I think people are being overly optomistic when expecting more dynamic pve content and the like. As much as people don't seem to like GW2, it has been massively successful at least a a pve 1-80 game.
TESO is doing a few things differently that look interesting and better than GW2:
1) More free form character development: free to use any equipment, more skill choices and character builds.
2) Endurance system that allows for active on-demand blocking (wanting this for years) and sprinting, hopefully dodging
3) More meaningful RvR - faction lock is important here. Also, I would prefer a system that focuses more on the maps and territory like Planetside or DAOC and not some arbitrary scoring system that simply rewards whoever can maintain the largest zerg 24/7 and kills all desire for people to play when they are way behind in realm score.
I don't have high hopes for PvE or Endgame. A lot of people here seem to want a raid gear treadmill like WoW. We had that in SWTOR and Rift and many other games and it didn't work for them. FOTM in GW2 which ultimately introduced a gear grind dungeon was not well received either.
Hopefully TESO can figure out how to add in some type of progression that is meaningful and interesting, yet doesn't create a massive statistic gap between hardcore and casual players.
nothing, so far tbh. at least, nothing that will be "superior"....people keep saying "rvr rvr rvr!!" but that's not really true, is it...you're not fighting realm vs realm, it's faction warfare that I can see becoming a huuuuuuuuge pitfall for the game depending on how they handle this emperor nonsense. Yeah, there's more character development in terms of what weapon and armor types you use which is great and all but it sounds like another gear treadmill which many people are all too sick of. And then there's the fact they haven't really detailed anything about the elder game except for "the game doesn't really open up until x level" which sort of stomped my interest into the ground. The more I hear about this game the less interested I become...And I was excited before.
As for lore...The lore in the GW series is extremely deep, anyone who says it isn't is either trolling, or obviously has no clue about the series at all. There are many differnet cultures in guild wars, all of which are developed in terms of lore and information, history, timelines etc. In the end, while TESO could be interesting, I doubt it will be genuinely any "better" than gw2 currently does, and there is no telling what GW2 will become by the time TESO is released. The one thing I would say ANET needs to do is add more sandbox inspired content to the game going forward, incrimentally. TESO doesn't sound like it even has the most basic functions of a sandbox, either...So...
oh I dunno prolly loot. I would hope they stay away from the instanced dungeon thing, and the DR in TESO and actually learn from mmo history.
They have open and instanced dungeon but they have no dungeon scaling in the game at all.
So what, the more people that go in, the easier it will be? That sounds fundamentally boring.
Nope they have said they would rather make more dungeons than use a scaling system. As long as they are not as boring as GW2 i'm happy about the system they have chosen.
And nope it just means you will out level that dungeon within 4-5 level.
I don't think ESO will amount to much but comparing it to GW2 is tragic. GW2 was the biggest waste of time to ever grace the MMO world. Everything was stupid easy and you weren't tangibly rewarded for anything including pvp. Terrible
Originally posted by JimmyYO I don't think ESO will amount to much Disagree but comparing it to GW2 is tragic. Agree
GW2 was the biggest waste of time to ever grace the MMO world. Everything was stupid easy and you weren't tangibly rewarded for anything including pvp. Terrible Agree
Whats with all the GW2 hate? Its a fun game and I am still enjoying it and I personally hope its around a long time. I will agree it needs work but what new MMO does not. The one thing I am surprised I miss in GW2 is the holly trinity and I hope its alive and well in ESO. I have seen a few articles where it said 90% of the content can be done with any of the classes. So this makes me worry. I find the lack of trinity in GW2 makes me want to look for a new MMO.
Jesus Christ its not hate. Who the hell hates a game?! Does that even make sense? Some people dont like GW2, it does not appeal to them. Why is that hard to understand? What does that always have to be hate? Others love it, more power to them. Glad they found their game. Can we leave it at that?
I really wish you all could just get back to playing and talking about games. Both the likes and dislikes without devolving into this redundant debate that adds absolutely no value. Just express your opinion and keep it (civil) and moving.
This idiotic Fanboy / hater conundrum is utterly retarded.
And yes I play GW2. I play WoW. And I will play TESO as I play MOST MMOs that come out. Some I like some I dont. Its personal taste.
Oh and while on the subject.... STOP with this hype stupidity. Some people are just excited about a new game based on what they hear/read/see. Whats so wrong with that? How does it change YOUR mind? Why? You make it sound like 'hype' is this all powerful subliminal drug that you cant fight and FORCES you to like a game you otherwise would have hated. Then the game releases and the hype dissipates (mysteriously as it was created) and all of sudden you were cheated/robbed of money you would not have spent otherwise. Give me a break.
And for those who really do blindly follow the marketing or who are actively against it -- Im not even speaking to you as it would be pointless.
Agree about the 'hype' thing, nothing wrong with being passionate and excited about a game prospect, even of if may not ultimately bet that good. Re this thread in general why is there a desperate need to measure against ?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
By the way, there's obviously more than just that but I'll let you do your own research and figure it out.
No. The question is what DOES the Elder Scrolls ONLINE offer that GW2 does not.
TESO offers NOTHING because TESO is not out yet.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
Originally posted by Marcus- So there could potentially be several "instances" of the RvR zone? That was certainly one of my bigger disappointments in WARs endgame.
not potentially there WILL be several instances.. i can pretty much say for sure there will be more than just 2k people doing PVP at launch
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
Originally posted by Marcus- So there could potentially be several "instances" of the RvR zone? That was certainly one of my bigger disappointments in WARs endgame.
There will be several versions of cyrodiil yes, called campaigns, but they have more in common with servers than instances (hold up to 2k players, they dont reset, you get locked to the campaign and they're perminent), its not like you will log into cyrodiil 2 one day and the next your in cyrodiil 7, you can only swap instances if you choose to pay to (will cost allience points)
Originally posted by Vlacke GW cannot even come close to the Elder Scrolls series when it comes to lore, with all the games and books TES has .
I dunno, it really isnt the amount of lore but the quality that matters.
Still, both world have a relatively good lore but if cool lore would be all you need then WAR would be the best game (at least if they actually had used the lore instead of screwing it over totally). Saying that one is a lot better than the other would be an opinion, there are GW2 books as well (some relatively good for books based on a game). Both Wow and EQ have more books than either but frankly are neither of those 2 even close to ES or GW in my opinion (on the other hand do neither of GW or ES stand a chanse against Forgotten realms).
Eso might get problems with GW2 is ESO tries P2P, the both are somewhat similar, like DDO and GW was and DDO had to change payment model to survive.
If ESO go B2P or F2P I dont think it will have any problem with GW2, in fact many players would probably play boths on and off but if ESO will be P2P it have to be a lot better.
Originally posted by zastroph Hopefully TESO will NOT have any pathetic level caping in lower level areas!
Shows how ignorant you are about GW2. The downleveling is one of the BEST features of GW2. I can play my 80 with all my friends lower level characters, and not completely facroll it. Sure I am a little bit more powerful, but not in such a way that I am one shotting stuff.
nothing, so far tbh. at least, nothing that will be "superior"....people keep saying "rvr rvr rvr!!" but that's not really true, is it...you're not fighting realm vs realm, it's faction warfare that I can see becoming a huuuuuuuuge pitfall for the game depending on how they handle this emperor nonsense. Yeah, there's more character development in terms of what weapon and armor types you use which is great and all but it sounds like another gear treadmill which many people are all too sick of. And then there's the fact they haven't really detailed anything about the elder game except for "the game doesn't really open up until x level" which sort of stomped my interest into the ground. The more I hear about this game the less interested I become...And I was excited before.
As for lore...The lore in the GW series is extremely deep, anyone who says it isn't is either trolling, or obviously has no clue about the series at all. There are many differnet cultures in guild wars, all of which are developed in terms of lore and information, history, timelines etc. In the end, while TESO could be interesting, I doubt it will be genuinely any "better" than gw2 currently does, and there is no telling what GW2 will become by the time TESO is released. The one thing I would say ANET needs to do is add more sandbox inspired content to the game going forward, incrimentally. TESO doesn't sound like it even has the most basic functions of a sandbox, either...So...
The lore in GW2 is no where near the depth of lore in TES games and what will be in ESO. ZeniMax hired a guy (who is a historian) just to be the Lore Guru for ESO because TES' lore is so complicated. To catch yourself up to the lore, you can start reading here: http://www.imperial-library.info/
Originally posted by Marcus- So there could potentially be several "instances" of the RvR zone? That was certainly one of my bigger disappointments in WARs endgame.
There will be several versions of cyrodiil yes, called campaigns, but they have more in common with servers than instances (hold up to 2k players, they dont reset, you get locked to the campaign and they're perminent), its not like you will log into cyrodiil 2 one day and the next your in cyrodiil 7, you can only swap instances if you choose to pay to (will cost allience points)
I'm not even going to try to hide my ignorance of this game, but this almost sounds worse.
They could potentially in that case be spreading a thin playerbase even thinner during non-peak hours. I'm also curious what effect that could have on the RvR and its benefit to the world (if any).
I plan to look into the game a lot more, as I really enjoy RvR. I just tend to look at games as they get closer to launch. I saw this thread and thought it might give me some pros and cons compared to GW2. I'm thinking i probably should have looked into it more before piping up.
Originally posted by Marcus- So there could potentially be several "instances" of the RvR zone? That was certainly one of my bigger disappointments in WARs endgame.
There will be several versions of cyrodiil yes, called campaigns, but they have more in common with servers than instances (hold up to 2k players, they dont reset, you get locked to the campaign and they're perminent), its not like you will log into cyrodiil 2 one day and the next your in cyrodiil 7, you can only swap instances if you choose to pay to (will cost allience points)
I'm not even going to try to hide my ignorance of this game, but this almost sounds worse.
They could potentially in that case be spreading a thin playerbase even thinner during non-peak hours. I'm also curious what effect that could have on the RvR and its benefit to the world (if any).
I plan to look into the game a lot more, as I really enjoy RvR. I just tend to look at games as they get closer to launch. I saw this thread and thought it might give me some pros and cons compared to GW2. I'm thinking i probably should have looked into it more before piping up.
Thanks for your info though
How is having a perminent pvp home (much like a server would be) worse than having a non perminent instance? The answer to you question about what happens when the player levels fall off, is the same as when it happens on a server based game, they will just merge the lower pop campaigns like they would lower pop servers
How is having a perminent pvp home (much like a server would be) worse than having a non perminent instance? The answer to you question about what happens when the player levels fall off, is the same as when it happens on a server based game, they will just merge the lower pop campaigns like they would lower pop servers
Well if they merge them at low population times than it may not be, but i didn't get that impression from your first post, apologies.
There's obviously a whole lot more questions i have in regards to that and other things, but this really isn't the thread for it
Originally posted by Marcus- So there could potentially be several "instances" of the RvR zone? That was certainly one of my bigger disappointments in WARs endgame.
There will be several versions of cyrodiil yes, called campaigns, but they have more in common with servers than instances (hold up to 2k players, they dont reset, you get locked to the campaign and they're perminent), its not like you will log into cyrodiil 2 one day and the next your in cyrodiil 7, you can only swap instances if you choose to pay to (will cost allience points)
I'm not even going to try to hide my ignorance of this game, but this almost sounds worse.
They could potentially in that case be spreading a thin playerbase even thinner during non-peak hours. I'm also curious what effect that could have on the RvR and its benefit to the world (if any).
I plan to look into the game a lot more, as I really enjoy RvR. I just tend to look at games as they get closer to launch. I saw this thread and thought it might give me some pros and cons compared to GW2. I'm thinking i probably should have looked into it more before piping up.
Thanks for your info though
How is having a perminent pvp home (much like a server would be) worse than having a non perminent instance? The answer to you question about what happens when the player levels fall off, is the same as when it happens on a server based game, they will just merge the lower pop campaigns like they would lower pop servers
I'm pretty ignorant about this game so far, but from what I've read on this thread the main difference between TESO's cyrodill and GW2's WvW is that the campaigns in TESO will be permanent while the matches on WvW reset every 2 weeks and new matchups are made. As far as I can see both systems have advantages and disadvantages, main advantage of TESO's system is that your contributions can be more permanent, they won't reset in a few weeks (at most) even if nobody takes it back...
The potential disadvantage I can see is what would happen if you end up locked on a campaign where one side completely dominates and you have no hope of ever beating or even defend from it, and I know that the 3 factions are supposed to prevent it, but both TSW and GW2 have 3 sided persistent battles and in both games I see one side completely dominating the other two for the duration of the game, usually thanks to either low numbers in the other two factions or the presence of more active and organized PvP guilds in one side.
Just currious what do you guys see TESO offering you that GW2 currently does not offer? What improvements do you see TESO having over GW2? Almost my entire guild left GW2 within a month of the game's release. When I ask most of them why they left they can't really pin it down to anything specific. Just that they lost interest, and couldn't be bothered to log in. The three big changes I see being different are
Lore - ESO and GW both have a well established lore, ESO is just different. But both are equally good. And while this is a different aspect between the two games. I don't see it as an improvment.
Character development - This is where I think TESO will really shine. The character development in gw2 is sort of lacking In my opinion. Being stuck with certain weapons for certain classes, and having skills tied to those weapons kind of bugs me. And after you have unlocked all of the attacks for each weapon, you really don't have anything huge to look forward to as far as advancing your character.
Seamless world - Having no loading screens will be a nice change.
What other changes do you see between two games? Of those changes is it really an improvement?
+Unique factions. One thing that bugged me really badly in GW2 besides the lack of character development/building, was the fact that I was basically fighting against a clone of my own faction in W v W. In TESO we get unique factions with races and racials and that's good, personally I dont care if it shakes the overall balance slightly as long as the factions are unique.
Comments
I think people are being overly optomistic when expecting more dynamic pve content and the like. As much as people don't seem to like GW2, it has been massively successful at least a a pve 1-80 game.
TESO is doing a few things differently that look interesting and better than GW2:
1) More free form character development: free to use any equipment, more skill choices and character builds.
2) Endurance system that allows for active on-demand blocking (wanting this for years) and sprinting, hopefully dodging
3) More meaningful RvR - faction lock is important here. Also, I would prefer a system that focuses more on the maps and territory like Planetside or DAOC and not some arbitrary scoring system that simply rewards whoever can maintain the largest zerg 24/7 and kills all desire for people to play when they are way behind in realm score.
I don't have high hopes for PvE or Endgame. A lot of people here seem to want a raid gear treadmill like WoW. We had that in SWTOR and Rift and many other games and it didn't work for them. FOTM in GW2 which ultimately introduced a gear grind dungeon was not well received either.
Hopefully TESO can figure out how to add in some type of progression that is meaningful and interesting, yet doesn't create a massive statistic gap between hardcore and casual players.
nothing, so far tbh. at least, nothing that will be "superior"....people keep saying "rvr rvr rvr!!" but that's not really true, is it...you're not fighting realm vs realm, it's faction warfare that I can see becoming a huuuuuuuuge pitfall for the game depending on how they handle this emperor nonsense. Yeah, there's more character development in terms of what weapon and armor types you use which is great and all but it sounds like another gear treadmill which many people are all too sick of. And then there's the fact they haven't really detailed anything about the elder game except for "the game doesn't really open up until x level" which sort of stomped my interest into the ground. The more I hear about this game the less interested I become...And I was excited before.
As for lore...The lore in the GW series is extremely deep, anyone who says it isn't is either trolling, or obviously has no clue about the series at all. There are many differnet cultures in guild wars, all of which are developed in terms of lore and information, history, timelines etc. In the end, while TESO could be interesting, I doubt it will be genuinely any "better" than gw2 currently does, and there is no telling what GW2 will become by the time TESO is released. The one thing I would say ANET needs to do is add more sandbox inspired content to the game going forward, incrimentally. TESO doesn't sound like it even has the most basic functions of a sandbox, either...So...
Nope they have said they would rather make more dungeons than use a scaling system. As long as they are not as boring as GW2 i'm happy about the system they have chosen.
And nope it just means you will out level that dungeon within 4-5 level.
And what does GW2 have that is sandbox?
That's me.
Sweetrolls.
/thread
Jesus Christ its not hate. Who the hell hates a game?! Does that even make sense? Some people dont like GW2, it does not appeal to them. Why is that hard to understand? What does that always have to be hate? Others love it, more power to them. Glad they found their game. Can we leave it at that?
I really wish you all could just get back to playing and talking about games. Both the likes and dislikes without devolving into this redundant debate that adds absolutely no value. Just express your opinion and keep it (civil) and moving.
This idiotic Fanboy / hater conundrum is utterly retarded.
And yes I play GW2. I play WoW. And I will play TESO as I play MOST MMOs that come out. Some I like some I dont. Its personal taste.
Oh and while on the subject.... STOP with this hype stupidity. Some people are just excited about a new game based on what they hear/read/see. Whats so wrong with that? How does it change YOUR mind? Why? You make it sound like 'hype' is this all powerful subliminal drug that you cant fight and FORCES you to like a game you otherwise would have hated. Then the game releases and the hype dissipates (mysteriously as it was created) and all of sudden you were cheated/robbed of money you would not have spent otherwise. Give me a break.
And for those who really do blindly follow the marketing or who are actively against it -- Im not even speaking to you as it would be pointless.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
No. The question is what DOES the Elder Scrolls ONLINE offer that GW2 does not.
TESO offers NOTHING because TESO is not out yet.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
Who cares? What I care is if game will be fun.
not potentially there WILL be several instances.. i can pretty much say for sure there will be more than just 2k people doing PVP at launch
I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg
There will be several versions of cyrodiil yes, called campaigns, but they have more in common with servers than instances (hold up to 2k players, they dont reset, you get locked to the campaign and they're perminent), its not like you will log into cyrodiil 2 one day and the next your in cyrodiil 7, you can only swap instances if you choose to pay to (will cost allience points)
I dunno, it really isnt the amount of lore but the quality that matters.
Still, both world have a relatively good lore but if cool lore would be all you need then WAR would be the best game (at least if they actually had used the lore instead of screwing it over totally). Saying that one is a lot better than the other would be an opinion, there are GW2 books as well (some relatively good for books based on a game). Both Wow and EQ have more books than either but frankly are neither of those 2 even close to ES or GW in my opinion (on the other hand do neither of GW or ES stand a chanse against Forgotten realms).
Eso might get problems with GW2 is ESO tries P2P, the both are somewhat similar, like DDO and GW was and DDO had to change payment model to survive.
If ESO go B2P or F2P I dont think it will have any problem with GW2, in fact many players would probably play boths on and off but if ESO will be P2P it have to be a lot better.
Shows how ignorant you are about GW2. The downleveling is one of the BEST features of GW2. I can play my 80 with all my friends lower level characters, and not completely facroll it. Sure I am a little bit more powerful, but not in such a way that I am one shotting stuff.
The lore in GW2 is no where near the depth of lore in TES games and what will be in ESO. ZeniMax hired a guy (who is a historian) just to be the Lore Guru for ESO because TES' lore is so complicated. To catch yourself up to the lore, you can start reading here: http://www.imperial-library.info/
Grab some snacks, it's gonna take a while.
I'm not even going to try to hide my ignorance of this game, but this almost sounds worse.
They could potentially in that case be spreading a thin playerbase even thinner during non-peak hours. I'm also curious what effect that could have on the RvR and its benefit to the world (if any).
I plan to look into the game a lot more, as I really enjoy RvR. I just tend to look at games as they get closer to launch. I saw this thread and thought it might give me some pros and cons compared to GW2. I'm thinking i probably should have looked into it more before piping up.
Thanks for your info though
How is having a perminent pvp home (much like a server would be) worse than having a non perminent instance? The answer to you question about what happens when the player levels fall off, is the same as when it happens on a server based game, they will just merge the lower pop campaigns like they would lower pop servers
Well if they merge them at low population times than it may not be, but i didn't get that impression from your first post, apologies.
There's obviously a whole lot more questions i have in regards to that and other things, but this really isn't the thread for it
I'm pretty ignorant about this game so far, but from what I've read on this thread the main difference between TESO's cyrodill and GW2's WvW is that the campaigns in TESO will be permanent while the matches on WvW reset every 2 weeks and new matchups are made. As far as I can see both systems have advantages and disadvantages, main advantage of TESO's system is that your contributions can be more permanent, they won't reset in a few weeks (at most) even if nobody takes it back...
The potential disadvantage I can see is what would happen if you end up locked on a campaign where one side completely dominates and you have no hope of ever beating or even defend from it, and I know that the 3 factions are supposed to prevent it, but both TSW and GW2 have 3 sided persistent battles and in both games I see one side completely dominating the other two for the duration of the game, usually thanks to either low numbers in the other two factions or the presence of more active and organized PvP guilds in one side.
What can men do against such reckless hate?
+Unique factions. One thing that bugged me really badly in GW2 besides the lack of character development/building, was the fact that I was basically fighting against a clone of my own faction in W v W. In TESO we get unique factions with races and racials and that's good, personally I dont care if it shakes the overall balance slightly as long as the factions are unique.