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Will There Be Battlegrounds?

Ice-QueenIce-Queen USA, GAPosts: 2,451Member Uncommon

I'm a huge fan of RvR Pre-ToA DAOC, and I loved DAOC battlegrounds. Today's battleground like WoW or GW2 though, I couldn't care less about them. They are boring, way too small, repetative, and not fun for me at all. I know CU will have lots of RvR, but I wonder if there will be lowbie battlegrounds with a keep sort of like we had in DAOC. I don't think I've seen anything from MJ about, maybe we'll find out before or when the kickstarter starts.

If they happen to be in CU that would be great, but if not, I'd still be interested in CU because of the Tri-realm pvp battles. I just wonder if there are plans for the low level battlegrounds like DAOC had.

image

What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot

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Comments

  • SyrixIISyrixII Loris, SCPosts: 43Member
    Originally posted by Tayah

    I'm a huge fan of RvR Pre-ToA DAOC, and I loved DAOC battlegrounds. Today's battleground like WoW or GW2 though, I couldn't care less about them. They are boring, way too small, repetative, and not fun for me at all. I know CU will have lots of RvR, but I wonder if there will be lowbie battlegrounds with a keep sort of like we had in DAOC. I don't think I've seen anything from MJ about, maybe we'll find out before or when the kickstarter starts.

    If they happen to be in CU that would be great, but if not, I'd still be interested in CU because of the Tri-realm pvp battles. I just wonder if there are plans for the low level battlegrounds like DAOC had.

    Yes - One giant battleground that will be called the server you log into. :)

    Seriously though, What would be the point of a battleground in a game where the entire world is already a battleground? It's not like you're off leveling in the world doing quests and decide that you want to fight some other players... Wrong game my friend.

  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by Tayah

    I'm a huge fan of RvR Pre-ToA DAOC, and I loved DAOC battlegrounds. Today's battleground like WoW or GW2 though, I couldn't care less about them. They are boring, way too small, repetative, and not fun for me at all. I know CU will have lots of RvR, but I wonder if there will be lowbie battlegrounds with a keep sort of like we had in DAOC. I don't think I've seen anything from MJ about, maybe we'll find out before or when the kickstarter starts.

    If they happen to be in CU that would be great, but if not, I'd still be interested in CU because of the Tri-realm pvp battles. I just wonder if there are plans for the low level battlegrounds like DAOC had.

    Yes - One giant battleground that will be called the server you log into. :)

    Seriously though, What would be the point of a battleground in a game where the entire world is already a battleground? It's not like you're off leveling in the world doing quests and decide that you want to fight some other players... Wrong game my friend.

    MJ hinted at a RvR area for newbies so they don't have to face veterans on day 1. I am assuming it will be something like a daoc-style BG.

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • SyrixIISyrixII Loris, SCPosts: 43Member
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by Tayah

    I'm a huge fan of RvR Pre-ToA DAOC, and I loved DAOC battlegrounds. Today's battleground like WoW or GW2 though, I couldn't care less about them. They are boring, way too small, repetative, and not fun for me at all. I know CU will have lots of RvR, but I wonder if there will be lowbie battlegrounds with a keep sort of like we had in DAOC. I don't think I've seen anything from MJ about, maybe we'll find out before or when the kickstarter starts.

    If they happen to be in CU that would be great, but if not, I'd still be interested in CU because of the Tri-realm pvp battles. I just wonder if there are plans for the low level battlegrounds like DAOC had.

    Yes - One giant battleground that will be called the server you log into. :)

    Seriously though, What would be the point of a battleground in a game where the entire world is already a battleground? It's not like you're off leveling in the world doing quests and decide that you want to fight some other players... Wrong game my friend.

    MJ hinted at a RvR area for newbies so they don't have to face veterans on day 1. I am assuming it will be something like a daoc-style BG.

    I guess that is possible. but i took it that it would be more like a training area where you fight a few guards so that you know how to target, cast spells, move around. Not a tutorial but just a quick familiarization area without having to do so out in the wild against players.

  • Ice-QueenIce-Queen USA, GAPosts: 2,451Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by Tayah

    I'm a huge fan of RvR Pre-ToA DAOC, and I loved DAOC battlegrounds. Today's battleground like WoW or GW2 though, I couldn't care less about them. They are boring, way too small, repetative, and not fun for me at all. I know CU will have lots of RvR, but I wonder if there will be lowbie battlegrounds with a keep sort of like we had in DAOC. I don't think I've seen anything from MJ about, maybe we'll find out before or when the kickstarter starts.

    If they happen to be in CU that would be great, but if not, I'd still be interested in CU because of the Tri-realm pvp battles. I just wonder if there are plans for the low level battlegrounds like DAOC had.

    Yes - One giant battleground that will be called the server you log into. :)

    Seriously though, What would be the point of a battleground in a game where the entire world is already a battleground? It's not like you're off leveling in the world doing quests and decide that you want to fight some other players... Wrong game my friend.

    It's not something  have to have in a game, but DAOC battlegrounds were to me, the best there ever were in any mmorpg. I absolutely can't stand the type of battlegrounds WoW and GW2 have so it's not like I'm wishing for battlegrounds. I was just wondering, because there are people that like to play in them with alts for a little break and different kind of fun when they're not doing RvR. image Myself, I'll be doing the RvR bit all the time and of course housing, I love housing.

    image

    What happens when you log off your characters????.....
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
    Dark Age of Camelot

  • ScillyScilly penzancePosts: 69Member
    all bg's do is allow "twinks" to kill the non "twinks" to make them selfs feel better... i dont see CU accomodating this tbh
  • kryllenkryllen Home, MAPosts: 26Member
    From what it sounds like, BGs won't be a part of his vision...at least so far from what we know. If everyone will be RVRing nearly immediately, then it'll bascially be one big open RVR area. To me it sounded like the first area you zone into will be a PVE type zone that's safe from enemy players so you can learn your controls and get situated.

    We The Few - Gaming Nomads: Rants, Ravings, Reviews and Randomness
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    Phoxx/Phsxx - Mid/Ywain

  • JithakJithak MunsterPosts: 9Member
    Originally posted by boxsnd

    MJ hinted at a RvR area for newbies so they don't have to face veterans on day 1. I am assuming it will be something like a daoc-style BG.

    Something like this possibly. They said there will be some newbie protection. Which is good. But he also stated that even new characters would be able to contribute in RvR. In a more horizontal scalig game it would totally be possible to play with an experianced group. Of course you wouldn't be as strong as them but it's not that you would be like a lvl 1 char in DAoC not being able to get one hit against a lvl 50.

  • Ice-QueenIce-Queen USA, GAPosts: 2,451Member Uncommon
    I hope the RvR world is huge. At least as big as all the Old Frontiers RvR areas combined.

    image

    What happens when you log off your characters????.....
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
    Dark Age of Camelot

  • FARGIN_WARFARGIN_WAR New York, NYPosts: 166Member
    Originally posted by Tayah

    I'm a huge fan of RvR Pre-ToA DAOC, and I loved DAOC battlegrounds. Today's battleground like WoW or GW2 though, I couldn't care less about them. They are boring, way too small, repetative, and not fun for me at all. I know CU will have lots of RvR, but I wonder if there will be lowbie battlegrounds with a keep sort of like we had in DAOC. I don't think I've seen anything from MJ about, maybe we'll find out before or when the kickstarter starts.

    If they happen to be in CU that would be great, but if not, I'd still be interested in CU because of the Tri-realm pvp battles. I just wonder if there are plans for the low level battlegrounds like DAOC had.

    I sure hope there aren't as I feel instanced BGs was the biggest thing that screwed up Warhammer Online.

    image

    If you don’t do stupid things while you’re young, you’ll have nothing to smile about when you’re old.

  • RaagnarzRaagnarz North Las Vegas, NVPosts: 268Member Uncommon
    God I hope there are no BG's. The last thing game needs is separating the player base into level ranged instances. Not to mention I tend to agree with the fact that in most cases, months after launch, BG's exist for twinks to destroy non twinks. That chases away any new playerbase. Which means the BG's exist only to  feed the ego of someone who can't hang in the full scale/leveled/skilled war.
  • time007time007 Houston, TXPosts: 490Member Uncommon

    No battlegrounds. 

     

    Again, no battlegrounds.  All they do is draw people away from big boy RVR.  Battleground serve no purpose except to bottle up RVR and put it in a shoebox.  I know that you want a tiny RVR area for lowbies, but oh well, deal with the big kids and just join regular RVR like all the other grownups.

    image
  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • SyrixIISyrixII Loris, SCPosts: 43Member
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • SyrixIISyrixII Loris, SCPosts: 43Member
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    We don't know what king of "progression" they have planned. Progression could very well be different than what you expect. No one is holding a gun to their head and telling them that they HAVE to make a 5 year character have 100 times the damage and health of a day one character. Of course players want to feel a power increase over time, but that doesn't mean they need to move from peasant status to god status. I think that is the problem that current PvE MMOs have developed that makes it difficult for people to see a design vision where that isn't neccessary. To create those epic PvE progression expansions, they needed that. It drives their players and their games. In an RvR focused game, that isn't needed nearly as much.

    A good example would be this. Compare a realm rank 5 character to a fresh new level 50 with no frontier kills in DAOC. That fresh new 50 (if he is a wise player) will have a valid chance at beating that realm rank 5 guy in a one on one fight. Does that mean that realm rank 5 guy hasn't had months if not years of progression to get realm rank 5? NO, it doesn't. He very well put in the time and got the rewards. They just didn't make the rewards break the competetive level between the two players.

    When thinking of progression in CU, you'll have to forget what you have learned from other MMOs. I'm not sure there has ever been a game that you can actually compare CU to from what MJ has stated so far. Maybe I am wrong, but all we have right now is what he has told us, and what I am hearing states we have to look at this game completely different than what has been thought to us by the current market.

     

  • RaagnarzRaagnarz North Las Vegas, NVPosts: 268Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

  • CyborWolfTKCyborWolfTK anywhere, AKPosts: 77Member
    Originally posted by Scilly
    all bg's do is allow "twinks" to kill the non "twinks" to make them selfs feel better... i dont see CU accomodating this tbh

     

     

     Not true. Bg's are an excellent place to lean how to play the game, and

    it also allowed people to learn there role in RvR.

       Sorry you had such a bad time, You didn't happen to be one of those fools we always saw

    running out solo all by yourself where you?

     /Raises eyebrows

     Hmm

     

     

  • skyexileskyexile MelbournePosts: 692Member

    given that the game is totally RvR i dont see why they would even need to buff stats when you enter RVR...since its all RVR just dont give level 1 shit stats...i dont get it why so many MMO's feel the need to let people startout with 1 basic attack, fuck all gear and a pitiful amount of health.

    shit, give people a full set of green gear to start with.
    a normal damage abilty
    a gap closer/breakaway abilty
    a class specific abilty to start with
    so many games think their population is all like "err hudur" so we're going to give you 1 abilty at a time!..Thats it, auto attack that rat down! *PATS*

    they are having a newbie zone, this could be to level 20 theres no reason abit of power cant come from these levels, i would expect some since you're leveling skills, there would be some specilization happening here im sure too with some banes and boons and a gear increase and leveling of skills through use. but it does not have to be jumping from 100HP and 20dps to 1000HP and 300dps with all the evade and crit chance bullshit thrown in the mix too.

    I would hope a level 1 could if he so chooses jump straight into the proper world right away and RvR with the bigs boys, but beating one at this level would require some fair skill as i would imagine there would be maybea 100%-200% difference in power. Once leveling the training zone due to level though id imagine that to be more in the realm of 50%-80% (im prettymuch only talking effective health+DPS, combined to be stated percentage) but the higher levels would obviously have access to those big "realm" abilities, better gear specilized gear for min maxing and more refined specs.

    SKYeXile
    TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
    Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Raagnarz
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

    In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by CyborWolfTK
    Originally posted by Scilly
    all bg's do is allow "twinks" to kill the non "twinks" to make them selfs feel better... i dont see CU accomodating this tbh

     

     

     Not true. Bg's are an excellent place to lean how to play the game, and

    it also allowed people to learn there role in RvR.

       Sorry you had such a bad time, You didn't happen to be one of those fools we always saw

    running out solo all by yourself where you?

     /Raises eyebrows

     Hmm

     

     

    Also it is very easy to combat twinks: RR/level cap , and no "/rp off" or "/xp off" commands. 

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • CyborWolfTKCyborWolfTK anywhere, AKPosts: 77Member

     

      The way I hear people talk in this thread makes me wonder if any of you played the same game I did.

     

     I hear some complain- "Oh Bg's where full of people who could not compete in big boy rvr"

    Nope, just didn't have time to take out of my life to level grind,,equip grind, not mention ML and CL.

     Bg's allowed me to bring my crafters to an easily attainable level, so that outfitting was fairly easy.

     I then could rvr with out spending my life leveling,grinding, nashing my teeth over rolls, and other BS.

     

    "People just wanted to beat up on the noobies"

    Acually a lot of the times we where the people who helped the noobs with gear and info, so that when they got to end game

    they knew a little bit about how the game worked. But I'm thinking now you people at the end game probably hated it when a group of "Noobs" came in and where not so easy to pick apart.

     I had alot of people thank me months later for my instruction, and help.

     

    "Blah blah blah Yada yoo Yado goo"

    Look if your compairing DaoC BG to any other game's bg just gtfo of this thread. They're not even close. It's not even the same sport.

       Bg's served a vital service in DaoC, and IMO, if your going to cry because someone stomped a mud hole in you the first day you walked into a bg with your store bought robe and stick, your a hoipeless case anyway, and i hope you wont be playing CU,

    QQ more.

  • RaagnarzRaagnarz North Las Vegas, NVPosts: 268Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by Raagnarz
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

    In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

    But you're making one assumption...that this is DAOC. Its not and while it might share some similarities or spiritual inspirations from that game, there are plenty of others it can draw from as well. I don't expect this game to be DAOC but a blend of the best idea from several pvp sandboxy type of games. Separating the player base is usually just a crutch for not being able to figure out a system for vets and newbs to all fight together. It doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Raagnarz
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by Raagnarz
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

    In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

    But you're making one assumption...that this is DAOC. Its not and while it might share some similarities or spiritual inspirations from that game, there are plenty of others it can draw from as well. I don't expect this game to be DAOC but a blend of the best idea from several pvp sandboxy type of games. Separating the player base is usually just a crutch for not being able to figure out a system for vets and newbs to all fight together. It doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

    We know that there is progression and item crafting which means veteran players will have more powerful characters. That's all we need to know really. There needs to be a PvP tutorial where newbies fight against newbies for a few days.

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • time007time007 Houston, TXPosts: 490Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by CyborWolfTK

     

      The way I hear people talk in this thread makes me wonder if any of you played the same game I did.

     

     I hear some complain- "Oh Bg's where full of people who could not compete in big boy rvr"

    Nope, just didn't have time to take out of my life to level grind,,equip grind, not mention ML and CL.

     Bg's allowed me to bring my crafters to an easily attainable level, so that outfitting was fairly easy.

     I then could rvr with out spending my life leveling,grinding, nashing my teeth over rolls, and other BS.

     

    "People just wanted to beat up on the noobies"

    Acually a lot of the times we where the people who helped the noobs with gear and info, so that when they got to end game

    they knew a little bit about how the game worked. But I'm thinking now you people at the end game probably hated it when a group of "Noobs" came in and where not so easy to pick apart.

     I had alot of people thank me months later for my instruction, and help.

     

    "Blah blah blah Yada yoo Yado goo"

    Look if your compairing DaoC BG to any other game's bg just gtfo of this thread. They're not even close. It's not even the same sport.

       Bg's served a vital service in DaoC, and IMO, if your going to cry because someone stomped a mud hole in you the first day you walked into a bg with your store bought robe and stick, your a hoipeless case anyway, and i hope you wont be playing CU,

    QQ more.

    Hey Cybor, I think the point people are trying to make is, that pvp activities that could pull people from the main RVR is something we want to avoid.  yes ok so you want to level your crafter in RVR etc, or don't want to play all day/grind in order to function well in the main RVR.

     

    Yes Daoc's BG was done well, in that it wasnt a major source of RPS for people so you can't compare it to WoW or WAR BG's where people can farm rps faster/more consistently than main RVR.  But, what I think people just want to avoid any form of PVP that is going to pull people from the game's main RVR area.

     

    Mark said in a podcast that is one benefit to having no PVE, is that it eliminates that option for people so they have to do crafting, housing, or RVR.  So i think to allow an outlet like a BG, just for kicks for crafters/alts, might not be a good idea, cuz it will pull people away from the games main RVR.

    image
  • SyrixIISyrixII Loris, SCPosts: 43Member
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by Raagnarz
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by Raagnarz
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by SyrixII
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    People who say no BGs obviously haven't played DAoC and think we are talking about WoW-style BGs.

    i say no BGs and i was a long time DAOC player. Thid fit nicely into DAOC because of the PvE leveling grind. It gave people a place to stop off and play RvR without having to get slaughtered by the guys who finished the PvE grind to 50. CU is being designed with the expectation that players will be walking into the RvR fights right from the moment they create their character. With that in mind, I can't see there being a need for BGs.

    So you expect day 1 newbies to fight 5 year veterans with a huge amount of progression behind them? That would drive them away pretty quickly. 

    Actually yes. But I say yes because we don't know how the leveling/skill/progression system will work. Some games allow for lower level or less skilled characters to fight semi buffed. Some other games remove hit caps based on levels so lower level or less skilled players can still hit high progressed players albeit not as hard. Until we have the answers on how progression and the world will work, I'm happy to say I am 100% against splitting off the population aside from a newbie area.

    In daoc new players even with a few weeks experience in PvE and BGs and being on the same item level (pre-ToA), they were still getting their asses kicked in level 50 RvR. Now imagine having them thrown into the lion's den on day 1 with the most basic items, no progression at all, no experience at all. It would be a terrible mistake.

    But you're making one assumption...that this is DAOC. Its not and while it might share some similarities or spiritual inspirations from that game, there are plenty of others it can draw from as well. I don't expect this game to be DAOC but a blend of the best idea from several pvp sandboxy type of games. Separating the player base is usually just a crutch for not being able to figure out a system for vets and newbs to all fight together. It doesn't mean one doesn't exist.

    We know that there is progression and item crafting which means veteran players will have more powerful characters. That's all we need to know really. There needs to be a PvP tutorial where newbies fight against newbies for a few days.

    Just because there is crafting and progression does not mean that a 5 year player should be doing 10,000 damge per hit and a day 1 player doing 200 damage per hit. (yes, this is a very skewed example) In this very limited example (yes, i am dumbing it down this much because you apparently can't see things any other way), the difference could be more like day 1 guy does 200 damage and 5 year guy does maybe 250 damage. The term "progression" doesn't have to mean power, it could mean versatility or other forms of progression that doesn't involve 1 shot killing people.

     

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