You forgot to mention those P2P game that went F2P becaues they kinda failed. Their subscription went from 1-2M to 500k and even lower. They had no choice. I bealive they would stay P2P if they could, sadly they couldnt and ONLY way to gain those numbers back was to make the game F2P. And I know what I am talking about, I bought every mmorpg released for past 10 years, in almost every each of them I have one or more maxxed out characters.
WHY it is so big deal to pay SO small amount of money per month for something you play daily several hours a day? If I wanted to do any outdoor activity every day for several hours a day (gym, tenis, golf, w/e) Just please think about it and STOP seeking and demanding ''free'' fun, thats not going to work.
but you said in your first post that even 100k players is good enough for FF14... then why is going from 1m to 500k a no- choice for other mmos? Im pretty sure that if FF14 dont get at least 1m players and retain them they will eventually add freemium. I dont support subs but if FF14:ARR is well done it could be that one mmo i would be glad to pay for monthly(still not every month).
You say why is it so hard to pay a monthly fee for an mmo you play daily for several hours a day? i dont know about the OP but thats one of the reasons i dont support subs. I do not play the same game several hours a day every day. I cant justify the monthly cost and i wont force myself to stick to 1 game so many hours every day just to get my money's worth. And like i said in other thread, if i wont be playing at least 75% of the month i subscribed, i dont subscribe in the first place. And i know i wont play the same game that long.
Lets see how good FF14:ARR is goind to be at launch. That will determine if ill pay for it (i already bought it at 1.0) and so far 2.0 its looking pretty good. A second factor that will determine if i will pay monthly is the generic ! quest system. If thats the only questing system in the game ill most likely step away. I love questing and spend most of the time in any mmo doing that. But after GW2 launched i set my new standard. If any upcoming subscription mmo comes with the generic WoW / Rift / TERA questing i wont pay for it. Improve beyond what GW2 did or you wont get my money.
Yoshi explained why in a recent article on ign.
What’s also odd about this situation is that Square Enix is going to relaunch Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn as a subscription-based game. This may seem ill-advised considering the recent trend of MMOs like The Secret World, Tera and even the massively big budget Star Wars: The Old Republic giving up on the subscription model in favor of free to play options. A Realm Reborn’s director and producer Naoki Yoshida explained why.
“For a free to play model, it’s very important to be able to give a lot of items to players in a very speedy manner. Unless you do that, you can’t get the money back as a business model. With [Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn’s] kind of quality, we won’t be able to bring so many items. If you want to support free to play as the game business model, the game design itself should be totally different.”
Yoshida went into even more detail about why he thinks a subscription model will work for Final Fantasy XIV even though it’s failed for so many others. “There are so many great MMOs in the Western market. Most of them, they have investors behind. So those investors want their money back as soon as the game is released. If they don’t reach a certain number of subscribers and they can’t give the money back to the investors, then they switch to a free-to-play mode to get the huge money straightaway and divide the profit among the investors. Only Blizzard and Square Enix are the companies making MMOs with their own money. We don’t have to worry about giving money back to investors. As long as we never give up we can continue supporting the game.”
“We think this game is going to be very, very successful, so we don’t think we’re not going to reach the target [number of subscribers]”
Yoshida wasn’t willing to reveal the target number of subscribers.
You forgot to mention those P2P game that went F2P becaues they kinda failed. Their subscription went from 1-2M to 500k and even lower. They had no choice. I bealive they would stay P2P if they could, sadly they couldnt and ONLY way to gain those numbers back was to make the game F2P. And I know what I am talking about, I bought every mmorpg released for past 10 years, in almost every each of them I have one or more maxxed out characters.
WHY it is so big deal to pay SO small amount of money per month for something you play daily several hours a day? If I wanted to do any outdoor activity every day for several hours a day (gym, tenis, golf, w/e) Just please think about it and STOP seeking and demanding ''free'' fun, thats not going to work.
Im pretty sure that if FF14 dont get at least 1m players and retain them they will eventually add freemium.
I don't agree. I am not saying this game will never add some form of 'freemium' but citing a 1kk retained player base as the bottom line for that is, IMO, ridiculous.
Well i don't know about that because Hoshi said it many time while re working on Reborn that this time he will stick to more traditional plastyle of MMOS. And so far what i have read and seen FFXIV is not like FFXI but more like traditional tried and tested western MMOS. They are being very cautious this time and taking familiar route because they can not afford another failure.
I have seen and read almost everything Hoshi said etc. And I dont remeber him saying ''We are going to copy western mmorpgs such as wow, rift, swtor, gw2 etc.'' However I remeber him saying something like ''We are going to release mmorpg that will be able to compete with all the top mmoprgs.'' That doesnt necessarily means its going to be some kind of copy. In my oppinion Smart developer/company should always check competition, see what they do best and wrong and use the best features they have and modify them, make them better and implement them to their game
Lets see what the game looks like after release mkay ?
Umm..where did i say Hoshi said he is going to just copy WOW and Rift? did i say that? nope. So why try to put words into my mouth? from where do you think both of these MMOS got their features from? FFXIV was innovative for sake of innovation. Reborn is going back to the familiar MMO features which do not alienate MMO players. This time goal is to appeal to majority and not niche numbers.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.' -Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid." -Luke McKinney
You forgot to mention those P2P game that went F2P becaues they kinda failed. Their subscription went from 1-2M to 500k and even lower. They had no choice. I bealive they would stay P2P if they could, sadly they couldnt and ONLY way to gain those numbers back was to make the game F2P. And I know what I am talking about, I bought every mmorpg released for past 10 years, in almost every each of them I have one or more maxxed out characters.
WHY it is so big deal to pay SO small amount of money per month for something you play daily several hours a day? If I wanted to do any outdoor activity every day for several hours a day (gym, tenis, golf, w/e) Just please think about it and STOP seeking and demanding ''free'' fun, thats not going to work.
but you said in your first post that even 100k players is good enough for FF14... then why is going from 1m to 500k a no- choice for other mmos? Im pretty sure that if FF14 dont get at least 1m players and retain them they will eventually add freemium. I dont support subs but if FF14:ARR is well done it could be that one mmo i would be glad to pay for monthly(still not every month).
You say why is it so hard to pay a monthly fee for an mmo you play daily for several hours a day? i dont know about the OP but thats one of the reasons i dont support subs. I do not play the same game several hours a day every day. I cant justify the monthly cost and i wont force myself to stick to 1 game so many hours every day just to get my money's worth. And like i said in other thread, if i wont be playing at least 75% of the month i subscribed, i dont subscribe in the first place. And i know i wont play the same game that long.
Lets see how good FF14:ARR is goind to be at launch. That will determine if ill pay for it (i already bought it at 1.0) and so far 2.0 its looking pretty good. A second factor that will determine if i will pay monthly is the generic ! quest system. If thats the only questing system in the game ill most likely step away. I love questing and spend most of the time in any mmo doing that. But after GW2 launched i set my new standard. If any upcoming subscription mmo comes with the generic WoW / Rift / TERA questing i wont pay for it. Improve beyond what GW2 did or you wont get my money.
Yoshi explained why in a recent article on ign.
What’s also odd about this situation is that Square Enix is going to relaunch Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn as a subscription-based game. This may seem ill-advised considering the recent trend of MMOs like The Secret World, Tera and even the massively big budget Star Wars: The Old Republic giving up on the subscription model in favor of free to play options. A Realm Reborn’s director and producer Naoki Yoshida explained why.
“For a free to play model, it’s very important to be able to give a lot of items to players in a very speedy manner. Unless you do that, you can’t get the money back as a business model. With [Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn’s] kind of quality, we won’t be able to bring so many items. If you want to support free to play as the game business model, the game design itself should be totally different.”
Yoshida went into even more detail about why he thinks a subscription model will work for Final Fantasy XIV even though it’s failed for so many others. “There are so many great MMOs in the Western market. Most of them, they have investors behind. So those investors want their money back as soon as the game is released. If they don’t reach a certain number of subscribers and they can’t give the money back to the investors, then they switch to a free-to-play mode to get the huge money straightaway and divide the profit among the investors. Only Blizzard and Square Enix are the companies making MMOs with their own money. We don’t have to worry about giving money back to investors. As long as we never give up we can continue supporting the game.”
“We think this game is going to be very, very successful, so we don’t think we’re not going to reach the target [number of subscribers]”
Yoshida wasn’t willing to reveal the target number of subscribers.
Awesome. Glad to read that. It was never necessary for them to bring a 'freemium' model into FFXI, so I wouldn't expect it with this game either. Besides, it's a given that a large portion of their playerbase will be Japanese players, and I don't think most of them feel that 15 dollars a month is such a steep investment. I certainly don't.
For what you get in return, it's about the best "bang for you buck" in entertainment, bar none. Good for them for being able to stick to their vision and principles (without those bean-counting investors getting in the way), rather than regressing to some "nickel and dime" system that so many others have adopted recently. I'm not saying there aren't some decent F2P models, but they are certainly few and far between.
That being the case, I'd much rather pay 15 dollars a month for a complete game, versus the "free" model, that typically requires you pay more for things that come standard with a sub, just to have an acceptable gaming experience. Call me old fashioned.
I'm 39 years old have a full-time job and a pretty busy life that doesn't leave a whole lot of time for gaming.
Still, no matter how often I see it, I just can not get on board with the idea of "it was fine when *I* was younger and had more time. But now that *I* am older and have more responsibility, it's not good anymore for *me*. So now, the games should change to better suit *me*, so that *I* can continue playing as *I* would like to, without having to compromise *my* sense of enjoyment".
Note, I say "you" in the general sense here, because even though I'm responding to the OP, I see this logic argued by so many people that it really doesn't apply to any one individual. It relates to anyone who shares that way of thinking. And there are a lot of you.
It just strikes me as a shamelessly entitled and ego-centric mindset. "My life has changed, so now the games should change to better suit my circumstances".
No. They shouldn't. You should change your expectations and adjust your priorities to suit your new circumstances.
Newsflash folks: It ain't "all about you". You are not the center of the universe. A change in your personal life situation is not a mandate for change in the way games are developed or sold, so you can continue to play as you'd like, and achieve what you'd like, on your own terms, without having to compromise.
So, you used to be able to spend 5 hours straight in-game going after that item you wanted, but don't have that kind of time anymore? Okay fine. So you make that realization, adjust your expectations and accept that, okay, so now it might take you 3 sessions of 2 hours to get that item you wanted. You're still getting it just not in one session. Can't enjoy the game as much that way? Well, then you should reconsider whether it's time to move on and find a new game that better suits your circumstances.
"But it's not fair", some might say?
Of course it's fair. That's called life. It's called growing up and realizing that nothing lasts forever, and you can't have your cake and eat it, too.
Say you play golf every weekend for 8 hours a day because you're single, free and clear. Then you get married and have children which take up more of your time. That doesn't mean the rules of golf need to change because they're no longer convenient to your life situation. It doesn't mean your membership fee for the Country Club should be reduced because "you don't feel it's worth that much anymore". It means you have to adjust your expectations and shift your schedule to work it in, and accept that you're just not gonna be able to play as much as you used to. You might have to cut that game short once in a while and not go the whole 18 holes. That's life.
The other part of that attitude that irks me is how it just completely and utterly ignores and disqualifies those who do still have all that time to pour into a game that you used to. Those people still have a lot of free time. They shouldn't have the opportunity to enjoy these games the way you used to, because you've grown up, become more responsible and can't do it anymore? Really?
Can't justify the subscription fee because you don't feel you have enough time to make it worth while? Then pick another game that better suits your finances. Don't expect a game to change its entire revenue model, just because it no longer suits your sense of value.
Seriously folks. Get over yourselves.
The fact that you cannot grasp the fact that the gaming population is getting older, has different priorities and basically does not have enough time to game like they once did. Then you have the nerve to ridicule someone that states that obvious fact?
If they EVER even THINK of putting an F2P option in this game, they better making it a high level requirement before they can start talking in any global chat that is available. I'd personally give separate global/local chat channels for P2P and F2P players.
Whispers and general chat is fine, however.
I don't mind if free players are actually playing the game, I just don't wanna read any of their shit, and quite frankly, it should be a perk of subbing that I never have to.
If they EVER even THINK of putting an F2P option in this game, they better making it a high level requirement before they can start talking in any global chat that is available. I'd personally give separate global/local chat channels for P2P and F2P players.
Whispers and general chat is fine, however.
I don't mind if free players are actually playing the game, I just don't wanna read any of their shit, and quite frankly, it should be a perk of subbing that I never have to.
There were never any chat channels in 1.0 and there don't seem to be any plans to implement them in ARR.
If they EVER even THINK of putting an F2P option in this game, they better making it a high level requirement before they can start talking in any global chat that is available. I'd personally give separate global/local chat channels for P2P and F2P players.
Whispers and general chat is fine, however.
I don't mind if free players are actually playing the game, I just don't wanna read any of their shit, and quite frankly, it should be a perk of subbing that I never have to.
There were never any chat channels in 1.0 and there don't seem to be any plans to implement them in ARR.
The fact that you cannot grasp the fact that the gaming population is getting older, has different priorities and basically does not have enough time to game like they once did. Then you have the nerve to ridicule someone that states that obvious fact?
Maybe you should rethink your post.
I can change my font colour too, see? That doesnt make my post any more important and interesting. In your case, quite the opposite ..
But maybe you should use your brain meanwhile reading what he wrote. Just because someone is getting older and he has family now doesnt mean he has right to bitch about it ... you know, people are also born. So he should just maybe quit playing if he doesnt have the time that he used to have, cryeing about it isnt the option.
I have 22 years old and study, work and got family. Could pay R$ 40.00(€ 13,00) per month but is set quite high for a game. I could buy milk for my son for three weeks with this value.
So this part where you say you do not understand why players talking about free to play, think about it.
Just because some people aren't in the financial position to play this game doesn't mean SE should change their whole payment structure to accommodate that. I'm sure there are enough people out there that are capable and willing to pay for this game to make it profitable.
You forgot to mention those P2P game that went F2P becaues they kinda failed. Their subscription went from 1-2M to 500k and even lower. They had no choice. I bealive they would stay P2P if they could, sadly they couldnt and ONLY way to gain those numbers back was to make the game F2P. And I know what I am talking about, I bought every mmorpg released for past 10 years, in almost every each of them I have one or more maxxed out characters.
I just DONT see the reason to have P2P and F2P shards or whatever you suggested. For instance ..when I pay gym pass for 600 euro a year, I dont see any option availible to pay 0 euros but with limited acess or limeted uses fitness equipment. For those who want to try it out, there is trial (ingame) and something like free excersise (ingym)
Aaaanyway. I wont ever understant how 13 euro per month or w/e can BE ever a problem to pay? HOW, tell me? 13 euro for me is one cinema visit, not even half lunch in restaurant, etc. Its 13 euro per MONTH, not day... So either those F2P players dont take the game seriously and just wants free fun and play 10 F2P mmorpgs at same time or they are 12 years old kids with no money..
WHY it is so big deal to pay SO small amount of money per month for something you play daily several hours a day? If I wanted to do any outdoor activity every day for several hours a day (gym, tenis, golf, w/e) Just please think about it and STOP seeking and demanding ''free'' fun, thats not going to work.
In my country € 13,00 are worth almost R$ 40.00
I have 22 years old and study, work and got family. Could pay R$ 40.00(€ 13,00) per month but is set quite high for a game. I could buy milk for my son for three weeks with this value.
So this part where you say you do not understand why players talking about free to play, think about it.
I have 22 years old and study, work and got family. Could pay R$ 40.00(€ 13,00) per month but is set quite high for a game. I could buy milk for my son for three weeks with this value.
So this part where you say you do not understand why players talking about free to play, think about it.
Hmm I have 22 years old and study. I dont have family and I dont work. Paying the P2P is no problem for me. But when I will have family and kids I AM 100% SURE I wont go to mmorpgs.com and DEMAND all games to be F2P just because ME.
Maybe you should quit playing the games if you have family now and dont want to spend money on it .. or go play F2P mmos
THERE are milions of people who had to give up many things, for instance sport. Someone who did play fotball for 10 years when he was young, now had to give up because hes old or he is injured.. Does he goes to the manager, arbitrator and DEMAND change to the game so he can keep up with the rest?
NO, he has to give up or play just from time to time, not professionaly anymore.
Its no one but your problem that you dont have time or money to play the game! That is your decision. You made your decision to have a baby and family. Not us ... Everyone is his own master, dont blame someone else.
I have 22 years old and study, work and got family. Could pay R$ 40.00(€ 13,00) per month but is set quite high for a game. I could buy milk for my son for three weeks with this value.
So this part where you say you do not understand why players talking about free to play, think about it.
Just because some people aren't in the financial position to play this game doesn't mean SE should change their whole payment structure to accommodate that. I'm sure there are enough people out there that are capable and willing to pay for this game to make it profitable.
Like I said, I can afford to play and I'll probably do that because it's a great game. I just wanted to make you think about the value of money.
Remains a high value for a game you've already paid $ 50.00 to play.
Buy to Play or Free to Play. Pay to Play yea no, a lot of people wiill be turned off by this and a lot already are the many people giving the game a go are the people who played 1.0, who get a month's free.
"if u forcefully insert foriegn objects into my? body, i will die"
Buy to Play or Free to Play. Pay to Play yea no, a lot of people wiill be turned off by this and a lot already are the many people giving the game a go are the people who played 1.0, who get a month's free.
Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will be
Final Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game Thank you
Buy to Play or Free to Play. Pay to Play yea no, a lot of people wiill be turned off by this and a lot already are the many people giving the game a go are the people who played 1.0, who get a month's free.
Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will be
Final Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game Thank you
It is because of this kind of opinion they sell founder package $ 200.00 nowadays.
Instead of wanting more casual and F2P MMO's in a sea of casual MMO's, how about you stick to the already casual and F2P MMO's?
There is nothing good about the F2P fad unless you are someone who doesn't plan on actually playing the game more than a few weeks or less.
The whole F2P fad is killing the genre and I'm sick and tired of you casuals demanding everything be ruined because you have no time to play or are too cheap to pay money.
They have already turned FFXIV into a WoW clone frrom what I keep hearing from the people in beta, so I think you guys have done enough damage to the game.
What about us real MMO players that want an immersive and hardcore MMORPG? Why do you casuals get to demand everything be free and easy and we get n-o-t-h-i-n-g?
IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SPEND THE TIME OR MONEY ON MMO'S THEN DON'T PLAY MMO'S! GO PLAY A SINGLE PLAYER GAME!
Also, since you think MMO's are "unproductive" and just "entertainment" and the people who play them are irrisponsoble people with no lives, I'll leave you this quote to hopefully enlignten you.
"A reader lives a thousand lives, the man who never reads lives only one."
Buy to Play or Free to Play. Pay to Play yea no, a lot of people wiill be turned off by this and a lot already are the many people giving the game a go are the people who played 1.0, who get a month's free.
Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will be
Final Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game Thank you
It is because of this kind of opinion they sell founder package $ 200.00
See nothing wrong about that Somehow I dont understand where you ppl live, Everythingforfree land?
Do they force you to ppay for subscripton, game, founders package? No they dont. Only you have messed up thinking that everyone should be for free. It isnt.
I am not going to Bentley and scream and shout and demand lower prices just because .. I dont have money to buy it.
Instead of wanting more casual and F2P MMO's in a sea of casual MMO's, how about you stick to the already casual and F2P MMO's? There is nothing good about the F2P fad unless you are someone who doesn't plan on actually playing the game more than a few weeks or less. The whole F2P fad is killing the genre and I'm sick and tired of you casuals demanding everything be ruined because you have no time to play or are too cheap to pay money. They have already turned FFXIV into a WoW clone frrom what I keep hearing from the people in beta, so I think you guys have done enough damage to the game. What about us real MMO players that want an immersive and hardcore MMORPG? Why do you casuals get to demand everything be free and easy and we get n-o-t-h-i-n-g? IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SPEND THE TIME OR MONEY ON MMO'S THEN DON'T PLAY MMO'S! GO PLAY A SINGLE PLAYER GAME! Also, since you think MMO's are "unproductive" and just "entertainment" and the people who play them are irrisponsoble people with no lives, I'll leave you this quote to hopefully enlignten you."A reader lives a thousand lives, the man who never reads lives only one."
The people who bought the game via Digital download or from the store , the people who invest money to play the game to support the game/company , those people are the ones who get upset and pissed off because a game ends up F2P. The F2P player did jot give a hill of beans for investing of the game .any subscription game that went F2P here now its free and now they think that the game is equally there's more so then the player who invested real money to the game That's why F2P games are lame. It's that player base and that mentality. Everyone who plays a sub based game that went Free will agree with me
You do not understand what people are trying to show. Just come to read the posts with the "head made" with its ideas already formed. I understand when some talked about leaving and try other things but the game(mmorpg) is a pleasure for me as it is movies for some peoples. For years I get games and do some signing. Ex: Tibia, UO, WoW, GW and others. What I have tried is going on here: Not because we defend free to play we are children 12 years and have no job and able to finance games. yes we must question some points as consumers. Years in the gaming industry and do not like the direction that is being taken. We have reached the point that we pay to test a game in Closed Beta. Companies sell their games before they finish them and then sell again. Not because I'm a fan and I love games that accept pay anything and any value. Remember the initial subject of the topic and just try to understand the other side of the coin as we try to do when looking for the P2P mode.
Originally posted by DarknessReign The people who bought the game via Digital download or from the store , the people who invest money to play the game to support the game/company , those people are the ones who get upset and pissed off because a fame ends up F2P. The F2P player did jot give a hilloof beans for insert any subscription game that went F2P here now its free and now they think that the game is equally there's more so then the player who invested real money to the game That's why F2P games are lame. It's that player base and that mentality. Everyone who plays a sub based game that went Free will agree with me
Yep .. totally agreed. I played every mmorpg that was released in past 10 years and there is almost nothing worse than company change their decision/promises they had before release.
Most P2P players who are strictly against F2P are against it for good and important reasons. F2P brings and lure more trolls, kids, casuals, bots,etc. than P2P model. F2P model require developers to focus in some point on vanity/cash shopt/boost items. These reasons are a damn big reason NOT to want F2P in any good game.
If you need to try the game out before buying it or paying sub, its easy. Just go play in open beta, get trial or find someone who is willing to send you buddy key. And we also live in internet world. Use youtube.com and read something about it. Its not that hard.
Originally posted by Kinh021 You do not understand what people are trying to show. Just come to read the posts with the "head made" with its ideas already formed. I understand when some talked about leaving and try other things but the game(mmorpg) is a pleasure for me as it is movies for some peoples. For years I get games and do some signing. Ex: Tibia, UO, WoW, GW and others. What I have tried is going on here: Not because we defend free to play we are children 12 years and have no job and able to finance games. yes we must question some points as consumers. Years in the gaming industry and do not like the direction that is being taken. We have reached the point that we pay to test a game in Closed Beta. Companies sell their games before they finish them and then sell again. Not because I'm a fan and I love games that accept pay anything and any value. Remember the initial subject of the topic and just try to understand the other side of the coin as we try to do when looking for the P2P mode.
The other side of the coin is easily understandable. People who want to play for free because they don't have the means to pay monthly, people who don't feel the product is worthy of a sub yet for some reason still want to play it anyway, or people are just too cheap and want to get as much for free as possible. There are plenty of other options for you out there, so leave the few remaining games that are P2P for the actual people who prefer P2P.
The value of money and the value of a game varies from one person to the next. Decide where you stand, make a decision to bite the bullet or not, and move on.
There's really nothing else that needs to be said about it.
Comments
Yoshi explained why in a recent article on ign.
What’s also odd about this situation is that Square Enix is going to relaunch Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn as a subscription-based game. This may seem ill-advised considering the recent trend of MMOs like The Secret World, Tera and even the massively big budget Star Wars: The Old Republic giving up on the subscription model in favor of free to play options. A Realm Reborn’s director and producer Naoki Yoshida explained why.
“For a free to play model, it’s very important to be able to give a lot of items to players in a very speedy manner. Unless you do that, you can’t get the money back as a business model. With [Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn’s] kind of quality, we won’t be able to bring so many items. If you want to support free to play as the game business model, the game design itself should be totally different.”
Yoshida went into even more detail about why he thinks a subscription model will work for Final Fantasy XIV even though it’s failed for so many others. “There are so many great MMOs in the Western market. Most of them, they have investors behind. So those investors want their money back as soon as the game is released. If they don’t reach a certain number of subscribers and they can’t give the money back to the investors, then they switch to a free-to-play mode to get the huge money straightaway and divide the profit among the investors. Only Blizzard and Square Enix are the companies making MMOs with their own money. We don’t have to worry about giving money back to investors. As long as we never give up we can continue supporting the game.”
“We think this game is going to be very, very successful, so we don’t think we’re not going to reach the target [number of subscribers]”
Yoshida wasn’t willing to reveal the target number of subscribers.
http://uk.ign.com/articles/2013/02/21/relaunching-final-fantasy-xiv-a-realm-reborn
I don't agree. I am not saying this game will never add some form of 'freemium' but citing a 1kk retained player base as the bottom line for that is, IMO, ridiculous.
Umm..where did i say Hoshi said he is going to just copy WOW and Rift? did i say that? nope. So why try to put words into my mouth? from where do you think both of these MMOS got their features from? FFXIV was innovative for sake of innovation. Reborn is going back to the familiar MMO features which do not alienate MMO players. This time goal is to appeal to majority and not niche numbers.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney
Awesome. Glad to read that. It was never necessary for them to bring a 'freemium' model into FFXI, so I wouldn't expect it with this game either. Besides, it's a given that a large portion of their playerbase will be Japanese players, and I don't think most of them feel that 15 dollars a month is such a steep investment. I certainly don't.
For what you get in return, it's about the best "bang for you buck" in entertainment, bar none. Good for them for being able to stick to their vision and principles (without those bean-counting investors getting in the way), rather than regressing to some "nickel and dime" system that so many others have adopted recently. I'm not saying there aren't some decent F2P models, but they are certainly few and far between.
That being the case, I'd much rather pay 15 dollars a month for a complete game, versus the "free" model, that typically requires you pay more for things that come standard with a sub, just to have an acceptable gaming experience. Call me old fashioned.
The fact that you cannot grasp the fact that the gaming population is getting older, has different priorities and basically does not have enough time to game like they once did. Then you have the nerve to ridicule someone that states that obvious fact?
Maybe you should rethink your post.
If they EVER even THINK of putting an F2P option in this game, they better making it a high level requirement before they can start talking in any global chat that is available. I'd personally give separate global/local chat channels for P2P and F2P players.
Whispers and general chat is fine, however.
I don't mind if free players are actually playing the game, I just don't wanna read any of their shit, and quite frankly, it should be a perk of subbing that I never have to.
There were never any chat channels in 1.0 and there don't seem to be any plans to implement them in ARR.
Ok, well that works fine, too.
I like the free to play model with shop.
I can change my font colour too, see? That doesnt make my post any more important and interesting. In your case, quite the opposite ..
But maybe you should use your brain meanwhile reading what he wrote. Just because someone is getting older and he has family now doesnt mean he has right to bitch about it ... you know, people are also born. So he should just maybe quit playing if he doesnt have the time that he used to have, cryeing about it isnt the option.
Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
Just because some people aren't in the financial position to play this game doesn't mean SE should change their whole payment structure to accommodate that. I'm sure there are enough people out there that are capable and willing to pay for this game to make it profitable.
In my country € 13,00 are worth almost R$ 40.00
I have 22 years old and study, work and got family. Could pay R$ 40.00(€ 13,00) per month but is set quite high for a game. I could buy milk for my son for three weeks with this value.
So this part where you say you do not understand why players talking about free to play, think about it.
Hmm I have 22 years old and study. I dont have family and I dont work. Paying the P2P is no problem for me. But when I will have family and kids I AM 100% SURE I wont go to mmorpgs.com and DEMAND all games to be F2P just because ME.
Maybe you should quit playing the games if you have family now and dont want to spend money on it .. or go play F2P mmos
THERE are milions of people who had to give up many things, for instance sport. Someone who did play fotball for 10 years when he was young, now had to give up because hes old or he is injured.. Does he goes to the manager, arbitrator and DEMAND change to the game so he can keep up with the rest?
NO, he has to give up or play just from time to time, not professionaly anymore.
Its no one but your problem that you dont have time or money to play the game! That is your decision. You made your decision to have a baby and family. Not us ... Everyone is his own master, dont blame someone else.
Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
Like I said, I can afford to play and I'll probably do that because it's a great game. I just wanted to make you think about the value of money.
Remains a high value for a game you've already paid $ 50.00 to play.
"if u forcefully insert foriegn objects into my? body, i will die"
Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will beFinal Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game
Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will beFinal Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game
It is because of this kind of opinion they sell founder package $ 200.00 nowadays.Instead of wanting more casual and F2P MMO's in a sea of casual MMO's, how about you stick to the already casual and F2P MMO's?
There is nothing good about the F2P fad unless you are someone who doesn't plan on actually playing the game more than a few weeks or less.
The whole F2P fad is killing the genre and I'm sick and tired of you casuals demanding everything be ruined because you have no time to play or are too cheap to pay money.
They have already turned FFXIV into a WoW clone frrom what I keep hearing from the people in beta, so I think you guys have done enough damage to the game.
What about us real MMO players that want an immersive and hardcore MMORPG? Why do you casuals get to demand everything be free and easy and we get n-o-t-h-i-n-g?
IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SPEND THE TIME OR MONEY ON MMO'S THEN DON'T PLAY MMO'S! GO PLAY A SINGLE PLAYER GAME!
Also, since you think MMO's are "unproductive" and just "entertainment" and the people who play them are irrisponsoble people with no lives, I'll leave you this quote to hopefully enlignten you.
"A reader lives a thousand lives, the man who never reads lives only one."
Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will beFinal Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game
It is because of this kind of opinion they sell founder package $ 200.00
See nothing wrong about thatDo they force you to ppay for subscripton, game, founders package? No they dont. Only you have messed up thinking that everyone should be for free. It isnt.
I am not going to Bentley and scream and shout and demand lower prices just because .. I dont have money to buy it.
Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
AMEN broFinal Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link
I understand when some talked about leaving and try other things but the game(mmorpg) is a pleasure for me as it is movies for some peoples.
For years I get games and do some signing. Ex: Tibia, UO, WoW, GW and others.
What I have tried is going on here:
Not because we defend free to play we are children 12 years and have no job and able to finance games.
yes we must question some points as consumers.
Years in the gaming industry and do not like the direction that is being taken. We have reached the point that we pay to test a game in Closed Beta. Companies sell their games before they finish them and then sell again.
Not because I'm a fan and I love games that accept pay anything and any value.
Remember the initial subject of the topic and just try to understand the other side of the coin as we try to do when looking for the P2P mode.
Yep .. totally agreed. I played every mmorpg that was released in past 10 years and there is almost nothing worse than company change their decision/promises they had before release.
Most P2P players who are strictly against F2P are against it for good and important reasons. F2P brings and lure more trolls, kids, casuals, bots,etc. than P2P model. F2P model require developers to focus in some point on vanity/cash shopt/boost items. These reasons are a damn big reason NOT to want F2P in any good game.
If you need to try the game out before buying it or paying sub, its easy. Just go play in open beta, get trial or find someone who is willing to send you buddy key. And we also live in internet world. Use youtube.com and read something about it. Its not that hard.
Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn
The other side of the coin is easily understandable. People who want to play for free because they don't have the means to pay monthly, people who don't feel the product is worthy of a sub yet for some reason still want to play it anyway, or people are just too cheap and want to get as much for free as possible. There are plenty of other options for you out there, so leave the few remaining games that are P2P for the actual people who prefer P2P.
The value of money and the value of a game varies from one person to the next. Decide where you stand, make a decision to bite the bullet or not, and move on.
There's really nothing else that needs to be said about it.