It's not just PvP though, it's all the people who feel that they have to compete with everyone around them instead of just playing the game. They have to have the best gear, the best armor, the best everything, they have to complete the content first, they have to make it to level cap first, it's not about having fun, it's about beating others.
Those are the people who harm these games!
Beating others is fun. And that is pretty much human nature. Just look at all the progress update sites likw wow-heroes, diabloprogress, playerscore .....
Essentially you can rank yourself against the whole world if you want to.
I'm not on any of those and find the whole practice childish. I find no enjoyment in beating someone up, stealing their stuff and lording it over them. I do not feel superior because I got in a lucky hit or because I beat up someone smaller than me.
It's not just PvP though, it's all the people who feel that they have to compete with everyone around them instead of just playing the game. They have to have the best gear, the best armor, the best everything, they have to complete the content first, they have to make it to level cap first, it's not about having fun, it's about beating others.
Those are the people who harm these games!
Beating others is fun. And that is pretty much human nature. Just look at all the progress update sites likw wow-heroes, diabloprogress, playerscore .....
Essentially you can rank yourself against the whole world if you want to.
Yeah I think most mmorpg players (whether they'll admit it or not) compare themselves to the players around them. Now whether it bothers them if other players are doing better / worse is whole other story.
It's not an coincidence that so many games have an "inspect" feature.
I don't. I couldn't care less what anyone around me does, I pay no attention whatsoever. In fact, the only reason I've ever "inspected" anyone is if they're carrying something I haven't seen before and want to know what it is. I find the whole MMO dick-waving contest to be immature.
I'm not on any of those and find the whole practice childish. I find no enjoyment in beating someone up, stealing their stuff and lording it over them. I do not feel superior because I got in a lucky hit or because I beat up someone smaller than me.
There's just no fun in that, sorry.
So? It is no fun for you but others find it fun, and use those website. Don't tell me you don't know that it is popular.
You are not going to see this epleen practice going away soon.
Anonymity + self reliance in games is a perfect recipe for asshattery.
I'm all for anonymity, but some interdependence in games would be a retro-breath of fresh air. A reputation that meant something? When is the last time you saw that in a game? Everquest? Vanilla WoW? *shrugs*
I'm not on any of those and find the whole practice childish. I find no enjoyment in beating someone up, stealing their stuff and lording it over them. I do not feel superior because I got in a lucky hit or because I beat up someone smaller than me.
There's just no fun in that, sorry.
So? It is no fun for you but others find it fun, and use those website. Don't tell me you don't know that it is popular.
You are not going to see this epleen practice going away soon.
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
Define "problem". If you mean it irritates you (or some others who have similar preference as you), then sure, it is a "problem". Given how diverse the internet is, it is a problem that you just have to live you. There always will be others who enjoy stuff that you find irritating.
You can, of course, choose not to participate and ignore the whole thing. No one forces you to go to wow-heroes.com or diabloprogress.som.
I don't see how it is a problem for you when a) you can ignore the practice and not participate in any of the website or addon, and b) you can choose not to play with any players who like the practice.
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
Define "problem". If you mean it irritates you (or some others who have similar preference as you), then sure, it is a "problem". Given how diverse the internet is, it is a problem that you just have to live you. There always will be others who enjoy stuff that you find irritating.
You can, of course, choose not to participate and ignore the whole thing. No one forces you to go to wow-heroes.com or diabloprogress.som.
I don't see how it is a problem for you when a) you can ignore the practice and not participate in any of the website or addon, and b) you can choose not to play with any players who like the practice.
How would you ignore it if there are people (Not going to name names) that CONSTANTLY enter every thread of people like him are involved in putting in their 2 cents when they don't need to? Or in games they like. Your basically tellign him...you don't like it, leave or don't play.
The easiest way to improve this particular community, is to follow the mmorpg.com own rules and not be an open venue for those who require perental supervision.
ie: old enough to accept the mmorpg.com Terms of Service.
One u have an age group that does not require baby-sitting, then u can have a like-minded community, that host ideas and feedback.
Making a valid point, only to have it underminded (troll'd) by a 15 year old, is not conducive for adult discussion. Cannot have non-earners spouting off on things they, themselves.. have no means of aquiring.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
Originally posted by Phelcher The easiest way to improve this particular community, is to follow the mmorpg.com own rules and not be an open venue for those who require perental supervision.
ie: old enough to accept the mmorpg.com Terms of Service.
One u have an age group that does not require baby-sitting, then u can have a like-minded community, that host ideas and feedback.
Making a valid point, only to have it underminded (troll'd) by a 15 year old, is not conducive for adult discussion. Cannot have non-earners spouting off on things they, themselves.. have no means of aquiring.
How could you do that though unless a credit card has to be entered (No fee, just to verify 18+). And even then...who's to say and adult won't enter the info so their kid can get on anyways.
Not to mention it isn't always the teens (kids) who do it...sadly.
Originally posted by Phelcher The easiest way to improve this particular community, is to follow the mmorpg.com own rules and not be an open venue for those who require perental supervision.
ie: old enough to accept the mmorpg.com Terms of Service.
One u have an age group that does not require baby-sitting, then u can have a like-minded community, that host ideas and feedback.
Making a valid point, only to have it underminded (troll'd) by a 15 year old, is not conducive for adult discussion. Cannot have non-earners spouting off on things they, themselves.. have no means of aquiring.
How could you do that though unless a credit card has to be entered (No fee, just to verify 18+). And even then...who's to say and adult won't enter the info so their kid can get on anyways.
Not to mention it isn't always the teens (kids) who do it...sadly.
Because money talks...
Honestly, I've been around since pong. With history, comes knowledge. Nothing has changed but the cadence.
A market will eventually find their premium customer. Ironically, it is one of the most vocal communities and one of the oldest. This whole genra would not exist, if it wasn't for those who played pen & paper role-playing games. Those people are the staple and backbone of any MMORPG community. It was on our $0.50/hour internet tab, that fueled these MUDs, that later went graphical.
We were the same people who had $2k systems back on the early 80's. Playing the first of these games like Wizardry.
People tend to forget, that even Ultima Online (UO), had a massive following before it went online. The Ultima series and Lord British was an icon in the Role Playing industry. Most of us are about his age too..
Most roleplayers are not little kids, but veteran gamers who are all easily 40'ish & older now. Well established, just like Brad, Smed or any of our contemporaries.
So why are us Role-playing veteran's constantly being spoon-fed children-style trinket games..?
Again... word & cash are two different things. Most my age or not sharing "words" on an internet forum. But.. their wallet's are already fueling their kids (some of them you), their iPads & Xbox games.
My generation should have the respect of a premium $25/month metaworld to discover and roleplay in. Period!
This community will not improve, as long as you have a mix-dichotomy of income & age. (12 ~ 50+)
Some time back, we had just conducted a MMORPG.com poll of age, (most were past 30yrld), and a moderator got perturbed, because we had a (deleted) thread going, making phun of the game called Rusty Hearts. We all were laughing about who that game's target audience was... squarly the teeny-bopper (12 ~ 15). The thread went around our office floor, getting laughes.
Yet, the mods deleted it and issued warning for being old (ie: laughing at a child's game). When clearly, the mod was personally insulted because he was much younger and was unable to see this community for what it was. True MMORPG players... with transient talking heads, peeping in whenever some news struck their fancy.
Otherwise look who has been here for a while, forwarding well thoughout ideas, it is the oldschool Veteran gamer.
So.. as long as this Site continues it's marketing approach, you will always have friction here @ MMORPG.com. In other RPG communities, you don't not have this problem, because the people who are there, are so for MMORPG.. nothing other. Coincidentally, Massively doesn't have the issues we have here... , but they also don't run Rusty Heart adverts all over their site either.
You get what you pay for...
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
In some ways the history of MMO's is on these forums with the expectations of older players and the brashness of youth. But I don't think it has anything to do with the sites marketing. Put us all in the same pot and there will be some boiling.
We get blamed for alot of violence and problems. Maybe it is true since our community is so mean, racist, sexist, and generally evil (except for a few)
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
Define "problem". If you mean it irritates you (or some others who have similar preference as you), then sure, it is a "problem". Given how diverse the internet is, it is a problem that you just have to live you. There always will be others who enjoy stuff that you find irritating.
You can, of course, choose not to participate and ignore the whole thing. No one forces you to go to wow-heroes.com or diabloprogress.som.
I don't see how it is a problem for you when a) you can ignore the practice and not participate in any of the website or addon, and b) you can choose not to play with any players who like the practice.
But these are the majority of people who play these games! We're talking about people who gank others, who act like immature children, etc. It's hard not to play with them when they are seemingly the most common players in a lot of these games, especially PvP based games. I have no idea where the whole website thing came from.
So, to get back to the topic, no matter how much fun gankers have ganking, it doesn't make ganking a good thing for most MMOs.
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
Define "problem". If you mean it irritates you (or some others who have similar preference as you), then sure, it is a "problem". Given how diverse the internet is, it is a problem that you just have to live you. There always will be others who enjoy stuff that you find irritating.
You can, of course, choose not to participate and ignore the whole thing. No one forces you to go to wow-heroes.com or diabloprogress.som.
I don't see how it is a problem for you when a) you can ignore the practice and not participate in any of the website or addon, and b) you can choose not to play with any players who like the practice.
How would you ignore it if there are people (Not going to name names) that CONSTANTLY enter every thread of people like him are involved in putting in their 2 cents when they don't need to? Or in games they like. Your basically tellign him...you don't like it, leave or don't play.
Use the "ignore" function? Just like on this forum .. put a poster on ignore and you will never see his posts. Put a player on ignore in a game, and you will never see his chat.
But these are the majority of people who play these games! We're talking about people who gank others, who act like immature children, etc. It's hard not to play with them when they are seemingly the most common players in a lot of these games, especially PvP based games. I have no idea where the whole website thing came from.
So, to get back to the topic, no matter how much fun gankers have ganking, it doesn't make ganking a good thing for most MMOs.
Oh, those website things are places people are showing off their epleen with rankings of dps, hero scores, and what-not.
The point is this .... this is only irritating if they talk to you. In a pvp game, you are going to kill the opposite side player anyway. I don't see how this affect you .. if you just mute your chat channels.
do you guys seriosuly think this is only to gamers on the net? Hell i just spent the last two hours at work in a shit storm arguing over my team losing the super bowl and how the refs ignored key calls . I cussed out about 20 people and they cussed me out . Its life stop taking everything on the net so personally and grow a thicker skin. The net is full of trolls with opinions including my own trolling opinion its how life is if you are not a zombie. Be glad the countries you are from have free speech and internet , there is far more things to worry about in this world but some trolling comments that people make that you do not agree with. Hell some of the biggest trolls on this site are spotlight posters , who cares you can still agree with them on a lot of things also here. If you dont like what someone is saying put em on ignore. But unless its racist or sexist why should you really care?
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
Define "problem". If you mean it irritates you (or some others who have similar preference as you), then sure, it is a "problem". Given how diverse the internet is, it is a problem that you just have to live you. There always will be others who enjoy stuff that you find irritating.
You can, of course, choose not to participate and ignore the whole thing. No one forces you to go to wow-heroes.com or diabloprogress.som.
I don't see how it is a problem for you when a) you can ignore the practice and not participate in any of the website or addon, and b) you can choose not to play with any players who like the practice.
How would you ignore it if there are people (Not going to name names) that CONSTANTLY enter every thread of people like him are involved in putting in their 2 cents when they don't need to? Or in games they like. Your basically tellign him...you don't like it, leave or don't play.
Use the "ignore" function? Just like on this forum .. put a poster on ignore and you will never see his posts. Put a player on ignore in a game, and you will never see his chat.
No one needs to leave the game.
Well sure...but the problem is no game ever provides a big enough space on igmore lists. Not sure on the size here.
send all antagonists to an instanced world all by themselves. Flagged as griefer. Unless they remove their account flag and stop their negative behavior they cant transfer back to the open world with everyone else. If you make it 3 times to the instanced server (or just a piece of instanced map) you are permanently banned. If you grief in the open world you can be reported with proof of the grief so you can be tranfered back to the instanced area with other griefers. Griefers that havent been sent to the instanced area can be full looted when killed in the open world. But good people cant be looted. This works with a guardian / criminal sort of reputation system.
severely punish the a*hats and reward the people who help keeping a good community.
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar On this forum, ignore does not even seem to work for me. There are currently two on my list and I still their comments.
weird .. it works for me. However, that is a software issue .. and not a design issue. Obviously a properly implemented "ignore" function can solve a lot of problems.
send all antagonists to an instanced world all by themselves. Flagged as griefer. Unless they remove their account flag and stop their negative behavior they cant transfer back to the open world with everyone else. If you make it 3 times to the instanced server (or just a piece of instanced map) you are permanently banned. If you grief in the open world you can be reported with proof of the grief so you can be tranfered back to the instanced area with other griefers. Griefers that havent been sent to the instanced area can be full looted when killed in the open world. But good people cant be looted. This works with a guardian / criminal sort of reputation system.
severely punish the a*hats and reward the people who help keeping a good community.
If you're going to go through all that trouble then why even have PvP?
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own. -- Herman Melville
send all antagonists to an instanced world all by themselves. Flagged as griefer. Unless they remove their account flag and stop their negative behavior they cant transfer back to the open world with everyone else. If you make it 3 times to the instanced server (or just a piece of instanced map) you are permanently banned. If you grief in the open world you can be reported with proof of the grief so you can be tranfered back to the instanced area with other griefers. Griefers that havent been sent to the instanced area can be full looted when killed in the open world. But good people cant be looted. This works with a guardian / criminal sort of reputation system.
severely punish the a*hats and reward the people who help keeping a good community.
If you're going to go through all that trouble then why even have PvP?
im not talking about how pvp works. Im talking about aholes. They are the reason why pvp is not enjoyable. And you can have good pvp without them.
Comments
I'm not on any of those and find the whole practice childish. I find no enjoyment in beating someone up, stealing their stuff and lording it over them. I do not feel superior because I got in a lucky hit or because I beat up someone smaller than me.
There's just no fun in that, sorry.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
I don't. I couldn't care less what anyone around me does, I pay no attention whatsoever. In fact, the only reason I've ever "inspected" anyone is if they're carrying something I haven't seen before and want to know what it is. I find the whole MMO dick-waving contest to be immature.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
So? It is no fun for you but others find it fun, and use those website. Don't tell me you don't know that it is popular.
You are not going to see this epleen practice going away soon.
Anonymity + self reliance in games is a perfect recipe for asshattery.
I'm all for anonymity, but some interdependence in games would be a retro-breath of fresh air. A reputation that meant something? When is the last time you saw that in a game? Everquest? Vanilla WoW? *shrugs*
No, we're not, yet it is exactly that e-peen practice that causes so many of the problems that we see. Just because people have fun doing it doesn't mean it's a problem-free practice.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Define "problem". If you mean it irritates you (or some others who have similar preference as you), then sure, it is a "problem". Given how diverse the internet is, it is a problem that you just have to live you. There always will be others who enjoy stuff that you find irritating.
You can, of course, choose not to participate and ignore the whole thing. No one forces you to go to wow-heroes.com or diabloprogress.som.
I don't see how it is a problem for you when a) you can ignore the practice and not participate in any of the website or addon, and b) you can choose not to play with any players who like the practice.
How would you ignore it if there are people (Not going to name names) that CONSTANTLY enter every thread of people like him are involved in putting in their 2 cents when they don't need to? Or in games they like. Your basically tellign him...you don't like it, leave or don't play.
ie: old enough to accept the mmorpg.com Terms of Service.
One u have an age group that does not require baby-sitting, then u can have a like-minded community, that host ideas and feedback.
Making a valid point, only to have it underminded (troll'd) by a 15 year old, is not conducive for adult discussion. Cannot have non-earners spouting off on things they, themselves.. have no means of aquiring.
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
How could you do that though unless a credit card has to be entered (No fee, just to verify 18+). And even then...who's to say and adult won't enter the info so their kid can get on anyways.
Not to mention it isn't always the teens (kids) who do it...sadly.
Because money talks...
Honestly, I've been around since pong. With history, comes knowledge. Nothing has changed but the cadence.
A market will eventually find their premium customer. Ironically, it is one of the most vocal communities and one of the oldest. This whole genra would not exist, if it wasn't for those who played pen & paper role-playing games. Those people are the staple and backbone of any MMORPG community. It was on our $0.50/hour internet tab, that fueled these MUDs, that later went graphical.
We were the same people who had $2k systems back on the early 80's. Playing the first of these games like Wizardry.
People tend to forget, that even Ultima Online (UO), had a massive following before it went online. The Ultima series and Lord British was an icon in the Role Playing industry. Most of us are about his age too..
Most roleplayers are not little kids, but veteran gamers who are all easily 40'ish & older now. Well established, just like Brad, Smed or any of our contemporaries.
So why are us Role-playing veteran's constantly being spoon-fed children-style trinket games..?
Again... word & cash are two different things. Most my age or not sharing "words" on an internet forum. But.. their wallet's are already fueling their kids (some of them you), their iPads & Xbox games.
My generation should have the respect of a premium $25/month metaworld to discover and roleplay in. Period!
This community will not improve, as long as you have a mix-dichotomy of income & age. (12 ~ 50+)
Some time back, we had just conducted a MMORPG.com poll of age, (most were past 30yrld), and a moderator got perturbed, because we had a (deleted) thread going, making phun of the game called Rusty Hearts. We all were laughing about who that game's target audience was... squarly the teeny-bopper (12 ~ 15). The thread went around our office floor, getting laughes.
Yet, the mods deleted it and issued warning for being old (ie: laughing at a child's game). When clearly, the mod was personally insulted because he was much younger and was unable to see this community for what it was. True MMORPG players... with transient talking heads, peeping in whenever some news struck their fancy.
Otherwise look who has been here for a while, forwarding well thoughout ideas, it is the oldschool Veteran gamer.
So.. as long as this Site continues it's marketing approach, you will always have friction here @ MMORPG.com. In other RPG communities, you don't not have this problem, because the people who are there, are so for MMORPG.. nothing other. Coincidentally, Massively doesn't have the issues we have here... , but they also don't run Rusty Heart adverts all over their site either.
You get what you pay for...
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
wut?
But these are the majority of people who play these games! We're talking about people who gank others, who act like immature children, etc. It's hard not to play with them when they are seemingly the most common players in a lot of these games, especially PvP based games. I have no idea where the whole website thing came from.
So, to get back to the topic, no matter how much fun gankers have ganking, it doesn't make ganking a good thing for most MMOs.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Use the "ignore" function? Just like on this forum .. put a poster on ignore and you will never see his posts. Put a player on ignore in a game, and you will never see his chat.
No one needs to leave the game.
Oh, those website things are places people are showing off their epleen with rankings of dps, hero scores, and what-not.
The point is this .... this is only irritating if they talk to you. In a pvp game, you are going to kill the opposite side player anyway. I don't see how this affect you .. if you just mute your chat channels.
Well sure...but the problem is no game ever provides a big enough space on igmore lists. Not sure on the size here.
Really? There is a limit? I have been ignoring people left and right on battle.net and never ran out of "space" to do so.
send all antagonists to an instanced world all by themselves. Flagged as griefer. Unless they remove their account flag and stop their negative behavior they cant transfer back to the open world with everyone else. If you make it 3 times to the instanced server (or just a piece of instanced map) you are permanently banned. If you grief in the open world you can be reported with proof of the grief so you can be tranfered back to the instanced area with other griefers. Griefers that havent been sent to the instanced area can be full looted when killed in the open world. But good people cant be looted. This works with a guardian / criminal sort of reputation system.
severely punish the a*hats and reward the people who help keeping a good community.
weird .. it works for me. However, that is a software issue .. and not a design issue. Obviously a properly implemented "ignore" function can solve a lot of problems.
If you're going to go through all that trouble then why even have PvP?
There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.
-- Herman Melville
im not talking about how pvp works. Im talking about aholes. They are the reason why pvp is not enjoyable. And you can have good pvp without them.
They don't have to be nice.
What reason is there to be rude?