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Give Everyone What They Want!

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  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by fs23otm

    Or you could just play on the megaserver and find people of like mind to play with?

    In PVE you are playing with everyone from around the world, can play with anyone you want and swtich instances if you need to. 

    In PVP you get assigned to a campaign based on your guild affliations. Think of a campaign as a server. Everyone in that campaign plays against one an another. 

    That is my understanding of how it works. What your suggecting is limiting the PVE part and mashing the PVP part together...

    If I'm not mistaken the mega server automatically puts you with people you would enjoy playing with although I'm not sure how they are going to do that.

    You can't limit something by adding other options to do it, that's impossible.  The whole private instance is for TES single players who want to sandbox a little.   It would be tied to official ESO MMO progress;  once you finish a town's quests you could log onto your private server and buy a house.

    In time they could add many different sandbox elements to your personal world.  It would also be encouraged to invite other players into your instance (you may could give them a house or something).  This would help to encourage subscribers as well so you can invite a bunch of people to your instance.  There could be guild instances in which you would be playing in PvE with only people from your guild (or a collection of guilds).  If no one is on then you would just move to a public server and play.

    I'm not trying to mash PvP together but it's not wise to only have 1 choice to PvP.  If done correctly they could add in wPvP instances and invite other players in from different factions to be present in the world.  It would be like organized world PvP for those who wish to do it.  It does not mesh into the Cyrodiil system because that's it's own thing.

    This is about adding options to the game, not taking them away.

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by WellzyC

     

    The mega server is a horse sh*t idea.

     

    Yet another step in the wrong direction for MMos

     - No sense of community; faceless ppl that que for this , or instanced for that, giving the player no reason to get to know anyone or act accordingly becuase they will probably never see that group of ppl ever again (same attidiude as youtube comments)

    - Guilds willl be so numerouse that no one will care, everyones uncle will have a guild, not like daoc where there was MAYBE 15 good guilds, if that.

    - There will be no faction prode because, again, no one will know anyone.

     

    If we can get the mega server to create instances with different rule-set then we can create our own community.  Imagine being part of a huge guild and playing in a world with just other guildies.  Up to 2000 people (might have to invite other friendly guilds to join).

    Faction Pride is a pretty word.  People like to hear it but what it really means is if people are connecting to the game or not.  GW2 lacked faction pride because there was no reason for WvW other than servers versus servers.  It broke the immersion (and the free transfers didn't help).

    I strongly believe that if we give people the choice to play the way they want to play they would connect to the game and make their own communities.

  • fs23otmfs23otm Winter Haven, FLPosts: 293Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by sapphen
    Originally posted by fs23otm

    Or you could just play on the megaserver and find people of like mind to play with?

    In PVE you are playing with everyone from around the world, can play with anyone you want and swtich instances if you need to. 

    In PVP you get assigned to a campaign based on your guild affliations. Think of a campaign as a server. Everyone in that campaign plays against one an another. 

    That is my understanding of how it works. What your suggecting is limiting the PVE part and mashing the PVP part together...

    If I'm not mistaken the mega server automatically puts you with people you would enjoy playing with although I'm not sure how they are going to do that.

    You can't limit something by adding other options to do it, that's impossible.  The whole private instance is for TES single players who want to sandbox a little.   It would be tied to official ESO MMO progress;  once you finish a town's quests you could log onto your private server and buy a house.

    In time they could add many different sandbox elements to your personal world.  It would also be encouraged to invite other players into your instance (you may could give them a house or something).  This would help to encourage subscribers as well so you can invite a bunch of people to your instance.  There could be guild instances in which you would be playing in PvE with only people from your guild (or a collection of guilds).  If no one is on then you would just move to a public server and play.

    I'm not trying to mash PvP together but it's not wise to only have 1 choice to PvP.  If done correctly they could add in wPvP instances and invite other players in from different factions to be present in the world.  It would be like organized world PvP for those who wish to do it.  It does not mesh into the Cyrodiil system because that's it's own thing.

    This is about adding options to the game, not taking them away.

    Incorrect.

    You said if you want to PVE you go here... and if you want to PVP you go here. 

    You are limiting those people who want to PVE and PVP. How about people that PVE, PVP, RP, etc. Not everyone plays one way. The majority of people play different ways, usually changing what they do while they play.

    As for you PVP comment. Keeping PVP focused to a single area promotes more PVP then if you spread it out. It causes PVP to happen more often. Open world PVP in PVE areas is bad design.

    Take a look at various games through the ages. PVP server almost always have lower populations then PVE servers in the long haul. PVP servers do well when the server is first released, and then die as people get to max level. 

    I have been playing MMO's since UO and EQ. 

     

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by fs23otm

    Incorrect.

    You said if you want to PVE you go here... and if you want to PVP you go here. 

    You are limiting those people who want to PVE and PVP. How about people that PVE, PVP, RP, etc. Not everyone plays one way. The majority of people play different ways, usually changing what they do while they play.

    As for you PVP comment. Keeping PVP focused to a single area promotes more PVP then if you spread it out. It causes PVP to happen more often. Open world PVP in PVE areas is bad design.

    Take a look at various games through the ages. PVP server almost always have lower populations then PVE servers in the long haul. PVP servers do well when the server is first released, and then die as people get to max level. 

    I have been playing MMO's since UO and EQ. 

    How am I limited people who want to do both?  The normal game is PvE in all areas except Cyrodiil.  I'm suggesting that if people want to wPvP then they play the EXACT same game except they can fight with people from other factions.  If they want to stop then they would just go back to the PvE server.  They can freely switch between these servers on one character.

    AvA would be in Cyrodiil but there are some people who like open world PvP and/or battlgrounds.  Battlegounds are NOT going to be put in ESO (which is a good thing in some ways) but letting people invade other areas while people are PvE (and wish to also wPvP) would be a great replacement.

    That's fine that there is a lower amount of people who want to do these things.  That's where the mega server comes into play, it will only create a wPvP instance if there are enough people who want to do it and the previous wPvP instances are full.  If no one wants to do it then it won't create these instances.

    Why should they make the game for only one type of MMOplayer?  I didn't like wPvP but that doesn't mean I'm happy that it was taken away from those who do.

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Web he's not really limiting anyone as zenimax are highy unlikely to take notice of an armchair games designer on some forum that isn't their own.
  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by ShakyMo
    Web he's not really limiting anyone as zenimax are highy unlikely to take notice of an armchair games designer on some forum that isn't their own.

    Isn't that very limiting of Zenimax?  How am I limiting players by giving them choices?

    How is this much different than you suggesting that they do different servers like DAoC.  Things like co-op, classic, pve, etc.  I'm just suggesting that ESO server types include common requests by players such as world PvP.

    I would love to take a break from questing, switch to an explorer based instance and just look around with little to none interaction between NPCs.  Just me and other players roaming the world going anywhere we please.  Why does everything have to revolve around PvP or combat?

    Private servers could be great community builders.  Your progress is the same if you playing on a private instance or public one.  You could invite up to 2000 people to join you on your private instance.  As time goes on the developers could make modifiers that mimic popular TES mods.  For instance I could set a modifier on my private instance that requires everyone to use first person view - or one that lets them remake their character to any race.  Once they go back to the public server then they would be thier original character.

    This suggestion doesn't even effect people who don't like it ~ It adds options, it doesn't remove them.  Like 2 games in one; ESO MMO and TES multiplayer.

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common

    With the mega server there will be no need for Dungeon Finders. "The system can add new players to the world or can merge several worlds into one".  You would still need to look for groups but you could go there to find them.  I liked GW2 teleport system but part of me misses flight points.  It was great to see people in GW2 standing around a dungeon's entrance looking for a group rather than autoport in a dungeon with random people.

    I also would like to note that someone's private server would only include their race's provience.  Once they go outside their loading screen, they return to the public servers.  Private server would be like playing by yourself, allowing you to own houses and to change your world.  The trick is to give peak level subscribers a world to invite hundreds of players and then use developer made modifiers to alter the ruleset.   All characters would be linked to the official ESO, you can't alter the xp or gold gain on your server (in fact it could be less while playing by yourself to enocourage grouping).

  • XAPKenXAPKen Northwest, INPosts: 4,916Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by sapphen

     

    Can they convert that technology to create instances with different rule-sets, thereforth making a character who can jump between choices like wPvP, PvE, or Exploration instances.  I've seen this suggestion before and it's a great one.  It  allows players to pick how they want to play and then groups them with others.

    Different rule-sets would include;

     [...]

    So the list is of "suggestions" not of known features?

     


    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now turned Amateur Game Developer.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  Realm Lords 2 on MMORPG.com
  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by XAPGames

    So the list is of "suggestions" not of known features?

    They may be doing something like this.  There has to be a way to give everyone what they want... well at least more than just one group of people.  If the Mega Server could create different instances like PvE, wPvP and Explorer Mode then they could hit a whole lot of player bases with one swing.  Throw in a private instance for subscribers that allows them to own houses, marry, steal and kill (for the single player nuts).

    The private server would be linked to your online prgress, once you reach peak level you get your own castle!  It has over 20 different rooms you can lend out to friends for when they come over to play.  Raids could even be hosted this way as well:  Instead of them being public, you have to find someone who has unlocked it in their private server and then join them with up to 40 other people to take down a boss.

    Developers could make mods for ESO and offer them to subscribers as content.  It would have to be mostly roleplaying stuff as not to alter progression and attribute gains.  They could also focus on wPvP as a battleground replacement.  The good ol' days of open world PvP with consent was an excellent thing - i would take that over battlegrounds any day.

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    I added 3 questions dealing with "server" types, developer made mods, and explorer mode.  I thought it would be cool to allow people to travel to enemy territories in explorer mode and then let them 'que' for wPvP as invaders.  If there is enough people who want to wPvP from that region then it will throw all of you together in a public instance.
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon

    While it's refershing to see some actual positive as well as constructive feedback toward an element you dislike. I'm looking at some of these suggestions you're offering (throughout the thread) with jaw to the floor. Some of this stuff is quite a huge undertaking.

    While having all of these options available to the player would be great. They would need some serious time and work added to development ( if these are not the directions they're taking), not to mention budget costs. I seriously doubt they have that option.

    Maybe some day we'll see all of these things in one MMO (Your suggestions on top of Zen's promoted features).

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by Distopia

    While it's refershing to see some actual positive as well as constructive feedback toward an element you dislike. I'm looking at some of these suggestions you're offering (throughout the thread) with jaw to the floor. Some of this stuff is quite a huge undertaking.

    While having all of these options available to the player would be great. They would need some serious time and work added to development ( if these are not the directions they're taking), not to mention budget costs. I seriously doubt they have that option.

    Maybe some day we'll see all of these things in one MMO (Your suggestions on top of Zen's promoted features).

    I respect your critique.

    Would it not be simple to create an instance of ESO and just put one person in it?  As time goes on the developers could add modifiers like housing and castles.  The content is going to take time but the idea is rather simple.

    Same as the world PvP or Explorer mode options ~ Is it not implausable to put in enemy players or passive NPCs?

    With these options they could please the mmo'rs, fanatics, explorers, pvp'rs, roleplayers, mod'rs... all without effecting the official game.

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common

    Wouldn't it be cool to log on your private instance and have a garden of materials (like the Archmage garden in Skyrim) or a private mine you bought to stock pile materials (like SWG/EVE)?

    Wouldn't it be cool to invite traders into your private instance and give them a shop in a town you own?  Instead of the auction house, players could just visit differen't shopping districts set up by players and guilds.

    Give us the official game but give us a sandbox and build on it as time goes on.  The "mod" element is dismissed too quickly, what if the developers made the modifications and gave (sold) them to us.  They could still go through with the official plan but hire a small mod team to offer popular roleplaying TES mods.  Let the fans vote with their wallet if they want these options ~ if it makes no money then drop it, you still have the official MMO.

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    I think they should add the option to play as a wookie and wield a lightsaber
  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by ShakyMo
    I think they should add the option to play as a wookie and wield a lightsaber

    LOL, that's just silly.  Although it would be cool if they added a weapon creation tool for players so we can make and texture our own weapons... armor, dungeon and house could work also all within our private adventure.  Would be an awesome expansion!

  • Rthuth434Rthuth434 uniondale, NYPosts: 346Member
    so i guess OP is TESO's MMOMaverick?
  • jtcgsjtcgs New Port Richey, ILPosts: 1,777Member

    All I know is that I cannot WAIT to see everyone that has been protecting the idea of RvR in this game realize that the server setup is going to prevent the...rivalries...they think its going to bring back.

    You are going to face people/guilds one day and may not see them again for a long time because of the way they are setting the servers up further making this faction based play choice even more pointless well beyond the fact it makes the game NOT TES with its limitations on faction/race/non-opened world.

    And no...TESO is not a Themepark and a Sandbox, its themepark. lvled content, closed factions, race restrictions, non-opened world, vast storyline to quest through...and its faction zones are closed to only that faction. The only thing announced that could be confused with sandbox is the somewhat open class system.

    “I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jtcgs

    All I know is that I cannot WAIT to see everyone that has been protecting the idea of RvR in this game realize that the server setup is going to prevent the...rivalries...they think its going to bring back.

    How it's supposed to work is you get placed in a campaign for RVR, you're bound to that campaign unless you use (whatever currency they offer) to switch. At least that's my understanding. Will there be flip-floppers? Of course, however, I'd wager many PVP oriented guilds will not be doing that sort of thing.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Rthuth434
    so i guess OP is TESO's MMOMaverick?

    Mav was a supporter of TOR, Sap doesn't seem to be a supporter of TESO. I'm not sure how you've come to such a conclusion.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by jtcgs

    All I know is that I cannot WAIT to see everyone that has been protecting the idea of RvR in this game realize that the server setup is going to prevent the...rivalries...they think its going to bring back.

    You are going to face people/guilds one day and may not see them again for a long time because of the way they are setting the servers up further making this faction based play choice even more pointless well beyond the fact it makes the game NOT TES with its limitations on faction/race/non-opened world.

    I agree.  It seems people are protection only one idea and swear anything else would ruin their gaming experience.  I don't like it when content is missing, not stuff I don't do.  They should give us as many options to play their game as possible; have a traditional RvR rule-set, then have an explorer mode, wPvP,  Open Factions, etc.   Even DAoC used different server rule-sets - do the same thing but make characters persistent. 

     

    Originally posted by jtcgs

    And no...TESO is not a Themepark and a Sandbox, its themepark. lvled content, closed factions, race restrictions, non-opened world, vast storyline to quest through...and its faction zones are closed to only that faction. The only thing announced that could be confused with sandbox is the somewhat open class system.


    It can be a sandbox.  For $9.99 a month you can have your private instance and invite who ever you want with whatever rule-set as you prefer.  Imagine a First Person View server.  Fight in Cyrodiil 'locked' into first person view on your main... if it sucks switch back to a normal rule-set instance.

    It goes deeper than this.  If they give buyers a private game then they could add features like housing, material gathering, land/shop ownership (replacing AH), and many other things.  Subscribers can have up to 2000 people on their instance while b2p could only invite 4-5 for dungeons and small runs ~ but unless you're showing off your house it would probably be better to join an official instance.

    I'm trying to make sense but I feel like I'm rambling.

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by Distopia

    How it's supposed to work is you get placed in a campaign for RVR, you're bound to that campaign unless you use (whatever currency they offer) to switch. At least that's my understanding. Will there be flip-floppers? Of course, however, I'd wager many PVP oriented guilds will not be doing that sort of thing.

    What about and explorer version of Cyrodiil?  PvP isn't allowed, all the NPCs are unresponsive, you can scout around and talk with other players from any faction doing the same.

    We want players to get to know each other and create relations right?

  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by Rthuth434
    so i guess OP is TESO's MMOMaverick?

    Mav was a supporter of TOR, Sap doesn't seem to be a supporter of TESO. I'm not sure how you've come to such a conclusion.

    Yeah, I've been bashing ESO pretty hard.  I feel kind of bad about it... but that doesn't change that I don't fully agree with their narrow approach.  It seems only directed for RvR.  If the mega server could create instances with different rule-sets then they could allow me, and others, to play the game in a way we would enjoy.

    Whats the harm in letting me change my character's appearence to another race (even though the storyline would be as if I'm an orc).  It could be a toggle for you, you would see my original race but everyone else who doesn't mind open factions would see my altered race.  It's just visual.

    Why not have the mega server open up wPvP instances.  Would be cool to quest with enemy players roaming about.  A 'invador' que could bring enemy players to the instance and spawn them at secret camps. AT ANY TIME, if you get tired of the rule-set then you could switch to a PvE server, with the same character in the same space.

  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,905Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by sapphen
    Originally posted by Distopia

    How it's supposed to work is you get placed in a campaign for RVR, you're bound to that campaign unless you use (whatever currency they offer) to switch. At least that's my understanding. Will there be flip-floppers? Of course, however, I'd wager many PVP oriented guilds will not be doing that sort of thing.

    What about and explorer version of Cyrodiil?  PvP isn't allowed, all the NPCs are unresponsive, you can scout around and talk with other players from any faction doing the same.

    We want players to get to know each other and create relations right?

    I'd be all about something like that, or even simply the ability to war all over Tamriel (mordred like ruleset).

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • FromHellFromHell NY, NYPosts: 1,311Member
    Can I just have Skyrim with a decent multiplayer option? thanks

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  • sapphensapphen Madison, NCPosts: 911Member Common
    Originally posted by Distopia
    Originally posted by sapphen
    Originally posted by Distopia

    How it's supposed to work is you get placed in a campaign for RVR, you're bound to that campaign unless you use (whatever currency they offer) to switch. At least that's my understanding. Will there be flip-floppers? Of course, however, I'd wager many PVP oriented guilds will not be doing that sort of thing.

    What about and explorer version of Cyrodiil?  PvP isn't allowed, all the NPCs are unresponsive, you can scout around and talk with other players from any faction doing the same.

    We want players to get to know each other and create relations right?

    I'd be all about something like that, or even simply the ability to war all over Tamriel (mordred like ruleset).

    Dude that would be wicked cool.  I would totally dig an open war instance of faction'd territories.

    I wonder how a perma-death server would do?

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