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PvP progression?

OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
Do you think TESO will have some sort of realm point/abilities system like DAOC?

Comments

  • morbuskabismorbuskabis RodonPosts: 290Member

    Think I did read somthing about it. Hope it will, other wise what's the piont of PVP?

    image -Massive-Industries- Heavy Duty

  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member

    Yeah, I really loved DAOC's endgame progression system.

     

    Contrast that with games like WoW, where the only PvP progression is item upgrades... I hate it.

  • deakondeakon birminghamPosts: 583Member
    Originally posted by OgreRaper
    Do you think TESO will have some sort of realm point/abilities system like DAOC?

    According to tamrielfoundry they have alliance points

     

    • Alliance points accumulate through killing enemies and taking objectives in Cyrodiil. This constitutes an alternate advancement system through which the player can earn Alliance Ranks. There are 23 ranks planned for launch, although this number is subject to change. (TF1)
     
    Its under the pvp tab
  • aesperusaesperus Hamshire, NVPosts: 5,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by morbuskabis

    Think I did read somthing about it. Hope it will, other wise what's the piont of PVP?

    The point of PvP is to have fun, emulating a battle, skirmish, or war.

    The point isn't meant to be chasing the next shiniest piece of underpants.

     

    - If TESO does have realm points, ranks, w/e I hope it's for Siege PvP specific things (i.e. being able to be a commander on the battlefield, setting up objective orders, special keep upgrades, etc.), and not loot based.

  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
    Originally posted by aesperus
    Originally posted by morbuskabis

    Think I did read somthing about it. Hope it will, other wise what's the piont of PVP?

    The point of PvP is to have fun, emulating a battle, skirmish, or war.

    The point isn't meant to be chasing the next shiniest piece of underpants.

     

    - If TESO does have realm points, ranks, w/e I hope it's for Siege PvP specific things (i.e. being able to be a commander on the battlefield, setting up objective orders, special keep upgrades, etc.), and not loot based.

     

    PvP just for fun is fine in a FPS or lobby game. But in an MMORPG there also needs to be some character progression involved.

     

  • dwarflordkingdwarflordking long beach, CAPosts: 265Member
    i think you control dungeons in the territory you've captured
  • MrJones77MrJones77 Dayton, OHPosts: 17Member
    Another pretty cool incentive for PvP in ESO, the player with highest contribution of the winning faction becomes Emperor. After that not really sure what you can do, but it does make for major bragging rights.
  • LongLivePvPLongLivePvP LA, CAPosts: 102Member

    So I've never played DAOC before but heard so many great things about its 3 faction aspect.

    Anyone know what the incentive of open world pvp will be? Been trying to dig for info but to no avail besides whats in this post so far. 

    Playing: Darkfall Unholy Wars & ArcheAge(Alpha)
    Backed: Shards Online, Camelot Unchained
    Loved: Vanilla WoW,UO,Shadowbane,EQ,DAoC,Asheron's Call(Darktide)

  • Eol-Eol- houston, TXPosts: 274Member
    Originally posted by aesperus
    Originally posted by morbuskabis

    Think I did read somthing about it. Hope it will, other wise what's the piont of PVP?

    The point of PvP is to have fun, emulating a battle, skirmish, or war.

    The point isn't meant to be chasing the next shiniest piece of underpants.

     

    - If TESO does have realm points, ranks, w/e I hope it's for Siege PvP specific things (i.e. being able to be a commander on the battlefield, setting up objective orders, special keep upgrades, etc.), and not loot based.

    well, to be fair, if you take away 'chasing the next shiniest piece of underpants' from mmorpgs there wont be much left. Isnt most of PvE doing exactly that? Sure there is the thrill of beating a boss or soloing 4 at a time, but if thats all if took to make a good game, we would do away with levels and progression entirely. The fact is, people want to have some sort of reward for PvPing, to feel some sense of progression. I am not sure making it entirely realm based would provide that.

    DAoC didnt have loot drops, it had abilities you could buy with realm points earned in PvP, but if anything that had an even more dramatic impact than gear. The last MMORPG I played was Rift where the main reward for PvPing is gear that you buy with points earned from doing PvP, and frankly it didnt feel that much different from the DAoC realm abilities from a decade ago. Either way, a max level character entering PvP is at a huge disadvantage to a max level character with lots of PvP points under their belts.

    Dont misunderstand me, I wish it was more like what you suggest, I just dont think that would be enough for a lot of people. When DAoC first came out, there were no rewards for PvP other than the pride of seeing your realm take forts and succeed in the war. But that wasnt nearly enough reward for the harder core players who wanted some sort of progression for their character, which is what led to the realm abilities system. Abilties or gear, either way, you're a hamster on the wheel chasing the next reward.

    Elladan - ESO (AD)
    Camring - SWTOR (Ebon Hawk)
    Eol & Justinian - Rift (Faeblight)
    Ceol and Duri - LotRO (Landroval)
    Kili - WoW
    Eol - Lineage 2
    Camring - SWG
    Justinian (Nimue), Camring - DAoC

  • GoldenArrowGoldenArrow TurkuPosts: 1,187Member

    I described this in another thread..

    But the most important thing with pvp is exactly the same a PvE.

    Constant treadmill for Gear/Power/Levels/Abilities.

    Even the new FPS games that are mostly about PvP have long wound progression systems.

    Even MOBA games have progression.

     

    It's a requirement, not a nice-to-have.

    That's why GW2 structured and WvW sucks.

     

    CARROT-ON-A-STICK OR NO GAME.

  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
    Originally posted by GoldenArrow

    CARROT-ON-A-STICK OR NO GAME.

    Yes, agreed. Obviously a fun combat system is number one. But I will never pay money for a game that doesn't have a long term (and interesting) endgame progression system. II'm hoping for the upgradeable and/or new abilities to purchase with Aliiance Points. As just upgrading gear is very bland to me.

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    The devs have said pvp gear, pve gear and crafted gear will be of equal quality.

    If they work it like daoc, expect a shallower power curve e.g. you upgrade your +5 sword to a +6 sword, rather than upgrading it to a +12 sword with an proc fire attack in a wow stylee.

    Also I would expect them not to use separate special pve / pvp stats, that's just a band aid in raidgrinder type mmos like wow and rift to stop raiders 1 shotting everyone in pvp. But won't be the case in TESO as raid gear won't be better than pvp or craft gear.
  • GoldenArrowGoldenArrow TurkuPosts: 1,187Member
    Originally posted by ShakyMo
    The devs have said pvp gear, pve gear and crafted gear will be of equal quality.

    If they work it like daoc, expect a shallower power curve e.g. you upgrade your +5 sword to a +6 sword, rather than upgrading it to a +12 sword with an proc fire attack in a wow stylee.

    Also I would expect them not to use separate special pve / pvp stats, that's just a band aid in raidgrinder type mmos like wow and rift to stop raiders 1 shotting everyone in pvp. But won't be the case in TESO as raid gear won't be better than pvp or craft gear.

    You got it bit wrong Shaky.

    They said you'd need to do all of the mentioned to get the best possible gear.

    Simply running dungeons or doing PvP won't cut it.

     

    This of course requires they to go through with it, instead of falling "Here's a PvP vendor who sells resilience gear" trap.

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Yeah if you do more than 1 of the 3 you have better stuff. But if you just pvp or just raid or just craft your gear will be equal in quality. I'm expecting some epic whine from raiders spoiled by wow style games though, so may change.
  • deakondeakon birminghamPosts: 583Member
    Originally posted by ShakyMo
    Yeah if you do more than 1 of the 3 you have better stuff. But if you just pvp or just raid or just craft your gear will be equal in quality. I'm expecting some epic whine from raiders spoiled by wow style games though, so may change.

    The way i see it happening, is you will get either different slots from each activity (eg head slot comes from crafting, shoulders raiding, chest pvp etc) and they're not bound so you can trade, or you get different componants/mats from each activity and the crafter makes the item

  • alterfenixalterfenix Bielsko-BialaPosts: 343Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by deakon
    Originally posted by ShakyMo
    Yeah if you do more than 1 of the 3 you have better stuff. But if you just pvp or just raid or just craft your gear will be equal in quality. I'm expecting some epic whine from raiders spoiled by wow style games though, so may change.

    The way i see it happening, is you will get either different slots from each activity (eg head slot comes from crafting, shoulders raiding, chest pvp etc) and they're not bound so you can trade, or you get different componants/mats from each activity and the crafter makes the item

    To be fair this could work perfectly. Simply that way players a s a faction need to do all kind of stuff but then if you don't like PvP then there is no need for you to do it. If you don't like PvE then you just do as much as required to cover the costs and that's it.

    In topic: as some ppl here I also hope for some kind of PvP progression. That shouldn't be short (2-3 months for total hardcore player is a must really), should be rewarding but shouldn't make it so vets 1 shot newbies (see DAoC vs WoW example). There should be some perks and skills for PvP ranks that would be useful only in PvP.

    Although no resilliance or PvP power, or any PvP specific stats on gear (simply wtf). Such stats may be nice to have in game however some title's example shows that it can easily get out of control really and this is something I guess nobody wants. There eventually may be some wards (like in WAR) but this should be done carefully. Like 1 ward gives at most 2% or so to stat boost in PvP combat but no more (and there are like 3-4 wards at most available). In general boost coming from PvP specific stuff shouldn't be more than 10-20% or so to stats (and definitely not like 50% or more) - not counting here gear stats that are used also in PvE.

  • deakondeakon birminghamPosts: 583Member

    just found this:

    "Yes we have a PVP progression system that we haven't really talked about yet," says Firor. "And in beta we'll go further into this, but you get Alliance Points the more you PVP, you get more abilities, and in that sense it's similar to Camelot where we had Realm Points"

    link

     

    Also dodge/roll confirmed :)

  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Common
    Originally posted by deakon

    just found this:

    "Yes we have a PVP progression system that we haven't really talked about yet," says Firor. "And in beta we'll go further into this, but you get Alliance Points the more you PVP, you get more abilities, and in that sense it's similar to Camelot where we had Realm Points"

    link

     

    Also dodge/roll confirmed :)

    After the GW2 disaster I promised to myself to never get hyped for an MMO again, but news like this makes it very difficult to stay calm ;_;

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • GoldenArrowGoldenArrow TurkuPosts: 1,187Member
    Why wait for the hype train when you can be miles ahead of it.
  • Originally posted by boxsnd
    Originally posted by deakon

    just found this:

    "Yes we have a PVP progression system that we haven't really talked about yet," says Firor. "And in beta we'll go further into this, but you get Alliance Points the more you PVP, you get more abilities, and in that sense it's similar to Camelot where we had Realm Points"

    link

     

    Also dodge/roll confirmed :)

    After the GW2 disaster I promised to myself to never get hyped for an MMO again, but news like this makes it very difficult to stay calm ;_;

    We must endeavour to stay sceptical.

  • SovrathSovrath Boston Area, MAPosts: 18,451Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by OgreRaper
    Originally posted by aesperus
    Originally posted by morbuskabis

    Think I did read somthing about it. Hope it will, other wise what's the piont of PVP?

    The point of PvP is to have fun, emulating a battle, skirmish, or war.

    The point isn't meant to be chasing the next shiniest piece of underpants.

     

    - If TESO does have realm points, ranks, w/e I hope it's for Siege PvP specific things (i.e. being able to be a commander on the battlefield, setting up objective orders, special keep upgrades, etc.), and not loot based.

     

    PvP just for fun is fine in a FPS or lobby game. But in an MMORPG there also needs to be some character progression involved.

     

    I seem to recall doing a lot of pvp in Lineage 2 and it was for land/resources or revenge.

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