it doesnt matter, its not about finding the top dogs, they can do that if they wish. What it does offer is a route for genuine posters to genuinly +1 great posts. the author gets the benefit in this case, and why not!
i.e i abuse the system and get 1000 votes. So what, means nothing. However joe blogg posted a great post, and got a +1 for it = Auther of positive post feels rewarded and encouraged to contribute more. Myself with my 1000 votes, hey im going for a million - still means nothing, il end up feeling a bit foolish.
That only works if the points system means something to them. I can see where you are going with that, but you're talking about a system that would have meaning to very few people, and of those people it may sway the behaviour of a tiny fraction, if at all.
Like Loktofeit already suggested, you get exactly what you measure. The posts which gather the most points may not be the best replies, only ones that gather most points. And in the MMORPG.com's case it would be old-schoolers voting against modern views and vice versa.
I'm quite sure it would not work the way you intend, Bladestorm.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
It's perfectly true the best posts will not get the most points, but that's thinking about in terms of a competition to be won where if a bad post gets abused with lots of +1s it will destroy the model. But that is not the point, the point is that genuinely good posts get +1'd regardless of silly abuses by people who go out to ruin forums. It's the equiv of the spotlight poster mechanism but on a much finer scale.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Originally posted by Bladestrom It's perfectly true the best posts will not get the most points, but that's thinking about in terms of a competition to be won where if a bad post gets abused with lots of +1s it will destroy the model. But that is not the point, the point is that genuinely good posts get +1'd regardless of silly abuses by people who go out to ruin forums. It's the equiv of the spotlight poster mechanism but on a much finer scale.
Spotlight Poster is very different. It is decided by an overseeing group, not the userbase.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein "Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
I was talking about a good post, I've got better things to do in my life than being negative. In real life the most pleasant and well adjusts people compliment the good that people do, and try to ignore the bad, or maybe this is a culture thing.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Originally posted by Bladestrom I was talking about a good post, I've got better things to do in my life than being negative. In real life the most pleasant and well adjusts people compliment the good that people do, and try to ignore the bad, or maybe this is a culture thing.
Have you actually read forums here? Most stuff is negative. So may be you are not .. but that does not change the nature of the bitter ranting here.
Hence you only allow +1s . Lol what's so horrible and terrifying about tucking a box to say you liked something, giving compliments is what being part of a community is all about. Shotty community if everyone is hyper critical and nit- picky eh.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
So, there has been a large amount of talk about the gaming community being toxic. It is fine and well to dwell in the negative, but how can we fix it? We are all smart people here, so lets put our brains together and maybe we can accomplish something. What do you think we can do?
Example 1:
I know as a female gamer I have seen several "support" groups/communities for female gamers open up over the years. They emphasize girl gamers being normal players and deserve the same respect of any male gamer. Do you think a anti-being-an-a-hat community would work to fix our problem?
Example 2:
League of legends has started banning pro gamers that are toxic to show that they will not take it and that it is not ok on any level of skill. They have also implemented the honor system to try and make people think about the positive and not only the negative (reporting). I personally think it has worked wonders on the community and given it a fighting chance at maybe recovering from its a-hat infection.
We get blamed for alot of violence and problems. Maybe it is true since our community is so mean, racist, sexist, and generally evil (except for a few) If we were to try to activally pursue change and growth of our community out of being 4-6 year olds into being 21/25+ people maybe we could lose a bit of the media heat that we get. So, think. Think hard and lets come together and figure out how we can make a better community!
tl;dr
How do you think we can fix the gaming community?
Honestly, there's no simple way to solve this problem. Banning people may work well enough in certain cases, but it's a VERY fine line to tread across. It's far too easy to start banning people unjustly under such a banner.
That said, I think the gaming community gets blamed for a lot of things it has no right to be judged by. Given the latest talks about 'violent media', a lot of it is frankly political BS. Anyone w/ half a brain knows there is no significant correlation (as a whole) between violent entertainment & violent actions. If that was to be even remotely true, then the US as a whole would be predominately homocidal maniacs.
However, when it comes to racism, trolling, flaming, etc. It's very easy for that to get out of hand over the internet. There's no real way to get rid of it. There's so much anonymity over the internet that some people get off on abusing that to create trouble. The only real solution is for the community to start policing itself. Push community leaders to start taking more of the right kinds of action against these things. Or, if you feel they aren't doing a good enough job, become a community leader yourself. If you want something done right...
ROFL....rofl rofl rofl... if you actually think anyone can improve a game's online community you are nuts.
communities are built by the end users.. the only way to have the "best" community is to ban everyone who is differant to the ideal person... which basicly means. ban everyone but your self. BUT then 1 person is hardly a community now are they..
Originally posted by Bladestrom Hence you only allow +1s . Lol what's so horrible and terrifying about tucking a box to say you liked something, giving compliments is what being part of a community is all about. Shotty community if everyone is hyper critical and nit- picky eh.
Really? Isn't this community about ranting about MMOs 90% of the time?
You start simply by rewarding positive behaviour and not rewarding negative behaviour. A really basic example is resource nodes in a game. Games that enforce and implicitly reward negative behaviour alloys you to selfishly tag a node, games that allow sharing promote positive behaviour, do just that. Same in a community, you can't just punish, you have to positively reinforce as well. We do it with our kids, why would we not do the same with our peers.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Originally posted by emperorwings Get those who used to play EQ and UO and put them into the same game.
So they can rip out each others' throat arguing if open world PvP should be in a game?
Now that made me laugh out loud... ^^ Thats all too likely to happen. Way too many people can't understand that people can disagree, without being disagreable.
Originally posted by Bladestrom You start simply by rewarding positive behaviour and not rewarding negative behaviour. A really basic example is resource nodes in a game. Games that enforce and implicitly reward negative behaviour alloys you to selfishly tag a node, games that allow sharing promote positive behaviour, do just that. Same in a community, you can't just punish, you have to positively reinforce as well. We do it with our kids, why would we not do the same with our peers.
You really should've seen when they tried that in League of Legends. I think the only way to prevent the community to devolve into a cesspool is to make the game as "socially light" as possible. Don't force people to endure one another any more than they want to.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
Originally posted by Bladestrom You start simply by rewarding positive behaviour and not rewarding negative behaviour. A really basic example is resource nodes in a game. Games that enforce and implicitly reward negative behaviour alloys you to selfishly tag a node, games that allow sharing promote positive behaviour, do just that. Same in a community, you can't just punish, you have to positively reinforce as well. We do it with our kids, why would we not do the same with our peers.
You really should've seen when they tried that in League of Legends. I think the only way to prevent the community to devolve into a cesspool is to make the game as "socially light" as possible. Don't force people to endure one another any more than they want to.
PvP brings out the worse in people, and the worse types. Trying to add some kind of system to cut down on douchebaggery in a PvP game is like trying to keep a sex addict out of a brothel.
It affects all Online communities and it is tied to people being anonymous online and thus not caring about their action.
I think Blizzard made the best attempt out of all Online Gaming companies to try and combat 'toxic' behavior by having the first iteration of Real ID be mandatory and showcase people's real names on the forums. Of course there was a huge backlash because people want to remain anonymous on the internet..
Personally, I think removing the anonymous factor will help a lot in making people act more civil, but is that ever going to happen? Probably not.
I'd like to mention one more thing: The worst or most 'toxi' behavior I see I hacking. Hacking in many online video games is a rampant problem around the world...except in South Korea. The reason being: Korean players are required to provide their social security number when making a game account. Hacking in korea is illegal and you will be fined if caught.
Comments
Like Loktofeit already suggested, you get exactly what you measure. The posts which gather the most points may not be the best replies, only ones that gather most points. And in the MMORPG.com's case it would be old-schoolers voting against modern views and vice versa.
I'm quite sure it would not work the way you intend, Bladestorm.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Spotlight Poster is very different. It is decided by an overseeing group, not the userbase.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Or put it this way. If you read a post opposite to your opinion, wouldn't it be nice to tick a box to say "bad" post, to take a down a notch?
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Or put it this way, someone could log in 20 alt accounts to take it down 20 notches.
Or take it up 20 notches.
Or use 10 to vote down and 10 to vote up, cancelling each other out.
Pandamonium!!!!!1111!!!
Have you actually read forums here? Most stuff is negative. So may be you are not .. but that does not change the nature of the bitter ranting here.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
Honestly, there's no simple way to solve this problem. Banning people may work well enough in certain cases, but it's a VERY fine line to tread across. It's far too easy to start banning people unjustly under such a banner.
That said, I think the gaming community gets blamed for a lot of things it has no right to be judged by. Given the latest talks about 'violent media', a lot of it is frankly political BS. Anyone w/ half a brain knows there is no significant correlation (as a whole) between violent entertainment & violent actions. If that was to be even remotely true, then the US as a whole would be predominately homocidal maniacs.
However, when it comes to racism, trolling, flaming, etc. It's very easy for that to get out of hand over the internet. There's no real way to get rid of it. There's so much anonymity over the internet that some people get off on abusing that to create trouble. The only real solution is for the community to start policing itself. Push community leaders to start taking more of the right kinds of action against these things. Or, if you feel they aren't doing a good enough job, become a community leader yourself. If you want something done right...
ROFL....rofl rofl rofl... if you actually think anyone can improve a game's online community you are nuts.
communities are built by the end users.. the only way to have the "best" community is to ban everyone who is differant to the ideal person... which basicly means. ban everyone but your self. BUT then 1 person is hardly a community now are they..
Really? Isn't this community about ranting about MMOs 90% of the time?
This isn't a signature, you just think it is.
So they can rip out each others' throat arguing if open world PvP should be in a game?
should make that a new MMO.... im sure many would pay to watch that. though i forsee popcorn prices to skyrocket
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
LOL ... yeah .... give a new meaning to "e-sports".
Now that made me laugh out loud... ^^ Thats all too likely to happen. Way too many people can't understand that people can disagree, without being disagreable.
You really should've seen when they tried that in League of Legends. I think the only way to prevent the community to devolve into a cesspool is to make the game as "socially light" as possible. Don't force people to endure one another any more than they want to.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
PvP brings out the worse in people, and the worse types. Trying to add some kind of system to cut down on douchebaggery in a PvP game is like trying to keep a sex addict out of a brothel.
It affects all Online communities and it is tied to people being anonymous online and thus not caring about their action.
I think Blizzard made the best attempt out of all Online Gaming companies to try and combat 'toxic' behavior by having the first iteration of Real ID be mandatory and showcase people's real names on the forums. Of course there was a huge backlash because people want to remain anonymous on the internet..
Personally, I think removing the anonymous factor will help a lot in making people act more civil, but is that ever going to happen? Probably not.
I'd like to mention one more thing: The worst or most 'toxi' behavior I see I hacking. Hacking in many online video games is a rampant problem around the world...except in South Korea. The reason being: Korean players are required to provide their social security number when making a game account. Hacking in korea is illegal and you will be fined if caught.
Koreans take their gaming seriously!
This is why people want to remain anonymous on the internet.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4l1_8wefR7c