Golden Age = Best there ever was, and only way to go is down.
So, what the OP is saying is that we will never get anything better than what we have now? ... I am skeptical by nature, but even i wont go as far as predicting that in the future we will never have anything better than what is out there now.
Personally, I can't wait until technology catches up to what my dream games would be. Fully inmersive 3D projections that require full physical movements and where your virtual world actions affect the overall virtual world. Dawning my mages' robes in that world would be totally epic. *queue Star Trek'esk holodecks*
No, it's a job. There is a paycheck. Output is all that matters unless I'm in human resources at the company where the monitor monkeys work.
To me they're just there to put something out. If that thing sucks, then their work sucks.
No adulation.
No handholding or coddling.
Hard work?
Go work in some other field.
It helps if you understood even the basics. You understand why buildings have to be built on solid ground, have to have foundations, sometimes steel reinforcement, where do you start and which order do you build your house. Almost everyone can atleast guess how all this works and why.
But when many people understand construction, very few understand software development. People who don't understand demand that they should start with the roof and that the whole thing should be made of entirely of glass and be 100 stories high. And then they complain how they didn't get their glass tower. Thats you.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
It helps if you understood even the basics. You understand why buildings have to be built on solid ground, have to have foundations, sometimes steel reinforcement, where do you start and which order do you build your house. Almost everyone can atleast guess how all this works and why.
This is the thing, and maybe off topic to that discussion you are having right now, but one of the arguments around is that the foundation is to shallow because the company had to save on cost and does not really expect the house to last more than a limited time, for which the foundation is enough.
In this sense it can be argued that due to much less information available (market research, experience with massive games), the foundations were much deeper and more solid in the past, "just in case".
In this sense it can be argued that due to much less information available (market research, experience with massive games), the foundations were much deeper and more solid in the past, "just in case".
uh? Wouldn't market research and experience be much better NOW than in the past? In fact, there is no MMO market research firm then, and there is now.
This is the thing, and maybe off topic to that discussion you are having right now, but one of the arguments around is that the foundation is to shallow because the company had to save on cost and does not really expect the house to last more than a limited time, for which the foundation is enough.
In this sense it can be argued that due to much less information available (market research, experience with massive games), the foundations were much deeper and more solid in the past, "just in case".
Flame on!
Its not that. No one makes anything "just in case". When you have a limited budget and time, you do what you can and hope all of it shows in the final product. Today's games actually have budget to do market research, but like always, customers have trouble expressing exactly what they want. Past games had the advantage of being the first, or if they didn't have that, they were stabs in the dark. Quite a few of developers turned out to be one-hit-wonders. It rises a question: Did they know what they were doing back then?
Going won't certainly help. Coming up with something completely new is the key, I think.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been-Wayne Gretzky
Golden age? It basically made me quit mmorpgs. For the first time in 10 years I'm not playing a mmorpg, or looking forward to one.
I'm tired and bored of looking forward to mmorpgs that cant hold me for more than one month and have no longevity, seems like they are either these burger one trick pony mmorpgs that you "complete" in one month or crappy low budget bad looking sandboxes with twitchy low quality animations and just low quality everything.
It's almost a relief sort of, I've missed many great *singplayer games and it's very fun to play high quality games more for a change that feel good for what they are. Also leaves me more time to do other things, yay. It's getting quite a bit more expensive though even when I mostly buy them from Steam sale or similar.
I enjoyed Planetside 2 longer than an average mmorpg and still looking forward to play it actively once the metagame and few other issues gets solved. Cannot wait for Aliens: Colonial Marines next month, and I might even get Deadspace 3 for the coop, havent played Deadspace before but it sounds nice. Walking Dead waiting on the HD also, waiting for the right mood for it
Good times ahead, maybe in some distant future I can I say the same for some new mmorpg(s).
Edit: *rather "smaller scale games" actually instead "singleplayer games", since these games usually comes with very fun multiplayer to last about the same time as these new generation crap-pile mmorpgs.
Like I said on page one, this is the beauty of MMO's today. They are free or close to it, There are story mmo's, traditional mmo's, super combat and graphics mmo's, sandboxes, mmo's with great crafting and harvesting, and mmo's with some great PvP action-It really is the Golden Age of Pay nothing mmo's. If you do want to spend money you have excellent sand boxes like Eve and Darkfall or you can go back to the most traditional of all themepark mmo's EQ and see where it all started, they even brought back the classic sand box Asherons Call 2--Enjoy
No, it's a job. There is a paycheck. Output is all that matters unless I'm in human resources at the company where the monitor monkeys work.
To me they're just there to put something out. If that thing sucks, then their work sucks.
No adulation.
No handholding or coddling.
Hard work?
Go work in some other field.
It helps if you understood even the basics. You understand why buildings have to be built on solid ground, have to have foundations, sometimes steel reinforcement, where do you start and which order do you build your house. Almost everyone can atleast guess how all this works and why.
But when many people understand construction, very few understand software development. People who don't understand demand that they should start with the roof and that the whole thing should be made of entirely of glass and be 100 stories high. And then they complain how they didn't get their glass tower. Thats you.
Ooh you're obviously very smart. I guess I shouldn't have any opinion on games because I don't program games. Are you serious? There may be cost/technical reasons for something sucking, but it still sucks. The people who made it don't deserve an award for doing their job (getting paid) and then sucking at it.
Originally posted by eddieg50 Like I said on page one, this is the beauty of MMO's today. They are free or close to it, There are story mmo's, traditional mmo's, super combat and graphics mmo's, sandboxes, mmo's with great crafting and harvesting, and mmo's with some great PvP action-It really is the Golden Age of Pay nothing mmo's.
If you do want to spend money you have excellent sand boxes like Eve and Darkfall or you can go back to the most traditional of all themepark mmo's EQ and see where it all started, they even brought back the classic sand box Asherons Call 2--Enjoy
But we really haven't gotten to the golden age as we are not at the point where there is is a no more room to improve, or even reached a point where there is very little room for improvement.
A mmorpg is a persistant world.. a virtual world. Instancing is just a business decision to fake a persitant world, which over the years gained traction due to most games going massive online arcade games. Not worlds like on the past.
LOL .. past is gone. You just can't deal with progress.
WOW is a MMO .. mostly a lobby game now. So is DDO, and many other MMOs. Virtual world is just not that important. You can bitch and moan .. old failed ideas are not coming back.
A mmorpg is a persistant world.. a virtual world. Instancing is just a business decision to fake a persitant world, which over the years gained traction due to most games going massive online arcade games. Not worlds like on the past.
LOL .. past is gone. You just can't deal with progress.
WOW is a MMO .. mostly a lobby game now. So is DDO, and many other MMOs. Virtual world is just not that important. You can bitch and moan .. old failed ideas are not coming back.
Virtual world isnt the past, the future is making it better not getting rid of it lol. You cant have a mmorpg without a world. Whats wrong with you? You cant even tell the difference between lobby game, mmo, mmorpg, and single player with mp support games. You try so hard to get people to buy into what you are saying, but your logic is severely flawed. The future is better games not your f2p lobby junk games. Just because you like to bounce around from free game to free game doesnt mean everyone does. We want better for our mmorpgs, even if you dont. Every post you write is always negative towards games 95% of us like here and want to get better, perhaps you should be more open minded.
A mmorpg is a persistant world.. a virtual world. Instancing is just a business decision to fake a persitant world, which over the years gained traction due to most games going massive online arcade games. Not worlds like on the past.
LOL .. past is gone. You just can't deal with progress.
WOW is a MMO .. mostly a lobby game now. So is DDO, and many other MMOs. Virtual world is just not that important. You can bitch and moan .. old failed ideas are not coming back.
But without a persistant world you do lose some of the RPG aspect of an MMORPG. I'm not saying that without persistant world you don't have a MMORPG. But more that without a world for players to interact with you limit the RP aspect of RPG and focus more so on making it gamey(?).
I mean without a presistent world you really just have players, soloing or grouping up to play levels, with no other purpose but to get gear and move to the next set of content.
edit: so yes you can have a MMO without a persistent world but an MMORPG is a different beast entirely in the fact that you have to promote the Roleplaying apsect along side the game aspect and persistent worlds are one solution in providing a balance between the two.
A mmorpg is a persistant world.. a virtual world. Instancing is just a business decision to fake a persitant world, which over the years gained traction due to most games going massive online arcade games. Not worlds like on the past.
LOL .. past is gone. You just can't deal with progress.
WOW is a MMO .. mostly a lobby game now. So is DDO, and many other MMOs. Virtual world is just not that important. You can bitch and moan .. old failed ideas are not coming back.
Virtual world isnt the past, the future is making it better not getting rid of it lol. You cant have a mmorpg without a world. Whats wrong with you? You cant even tell the difference between lobby game, mmo, mmorpg, and single player with mp support games. You try so hard to get people to buy into what you are saying, but your logic is severely flawed. The future is better games not your f2p lobby junk games. Just because you like to bounce around from free game to free game doesnt mean everyone does. We want better for our mmorpgs, even if you dont. Every post you write is always negative towards games 95% of us like here and want to get better, perhaps you should be more open minded.
+1, according to his logic I suppose Battlefield 3 is a mmorpg.
A mmorpg is a persistant world.. a virtual world. Instancing is just a business decision to fake a persitant world, which over the years gained traction due to most games going massive online arcade games. Not worlds like on the past.
LOL .. past is gone. You just can't deal with progress.
WOW is a MMO .. mostly a lobby game now. So is DDO, and many other MMOs. Virtual world is just not that important. You can bitch and moan .. old failed ideas are not coming back.
But then ur original point doesn't stand, does it..?
Why do you constantly meander between the points, instead of taking them head on? Why do you not understand, that people were playing MMORPGs before you knew about them? Why do you constantly post when you have such a very small understanding of business models and the MMORPG genra..?
We understand... You like video games, & want to be entertained, but you've also illustrated (with your post history) you are incapable of understanding a MMORPG. Yet, ironically... you mention MMO all the time, yet you have not displayed that you understand the difference. Always needing to resort to another website for definition. Citing a websdite and understand what your citing are two different things.
You've just said a virtual world is not important... to you. Because your incapable of understanding the difference between a video game... and a MMORPG. You are not a roleplayer... your a kid, who wants entertainment and can only afford the cheapest form possible, because your incessant and constantly play 0~5 free ones all the time. We get it dude.. that you play for entertainment purposes only... you've said so numerous times. We understand that you need games with "hard mode" so you feel better about yourself... we get it dude.
I have read your post history... all the points you've ever made and all the "facts" you state... it's as if... your talking about Battlefield style of gameplay & mechanics. You want cheap free instancing and a non-persistant world... so why are you here on MMORPG forums trolling...? Threadcrapping everywhere telling others how little you know?
So (again) why are you not playing those video games, if that is the gameplay you are looking for and a proponent of..?
Attempting to rebuttal me implies that you understand your at MMORPG.com, not MMO.com... and you need to know the difference before your post history get more embarrasing..!
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
Virtual world isnt the past, the future is making it better not getting rid of it lol. You cant have a mmorpg without a world. Whats wrong with you? You cant even tell the difference between lobby game, mmo, mmorpg, and single player with mp support games. You try so hard to get people to buy into what you are saying, but your logic is severely flawed. The future is better games not your f2p lobby junk games. Just because you like to bounce around from free game to free game doesnt mean everyone does. We want better for our mmorpgs, even if you dont. Every post you write is always negative towards games 95% of us like here and want to get better, perhaps you should be more open minded.
hahahah .. who is close minded when you are holding onto old ideas. In fact, it is open minded to see all the lobby-based games, MMOs, MOBA, and all the variations.
I don't limit myself to virtual world games, not that i won't play one. I do play PS2. But why should every MMO has a virtual world? More variations and more innovation is good for gaming.
Vanguard - Ohh this game could of had it all, but I could never suggest to someone a game that has not had a significant update in about five years. It lacks polish in so many areas, I love what Vanguard could and should be, and perhaps supporting it is a way to get it to that place, but see it for what its free to play model is please, a cash grab. in a dying game.
This game has been Doing update all the time has a new area just put in. Plus new F2p restrictions removed. You need to get your facts straight before trying to make a points.
But without a persistant world you do lose some of the RPG aspect of an MMORPG. I'm not saying that without persistant world you don't have a MMORPG. But more that without a world for players to interact with you limit the RP aspect of RPG and focus more so on making it gamey(?).
I mean without a presistent world you really just have players, soloing or grouping up to play levels, with no other purpose but to get gear and move to the next set of content.
edit: so yes you can have a MMO without a persistent world but an MMORPG is a different beast entirely in the fact that you have to promote the Roleplaying apsect along side the game aspect and persistent worlds are one solution in providing a balance between the two.
All those are wrong assumptions.
First, with a lobby, you can group up with millions of players. In that regard, using LFD in WOW has little difference than Diablo 3 dungeon runs. What is the difference? I click a button, and match with 4 or 5 other players in a pool of millions.
Now what about purpose? In WOW today, or LOTRO, or DDO, isn't the purpose to go through the dungeon/raid and get loot?
And i would also say that you can role-play better in a story dungeon with 5 others than having random people run by you when you are doing solo-questing in the world. In fact, i play WOW and other MMOs (like LOTOR and STO) for years, and the number of times i see any role-playing in the persistent world when question ... ZERO.
But without a persistant world you do lose some of the RPG aspect of an MMORPG. I'm not saying that without persistant world you don't have a MMORPG. But more that without a world for players to interact with you limit the RP aspect of RPG and focus more so on making it gamey(?).
I mean without a presistent world you really just have players, soloing or grouping up to play levels, with no other purpose but to get gear and move to the next set of content.
All those are wrong assumptions.
First, with a lobby, you can group up with millions of players. In that regard, using LFD in WOW has little difference than Diablo 3 dungeon runs. What is the difference? I click a button, and match with 4 or 5 other players in a pool of millions.
cannot speak for other mmos but WOW lobby dungeons - its get the loot and get out mentality -- gogogo
But without a persistant world you do lose some of the RPG aspect of an MMORPG. I'm not saying that without persistant world you don't have a MMORPG. But more that without a world for players to interact with you limit the RP aspect of RPG and focus more so on making it gamey(?).
I mean without a presistent world you really just have players, soloing or grouping up to play levels, with no other purpose but to get gear and move to the next set of content.
edit: so yes you can have a MMO without a persistent world but an MMORPG is a different beast entirely in the fact that you have to promote the Roleplaying apsect along side the game aspect and persistent worlds are one solution in providing a balance between the two.
All those are wrong assumptions.
First, with a lobby, you can group up with millions of players. In that regard, using LFD in WOW has little difference than Diablo 3 dungeon runs. What is the difference? I click a button, and match with 4 or 5 other players in a pool of millions.
Now what about purpose? In WOW today, or LOTRO, or DDO, isn't the purpose to go through the dungeon/raid and get loot?
And i would also say that you can role-play better in a story dungeon with 5 others than having random people run by you when you are doing solo-questing in the world. In fact, i play WOW and other MMOs (like LOTOR and STO) for years, and the number of times i see any role-playing in the persistent world when question ... ZERO.
Thank you for pointing out where I am wrong. Now with my limited time playing MMORPGs I've seen quite a bit of RPers in the open world but that may because I try to introduce my self to them in an RP way. Now If I may ask how would games without a persistant world handle crafting that is say as in depth as swg where players can be full time crafters and not need to do combat? I think at there is some forms of MMOs that don't need persistant worlds while others still need them.
But without a persistant world you do lose some of the RPG aspect of an MMORPG. I'm not saying that without persistant world you don't have a MMORPG. But more that without a world for players to interact with you limit the RP aspect of RPG and focus more so on making it gamey(?).
I mean without a presistent world you really just have players, soloing or grouping up to play levels, with no other purpose but to get gear and move to the next set of content.
All those are wrong assumptions.
First, with a lobby, you can group up with millions of players. In that regard, using LFD in WOW has little difference than Diablo 3 dungeon runs. What is the difference? I click a button, and match with 4 or 5 other players in a pool of millions.
cannot speak for other mmos but WOW lobby dungeons - its get the loot and get out mentality -- gogogo
often no one will talk w each other
thats not my idea of player interaction
Sure .. you don't like it .. but millions of playres do this kind of dungeon every day .. must be fun to them. It is fun to me.
Thank you for pointing out where I am wrong. Now with my limited time playing MMORPGs I've seen quite a bit of RPers in the open world but that may because I try to introduce my self to them in an RP way. Now If I may ask how would games without a persistant world handle crafting that is say as in depth as swg where players can be full time crafters and not need to do combat? I think at there is some forms of MMOs that don't need persistant worlds while others still need them.
What does crafting has to do with persistent world? You can put the same crafting system in a SP player game, and it plays the same.
In fact, Minecraft is the most complex "crafting" game and it is not even a MMO.
Thank you for pointing out where I am wrong. Now with my limited time playing MMORPGs I've seen quite a bit of RPers in the open world but that may because I try to introduce my self to them in an RP way. Now If I may ask how would games without a persistant world handle crafting that is say as in depth as swg where players can be full time crafters and not need to do combat? I think at there is some forms of MMOs that don't need persistant worlds while others still need them.
What does crafting has to do with persistent world? You can put the same crafting system in a SP player game, and it plays the same.
In fact, Minecraft is the most complex "crafting" game and it is not even a MMO.
Have you ever played swg?
edit: what I'm trying to say is I don't see how a sandbox MMORPG can be done without a persistant world.
edit: what I'm trying to say is I don't see how a sandbox MMORPG can be done without a persistant world.
Sure. But sandbox MMORPGs are not the only MMORPGs, aren't they?
In fact, GW1 is classified as a MMORPG but it has no persistent world. DDO is mostly dungeon adventure and the persistent world may as well not be there.
And you don't need a sandbox to have crafting either. Heck, many non-MMO has crafting (SKYRIM, Diablo 3...). Granted that those are not very deep system, probably because the core audience of those games don't really care.
Comments
Golden Age = Best there ever was, and only way to go is down.
So, what the OP is saying is that we will never get anything better than what we have now? ... I am skeptical by nature, but even i wont go as far as predicting that in the future we will never have anything better than what is out there now.
Personally, I can't wait until technology catches up to what my dream games would be. Fully inmersive 3D projections that require full physical movements and where your virtual world actions affect the overall virtual world. Dawning my mages' robes in that world would be totally epic. *queue Star Trek'esk holodecks*
If that pre-order money powers the game in totality then good for them, they found an advantage and won.
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011
It helps if you understood even the basics. You understand why buildings have to be built on solid ground, have to have foundations, sometimes steel reinforcement, where do you start and which order do you build your house. Almost everyone can atleast guess how all this works and why.
But when many people understand construction, very few understand software development. People who don't understand demand that they should start with the roof and that the whole thing should be made of entirely of glass and be 100 stories high. And then they complain how they didn't get their glass tower. Thats you.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
This is the thing, and maybe off topic to that discussion you are having right now, but one of the arguments around is that the foundation is to shallow because the company had to save on cost and does not really expect the house to last more than a limited time, for which the foundation is enough.
In this sense it can be argued that due to much less information available (market research, experience with massive games), the foundations were much deeper and more solid in the past, "just in case".
Flame on!
uh? Wouldn't market research and experience be much better NOW than in the past? In fact, there is no MMO market research firm then, and there is now.
Its not that. No one makes anything "just in case". When you have a limited budget and time, you do what you can and hope all of it shows in the final product. Today's games actually have budget to do market research, but like always, customers have trouble expressing exactly what they want. Past games had the advantage of being the first, or if they didn't have that, they were stabs in the dark. Quite a few of developers turned out to be one-hit-wonders. It rises a question: Did they know what they were doing back then?
Going won't certainly help. Coming up with something completely new is the key, I think.
I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky
Golden age? It basically made me quit mmorpgs. For the first time in 10 years I'm not playing a mmorpg, or looking forward to one.
I'm tired and bored of looking forward to mmorpgs that cant hold me for more than one month and have no longevity, seems like they are either these burger one trick pony mmorpgs that you "complete" in one month or crappy low budget bad looking sandboxes with twitchy low quality animations and just low quality everything.
It's almost a relief sort of, I've missed many great *singplayer games and it's very fun to play high quality games more for a change that feel good for what they are. Also leaves me more time to do other things, yay. It's getting quite a bit more expensive though even when I mostly buy them from Steam sale or similar.
I enjoyed Planetside 2 longer than an average mmorpg and still looking forward to play it actively once the metagame and few other issues gets solved. Cannot wait for Aliens: Colonial Marines next month, and I might even get Deadspace 3 for the coop, havent played Deadspace before but it sounds nice. Walking Dead waiting on the HD also, waiting for the right mood for it
Good times ahead, maybe in some distant future I can I say the same for some new mmorpg(s).
Edit: *rather "smaller scale games" actually instead "singleplayer games", since these games usually comes with very fun multiplayer to last about the same time as these new generation crap-pile mmorpgs.
Ooh you're obviously very smart. I guess I shouldn't have any opinion on games because I don't program games. Are you serious? There may be cost/technical reasons for something sucking, but it still sucks. The people who made it don't deserve an award for doing their job (getting paid) and then sucking at it.
Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011
But we really haven't gotten to the golden age as we are not at the point where there is is a no more room to improve, or even reached a point where there is very little room for improvement.
LOL .. past is gone. You just can't deal with progress.
WOW is a MMO .. mostly a lobby game now. So is DDO, and many other MMOs. Virtual world is just not that important. You can bitch and moan .. old failed ideas are not coming back.
Virtual world isnt the past, the future is making it better not getting rid of it lol. You cant have a mmorpg without a world. Whats wrong with you? You cant even tell the difference between lobby game, mmo, mmorpg, and single player with mp support games. You try so hard to get people to buy into what you are saying, but your logic is severely flawed. The future is better games not your f2p lobby junk games. Just because you like to bounce around from free game to free game doesnt mean everyone does. We want better for our mmorpgs, even if you dont. Every post you write is always negative towards games 95% of us like here and want to get better, perhaps you should be more open minded.
But without a persistant world you do lose some of the RPG aspect of an MMORPG. I'm not saying that without persistant world you don't have a MMORPG. But more that without a world for players to interact with you limit the RP aspect of RPG and focus more so on making it gamey(?).
I mean without a presistent world you really just have players, soloing or grouping up to play levels, with no other purpose but to get gear and move to the next set of content.
edit: so yes you can have a MMO without a persistent world but an MMORPG is a different beast entirely in the fact that you have to promote the Roleplaying apsect along side the game aspect and persistent worlds are one solution in providing a balance between the two.
+1, according to his logic I suppose Battlefield 3 is a mmorpg.
But then ur original point doesn't stand, does it..?
Why do you constantly meander between the points, instead of taking them head on? Why do you not understand, that people were playing MMORPGs before you knew about them? Why do you constantly post when you have such a very small understanding of business models and the MMORPG genra..?
We understand... You like video games, & want to be entertained, but you've also illustrated (with your post history) you are incapable of understanding a MMORPG. Yet, ironically... you mention MMO all the time, yet you have not displayed that you understand the difference. Always needing to resort to another website for definition. Citing a websdite and understand what your citing are two different things.
You've just said a virtual world is not important... to you. Because your incapable of understanding the difference between a video game... and a MMORPG. You are not a roleplayer... your a kid, who wants entertainment and can only afford the cheapest form possible, because your incessant and constantly play 0~5 free ones all the time. We get it dude.. that you play for entertainment purposes only... you've said so numerous times. We understand that you need games with "hard mode" so you feel better about yourself... we get it dude.
I have read your post history... all the points you've ever made and all the "facts" you state... it's as if... your talking about Battlefield style of gameplay & mechanics. You want cheap free instancing and a non-persistant world... so why are you here on MMORPG forums trolling...? Threadcrapping everywhere telling others how little you know?
So (again) why are you not playing those video games, if that is the gameplay you are looking for and a proponent of..?
Attempting to rebuttal me implies that you understand your at MMORPG.com, not MMO.com... and you need to know the difference before your post history get more embarrasing..!
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
hahahah .. who is close minded when you are holding onto old ideas. In fact, it is open minded to see all the lobby-based games, MMOs, MOBA, and all the variations.
I don't limit myself to virtual world games, not that i won't play one. I do play PS2. But why should every MMO has a virtual world? More variations and more innovation is good for gaming.
This game has been Doing update all the time has a new area just put in. Plus new F2p restrictions removed. You need to get your facts straight before trying to make a points.
All those are wrong assumptions.
First, with a lobby, you can group up with millions of players. In that regard, using LFD in WOW has little difference than Diablo 3 dungeon runs. What is the difference? I click a button, and match with 4 or 5 other players in a pool of millions.
Now what about purpose? In WOW today, or LOTRO, or DDO, isn't the purpose to go through the dungeon/raid and get loot?
And i would also say that you can role-play better in a story dungeon with 5 others than having random people run by you when you are doing solo-questing in the world. In fact, i play WOW and other MMOs (like LOTOR and STO) for years, and the number of times i see any role-playing in the persistent world when question ... ZERO.
cannot speak for other mmos but WOW lobby dungeons - its get the loot and get out mentality -- gogogo
often no one will talk w each other
thats not my idea of player interaction
EQ2 fan sites
Thank you for pointing out where I am wrong. Now with my limited time playing MMORPGs I've seen quite a bit of RPers in the open world but that may because I try to introduce my self to them in an RP way. Now If I may ask how would games without a persistant world handle crafting that is say as in depth as swg where players can be full time crafters and not need to do combat? I think at there is some forms of MMOs that don't need persistant worlds while others still need them.
Sure .. you don't like it .. but millions of playres do this kind of dungeon every day .. must be fun to them. It is fun to me.
What does crafting has to do with persistent world? You can put the same crafting system in a SP player game, and it plays the same.
In fact, Minecraft is the most complex "crafting" game and it is not even a MMO.
Have you ever played swg?
edit: what I'm trying to say is I don't see how a sandbox MMORPG can be done without a persistant world.
Golden age of mmos? You are off about a decade. This is more like the golden showers of mmos because most of them are piss poor.
My YouTube MMO PvP Channel
Sure. But sandbox MMORPGs are not the only MMORPGs, aren't they?
In fact, GW1 is classified as a MMORPG but it has no persistent world. DDO is mostly dungeon adventure and the persistent world may as well not be there.
And you don't need a sandbox to have crafting either. Heck, many non-MMO has crafting (SKYRIM, Diablo 3...). Granted that those are not very deep system, probably because the core audience of those games don't really care.