thing confuses me. Am I the only one thinking if someone steps in front of your Target, you should hit them?

    Seems odd to go action combat and smart ai and then not let a big tough mob stand in front of his squishy caster mate to protect him.

    Later in the Q&A it says "Like any of our combat, you must aim at your target to hit them."

    Contradiction! I think the soft-target part is badly explained or ZOS have two different people answering these questions and both don't know the game very well. 

    Unless the "soft-target" is a fancy name for magnetic/sticky aim like in Neverwinter Online.

  • IllyssiaIllyssia LondonPosts: 1,524Member
    Originally posted by azarhal
     

    Unless the "soft-target" is a fancy name for magnetic/sticky aim like in Neverwinter Online.

     

     

     

    Just think WoW combat...you tab target around and even if technically a NPC or PC in the way the game mechanics allow the hit.

  • SavageHorizonSavageHorizon ParisPosts: 2,073Member Uncommon
    If you want to pick out a certain mob in a group you can press tab and it will target the mob you are aiming at. Once locked on you will hit that target. You can tab through the whole group using the tab targeting system. If you are tab targeting another player and you get a lock then another player jumping in the way wont stop you hitting the tabbed target.

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  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
    Originally posted by Mange1
    They pretty much just told you it's tab targetting, move along people.  You clearly can't move out of the way of projectiles, just use a dodge mechanic.  Wildstar is looking even better.

     

    If WildStar was going to have a PvP system like ESO, I'd be interested. But instead they're going with instanced PvP.

  • DarkcrystalDarkcrystal st clair shores, MIPosts: 809Member Uncommon

    Being a person who deals with this stuff, it sounds poorly explained and people are jumping to conclusions like they always do.

     

    This is nothing like Tab targeting like WOW, so get that our of your head right now.  If I try and explain this to you, people will still assume what ever they want this is why any DEVS with a half of brains won't make MMo's anymore because of  the way people act....   I for one won't touch another MMo ever again development wise because after reading posts, blaming DEVS would have little to no control over this stuff makes me sick to my stomach...

     

    I think people need to educate them selves to see who has the control over what is done, this way or that way, I can tell you this DEVS have very little control, some of our work  goes in the trash.. Alot of Devs GO ON there own for a reason, this is why alot of Indie company's are coming to life.

     

    Then people want to bash Indie's when some of them are experinced DEVS  from Blizzard, EA, bioware etc. But yet they bash them because they don't have a fat pocket book, which is not needed as much as some  of think today..... Hell I have a license for each piece of software in my house.... I don't need to work in a stupid studio any longer, I do contract work , so people really need to get there facts straight , and stop acting like spoiled brats..

  • RuinalRuinal duhPosts: 195Member
    Darkfall had the best combat system I've seen in an mmo bar none. You actually had to connect to do damage with a weapon swing, spells had to be aimed, arrows had to be aimed. Positional damage, so if you hit a targets back you'd do extra damage. If ESO could head in that direction it would be a much superior game to anything else out there, but sadly it looks like the same old half baked 'innovation' which is anything but.
  • azarhalazarhal Somewhere, BCPosts: 761Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Illyssia

    Just think WoW combat...you tab target around and even if technically a NPC or PC in the way the game mechanics allow the hit.

    TESO doesn't have tab-targeting, it's an aiming mechanism. It event looks like you can't hit something behind cover (considering the "fighting near cover").

     
  • SentnlSentnl SydneyPosts: 73Member
    Originally posted by Sovrath
    Originally posted by Dauzqul

    I understand the desire for "action-oriented combat". But when I have to stand perfecty still in order to swing my sword, it kills any type of "arcade" feeling. Stationary combat is boring.

    A dodging system worked in Unreal Tournament, as we were able to dodge on the move to avoid incoming projectiles.  The typical MMO dodge is slow and dumpy. Not only do we have to standing perfectly still before we can dodge, but there is usually a 1-second delay before the dodge even happens.

    I've never experienced dodging that worked in a MMO.

     

    I'm hoping that we'll be able to dodge and attack while on the move. If not, combat will be just as tame as tab-target / hotbar.

     
     

    I suppose this falls to taste.

    I was playing a bit of dark souls this weekend, It's more of an "action ortiented game in that you do have to swing your sword or aim. However, one can lock onto a target so there is that. It's not always a good idea. However, you are not guaranteed a hit as the enemy can dodge or jump back.

    You do :stop: and swing your sword and it feels very "real" in that you get the feeling that your sword has weight, that your armor is slowing you down, etc. You get caught in the animation of your sword "following through". It has a very "real" feel.

    It seems there are two camps for "action oriented" combat. Those who are more interested in a "real" feeling combat system where one has to stop and aim, has to stop and concentrate to cast a spell, has to take the time to swing a claymore, and the other camp that is interested in a non-stop ever moving combat system.

    [mod edit] Go use a real sword or knife and you'll realise that in most cases you need movement to create more force. Swinging around while stationary isn't enough.

    I sometimes play under the alias "Exposed". Don't tell anybody.

  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,603Member Uncommon

    Sounds a LOT like GW2s combat but with a few differences here and there.


    Some of it sounds like them looking at what GW2 and then improving it. Stand out example for me is:

    GW2 - classes can use a set selection of weapons and the abilities you can use are determined by the weapon


    ESO - classes can use any weapon and the abilities you can use are determined by the weapon

  • VyllynVyllyn Pasadena, CAPosts: 10Member
    Originally posted by palulalula
    It is most advanced and most complicated combat ever made in one mmorpg. I hope  they make this good.
     

    u never played conan then. if this game has combat even remotley as indepth ill be content with this and love it for eternaty... or untill the devs fuck it up like most mmo dev teams :)

  • WellzyCWellzyC Stillwater, MNPosts: 557Member Uncommon


    I really don't understand this sudden obsession with killing off the dedicated healer.


    Anyone who plays a healer will tell you it is the most enjoyable part of any mmo. Being the healer, the heart of the group.


    Ground AoE's and cone HoTs just doesn't work, they are lack luster  and this crappy method of healing doesnt make group play very divers.

    The way mmo's were: Community, Exploration, Character Development, Conquest.

    The way mmo's are now : Cut-Scenes,Cut-Scenes, solo Questing, Cut-Scenes...


    www.CeaselessGuild.com

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,455Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Sentnl
     
    F=ma you fool. Go use a real sword or knife and you'll realise that in most cases you need movement to create more force. Swinging around while stationary isn't enough.

    *rolls eyes*

     Of course a "real" weapon is going to use motion. That's not the point. the point is that when you are lunging or swinging with a real weapon there is a motion in the direction of your lung and swing. Usually it's that locking in place while the animation recreates the contortion of the body and the motion of the weapon that some players dislike.

    In the Dark Souls example, the developers made it so that a swing will move yoru body and you have to follow through with the weapon. If you swing anything large or if you slash your body follows through with that motion. Additionally, same example, heavier weapons require more follow through and recovery. But you can move, it's just not running and more of a walk to adjust position.

    Even though a game like dark souls is not trying to be a "real combat simulator" it does take into account different weights of weapons as well as encumberance for different types of armor as well as recovery from different weapon movements.

    You aren't running here and there at a fast pace all the while swinging a claymore with wild abandon.

    Also, the type of weapon (in reality) is going to affect how you fight and how you use motion. A dagger user or a Katana user is going to move more (all the while keeping in mind that the body is going to move with and react against attacks and the opponent's defense) while someone using a giant hammer or claymore will probably be running,  jumping around less once they get into it, and using the weight and momentum to create havoc.

    There is of course footwork involved but not the runnnig around that those who prefer a lot of action might desire.

    The main idea is that it's "footwork" to adjust position and then some motion or lunch or feint.

     

     

  • Dagon13Dagon13 Posts: 269Member Uncommon
    Dark Souls still has its own list of problems, but I think its a good template.  I also like how you bring footwork into the equation.  It's interesting to consider that MMOs with action combat seem to focus on controlling the weapon and I wonder if someone smarter than I could somehow expand on the controlling your character aspect of it.
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