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Please stop buying "founder's packs" !

HappyFunBallHappyFunBall Boston, MAPosts: 225Member

This trend has GOT to stop.  Selling weekend, or closed beta access?  What?  It blows my mind that game pre-orders exist, especially 1 to 1.5 years out, and people buy them.  Who would buy a product that doesn't even come out for over a year?  Seriously, what's wrong with people?

As far as Founder's packs, to me, this is saying, "Hey, our game isn't done yet, but fund our development, and beta test (or alpha test) our game, and we'll even let you PAY for it!"

You can't make 50-80k as a SQA analyst, or engineer.  But let's pay THEM to "let" us test their game. What?

Many games stress test behind the scenes, and even gather all sorts or performance data from you, and you pay them to help test their software.  This seems ass-backwards to me, especially as a principal software engineer.

I understand some people think they that are making a game they want better by beta testing, but paying for it?  Some of these founder packs are $200!!!!  For what, virtual items, and only weekend play time like Neverwinter?  I'm the Firefall beta, and it's not even a beta.  There's a ton of game content that isn't in the game yet.  Sorry, but by definition, that makes in an alpha.

Are people really THIS desperate to play a game?

The worst thing to me is not even playing the game once, and then shelling out $200 on a founders pack.  Without even knowing if you like the game or not?  Again, what??

Also, I'm not trolling.  Just posting an opinion.  I really think this is a terrible trend.

 

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Comments

  • BitterClingerBitterClinger Newark, DEPosts: 224Member Uncommon

    What difference does it make?

    Let's say I make Bitter Games, and I need 2,000 people to beta test my games.  The problem is that I am making a game based on some popular IP, so I know there are going to be 100,000 players trying to get into my beta! The right and appropriate solution is charging money for my 2000 beta slots.

    In order to make this work, I have to entice interested players with something they can take with them into the released version of the game. The founders pack is not created by game developers or publishers; it was created by game players.

    Top Games Played in 2015: World of Tanks, Tera, World of Warships

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    i think a worse one is charging a box fee + charging a monthly sub + charging people for special items.. many if not most people who will play neverwinter probably will not spend a dime on this game why does it matter if some of the ones with more disposable income or hardcore fans want to contribute to the game and get some perks as well

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • PurutzilPurutzil East Stroudsburg, PAPosts: 2,923Member Uncommon
    Yeah... except a founder's package can be used to support a game in getting released by having the founds available for it. Honestly, I think its stupid not to have the choice, particularly if its primarily for perks and its still giving the player access to the game and the likes if they invest in it. As long as the player gets their worth out of it and some perks for helping to support the development, I see no reason not to. Hell, businesses do this all the time as investors often times are given the product to see what their money helped to support if they got enough chunk in the operation.
  • DigironoDigirono Charlotte, NCPosts: 86Member
    What's wrong with people paying for a game they have either enjoyed, or think they're going to enjoy it so they throw money at it? Firefall for example, the majority of people I have talked with in-game about the "$100.00 Commander pack" for the beta are not only happy that they spent the money on it, but are still having fun in it. Champions Online Lifetime sub is another thing, I think most people that bought it think they got their moneys worth. It's comes down to "If you enjoy this game, are you willing to give them money, and if so how much". I don't mind throwing money at a game if I like the concept, enjoy playing it, and think that I can get my moneys worth of "Entertaining gameplay". So, no...please -don't- stop buying "Founder's Packs" if you enjoy a game and or think you will get your moneys worth in that game. 

    image

  • knapuknapu GifhornPosts: 131Member

    FIrst of all to those whos got no idea about anything abut this game.

    Its from cryptic so by buying ,, founders package,, u dont help  develope the game u just buying a pre order thats it

    Nothing else nothign more the money goes to theyre pockets i mean how dumb can this company get charging founders package at beta the game is as good as rdy they will not add anything at all doesnt matter how many ,,founders packages ,, You people buy , u just get ripped off and im loughing .Cryptic comes back with another scamm and people going for it srsly i need to make games and rip if  people to its best thing now days i see noone learns nothing.

    I feel bad only for those companys that are actually DEVELOPING   a game and offer some kind a founder/support payments with small money etz but not a game that suppose to come out Q1 2013 omg ...

    Well thats just my opinion .

    I am the punishment of God...
    If you had not committed great sins,
    God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you
    — Genghis Khan

  • IG-88IG-88 GrandosPosts: 143Member
    I do what i want with my money.
  • BitterClingerBitterClinger Newark, DEPosts: 224Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by IG-88
    I do what i want with my money.

    HA HA HA! The voice of independence wins the day again.

    This is why "money" is so valuable. It is the most democratic (note the small 'D') representation of the peoples wishes.

    Top Games Played in 2015: World of Tanks, Tera, World of Warships

  • nationalcitynationalcity Decatur, MIPosts: 330Member Uncommon

    It just makes no sense why you care lol.. People can do what they want with there money...

     

    BUT and here's the BUT if people are actually spending 200$ on another Cryptic title they have to know what there getting themselves into after STO and CO.........

     

    Crytpic games have this factor that the fun seems to wear off awfully fast and it seems like your having to force yourself to login......

     

    Maybe thats just my opinion though......

  • AerowynAerowyn BUZZARDS BAY, MAPosts: 7,928Member
    Originally posted by knapu

    FIrst of all to those whos got no idea about anything abut this game.

    Its from cryptic so by buying ,, founders package,, u dont help  develope the game u just buying a pre order thats it

    Nothing else nothign more the money goes to theyre pockets i mean how dumb can this company get charging founders package at beta the game is as good as rdy they will not add anything at all doesnt matter how many ,,founders packages ,, You people buy , u just get ripped off and im loughing .Cryptic comes back with another scamm and people going for it srsly i need to make games and rip if  people to its best thing now days i see noone learns nothing.

    I feel bad only for those companys that are actually DEVELOPING   a game and offer some kind a founder/support payments with small money etz but not a game that suppose to come out Q1 2013 omg ...

    Well thats just my opinion .

    cryptic games have gotten plenty of updates since they released and STO has plenty of things coming soon as well http://www.stowiki.org/Upcoming_content

    I'm sure the money from these founder packs helps a good deal in funded this new content.. unless you have some details about their buisness practices and how their money is distributed i have no idea how you could make those claims

    I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  • jdnewelljdnewell Spring Hill, TNPosts: 2,150Member Uncommon

    I honestly dont care what other people do with money.

    I personally will not be buying a " founder " type deal on any game, ever. But if someone else does what business is it of mine? Or yours for that matter?

  • spankybusspankybus Orlando, FLPosts: 1,154Member Uncommon

    Devs should be able to charge whatever they want for whatever they want to sell...no matter how obsurd.

     

    darwinism in the market place......you know...a fool and his money....

    Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone
    www.spankybus.com
    -3d Artist & Compositor
    -Writer
    -Professional Amature

  • jonrd463jonrd463 Tacoma, WAPosts: 598Member
    Why are you so worried about what other people do with their money, OP? Don't you have a city park somewhere to occupy or something?

    "You'll never win an argument with an idiot because he is too stupid to recognize his own defeat." ~Anonymous

  • Originally posted by IG-88
    I do what i want with my money.

    I think thats what he was saying . It seems nowadays most that partake of such foolishness has more dollars than sense .

  • CecropiaCecropia The Great White North, ONPosts: 3,471Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by jdnewell

    I honestly dont care what other people do with money.

    I personally will not be buying a " founder " type deal on any game, ever. But if someone else does what business is it of mine? Or yours for that matter?

    Because it sets a bad precedent. These studios test the water with all sorts of silly ways to nickel and dime us, and if enough people fall for it, it becomes commonplace. Paying $200 in one go for a video game is well.....not smart.

    We used to get entire games for a relatively small price. Now look at the industry; we are essentially getting much less for much more (if, of course, one wants to enjoy a game in full).

     

    "Mr. Rothstein, your people never will understand... the way it works out here. You're all just our guests. But you act like you're at home. Let me tell you something, partner. You ain't home. But that's where we're gonna send you if it harelips the governor." - Pat Webb

  • ArconaArcona VanlosePosts: 1,185Member

    People support games all the time on kickstarter, so we all can play games.

    One person even gave Faster Than Light $5000 :)

  • WhiteLanternWhiteLantern Nevada, MOPosts: 2,732Member

    Originally posted by jonrd463
    Why are you so worried about what other people do with their money, OP? Don't you have a city park somewhere to occupy or something?

    /snicker

    Originally posted by Cecropia

    Originally posted by jdnewell

    I honestly dont care what other people do with money.

    I personally will not be buying a " founder " type deal on any game, ever. But if someone else does what business is it of mine? Or yours for that matter?

    Because it sets a bad precedent. These studios test the water with all sorts of silly ways to nickel and dime us, and if enough people fall for it, it becomes commonplace. Paying $200 in one go for a video game is well.....not smart.

    We used to get entire games for a relatively small price. Now look at the industry; we are essentially getting much less for much more (if, of course, one wants to enjoy a game in full).

     

    And yet, they can't force you to spend money. You can put whatever price you want on something and it's not worth it until someone buys it.

    Do you people really think there are thousands of people lined up to buy NW or MU 200$ packs? There will be some, sure, but don't get carried away thinking everyone is beating a path for this mousetrap.

    I want a mmorpg where people have gone through misery, have gone through school stuff and actually have had sex even. -sagil

  • rnor6084rnor6084 brunswick, GAPosts: 109Member

    How about you stop telling people what to do with their money? 

     

     

  • rnor6084rnor6084 brunswick, GAPosts: 109Member
    Originally posted by SimonTemplar
    Originally posted by IG-88
    I do what i want with my money.

    I think thats what he was saying . It seems nowadays most that partake of such foolishness has more dollars than sense .

    What you spend your money on someone else may consider foolish. 

     

    Again, how about we all stop worrying so much about what the other guy spends his money on?

     

    It supports the game and future development and most importantly allows someone to keep a job. Soem thing that is rare these days.

  • Yavin_PrimeYavin_Prime Oak Park, CAPosts: 233Member
    Originally posted by SimonTemplar
    Originally posted by IG-88
    I do what i want with my money.

    I think thats what he was saying . It seems nowadays most that partake of such foolishness has more dollars than sense .

    That's highly narrowminded of you. What makes one person happy wont always make another person happy. The person who buys a BMW when they could have bought a VW or a Toyota and gotten a similarly good car is "wasting" their money to another person. In other terms the person buying a three bedroom house with an acre of land that they don't plan to develop beyond grass and they live alone could have easily rented a one bedroom apartment and saved money. What makes each and every person happy and what they value is different and unique. Judging people like you've done is just plain rude. Then again I'm sure there is something you buy with your money that other people would call you a "fool" for. If everyone did the "sensible" thing with their money 100% of the the world would quickly become a boring place.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,765Member Uncommon

    Charging for beta access makes sense.

    The basic issue is that most of the people who play a beta aren't there to test things.  They're there to treat the game as a free trial.  You don't need or even want most of the people who will play your game shortly after release to be in the beta treating it like a free trial.

    So how do you filter that out so that only a small fraction of the people who will play after release get into the beta?  Charging for access not only gets you some money, but means that the people who play your beta and tell others about it are likely to be those most interested in your game--and thus, most likely to have a positive opinion of it.  Even apart from the revenue, that's likely to be better than picking people at random for beta access.

    But that's only if everything gets wiped at the end of beta.  If there is stuff that you can buy and use after the game launches, but can only buy it before you can play the game, I don't like that.

  • jdlamson75jdlamson75 Jacksonville, FLPosts: 983Member Uncommon

    I won't be buying any founders packs, but that doesn't mean I look down on those who do.  It's not my money, it's theirs.  They earned it (or stole it).  I've spent plenty of money on stuff I shouldn't have - for 12 years, I spent money on cigarrettes.  Definitely shouldn't have done that, but I did.

     

    The bottom line is that if it's for sale, there's a good chance someone's going to buy it.  To those someones who buy, good for them - it's something they want. 

     

    Telling others how to spend their money?  Ain't nobody got time for that.

     

     

     

     

    edit: For my 600th post here on MMORPG.com, I can't believe I included a Sweet Brown quote.  Shouldn't have done that either.

  • Big.Daddy.SamediBig.Daddy.Samedi Edmonton, ABPosts: 148Member Uncommon

    TLDR: What people do with their own money is their business. What a company offers for sale is their business (Literally). And what a gamer enjoys, is not for anyone else to tell them.

     

    **** Please beware this post is opinionated, with an attempt to be objective ****

     

    Ok, I do not talk much on the forums, I tend to browse and read posts when I feel like being entertained or look for some information. I felt the need to comment on this.

    First, a founders pack in this game is very much like pre-purchasing in game store stuff. This does several things.... It allows the company to develop more content, it funds the game (After all it is releasing as a free to play game), and it allows the people that wish to support the game to get in game items that are in theory unique.

    Second, the money and time that goes in to making these games is absurd, and the companies deserve to make some money from it. By this I mean that they are a business and are out to make a profit. It is not greed, it is not betrayal, it simply is.

     

    So, I really want to know how a founders pack is bad? I would also like to know how exactly it affects you personaly. You are not required to purchase one to play.... nor are you cheapened in any way by waiting until the game comes out and playing it for free. Buying a founders pack can be worth it, if the items appeal to you, or you would like to support the game, or even just want to try the game early. Are you against kickstarter to? or Indigogo? I have personally put money towards small game developers on Kickstarter because they were trying to make something of themselves. I see a founders pack as being no different.

    With the last statement I would like to discuss the idea that because this is Cryptic this is a scam..... Cryptic is a decent developer, one who has made games that have entertained many people. Why would you immediately state that this is a scam? Because they made some games that launched as buggy? Maybe not as fun as they could have been? Too repetative? Well, people judged with their wallet, and these games are no longer sub based.... but guess what? I know many people that still enjoy these games, especially now that they went free to play and they could choose what to put their money on. I myself do not play these games anymore, but far be it from me to tell people what to spend their money on, or what to enjoy. It is personal preference and instead of trying to push your opinions to other people, Sit down and write a letter to the company, start an online petition, do something other than try to tell your fellow gamers how wrong they are... because in reality the company will follow the profit (That is why they exist) and the gamer will follow the enjoyment (That is why we are gamers).

     

    Oh and one last thing. Game Pre-Orders exist so that companies can determine exactly how many games they need to release (Disc's, Keys, etc) on launch day so that they can get as many out to the people as they can. This allows for happy customers, which means return customers, and also allows for maximizing profit by not print so many discs that they cannot make any profit. This trend continued to digital releases because gamers wanted to be able to play the game as soon as it was released, especially with MMO's

     

    This went way longer than I wanted but that really is my 2 cents.

  • casual187casual187 omaha, NEPosts: 32Member

    Hehe could not resist. image

  • strangepowersstrangepowers Chiacgo, ILPosts: 602Member Common


    Originally posted by LightHeretic
    Originally posted by SimonTemplar Originally posted by IG-88 I do what i want with my money.
    I think thats what he was saying . It seems nowadays most that partake of such foolishness has more dollars than sense .
    That's highly narrowminded of you. What makes one person happy wont always make another person happy. The person who buys a BMW when they could have bought a VW or a Toyota and gotten a similarly good car is "wasting" their money to another person. In other terms the person buying a three bedroom house with an acre of land that they don't plan to develop beyond grass and they live alone could have easily rented a one bedroom apartment and saved money. What makes each and every person happy and what they value is different and unique. Judging people like you've done is just plain rude. Then again I'm sure there is something you buy with your money that other people would call you a "fool" for. If everyone did the "sensible" thing with their money 100% of the the world would quickly become a boring place.

    Well said.

    The scary part is one day the world will be run by adults who were never spanked as kids and got trophies just for participating.

  • Big.Daddy.SamediBig.Daddy.Samedi Edmonton, ABPosts: 148Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Cecropia
    Originally posted by jdnewell

    I honestly dont care what other people do with money.

    I personally will not be buying a " founder " type deal on any game, ever. But if someone else does what business is it of mine? Or yours for that matter?

    Because it sets a bad precedent. These studios test the water with all sorts of silly ways to nickel and dime us, and if enough people fall for it, it becomes commonplace. Paying $200 in one go for a video game is well.....not smart.

    We used to get entire games for a relatively small price. Now look at the industry; we are essentially getting much less for much more (if, of course, one wants to enjoy a game in full).

     

    This is more a complaint for the overall microtransaction model. Any game that offers microtransactions pushes this concept forward. To be honest I don't like it, but my options are buy it, or don't buy it. No sense complaining about something unless you have the power to change it. The good news is that you do not have to buy any of it, you are not forced. Much the same as I do not believe in spending 80,000 on a vehicle... when a 30,000 vehicle will do me just fine. It all comes down to what you want, what you can afford, and self control.

    Here is the other issue I have with your statement, How is it not-smart? If I determine a game will give me many hours of entertainment, and I often finish single player games in a weekend... does it not make sense that if this game can keep me entertained for months at a time and saves me from say 6 game purchases.

    6 Games @ $40 a piece = $240.... I am saving $40 in the long run. And that is assuming the games are $40.. some games I buy are $60. What difference does it make. See my previous post. It really does not hamper you until companies make the base game cost more, which I think even the people that purchased a founders pack would stay away from. This isn't about the content in the game, it is about support for a product you would like to believe in as you get what you are paying for, it is up to the buyer to ensure they are researching enough to make an educated purchase.

     

    *** Oh and I guess cryptic can thank you cause this just convinced me to give them my money to support and try the game, the foundry system looks great and I think I will have a lot of fun with this game in between my two careers, I am certain I will play less SP games as a result ***

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