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Renown hearts are insurance against broken quests

QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,788Member Uncommon

In a traditional MMORPG, you run around picking up quests and doing the quests.  A quest asks you to kill ten rats or go talk to some particular NPC or go kill some particular boss or whatever.  One problem with this approach is that some of the quests are bugged.  You need to kill a boss that won't spawn.  You need to give something to an NPC who won't respond to you.  You do what a quest said to do and it mysteriously won't give you credit.  You need to escort an NPC who finds creative ways to die.  (Actually, that last one might be working as intended, but it's still really annoying.)

Guild Wars 2 fixed that problem and we didn't even notice.  Sure, some of the dynamic events are buggy.  But those are more a replacement for the public quests that a few games have dabbled in, and not the traditional exclamation mark over the head quests.  I like dynamic events, but that's not what this thread is about.

Rather, renown hearts are Guild Wars 2's replacement for traditional quests.  What makes renown hearts different is that rather than having to do one particular thing that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult, you get your choice of several different things that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult.  Why is this such a good thing?  Because if you have four choices, of which one is broken and three work fine, then you can ignore the broken one and do the other three.  The odds that all four will independently be broken are very slim.

Comments

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    I have actually ran into this on a couple occasions back at launch but like you said you never have only a single way to complete a heart so I just did one of the other options and got it done

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • mikahrmikahr ZagrebPosts: 1,066Member
    Originally posted by Quizzical

    In a traditional MMORPG, you run around picking up quests and doing the quests.  A quest asks you to kill ten rats or go talk to some particular NPC or go kill some particular boss or whatever.  One problem with this approach is that some of the quests are bugged.  You need to kill a boss that won't spawn.  You need to give something to an NPC who won't respond to you.  You do what a quest said to do and it mysteriously won't give you credit.  You need to escort an NPC who finds creative ways to die.  (Actually, that last one might be working as intended, but it's still really annoying.)

    Guild Wars 2 fixed that problem and we didn't even notice.  Sure, some of the dynamic events are buggy.  But those are more a replacement for the public quests that a few games have dabbled in, and not the traditional exclamation mark over the head quests.  I like dynamic events, but that's not what this thread is about.

    Rather, renown hearts are Guild Wars 2's replacement for traditional quests.  What makes renown hearts different is that rather than having to do one particular thing that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult, you get your choice of several different things that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult.  Why is this such a good thing?  Because if you have four choices, of which one is broken and three work fine, then you can ignore the broken one and do the other three.  The odds that all four will independently be broken are very slim.

    I would say that its just a by product of them offering more ways to finish quest instead only one like in "traditional" quests.

  • RizelStarRizelStar Raleigh, NCPosts: 2,773Member
    Yea I much prefer the way these are done than traditional quest, I also like how the game isn't really built around them but they give good rewards for me, like xp, and karma venders, not that it's unique but to me they are don well, good alternative for when DE's aren't active and such.

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  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    Some DEs influence Hearts heavily, like the Centaur events in human zones. If the warfront isn't near the Heart, you can't kill Centaurs, so having another way to complete the heart is pretty much mandatory. So, it's not just insurance against broken quests, but also insurance against things working as planned.
  • fivorothfivoroth LondonPosts: 3,665Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by mikahr
    Originally posted by Quizzical

    In a traditional MMORPG, you run around picking up quests and doing the quests.  A quest asks you to kill ten rats or go talk to some particular NPC or go kill some particular boss or whatever.  One problem with this approach is that some of the quests are bugged.  You need to kill a boss that won't spawn.  You need to give something to an NPC who won't respond to you.  You do what a quest said to do and it mysteriously won't give you credit.  You need to escort an NPC who finds creative ways to die.  (Actually, that last one might be working as intended, but it's still really annoying.)

    Guild Wars 2 fixed that problem and we didn't even notice.  Sure, some of the dynamic events are buggy.  But those are more a replacement for the public quests that a few games have dabbled in, and not the traditional exclamation mark over the head quests.  I like dynamic events, but that's not what this thread is about.

    Rather, renown hearts are Guild Wars 2's replacement for traditional quests.  What makes renown hearts different is that rather than having to do one particular thing that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult, you get your choice of several different things that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult.  Why is this such a good thing?  Because if you have four choices, of which one is broken and three work fine, then you can ignore the broken one and do the other three.  The odds that all four will independently be broken are very slim.

    I would say that its just a by product of them offering more ways to finish quest instead only one like in "traditional" quests.

    This.

    When playing WoW I don't remember ever coming across a quest I couldn't complete because it was buggy and I've played it since the beginning.

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  • zimboy69zimboy69 chicargo, FLPosts: 378Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Fluxii
    [mod edit]

     

    firstly  i do agree  there arnt enough  heart quests to help you  level up in one area  but the  good news is  there are multiple other things you can do to level     

    and i agree i wouldnt pay a sub 

    because thats because  guild wars 2   has shown me that no mmo requires a sub 

    no single  mmo offers me £15 a month of more entertainment than guild wars 2  so why pay it

    id be very intrested in knowing what   mmo you are playing at  the moment

    image

  • zimboy69zimboy69 chicargo, FLPosts: 378Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Originally posted by mikahr
    Originally posted by Quizzical

    In a traditional MMORPG, you run around picking up quests and doing the quests.  A quest asks you to kill ten rats or go talk to some particular NPC or go kill some particular boss or whatever.  One problem with this approach is that some of the quests are bugged.  You need to kill a boss that won't spawn.  You need to give something to an NPC who won't respond to you.  You do what a quest said to do and it mysteriously won't give you credit.  You need to escort an NPC who finds creative ways to die.  (Actually, that last one might be working as intended, but it's still really annoying.)

    Guild Wars 2 fixed that problem and we didn't even notice.  Sure, some of the dynamic events are buggy.  But those are more a replacement for the public quests that a few games have dabbled in, and not the traditional exclamation mark over the head quests.  I like dynamic events, but that's not what this thread is about.

    Rather, renown hearts are Guild Wars 2's replacement for traditional quests.  What makes renown hearts different is that rather than having to do one particular thing that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult, you get your choice of several different things that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult.  Why is this such a good thing?  Because if you have four choices, of which one is broken and three work fine, then you can ignore the broken one and do the other three.  The odds that all four will independently be broken are very slim.

    I would say that its just a by product of them offering more ways to finish quest instead only one like in "traditional" quests.

    This.

    When playing WoW I don't remember ever coming across a quest I couldn't complete because it was buggy and I've played it since the beginning.

    are you joking?

    image

  • Eir_SEir_S Argyle, NYPosts: 4,623Member
    Originally posted by zimboy69
    Originally posted by fivoroth
    Originally posted by mikahr
    Originally posted by Quizzical

    In a traditional MMORPG, you run around picking up quests and doing the quests.  A quest asks you to kill ten rats or go talk to some particular NPC or go kill some particular boss or whatever.  One problem with this approach is that some of the quests are bugged.  You need to kill a boss that won't spawn.  You need to give something to an NPC who won't respond to you.  You do what a quest said to do and it mysteriously won't give you credit.  You need to escort an NPC who finds creative ways to die.  (Actually, that last one might be working as intended, but it's still really annoying.)

    Guild Wars 2 fixed that problem and we didn't even notice.  Sure, some of the dynamic events are buggy.  But those are more a replacement for the public quests that a few games have dabbled in, and not the traditional exclamation mark over the head quests.  I like dynamic events, but that's not what this thread is about.

    Rather, renown hearts are Guild Wars 2's replacement for traditional quests.  What makes renown hearts different is that rather than having to do one particular thing that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult, you get your choice of several different things that might be broken or scaled to be unreasonably difficult.  Why is this such a good thing?  Because if you have four choices, of which one is broken and three work fine, then you can ignore the broken one and do the other three.  The odds that all four will independently be broken are very slim.

    I would say that its just a by product of them offering more ways to finish quest instead only one like in "traditional" quests.

    This.

    When playing WoW I don't remember ever coming across a quest I couldn't complete because it was buggy and I've played it since the beginning.

    are you joking?

    I'd like to know if he/she was joking too.  I came across quite a number in Wotlk alone.  Just because you don't remember it happening doesn't mean it didn't.

  • mikahrmikahr ZagrebPosts: 1,066Member
    Originally posted by Fluxii

    STOP! with the Fanboi'ism.

    Seriously.  This is getting SO old.  I play the game to but I am so sick of people saying how great and revolutionary this game is... it's NOT.

    Guess what, TONS of hearts and DE's are broken all the time.

    Guess what else? There aren't enough hearts in any given area to level though.  Given the current state of 10-70 DE's barely trigger in most so you're stuck either GRINDING, crafting, pvp/wvw'ing, going and doing other zones hearts cuz ONE ZONE doesn't cut it, then bouncing back... there isn't a "normal flow".

    What did this game do but steal a few ideas and dumb things down a bit more?  Yea it's fun for what it is and has no sub, but I bet 95% of the population wouldn't play if it had a sub model, not a chance in hell.

    Enough with the OMGGW2IZtehBESTESTevar!

    Its great and revolutionary. IT IS.

    I havent come across any "broken heart" (ha ha ah) and ive been all over. Come across very few broken DEs. Very few. COnsidered the number of them that are available id say good job.

    Thats pretty much because those arent really ment to level you "through". Just filler between good stuff and for map completition. You got that right. Ive been leveling an alt lately and DEs fire all over wherever i go.

    No MMO gave me 15$ worth of anything/month. When expansion finally comes out - poof - give us another 40-50$ ON TOP of sub. Its fooltax. Its VERY unlikely ill play sub in MMO again. Unless they deliver content on weekly basis, have no bugs whatsoever, immediate GM responses, free call line to customer service worldwide...

    Good day to you too.

  • ShrillyShrilly Citra, FLPosts: 381Member Uncommon
    Wow someone has a problem with a game.... In any case I remember the bugged quests in warcraft still was fun I miss vanilla but I don't mind playing gw2 either why make it into a battle here? He2 is great innovation even if you can't see it
  • IsawaIsawa Middle 0 Nowhere, ORPosts: 1,051Member
    Originally posted by Fluxii

    STOP! with the Fanboi'ism.

    Seriously.  This is getting SO old.  I play the game to but I am so sick of people saying how great and revolutionary this game is... it's NOT.

    Guess what, TONS of hearts and DE's are broken all the time.

    Guess what else? There aren't enough hearts in any given area to level though.  Given the current state of 10-70 DE's barely trigger in most so you're stuck either GRINDING, crafting, pvp/wvw'ing, going and doing other zones hearts cuz ONE ZONE doesn't cut it, then bouncing back... there isn't a "normal flow".

    What did this game do but steal a few ideas and dumb things down a bit more?  Yea it's fun for what it is and has no sub, but I bet 95% of the population wouldn't play if it had a sub model, not a chance in hell.

    Enough with the OMGGW2IZtehBESTESTevar!

    Go read Quiz's The culling bugs are worse than you think--... and get back to us :)

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member

    You are about 3 months too late with this post. All the DE bugs were fixed a month or two after launch.

    Maybe try again when the expansion launches?

  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilastro

    You are about 3 months too late with this post. All the DE bugs were fixed a month or two after launch.

    Maybe try again when the expansion launches?

    Most of them were, but some are still there. Besides, this topic isn't about broken DEs, but about broken Hearts.

  • BetakodoBetakodo Poor land, FLPosts: 338Member

    OP is kind of grasping at straws here. Renown hearts are just plain old quests. Except instead of calling them quests, they're hearts and you automatically aquire them when you enter a certain area around the kill mobs.

    Pretty much, it's like saying quests are insurance against broken quests. In how many mmo's have you actually experienced a broken quest anyways? Anything about Chinese hastily made copies, of course. And yeah, I haven't found any WOTLK glitched quests.

    Yeah, it's nice that you have a choice of grinding on either mobs or picking up random items. Honestly, though. Who actually just tries to complete the boring heart as fast as possible so they can move on to the next heart so they can actually level up? Pretty much everyone who didn't quit because of it.

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,830Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Scalpless
    Originally posted by evilastro

    You are about 3 months too late with this post. All the DE bugs were fixed a month or two after launch.

    Maybe try again when the expansion launches?

    Most of them were, but some are still there. Besides, this topic isn't about broken DEs, but about broken Hearts.

    I think it is more a case of them still breaking.

    And yeah I've never seen a broken hearts.

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  • ScalplessScalpless SnowballvillePosts: 1,396Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Betakodo

    Honestly, though. Who actually just tries to complete the boring heart as fast as possible so they can move on to the next heart so they can actually level up?

    The ones who level up slowly. 3/4 of my XP comes from DEs and exploration.

  • Eir_SEir_S Argyle, NYPosts: 4,623Member
    Originally posted by Betakodo
    In how many mmo's have you actually experienced a broken quest anyways?

    Honestly?  In pretty much any of the ones I spent a significant amount of time in (WoW, Aion, GW2) and even ones I didn't (SWTOR).

  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,058Member Uncommon
    I jsut wished there were 2x or 3x as many DE's running at any particular time.  Often times I go over an hour or complete 2=3 hearts without ever doing a DE.

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  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,830Member Uncommon

    The only time I had a bit of problem leveling was during the first beta when I was adapting to the different playstyle.

    Since then my problem is that I generally level too fast meaning my personal story being way behind and the ps rewards being wasted.

    Currently playing: GW2
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  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,830Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by azzamasin
    I jsut wished there were 2x or 3x as many DE's running at any particular time.  Often times I go over an hour or complete 2=3 hearts without ever doing a DE.

    The most annoying fact is that there is a good chance if you were in the zone 2 minutes earlier or 2 minutes later you would get a bunch of them.

    Increasing the number of DEs, especially the ons that can be triggered by players in a predictable way would help out.

    Currently playing: GW2
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  • mikahrmikahr ZagrebPosts: 1,066Member
    Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
    Originally posted by azzamasin
    I jsut wished there were 2x or 3x as many DE's running at any particular time.  Often times I go over an hour or complete 2=3 hearts without ever doing a DE.

    The most annoying fact is that there is a good chance if you were in the zone 2 minutes earlier or 2 minutes later you would get a bunch of them.

    Increasing the number of DEs, especially the ons that can be triggered by players in a predictable way would help out.

    Yesterday i did DE in lvl 50-ish zone with 4 other players. After we completed it they rushed off. I stayed to see what hapens and to listen to banter of NPCs. There were 3 more events after first one which ive done solo.

  • Jean-Luc_PicardJean-Luc_Picard La BarrePosts: 3,549Member Uncommon
    I doubt ANet made several ways to solve hearts available just to fix "broken quests", but rather to give players more choices, but then that would make the thread title way less dramatic of course... ;-)

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  • VolkonVolkon Sterling, VAPosts: 3,788Member

    When GW2 was being pre-open beta tested they found a serious problem with the Dynamic Event system. It wasn't the events themselves... it was the people playing the game and the pre-programming they had from prior games. People would run by events because they didn't have a quest for something they saw going on. They had no idea what to do without some degree of hand-holding due to the archaic "quest hub/ quest bang" model older MMOs had ingrained into them. As a result, ANet added scouts and hearts to give those people that needed hand-holding something to see on the map to lead them about and get them into the event areas. 

     

    Hearts aren't to help fix a broken quest system... hearts are to help fix broken people.

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  • TorgrimTorgrim GothenburgPosts: 2,088Member
    Personally I don't like the heart system that much, It's sad Anet put them in, kinda make the world alittle static and you HAVE to do them to get map completion.

    If it's not broken, you are not innovating.

  • MardukkMardukk Posts: 1,558Member Uncommon

    The best thing about the later zones is the lack of hearts.  I'm not sure I understand what OP is talking about.  I've not really encountered that many broken DE's or hearts.  And with the massive amount of content at launch I can just go to another zone to get something done.  Oddly lvl 80 zones seem to be the most limited in content.  And if you are looking to make some cash on tradeskill mats you have to be in the lvl 80 zones for those drops.

     

    I do think some zones are quite light on DE's (or at least obvious ways to activate them) which kinda forces you to do some hearts.  More DE's would be welcome.  Also more lvl 80 zones with karma farming potential other than Cursed Shores...damn that gets old.

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