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Tab-Targetting PLEASE...

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  • CananCanan Wedowee, ALPosts: 94Member
    Originally posted by Killsmallchi
    I honestly think it is just bad players that ask for tab targetting. I just keep reading,'spells need tab target' and 'I cant hit things without tab target' Seriously learn to not be terrible. Tab targetting is old and based on lacking technology. If they tab target all it will show is that this is another sub par game. If you can not aim, go play solitaire.

    I will never understand this argument of "being good" at aiming. I am quite good at FPS games and aiming and I find it honestly simple. I see no skill in trying to target your enemy and attack...is that really considered a skill? And if one actually does consider that a skill how does it lessen the "skill" of tab targeting games? There is plenty of strategic and tactical decision making that is involved in the "skill" of tab targeting games which separates a good player from a novice.

    To sum it up - these are two different games both which involve different thinking and maneuvering techniques to excel. Are these necessarily skills? I would argue not. However, if we are going to label them as skills, their differences and setting make them incomparable in my opinion.

    Cheers~

     

     

  • ThaneThane berlinPosts: 2,232Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Qallidexz

    My fellow DAoC warriors! So many games nowadays are moving towards the "free-form" targetting system (not to be confused with real-time combat, which is a different thing, and you can have both tab-target and real time), but I remember the glory days, where tab-targetting was all there is. Some of the newer MMO'ers tend to get it into their heads that no tab-targetting is somehow "better", because it takes more "skill". Well, running through people, jumping around them, strafing side to side, all that is just an annoyance, as the true MMO fans know, those who played DAoC, real skill comes from knowing what to do, and when to do it (spell-wise, and ability-wise) not from trying to run through your opponent (hense the /face, and /stick commands had to be implemented).

    Free-form targetting does not make for fun combat, tab-targetting makes for fun combat, but without tab-targetting, it's just little kids who are used to playing Call of Duty, jumping around their opponents, and over their heads, to gain an advantage, because they're not smart enough to figure out which spells they need to cast and when, or capable of figuring out what abilities to use at the right times, so they just jump around a lot. Let's avoid this in CU, and get back to the good ole' days, you with me?

    actually i'd prefer the "tab" thingie JUST for highlighting.

    dont make moves dependant on who you targetet. let your sword hit what it hits!

    "I'll never grow up, never grow up, never grow up! Not me!"

  • MMOExposedMMOExposed lalal land, DCPosts: 6,257Member Uncommon
    Developers listen to the wrong set of people and get the game killed. Same situation with Rift and its new expansion.

    image

  • GruntyGrunty TexasPosts: 7,063Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Thane
     

    actually i'd prefer the "tab" thingie JUST for highlighting.

    dont make moves dependant on who you targetet. let your sword hit what it hits!

    Age of Conan tried that, people didn't like getting killed by the 2-handed sword wielding Herald of Xotli standing beside them.

  • TumblebutzTumblebutz Henderson, NVPosts: 322Member

    You guys are all missing the central point.  What most players want (certainly the posters in this thread) is a high level of complexity in combat.  The battle between" tab targetting" and "free form targetting" is really a debate about where that complexity lies.  Free form targetting creates a level of complexity in the targetting, itself... this necessarily removes complexity from the skills and abilities which you are attempting to land.

    On the other hand, tab-targetting removes the complexity from the targetting system and allows for a far more complex and sophisticated system of abilities and skills.

    There is a difference between "complex" and "compicated."  I think free-form targetting makes combat complicated without adding any real complexity.  I want a complex system, not a complicated system... just my opinion.

    Emeryc Eightdrakes - Ranger of DragonMyst Keep - Percival

    RED IS DEAD!

  • QallidexzQallidexz Austin, TXPosts: 253Member
    Originally posted by Tumblebutz

    You guys are all missing the central point.  What most players want (certainly the posters in this thread) is a high level of complexity in combat.  The battle between" tab targetting" and "free form targetting" is really a debate about where that complexity lies.  Free form targetting creates a level of complexity in the targetting, itself... this necessarily removes complexity from the skills and abilities which you are attempting to land.

    On the other hand, tab-targetting removes the complexity from the targetting system and allows for a far more complex and sophisticated system of abilities and skills.

    There is a difference between "complex" and "compicated."  I think free-form targetting makes combat complicated without adding any real complexity.  I want a complex system, not a complicated system... just my opinion.

    I think you nailed it here, while the free-form targeting people seem to think that that targeting model takes "skill", and people who don't like it need to "learn to play", the reality is THEY'RE the ones that need to learn to play...


    They're sacrificing a system that requires intelligence (tab-targeting) in exchange for a system that just requires aiming, jumping over, around, and through your opponent, and of course, just going back and forth, strafing like a moron, etc.

    True skills come from the intelligence of knowing exactly what ability to use at any given moment, not from jumping around, and using any skill you want, because you can just "aim well", and move in such a way that gets your more intelligent opponent to miss..

    So, in reality, the free-form targeting people need to "Learn To Play", because tab-targeting adds depth, and requires a more strategy and cunning, whereas free-form requires you to be one of those 10 year old call of duty players we hear whining to thier mommies over the X-Box... "Just 10 more minutes Mom".

    Are those the players we want to attract with this game, my DAoC bretheren?

     

  • Plastic-MetalPlastic-Metal Highland Heights, KYPosts: 405Member
    Originally posted by Qallidexz

    Are those the players we want to attract with this game, my DAoC bretheren?

     

    The single best feature to prevent the strafe, jumping, ADD face smashing in Dark Age of Camelot was the 'fumble'.  

    My name is Plastic-Metal and my name is an oxymoron.

    image

  • QallidexzQallidexz Austin, TXPosts: 253Member
    Originally posted by Plastic-Metal
    Originally posted by Qallidexz

    Are those the players we want to attract with this game, my DAoC bretheren?

     

    The single best feature to prevent the strafe, jumping, ADD face smashing in Dark Age of Camelot was the 'fumble'.  

    I would say that it was a combination of tab-targeting, with the /stick, and /face commands.

  • StilerStiler Athens, TNPosts: 599Member
    Originally posted by Icewhite
    Originally posted by Stiler

    Here is a quick youtube video showing the combat somewhat:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tbcZvGSgVk

    I want to see combat that doesn't ignore terrain features.

    (He swings his sword right through pillars, several times (0:30) in that video. And the blood-splatter's gotta go, thought Conan killed that idea for good.)

    Funny you mention that, because for the most part it usually works that way. The terrain does affect weapons, using a "big sword" or something in a small hallway with walls near you, etc , you will hit the wall and it won't work well, for some reason that pillar let it through though, but I agree that yes, terrain should affect weapons and such.

    Still it's just a small thing, the combat itself is the most fun melee combat I've played in an action game.

     

    Originally posted by Qallidexz
    Originally posted by Tumblebutz

    You guys are all missing the central point.  What most players want (certainly the posters in this thread) is a high level of complexity in combat.  The battle between" tab targetting" and "free form targetting" is really a debate about where that complexity lies.  Free form targetting creates a level of complexity in the targetting, itself... this necessarily removes complexity from the skills and abilities which you are attempting to land.

    On the other hand, tab-targetting removes the complexity from the targetting system and allows for a far more complex and sophisticated system of abilities and skills.

    There is a difference between "complex" and "compicated."  I think free-form targetting makes combat complicated without adding any real complexity.  I want a complex system, not a complicated system... just my opinion.

    I think you nailed it here, while the free-form targeting people seem to think that that targeting model takes "skill", and people who don't like it need to "learn to play", the reality is THEY'RE the ones that need to learn to play...


    They're sacrificing a system that requires intelligence (tab-targeting) in exchange for a system that just requires aiming, jumping over, around, and through your opponent, and of course, just going back and forth, strafing like a moron, etc.

    True skills come from the intelligence of knowing exactly what ability to use at any given moment, not from jumping around, and using any skill you want, because you can just "aim well", and move in such a way that gets your more intelligent opponent to miss..

    So, in reality, the free-form targeting people need to "Learn To Play", because tab-targeting adds depth, and requires a more strategy and cunning, whereas free-form requires you to be one of those 10 year old call of duty players we hear whining to thier mommies over the X-Box... "Just 10 more minutes Mom".

    Are those the players we want to attract with this game, my DAoC bretheren?

     

     

    I do appreciate the insults and bias aimed toward CoD and assuming all people are 10 year olds.


    Targetting is not tied to how complex, or complicated a game is, that depends moreso on how the games combat is designed.

    For exmample, you use call of duty as an example of fps, as though you think all fps games are like that. Now I will use Red Orchestra to counter your argument.

    RO is vastly different from CoD, even though they are "fps" games. For one, Red Orchestra has no crosshairs, period. You aim through your sights, or you hip shoot without a crosshair. On top of this RO accounts for more realistic bullet drop and other things. Also a single hit in RO can kill you, even from a pistol if it hits you in the right area. There's not a lot of people that just run around "run n gun" a la call of duty. It's a completely different, and more complex shooter then CoD is, more in-depth and fun to some people.

    If you have free aim for ranged users, they can still have many varied skills and magic spells in his aresnal, he will just need to aim them. That doesn't mean you have no skills or abilities.

    This also can open up MORE complexity then your usual "tab" targetting, why? Because think about it, you can aim and use spells anywhere, not all spells have to be offensive or cause direct-damage affects or have a "target."

    Mages could setup things like flame walls (especially useful if in a tight controlled space, IE A hallway or something to funnel people in).

    You could have a levitate spell (like say, what it hits, it "levitates" for x duration) and you actually have to AIM it, instead of tab-target>mash hotkey, you aim hit and hit your spell key and if oyu miss, you miss, if you hit it your levitate what you are aiming at.

    The lack of tab targetting does not mean a game is less in-depth then tab targetting enabled, it merely means you have to actualy aim things.

    It also frees up some skills, because they can be determined by HOW you aim. As I gave an example of earlier.

    If an Archer wants to "slow" someone, instead of having a specific hotkey for a "slow" ability, they would have to aim and hit someone in the leg with an arrow, that could slow their movement speed, thus you don't need a hotkey for that.

    To some people aiming is more fun. If I want to hit someone in the head as an archer, I want to aim for it, and let my skill (and perhaps a bit of luck) determine if I land my shot there, not a lock-on tab target that pre determines in if I have a skil called "head shot."

    This kind of combat does not get as reptitive to me, because it takes away the "sure thing" involved in tab targetting, it makes combat more dynamic, more suspensful, knowing that if you miss, it's because of your or the other players skills and not a pre determined lock-on or a die roll determining "you missed."

     

  • Plastic-MetalPlastic-Metal Highland Heights, KYPosts: 405Member
    Originally posted by Qallidexz

    I would say that it was a combination of tab-targeting, with the /stick, and /face commands.

    Yes sir, I mentioned that earlier in the discussion.  I couldn't agree more.

    My name is Plastic-Metal and my name is an oxymoron.

    image

  • skyexileskyexile MelbournePosts: 692Member


    Originally posted by Canan
    Originally posted by Killsmallchi I honestly think it is just bad players that ask for tab targetting. I just keep reading,'spells need tab target' and 'I cant hit things without tab target' Seriously learn to not be terrible. Tab targetting is old and based on lacking technology. If they tab target all it will show is that this is another sub par game. If you can not aim, go play solitaire.
    I will never understand this argument of "being good" at aiming. I am quite good at FPS games and aiming and I find it honestly "simple." I see no skill in trying to target your enemy and attack...is that really considered a skill? And if one actually does consider that a skill how does it lessen the the "skill" of tab targeting games? There is plenty of strategic and tactical decision making that is involved in the "skill" of the genre which separates a "good" player from a novice.

    To sum it up - these are two different games both which involve different thinking and maneuvering skills to excel. Are those necessarily skills? I would argue not. However, if we are going to use label them as skills, their differences and setting make them incomparable in my opinion.

    Cheers~

     

     


    Exactly, personally i find tab targeting games harder because to be really good at them you need to know everything about the game, all the classes all the skills, all the calls etc. "skill" based games im pretty sure you could have some of the best stats in the world by simply rolling your face along the keyboard.

    SKYeXile
    TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
    Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  • StilerStiler Athens, TNPosts: 599Member
    Originally posted by skyexile

     


    Originally posted by Canan

    Originally posted by Killsmallchi I honestly think it is just bad players that ask for tab targetting. I just keep reading,'spells need tab target' and 'I cant hit things without tab target' Seriously learn to not be terrible. Tab targetting is old and based on lacking technology. If they tab target all it will show is that this is another sub par game. If you can not aim, go play solitaire.
    I will never understand this argument of "being good" at aiming. I am quite good at FPS games and aiming and I find it honestly "simple." I see no skill in trying to target your enemy and attack...is that really considered a skill? And if one actually does consider that a skill how does it lessen the the "skill" of tab targeting games? There is plenty of strategic and tactical decision making that is involved in the "skill" of the genre which separates a "good" player from a novice.

     

    To sum it up - these are two different games both which involve different thinking and maneuvering skills to excel. Are those necessarily skills? I would argue not. However, if we are going to use label them as skills, their differences and setting make them incomparable in my opinion.

    Cheers~

     

     


     

    Exactly, personally i find tab targeting games harder because to be really good at them you need to know everything about the game, all the classes all the skills, all the calls etc. "skill" based games im pretty sure you could have some of the best stats in the world by simply rolling your face along the keyboard.

    That has absolutely nothing to do with tab targetting or free aim, the idea that without tab targetting you have "no skills/abilities" to use is absurd and makes no sense.

    There are more ways to use skills then hotkey toolbars and tab targetting, or even f ree aim + hotkeys.

    The point of no tab targetting doesn't mean no skills or abilities, it just means you have to actually aim, rather then target>cast ability.

     

    This in no way means it has to be simple, or complex, or that you don't need to know classes, ablitiles of others, and adapt or have in depth combat.

  • skyexileskyexile MelbournePosts: 692Member


    Originally posted by Stiler
    Originally posted by skyexile   Originally posted by Canan Originally posted by Killsmallchi I honestly think it is just bad players that ask for tab targetting. I just keep reading,'spells need tab target' and 'I cant hit things without tab target' Seriously learn to not be terrible. Tab targetting is old and based on lacking technology. If they tab target all it will show is that this is another sub par game. If you can not aim, go play solitaire.
    I will never understand this argument of "being good" at aiming. I am quite good at FPS games and aiming and I find it honestly "simple." I see no skill in trying to target your enemy and attack...is that really considered a skill? And if one actually does consider that a skill how does it lessen the the "skill" of tab targeting games? There is plenty of strategic and tactical decision making that is involved in the "skill" of the genre which separates a "good" player from a novice.   To sum it up - these are two different games both which involve different thinking and maneuvering skills to excel. Are those necessarily skills? I would argue not. However, if we are going to use label them as skills, their differences and setting make them incomparable in my opinion. Cheers~    
      Exactly, personally i find tab targeting games harder because to be really good at them you need to know everything about the game, all the classes all the skills, all the calls etc. "skill" based games im pretty sure you could have some of the best stats in the world by simply rolling your face along the keyboard.
    That has absolutely nothing to do with tab targetting or free aim, the idea that without tab targetting you have "no skills/abilities" to use is absurd and makes no sense.

    There are more ways to use skills then hotkey toolbars and tab targetting, or even f ree aim + hotkeys.

    The point of no tab targetting doesn't mean no skills or abilities, it just means you have to actually aim, rather then target>cast ability.

     

    This in no way means it has to be simple, or complex, or that you don't need to know classes, ablitiles of others, and adapt or have in depth combat.


    i never said no skills or abilities, i dont know what you put that in quotation marks, but its obvious that a game said to be "skill" based is going to have far less abilities than those using tab targeting which makes the game far easier to learn.

    SKYeXile
    TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
    Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  • CananCanan Wedowee, ALPosts: 94Member
    I am still confused...what are these "skill" based games you are referencing? What does that term even mean?

    I can't help being facetious when someone tells me their video game of choice takes more skill than mine.
  • TheSkimDotNetTheSkimDotNet Pittsburgh, INPosts: 274Member
    Originally posted by Canan
    I am still confused...what are these "skill" based games you are referencing? What does that term even mean?

    I can't help being facetious when someone tells me their video game of choice takes more skill than mine.

    Chances are if your playing a tab targetted game, the reason you won instead of your enemy was because of a stat point on a piece of your gear.

    If your playing a freeform target game, chances are the reason you won was a well timed dodge or good use of environment.

    That is what skill is, not your endless grinding for lewtz, not your epic auction house skills, and not you using your mama's credit card for uber gear. Skill is skill, some lack it and try to fake it with there gear based tab target games.

    image
  • craftseekercraftseeker kynetonPosts: 848Member Uncommon
    [mod edit]

    Yes you aim, but not like real people.  You are doing it in third person for a start, think about how you 'aim' a sword and try again.  Also "free form targetting" and "action combat" are more visceral, but not necessarily better.  Particularly not better if you have a much higher lag than the average North American player.

    I also find it interesting the way this argument has evolved.  There was a time when people who used a mouse or gamepad in an MMORPG were ridiculed as "cow clickers", now it is those that use all of the keys on the keyboard who are getting ridiculed. "Tab kiddies" is one of the more polite terms I have seen.

  • CananCanan Wedowee, ALPosts: 94Member
    [mod edit]

    Again, what is this skill you keep referencing? I have said before and I will say it again - I am a gamer that is good at both FPS type combat games and tab targeting games. Neither really involves skill. These are video games we are talking about, have you forgotten that?

    It is definitely laughable (in my opinion) that you can say action based games require more skill (again I am confused on what this mysterious skill is) than tab targeting games. So you are telling me that your team of 8 random FPS players would be able to take on a team of 8 experienced Dark Age of Camelot players in RvR right now and even have a chance of winning? You sir, are mistaken, there is quite the learning curve to tab targeting games and a huge amount of strategic and tactical decision making (especially in Dark Age of Camelot). In fact, I daresay that experienced Dark Age of Camelot players would have a much easier time defeating an experienced FPS team than vice versa.

    Anyhow, we can go at this particular issue all day but I rather just break it down for you: these are different types of games that involve different skills (I'm laughing as I type this) and comparing them (as you continue to do) is plain idiocy. But, please continue believing that your game of choice has some kind of amazing skill-curve compared to other genres. Maybe you can even make it to the Olympics.

  • niceguy3978niceguy3978 Gainesville, FLPosts: 2,000Member
    Originally posted by Killsmallchi
    Originally posted by Canan
    I am still confused...what are these "skill" based games you are referencing? What does that term even mean?

    I can't help being facetious when someone tells me their video game of choice takes more skill than mine.

    Chances are if your playing a tab targetted game, the reason you won instead of your enemy was because of a stat point on a piece of your gear.

    If your playing a freeform target game, chances are the reason you won was a well timed dodge or good use of environment.

    That is what skill is, not your endless grinding for lewtz, not your epic auction house skills, and not you using your mama's credit card for uber gear. Skill is skill, some lack it and try to fake it with there gear based tab target games.

    What does loot have to do with tab targeting being more or less skillful?  You can have completely cosmetic gear in tab targeted games the same as you can have stat enhancing gear in fps "action" combat.  These aren't mutually exclusive things.

  • SiempreLaVerdadSiempreLaVerdad Conroe, TXPosts: 4Member

    The majority of arguments I've read in favor of tab-targeting being more skill intensive assume that twitch based systems (free-targeting) have less complex relationships between the skills. If you take a tab-target game like DAoC and introduce a free-targeting system, the game immediately becomes more skill based on a twitch level and therefore increases in overall skill required to be a "good player". Tab-targeting systems require less twitch skill than a free-targeting system; I don't think anyone argues against that. What has made tab-target systems more skill based are the relationships between the skills and understanding how everything interacts. That isn't a skill level associated with the targeting system. It is a skill level associated with comprehending game mechanics. Introduce complex ability relationships to a free-targeting system and you would have one of the most daunting and demanding combat systems to date, and those gamers who are able to grasp mechanics as well as perform in a twitch based system would beat out your jump jump kiddies and /face /stick dinosaurs. If CoD bunny-hoppers are your concern, mitigate against that by adding a mechanic such as stamina and then penalize the gamer through that mechanic when they engage in something you want to discourage, such as repetitious jumping. If the truth is that you don’t like free targeting because you struggle with it, just say so. We’ve all lost to a 10-yr old in Halo at some point haha. My personal desire is for /face /stick to go away. Movement and positioning in pvp based games can be a lot of fun, and they introduce another dynamic to the combat experience. So while I sympathize with those of us who struggle in a faster paced combat environment, in the interest of the game, I must cast my vote for a more free-targeting based system.

  • QallidexzQallidexz Austin, TXPosts: 253Member
    Originally posted by niceguy3978
    Originally posted by Killsmallchi
    Originally posted by Canan
    I am still confused...what are these "skill" based games you are referencing? What does that term even mean?

    I can't help being facetious when someone tells me their video game of choice takes more skill than mine.

    Chances are if your playing a tab targetted game, the reason you won instead of your enemy was because of a stat point on a piece of your gear.

    If your playing a freeform target game, chances are the reason you won was a well timed dodge or good use of environment.

    That is what skill is, not your endless grinding for lewtz, not your epic auction house skills, and not you using your mama's credit card for uber gear. Skill is skill, some lack it and try to fake it with there gear based tab target games.

    What does loot have to do with tab targeting being more or less skillful?  You can have completely cosmetic gear in tab targeted games the same as you can have stat enhancing gear in fps "action" combat.  These aren't mutually exclusive things.

     

    Yea, I think the best argument for tab-targeting is, with free form targeting, you lag, you die... period.  It alsmost makes the game "Pay To Win", cuz while you're not actually giving your money to the devs themsevles, or the gaming company, you do have to pay a shit-load to get like, an Alienware-level machine, and the top-tier high-speed internet. lol

  • QallidexzQallidexz Austin, TXPosts: 253Member
    Originally posted by SiempreLaVerdad

    The majority of arguments I've read in favor of tab-targeting being more skill intensive assume that twitch based systems (free-targeting) have less complex relationships between the skills. If you take a tab-target game like DAoC and introduce a free-targeting system, the game immediately becomes more skill based on a twitch level and therefore increases in overall skill required to be a "good player".

    That's not true, because the focus always becomes more about just landing your spell, rather than what spell your going to cast, There's generally FAR less options in these games.

    And NO ONE can do both twitch and strategy-based combat, at the same time, as well as they can do just pure strategy, so it becomes a combination of 10 year old CoD player skills, and intelligently strategizing, as oppoesd to just intelligent strategy...

  • skyexileskyexile MelbournePosts: 692Member

    The more level playing field is good in tab based games anyway...its boring when nobody can touch your stats...

    SKYeXile
    TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
    Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  • craftseekercraftseeker kynetonPosts: 848Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Qallidexz
    Originally posted by niceguy3978
    Originally posted by Killsmallchi
    Originally posted by Canan
    I am still confused...what are these "skill" based games you are referencing? What does that term even mean?

    I can't help being facetious when someone tells me their video game of choice takes more skill than mine.

    Chances are if your playing a tab targetted game, the reason you won instead of your enemy was because of a stat point on a piece of your gear.

    If your playing a freeform target game, chances are the reason you won was a well timed dodge or good use of environment.

    That is what skill is, not your endless grinding for lewtz, not your epic auction house skills, and not you using your mama's credit card for uber gear. Skill is skill, some lack it and try to fake it with there gear based tab target games.

    What does loot have to do with tab targeting being more or less skillful?  You can have completely cosmetic gear in tab targeted games the same as you can have stat enhancing gear in fps "action" combat.  These aren't mutually exclusive things.

     

    Yea, I think the best argument for tab-targeting is, with free form targeting, you lag, you die... period.  It alsmost makes the game "Pay To Win", cuz while you're not actually giving your money to the devs themsevles, or the gaming company, you do have to pay a shit-load to get like, an Alienware-level machine, and the top-tier high-speed internet. lol

    Or if you live somewhere other than North America with a North American server:  you always lag, you always die. Please dont say something stupid like "play on an Australian Server"  or "get a better connection".  There are very few Australian servers at all and connections that would put you within 100ms of someone in the US on a US server are impossible. You would be lucky to be consistently within 200ms of a US connection to a US server.

  • NephelaiNephelai SydneyPosts: 184Member Uncommon

    I come from a hard core dualing background in Quake and UT - I just cant see the point of aiming in MMO's. MMO's are played across continents with latency in the ranges of 250ms so they make things move really slow an increase their hit boxes etc to compensate for that latency. Makes the point of aiming redundant so including it so it FEELS like you're playing an FPS is stupid imho.

  • SmorakSmorak Saint Petersburg, FLPosts: 62Member

    First off woah!  If you were using TAB key for your targetting in DAoC, you were horrible.  I couldn't even begin to imagine how bad you were in RVR if you were cycling through targets using tab.

    Some people are trying to suggest that tab targetting and target lock-on are the same thing.  They are in fact not the same thing.  One is a particular way to select targets while the other is like aiming with a rpg vs guided missle.  They are not comparable.

    OK, now on to the discussion I think the OP meant to start.  Skill-shot abilities are ofcourse harder because they is a lot of guessing.  However, lock-on targetting allows for greater chains of skills and better 1v1 combat.  I think that if a game combined both of these, it would be on the way to an excellent game.

    For example, if fireballs became skill shots in DAoC, most people wouldn't use them.  With the simplicity removed, players would just make a different build.  However, if you rewarded players for using a skill shot ability by adding more damage and a small AoE, players would be more tempted.  Risk vs Reward would be applied.

     

    P.S.  If you're really begging for a "oh please find the nearest enemy target" button, you shouldn't even mention that you played DAoC ever again.  Go hang out with these guys.

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