To be fair, a thread of that title (encouraging doom speculation) will create a mega-thread on any title out there, any time.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Its not how many people play swtor, indtead is HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE PAYING FOR IT (subs+cash shop)
Its better to have less subscribers but using cash shop than a ton of free players that dont spend a dime.
I see plenty of players with the new speedter (cartel coins) and cosmetic wear.
I guess subscribers are more or less the same than ftp conversion.
So if they hade around 300-350k , now they have the same plus cartel market sales.
I agree with most of your points tiefighter, but assuming the game has 80k subs is naive.
Take the example of warhammer, until 2 motnhs i played a lot and you always see the same people around, one has the impression that the server (karak-norn) has no more than 1000 players around but that cannot be cos the game will be closed by then.
Do they lost some people in the last month? Sure but again those people doesnt matter if they dont use cash shop.
To resume, you cant judge a ftp game with the same criteria than a p2p.
I see plenty of players with the new speeder (cartel coins) and cosmetic wear.
Yeah, I've seen the speeder around quite often myself, of course some of them probably bought it for in game currency - but that still means -someone- spent points on it to get it on the GTN.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
I havent really been paying much attention to SWTOR since about February last year when I realised what a disappointment it was.....but DAMN. 8 US servers. Is that it? There were 50 or so at launch.
Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom
Originally posted by mnwild1998 Man you sound desperate to try and prove your point. So how about I post the picture of the server status on this thread in a few weeks when the new update comes out. I bet they will be full then, what will be your excuse be about the full servers in a few weeks. You are aware its the cycle for ALL mmos right. Its not specifically SWTOR.
I'm fairly convinced that SWTOR killed Superniceguy's dog or something.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
Originally posted by mnwild1998 Man you sound desperate to try and prove your point. So how about I post the picture of the server status on this thread in a few weeks when the new update comes out. I bet they will be full then, what will be your excuse be about the full servers in a few weeks. You are aware its the cycle for ALL mmos right. Its not specifically SWTOR.
I'm fairly convinced that SWTOR killed Superniceguy's dog or something.
Originally posted by mnwild1998 Man you sound desperate to try and prove your point. So how about I post the picture of the server status on this thread in a few weeks when the new update comes out. I bet they will be full then, what will be your excuse be about the full servers in a few weeks. You are aware its the cycle for ALL mmos right. Its not specifically SWTOR.
I'm fairly convinced that SWTOR killed Superniceguy's dog or something.
His dog's name was Star Wars: Galaxies
Poor thing! May it rest in peace! And may its owner one day find peace of mind!
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
Originally posted by stragen001 I havent really been paying much attention to SWTOR since about February last year when I realised what a disappointment it was.....but DAMN. 8 US servers. Is that it? There were 50 or so at launch.
Actually they had 215 servers. I thought it was 216 for some reason. North America servers had 124. It is now down to 8 North American servers and 9 European servers. If they can at least sustain those server numbers for 2013 then it will at least show some stabilization with the F2P transition. Worst case scenario would be if they reduce the servers to one of each type. The lowest numbers of servers would be 4 for North America and 4 for Europe (pretty much half of what we have now). There is always a flux with server populations, but if by the end of the year we reach these “limits” then… I’m not sure what E.A. is going to do. Would the game even be considered profitable in the eyes of E.A. if they reached that threshold?
I remember Andryah posting that the new server limits hovered around 6k… roughly twice of what the server capacity were. Was she let go? She seems to have stopped posting right before Christmas break. I’m not sure if E.A. kept her.
Originally posted by mnwild1998 Man you sound desperate to try and prove your point. So how about I post the picture of the server status on this thread in a few weeks when the new update comes out. I bet they will be full then, what will be your excuse be about the full servers in a few weeks. You are aware its the cycle for ALL mmos right. Its not specifically SWTOR.
I'm fairly convinced that SWTOR killed Superniceguy's dog or something.
Making this game free to play did not fix the reasons people left in the first place. Nothing else needs to be said, really.
A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.
Originally posted by mnwild1998 Man you sound desperate to try and prove your point. So how about I post the picture of the server status on this thread in a few weeks when the new update comes out. I bet they will be full then, what will be your excuse be about the full servers in a few weeks. You are aware its the cycle for ALL mmos right. Its not specifically SWTOR.
I look forward to that screenshot in a few weeks then
It is specifically SWTOR, a decent MMO would have held on to a lot more of its 2 million initial playerbase. No MMO has ever started off so super strong, and then bombed so hard. A good MMO simply does not do that.
Originally posted by MindTrigger Making this game free to play did not fix the reasons people left in the first place. Nothing else needs to be said, really.
I agree with this statement completely. What F2P did was give people an opportunity to try it out. After completing their first class story, people will leave again like they did when it was P2P. There is no replayability in SWTOR due to repetative questing. I look for Tera to pull a lot of folks away from SWTOR and I am not a Tera fan at all. Tera looks to a lot less restrictive to F2P players, so why not play a more exciting game that is more F2P friendly. That's my take on it anyway...
Just rename the title of this thread to "Superniceguy vs Bioware". In fact, he should just rename himself to ANTITOR since he rarely posts about anything else.
Originally posted by mnwild1998 Man you sound desperate to try and prove your point. So how about I post the picture of the server status on this thread in a few weeks when the new update comes out. I bet they will be full then, what will be your excuse be about the full servers in a few weeks. You are aware its the cycle for ALL mmos right. Its not specifically SWTOR.
I look forward to that screenshot in a few weeks then
It is specifically SWTOR, a decent MMO would have held on to a lot more of its 2 million initial playerbase. No MMO has ever started off so super strong, and then bombed so hard. A good MMO simply does not do that.
Oh geez your argument from THIS THREAD is so incorrect and you get caught in you inaccurate comments now we have to go back to the beginning. No one is arguing that please stay on topic.
What? It is on topic
As the other 2 previous posters said either side of my previous post - F2P changes nothing. SWTOR has a proven history of people leaving the game, so it pretty much likely the same thing will happen again. Although on one hand nobody has to pay but on the other hand if people subbed and got used to no restrictions then may not be able to stomach the restrictions and just quit, but either way EA will not be getting their needed money. Before it went F2P and flopped it had more promise too, and more reason to stay, now they are living off 1 year old content, indicating it has not much of a future.
If they saw a long future for the game, they would have added more content first, before going F2P, and if F2P was a success they would have gotten Makeb in before 2013, or Jan/Feb at the latest, considering it seems done from previous comments by EA/BW, instead of Spring/June.
I resubbed for a month after been away for a year, just to try it and get the HK-51.
But, after completing my class quest there is no way im gonna roll a new character and run around and do the same killing of mobs as before. So, i unsubbed, and i dont really see myself coming back as a subber anytime soon.
I think everyone's forgetting the population will surely drop after the weeks stretch on from the latest content patch, it's how things work in a themepark game. Nothing different than usual here - when 1.7 launches I'm pretty sure things will be back to how they were before, at least for awhile. So is the circle of life.
Originally posted by Draron I think everyone's forgetting the population will surely drop after the weeks stretch on from the latest content patch, it's how things work in a themepark game. Nothing different than usual here - when 1.7 launches I'm pretty sure things will be back to how they were before, at least for awhile. So is the circle of life.
I don't think this is lull between patches. I believe you are seeing a large dip in FTP players playing. My guess is that doesn't seem so prevalent to subbers because you probably don't interact much with them in the first place. (Not much warzones, OPs, or even FPs for them.)
Considering the timing, attrition may be part of the reason why FTPers are leaving, but I would venture that Path of Exile is more to play for recent FTPers not loggin in.
Just rename the title of this thread to "Superniceguy vs Bioware". In fact, he should just rename himself to ANTITOR since he rarely posts about anything else.
so,,he is not allowed to write his opinion on a website about mmos,,only TOR Fans can post?
thats the BW way,,and it will hurt them a lot more in the long run
about a year ago:
BIGGEST MMO LAUNCH IN HISTORY
WERE GOING AFTER WOW
THIS WILL SET NEW STANDARDS FOR THE GENRE
it did,,never have so many players dropped a game so fast
they had their three strikes now,,give the IP to another company, so the 2 mio fans can have
a GOOD star wars mmo
or would you have another zombified game like warhammer online?
they came, they launched, and they failed
some things are better in SWTOR, than in ANY other game,,companions, voice overs etc
but most of it is below standard,,or worse
thats one reason for for the strong feelings about SWTOR,,it is attractive, and pulls the player in
but then pushes them back again in the next minute
Each time a new MMO, or even a big title single player game comes out there will be drops in activity - I remember there being a major one when D3 came out and entire guilds on our server were complaining about their guildies being off to play that. And for FTPers it's even easier to drop what they were doing to go play the new game since they aren't paying for a sub anyway, so they won't feel like they are losing out.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
Each time a new MMO, or even a big title single player game comes out there will be drops in activity - I remember there being a major one when D3 came out and entire guilds on our server were complaining about their guildies being off to play that. And for FTPers it's even easier to drop what they were doing to go play the new game since they aren't paying for a sub anyway, so they won't feel like they are losing out.
But that's sort of the point.
After D3's release, the ToR servers had a population decline to the point that they couldn't sustain themselves, which caused even more people to either reroll on the Fatman or unsub. Eventually the problem was resolved by a massive server merger. (240 to 27)
After GW2 and MoP released, a similar problem, and the servers were merged form 27 to 20.
It appears the problem maybe happening again with the Path of Exile release, but is probably just FTP players leaving. So, some are keeping a curious eye on server populations.
A lot of players here especially those who are obsessed with SWTOR have been hoping for the game to die since release. it is their wet dream coming true but i doubt it will happen any time sooner. All MMOS go up and down in population on regular basis. SWTOR is no exception.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.' -Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid." -Luke McKinney
Originally posted by Doogiehowser A lot of players here especially those who are obsessed with SWTOR have been hoping for the game to die since release.
It was not a good idea to completely screw the Ex-SWG players and give us NOTHING, not even remotely throw us a bone. BW pretended that SWG never existed. BIG mistake. MAJOR mistake.
That, and no space combat, no chat bubbles, no sitting in chairs, no day/night changes, no customizable ships or houses, no alternative leveling zones, dumbed down useless crafting... whole static planets locked into level ranges. Simply bad and incomplete game design in all corners.
Originally posted by Doogiehowser A lot of players here especially those who are obsessed with SWTOR have been hoping for the game to die since release.
It was not a good idea to completely screw the Ex-SWG players and give us NOTHING, not even remotely throw us a bone. BW pretended that SWG never existed. BIG mistake. MAJOR mistake.
That, and no space combat, no chat bubbles, no sitting in chairs, no day/night changes, no customizable ships or houses, no alternative leveling zones, dumbed down useless crafting... whole static planets locked into level ranges. Simply bad and incomplete game design in all corners.
I know that a lot of ex-SWG players bemoan either that EA had SWG shut down; or that ToR is nothing like SWG. Also, many SWTOR enthusiasts like to blame a lot of bad press on angry ex-SWG vets.
But to be honest, Bioware was looking to WoW's millions, not the 300,000 ex-SWG players, or the 10,000 active players at the game's close.
Neither was SWG a concern to Bioware, nor was there a vast ex-SWG plot to destroy SWTOR.
To a large extent these forums can be an echo chamber and not represenative of demographics outside of MMORPG.
I only say this to hope to prevent certain conflations. (Although i doubt it will help.)
Comments
To be fair, a thread of that title (encouraging doom speculation) will create a mega-thread on any title out there, any time.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Many people misses the point.
Its not how many people play swtor, indtead is HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE PAYING FOR IT (subs+cash shop)
Its better to have less subscribers but using cash shop than a ton of free players that dont spend a dime.
I see plenty of players with the new speedter (cartel coins) and cosmetic wear.
I guess subscribers are more or less the same than ftp conversion.
So if they hade around 300-350k , now they have the same plus cartel market sales.
I agree with most of your points tiefighter, but assuming the game has 80k subs is naive.
Take the example of warhammer, until 2 motnhs i played a lot and you always see the same people around, one has the impression that the server (karak-norn) has no more than 1000 players around but that cannot be cos the game will be closed by then.
Do they lost some people in the last month? Sure but again those people doesnt matter if they dont use cash shop.
To resume, you cant judge a ftp game with the same criteria than a p2p.
Yeah, I've seen the speeder around quite often myself, of course some of them probably bought it for in game currency - but that still means -someone- spent points on it to get it on the GTN.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/
Cluck Cluck, Gibber Gibber, My Old Mans A Mushroom
I'm fairly convinced that SWTOR killed Superniceguy's dog or something.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/
His dog's name was Star Wars: Galaxies
Poor thing! May it rest in peace! And may its owner one day find peace of mind!
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/
Actually they had 215 servers. I thought it was 216 for some reason. North America servers had 124. It is now down to 8 North American servers and 9 European servers. If they can at least sustain those server numbers for 2013 then it will at least show some stabilization with the F2P transition. Worst case scenario would be if they reduce the servers to one of each type. The lowest numbers of servers would be 4 for North America and 4 for Europe (pretty much half of what we have now). There is always a flux with server populations, but if by the end of the year we reach these “limits” then… I’m not sure what E.A. is going to do. Would the game even be considered profitable in the eyes of E.A. if they reached that threshold?
I remember Andryah posting that the new server limits hovered around 6k… roughly twice of what the server capacity were. Was she let go? She seems to have stopped posting right before Christmas break. I’m not sure if E.A. kept her.
http://swtorhumanrelations.com/2011/12/12/swtor-server-list/
http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=254
LOL- He really is in desperate hater mode
A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.
I look forward to that screenshot in a few weeks then
It is specifically SWTOR, a decent MMO would have held on to a lot more of its 2 million initial playerbase. No MMO has ever started off so super strong, and then bombed so hard. A good MMO simply does not do that.
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
I agree with this statement completely. What F2P did was give people an opportunity to try it out. After completing their first class story, people will leave again like they did when it was P2P. There is no replayability in SWTOR due to repetative questing. I look for Tera to pull a lot of folks away from SWTOR and I am not a Tera fan at all. Tera looks to a lot less restrictive to F2P players, so why not play a more exciting game that is more F2P friendly. That's my take on it anyway...
Just rename the title of this thread to "Superniceguy vs Bioware". In fact, he should just rename himself to ANTITOR since he rarely posts about anything else.
What? It is on topic
As the other 2 previous posters said either side of my previous post - F2P changes nothing. SWTOR has a proven history of people leaving the game, so it pretty much likely the same thing will happen again. Although on one hand nobody has to pay but on the other hand if people subbed and got used to no restrictions then may not be able to stomach the restrictions and just quit, but either way EA will not be getting their needed money. Before it went F2P and flopped it had more promise too, and more reason to stay, now they are living off 1 year old content, indicating it has not much of a future.
If they saw a long future for the game, they would have added more content first, before going F2P, and if F2P was a success they would have gotten Makeb in before 2013, or Jan/Feb at the latest, considering it seems done from previous comments by EA/BW, instead of Spring/June.
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
I resubbed for a month after been away for a year, just to try it and get the HK-51.
But, after completing my class quest there is no way im gonna roll a new character and run around and do the same killing of mobs as before. So, i unsubbed, and i dont really see myself coming back as a subber anytime soon.
Superniceguy you have a point about the delay of new content.
But think that they are delaying on purpose to work on the new material and thus have it ready (the new one that is) when the time comes.
This way they will have plenty of time to keep their promise of new content each 6-8 weeks.
What do you think?
I expect a dlc each year and in -between new operations, flashpoints, warzones and space missions.
Lol, come on OP.
The game is F2P, it tanked, it's a walking corpse, dead, one of the biggest failures in MMO history.
300M = f2p 6 months later.
Just stop beating the dead horse lol.
I don't think this is lull between patches. I believe you are seeing a large dip in FTP players playing. My guess is that doesn't seem so prevalent to subbers because you probably don't interact much with them in the first place. (Not much warzones, OPs, or even FPs for them.)
Considering the timing, attrition may be part of the reason why FTPers are leaving, but I would venture that Path of Exile is more to play for recent FTPers not loggin in.
http://www.torstatus.net/shards/us/stats http://www.torstatus.net/shards/eu/stats
Path of Exile is new, getting a so far favorable reception, and has a much more forginving frre to lay system.
That said, that doesn't really affact SWTOR's revenues much.
Even at the earnings call, EA never mentioned populations, just revenue.
The only real effect if the trend continues is another server merge, or even a possible relaxation of some of the FTP restrictions.
We shall see what we shall see.
so,,he is not allowed to write his opinion on a website about mmos,,only TOR Fans can post?
thats the BW way,,and it will hurt them a lot more in the long run
about a year ago:
BIGGEST MMO LAUNCH IN HISTORY
WERE GOING AFTER WOW
THIS WILL SET NEW STANDARDS FOR THE GENRE
it did,,never have so many players dropped a game so fast
they had their three strikes now,,give the IP to another company, so the 2 mio fans can have
a GOOD star wars mmo
or would you have another zombified game like warhammer online?
they came, they launched, and they failed
some things are better in SWTOR, than in ANY other game,,companions, voice overs etc
but most of it is below standard,,or worse
thats one reason for for the strong feelings about SWTOR,,it is attractive, and pulls the player in
but then pushes them back again in the next minute
Each time a new MMO, or even a big title single player game comes out there will be drops in activity - I remember there being a major one when D3 came out and entire guilds on our server were complaining about their guildies being off to play that. And for FTPers it's even easier to drop what they were doing to go play the new game since they aren't paying for a sub anyway, so they won't feel like they are losing out.
My SWTOR referral link for those wanting to give the game a try. (Newbies get a welcome package while returning players get a few account upgrades to help with their preferred status.)
https://www.ashesofcreation.com/ref/Callaron/
But that's sort of the point.
After D3's release, the ToR servers had a population decline to the point that they couldn't sustain themselves, which caused even more people to either reroll on the Fatman or unsub. Eventually the problem was resolved by a massive server merger. (240 to 27)
After GW2 and MoP released, a similar problem, and the servers were merged form 27 to 20.
It appears the problem maybe happening again with the Path of Exile release, but is probably just FTP players leaving. So, some are keeping a curious eye on server populations.
"The problem is that the hardcore folks always want the same thing: 'We want exactly what you gave us before, but it has to be completely different.'
-Jesse Schell
"Online gamers are the most ludicrously entitled beings since Caligula made his horse a senator, and at least the horse never said anything stupid."
-Luke McKinney
It was not a good idea to completely screw the Ex-SWG players and give us NOTHING, not even remotely throw us a bone. BW pretended that SWG never existed. BIG mistake. MAJOR mistake.
That, and no space combat, no chat bubbles, no sitting in chairs, no day/night changes, no customizable ships or houses, no alternative leveling zones, dumbed down useless crafting... whole static planets locked into level ranges. Simply bad and incomplete game design in all corners.
Secrets of Dragon?s Spine Trailer.. !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwT9cFVQCMw
Best MMOs ever played: Ultima, EvE, SW Galaxies, Age of Conan, The Secret World
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2X_SbZCHpc&t=21s
.
.
The Return of ELITE !
I know that a lot of ex-SWG players bemoan either that EA had SWG shut down; or that ToR is nothing like SWG. Also, many SWTOR enthusiasts like to blame a lot of bad press on angry ex-SWG vets.
But to be honest, Bioware was looking to WoW's millions, not the 300,000 ex-SWG players, or the 10,000 active players at the game's close.
Neither was SWG a concern to Bioware, nor was there a vast ex-SWG plot to destroy SWTOR.
To a large extent these forums can be an echo chamber and not represenative of demographics outside of MMORPG.
I only say this to hope to prevent certain conflations. (Although i doubt it will help.)