Isn't the whole concept of DE's a continuation of public quest's in War and the invasion/rift's in Rift.I'm not saying either of those game's does it better,but if you're soloing many of these isn't it defeating the point?
No, the concept is the replacement of static quests ("!") fully with dynamic content that can alter the world to varying degrees based on success/fail of the events. What you do or don't do will reflect what the next person sees. In a game like WoW that uses phasing when you do something it only affects you; the next person along sees the old stuff until he gets to the quests that change the phasing. In GW2, if you let a giant take a town everyone else that comes along sees the town occupied by the giant. They must do something to take the town back.
The thing is that the event's reset (at least in the zone's I've been in) and even though they may try and replace static quest's,they themselve's do a reset which make's them static.I mean they may have an area contested for awhile,they pretty much stay contested or reset once beaten.Nothing in the world has changed once a reset.
I agrre with the WOW only affecting you with phasing,They seem to want a person to feel they're the hero.It doesn't work though,once everyone get's to lvl cap it's hero's everywhere.
Some day I'm going to put a sword through your eye and out the back of your skull!
If GW2 is considered such a success that it spawns a host of clones (in a repeat of the post 2004 mmo landscape), then that is my mmo career officially over. It will be back to single player games for the forseeable future; talking of which has anyone played The Walking Dead- well worth a play through.
I am saying that 3 million sold units for a triple A B2P RPG is nothing special. Many B2P RPGs sold more than that and D3 was just one example, so 3 million is perhaps above average for a triple A title.
Hell even subscriber based RPGs like AoC and SW:TOR sold over a million units, so 3 million for a B2P one is nothing special.
context from wiki -- this is all time sales -- not just sales for 5 months
Didnt Diablo III sell like 9 million copies? I know it isn't an MMORPG but the payment model of the two are similar and both are action RPGs which do not have an offline component.
So for me 3 million copies is nothing special for a triple A RPG. If it was subscription based then yeah but it is not.
That is like saying Ronaldo isn't special because Messi is better.
And of course triple AAA RPGs you have Diablo and erm, Diablo.
Yeah, when you talk about GW2 you have to compare it to the most successful PC Games in history.
One doesn't need to do that when talking about crap.
I am saying that 3 million sold units for a triple A B2P RPG is nothing special. Many B2P RPGs sold more than that and D3 was just one example, so 3 million is perhaps above average for a triple A title.
Hell even subscriber based RPGs like AoC and SW:TOR sold over a million units, so 3 million for a B2P one is nothing special.
Not that many B2P RPGs in the PC, certainly not many PC B2P MMORPGs.
And comparing offline RPGs with MMORPGs isn't apple to apple either.
A MMORPG need to maintain some population to keep selling.
But I guess 4 million won't be special either.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
hmm, so far its sold exactly half as many copies as diablo3 did on the first day xD, Which is a pretty good indicator, leveling alts, item hunting and acheivments in D3 just seems to be far more gratuitous.
Guildwars2 is neither an MMO nor a standalonge RPG resulting in a game that isnt very very good at either. Great if your a person who is deeply conflicted about these gamyplay styles but not me. I rather play either a thorough-bred MMO or a thorough-bred RPG.
The only people in my friends list that still play it are just people determined to prove the game is as good as they convinced themselves it would be during the hype.
The reality is, it was fun for a month but now is the time to accept it will never be the wow-killer, will never live up to the hype and look for something else.
Diablo 3 is bad game that entirely on the strength of it's predessor and blizzard brand name. When was the last time Blizzard posted any stats about the game sales, yeah the intial one.
I would be careful about throwing around accusations like that. You can easily replace D3 with GW2 and Blizzard with ArenaNET and someone could present you with the same argument. No it's best if you just ignore posters that try to drag down a discussion by bringing in things that are not related to the subject at hand. Calling either game bad is a matter of opinion that varies wildly among millions of players.
Completely missed the point. I was stating guild wars 2 sold a million starting 2 months after launch meaning the game continue to sell decent past the intial launch buzz. The same can't be said for Diablo 3 otherwise blizzard would have mentioned it. GW2 also reviewed higher based on critics and general user score. Of course bad game is an opinion but gw2 is generally regard as higher by the majority from the information I have.
It hasn't sold a million copies since 2 months after launch. As of Sept 13th the game had sold 2 million copies (roughly 2 weeks after its official launch date), so in the following 4 months it sold another million. Diablo 3 sold 3.5 million its first day (plus 1.2 million of the annual pass people) and through September 30th had sold 10 million copies according to http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-07-diablo-3-has-over-10-million-subscribers. So the game more than doubled its sales in the following months after release. It looks like Guild Wars 2 will also double its initial launch sales around the end of the summer at this pace, so good on them. It is worth the intial cost, in my opinion. But now I got trapped in the x game has y sales compared to z games sales. Arg.
RIFT had Storm Legions and Storm Legions Infinity edition including base game
I'm expecting GW2 to do something similar
Including the base game and not needing it in order for a standalone to function are two totally different things. No where on the box does it say gw1 is required to play Nightfall when you buy the Nightfall campaign but I sure Storm Legions requires having Rift installed or they wouldn't be including it in the first place.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
Originally posted by niceguy3978 Diablo 3 sold 3.5 million its first day (plus 1.2 million of the annual pass people) and through September 30th had sold 10 million copies according to http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-07-diablo-3-has-over-10-million-subscribers. So the game more than doubled its sales in the following months after release.
it was announced in Blizzards financial report that D3 sold 10 million thru July 30th
Including the base game and not needing it in order for a standalone to function are two totally different things. No where on the box does it say gw1 is required to play Nightfall when you buy the Nightfall campaign but I sure Storm Legions requires having Rift installed or they wouldn't be including it in the first place.
Storm Legions Infinity - does not require RIFT installed
my point regarding GW2 remains
if ANET sells bundles of the expansion (similar to RIFT)
- how do you differentiate the old players from new players?
I doubt ANET is going to list the bundles seperately in their financial reports
I am saying that 3 million sold units for a triple A B2P RPG is nothing special. Many B2P RPGs sold more than that and D3 was just one example, so 3 million is perhaps above average for a triple A title.
Hell even subscriber based RPGs like AoC and SW:TOR sold over a million units, so 3 million for a B2P one is nothing special.
context from wiki -- this is all time sales -- not just sales for 5 months
i could be wrong but i think its realistic that GW2 will sell at least 10 million over a 3 year period
-- if it does, that places GW2 in top 10 PC games of all time for best sellers
This is an important point to make. 3 Million units is the total to date. I think there were around 2 million units sold by the end of September. An additional milion units in the 4th quarter is very solid for ongoing MMO sales.
However, this also provides some important information on the success of the B2P business model. GW2 produced $110US revenue in Q4. Unit Sales directly from Arenanet may provide $60/unit revenue, but with the wholesale prices for units sold through other retailers, the average revenue per unti sold would be less than $60/unit.
The wholesale price is probably closer to $36/unit. It's not unreasonable to guesstimate that the average revenue per unit is somewhere around $45. That would mean ~$65 million in revenue was produced via gem sales. That's pretty healthy revenue. Roughly the equivalent of the revenue produced by a subscription based game with a paying player base of over 1.4 million players! (If all 3 million GW2 accounts were being actively played, that would mean roughly half the revenue per account as a subscription based game, but few AAA MMOs released in recent years can boast of 700,000 active, paying subscribers).
These numbers look even better, relative to the competition, when you consider how many of the AAA P2P titles released in recent years have transitioned to F2P models, in some cases less than a year after the initial release.
GW2 will continue to build the total player base via box sales over time. Among that playerbase, people will come and go as far as active play time goes, but the expanding pool should continue to provide enough active, gem purchasing players to maintain and even grow the revenue stream over time.
People that hate the game is trying a little TOO HARD to make the game look bad.
Oooh 3 million sold for a buy to play isnt good because D3.
Yeah, it isnt even an actual MMORPG, its an ARPG with an IP that sold millions. The only thing different from D3 and D2 is that its 100% online.
The ACTUAL fact is that GW2 is a full fledged MMORPG and the list of MMORPGs that topped 3 million copies sold is VERY SMALL.
World of Warcraft, Guild Wars 1 and Lineage 2
Thats right, SWG did not come close. Ultima Online did not come close. EverQuest 1 or 2 did not come close. Age of Conan did not come close. Dark Age of Camelot did not come close...not even Lineage 1 which can be argued to be the second largest populated MMO in history sold more than 3 million because it went free so long ago.
So, how is it so many former MMORPGs that are held to be "good" or have "done well" did not come CLOSE to 3 million sold, but somehow GW2 does yet is held to a different standard? Simple, haters gonna hate...and they will hate with arguments that dont hold water.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
People that hate the game is trying a little TOO HARD to make the game look bad.
Oooh 3 million sold for a buy to play isnt good because D3.
Yeah, it isnt even an actual MMORPG, its an ARPG with an IP that sold millions. The only thing different from D3 and D2 is that its 100% online.
The ACTUAL fact is that GW2 is a full fledged MMORPG and the list of MMORPGs that topped 3 million copies sold is VERY SMALL.
World of Warcraft, Guild Wars 1 and Lineage 2
Thats right, SWG did not come close. Ultima Online did not come close. EverQuest 1 or 2 did not come close. Age of Conan did not come close. Dark Age of Camelot did not come close...not even Lineage 1 which can be argued to be the second largest populated MMO in history sold more than 3 million because it went free so long ago.
So, how is it so many former MMORPGs that are held to be "good" or have "done well" did not come CLOSE to 3 million sold, but somehow GW2 does yet is held to a different standard? Simple, haters gonna hate...and they will hate with arguments that dont hold water.
People that hate the game is trying a little TOO HARD to make the game look bad.
Oooh 3 million sold for a buy to play isnt good because D3.
Yeah, it isnt even an actual MMORPG, its an ARPG with an IP that sold millions. The only thing different from D3 and D2 is that its 100% online.
The ACTUAL fact is that GW2 is a full fledged MMORPG and the list of MMORPGs that topped 3 million copies sold is VERY SMALL.
World of Warcraft, Guild Wars 1 and Lineage 2
Thats right, SWG did not come close. Ultima Online did not come close. EverQuest 1 or 2 did not come close. Age of Conan did not come close. Dark Age of Camelot did not come close...not even Lineage 1 which can be argued to be the second largest populated MMO in history sold more than 3 million because it went free so long ago.
So, how is it so many former MMORPGs that are held to be "good" or have "done well" did not come CLOSE to 3 million sold, but somehow GW2 does yet is held to a different standard? Simple, haters gonna hate...and they will hate with arguments that dont hold water.
Haters and fanboys ^. Both equally irritating.
Its true, pointing out the argument that 3 million sold is not a lot based on D3 sales makes a person a fanboy. Must be a hater.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
Including the base game and not needing it in order for a standalone to function are two totally different things. No where on the box does it say gw1 is required to play Nightfall when you buy the Nightfall campaign but I sure Storm Legions requires having Rift installed or they wouldn't be including it in the first place.
Storm Legions Infinity - does not require RIFT installed
my point regarding GW2 remains
if ANET sells bundles of the expansion (similar to RIFT)
- how do you differentiate the old players from new players?
I doubt ANET is going to list the bundles seperately in their financial reports
That's because it's included in the package. Here:
Furthermore that's a pretty bold assumption to think that ANet will follow the lead of a mmo that has a sub based revenue model. I for one would think it would be wiser to maximize box sales seeing as they have a totally different way to generate revenue. But that's just me.
That alone is reason enough to believe that there will be separate statistics for its first expansion. Now whether ANet will be willing to share that information as easily as it has about GW2's success is something we will have to see.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
This is an important point to make. 3 Million units is the total to date. I think there were around 2 million units sold by the end of September. An additional milion units in the 4th quarter is very solid for ongoing MMO sales.
However, this also provides some important information on the success of the B2P business model. GW2 produced $110US revenue in Q4. Unit Sales directly from Arenanet may provide $60/unit revenue, but with the wholesale prices for units sold through other retailers, the average revenue per unti sold would be less than $60/unit.
The wholesale price is probably closer to $36/unit. It's not unreasonable to guesstimate that the average revenue per unit is somewhere around $45. That would mean ~$65 million in revenue was produced via gem sales. That's pretty healthy revenue. Roughly the equivalent of the revenue produced by a subscription based game with a paying player base of over 1.4 million players! (If all 3 million GW2 accounts were being actively played, that would mean roughly half the revenue per account as a subscription based game, but few AAA MMOs released in recent years can boast of 700,000 active, paying subscribers).
These numbers look even better, relative to the competition, when you consider how many of the AAA P2P titles released in recent years have transitioned to F2P models, in some cases less than a year after the initial release.
GW2 will continue to build the total player base via box sales over time. Among that playerbase, people will come and go as far as active play time goes, but the expanding pool should continue to provide enough active, gem purchasing players to maintain and even grow the revenue stream over time.
How is anything an indication of success or failure at this point? For an MMO to be successful it must overcome more hurdles than simply selling boxes, that goes for the B2P model point as well. An MMO's success greatly depends on how relevant it remains over a course of years not the first few months.
My major gripe with this form of success calculation is that many MMO's sell well when they release, be it 1-2 million or even 3 it really doesn't mean a game is going to be successful at offering a MMO experience. These are sales based on hype for the most part.
Come back two years from now and such a point will be relevant as well as accurate if things remain on the up for A-net.
Based on word of mouth right now, the retention based aspects of the game are suffering from some series problems. Much like they were in TOR at this point of it's life, the main factor here for success is how they deal with those issues.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Sucess for a game is when it provides value for money for the players and a profit for the developer. GW2 is a success based on this criteria alone. In addition it is hard to see the game not lasting for years considering the pedigree and that fact users can freely drop out and return at any time.
Not to mention the fact that even mediocre mmorgs can last for years.......
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
This is an important point to make. 3 Million units is the total to date. I think there were around 2 million units sold by the end of September. An additional milion units in the 4th quarter is very solid for ongoing MMO sales.
However, this also provides some important information on the success of the B2P business model. GW2 produced $110US revenue in Q4. Unit Sales directly from Arenanet may provide $60/unit revenue, but with the wholesale prices for units sold through other retailers, the average revenue per unti sold would be less than $60/unit.
The wholesale price is probably closer to $36/unit. It's not unreasonable to guesstimate that the average revenue per unit is somewhere around $45. That would mean ~$65 million in revenue was produced via gem sales. That's pretty healthy revenue. Roughly the equivalent of the revenue produced by a subscription based game with a paying player base of over 1.4 million players! (If all 3 million GW2 accounts were being actively played, that would mean roughly half the revenue per account as a subscription based game, but few AAA MMOs released in recent years can boast of 700,000 active, paying subscribers).
These numbers look even better, relative to the competition, when you consider how many of the AAA P2P titles released in recent years have transitioned to F2P models, in some cases less than a year after the initial release.
GW2 will continue to build the total player base via box sales over time. Among that playerbase, people will come and go as far as active play time goes, but the expanding pool should continue to provide enough active, gem purchasing players to maintain and even grow the revenue stream over time.
How is anything an indication of success or failure at this point? For an MMO to be successful it must overcome more hurdles than simply selling boxes, that goes for the B2P model point as well. An MMO's success greatly depends on how relevant it remains over a course of years not the first few months.
My major gripe with this form of success calculation is that many MMO's sell well when they release, be it 1-2 million or even 3 it really doesn't mean a game is going to be successful at offering a MMO experience. These are sales based on hype for the most part.
Come back two years from now and such a point will be relevant as well as accurate if things remain on the up for A-net.
Based on word of mouth right now, the retention based aspects of the game are suffering from some series problems. Much like they were in TOR at this point of it's life, the main factor here for success is how they deal with those issues.
It is quite simple.
GW2 has been out for over 4 months now.
In April 2012, SWTOR was out for 4 months - Layoffs.
Around that time (or even before) Blizzard did some layoffs (most in customer service) to accomodate the loss in subs.
TERA launched in the west in May, layoffs in August.
TSW launched in August, layoffs in September.
Trion "frozen" End of Nations (laying off 19 dudes and moving end of nation developement in house) and then proceeded to lay off 40 people (a third) shortly after launching Storm Legion.
Companies are very swift adjusting to lesser results.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
I am saying that 3 million sold units for a triple A B2P RPG is nothing special. Many B2P RPGs sold more than that and D3 was just one example, so 3 million is perhaps above average for a triple A title.
Hell even subscriber based RPGs like AoC and SW:TOR sold over a million units, so 3 million for a B2P one is nothing special.
context from wiki -- this is all time sales -- not just sales for 5 months
i could be wrong but i think its realistic that GW2 will sell at least 10 million over a 3 year period
-- if it does, that places GW2 in top 10 PC games of all time for best sellers
This is an important point to make. 3 Million units is the total to date. I think there were around 2 million units sold by the end of September. An additional milion units in the 4th quarter is very solid for ongoing MMO sales.
However, this also provides some important information on the success of the B2P business model. GW2 produced $110US revenue in Q4. Unit Sales directly from Arenanet may provide $60/unit revenue, but with the wholesale prices for units sold through other retailers, the average revenue per unti sold would be less than $60/unit.
The wholesale price is probably closer to $36/unit. It's not unreasonable to guesstimate that the average revenue per unit is somewhere around $45. That would mean ~$65 million in revenue was produced via gem sales. That's pretty healthy revenue. Roughly the equivalent of the revenue produced by a subscription based game with a paying player base of over 1.4 million players! (If all 3 million GW2 accounts were being actively played, that would mean roughly half the revenue per account as a subscription based game, but few AAA MMOs released in recent years can boast of 700,000 active, paying subscribers).
These numbers look even better, relative to the competition, when you consider how many of the AAA P2P titles released in recent years have transitioned to F2P models, in some cases less than a year after the initial release.
GW2 will continue to build the total player base via box sales over time. Among that playerbase, people will come and go as far as active play time goes, but the expanding pool should continue to provide enough active, gem purchasing players to maintain and even grow the revenue stream over time.
Guessing this is great news for Ncsoft since Gw2 and Blade & Souls which last heard seemed to be doing well in Korea were they're two main drivers of revenue.
I am saying that 3 million sold units for a triple A B2P RPG is nothing special. Many B2P RPGs sold more than that and D3 was just one example, so 3 million is perhaps above average for a triple A title.
Hell even subscriber based RPGs like AoC and SW:TOR sold over a million units, so 3 million for a B2P one is nothing special.
context from wiki -- this is all time sales -- not just sales for 5 months
i could be wrong but i think its realistic that GW2 will sell at least 10 million over a 3 year period
-- if it does, that places GW2 in top 10 PC games of all time for best sellers
This is an important point to make. 3 Million units is the total to date. I think there were around 2 million units sold by the end of September. An additional milion units in the 4th quarter is very solid for ongoing MMO sales.
However, this also provides some important information on the success of the B2P business model. GW2 produced $110US revenue in Q4. Unit Sales directly from Arenanet may provide $60/unit revenue, but with the wholesale prices for units sold through other retailers, the average revenue per unti sold would be less than $60/unit.
The wholesale price is probably closer to $36/unit. It's not unreasonable to guesstimate that the average revenue per unit is somewhere around $45. That would mean ~$65 million in revenue was produced via gem sales. That's pretty healthy revenue. Roughly the equivalent of the revenue produced by a subscription based game with a paying player base of over 1.4 million players! (If all 3 million GW2 accounts were being actively played, that would mean roughly half the revenue per account as a subscription based game, but few AAA MMOs released in recent years can boast of 700,000 active, paying subscribers).
These numbers look even better, relative to the competition, when you consider how many of the AAA P2P titles released in recent years have transitioned to F2P models, in some cases less than a year after the initial release.
GW2 will continue to build the total player base via box sales over time. Among that playerbase, people will come and go as far as active play time goes, but the expanding pool should continue to provide enough active, gem purchasing players to maintain and even grow the revenue stream over time.
Guessing this is great news for Ncsoft since Gw2 and Blade & Souls which last heard seemed to be doing well in Korea were they're two main drivers of revenue.
Didn't the game have around $45-$46 mill in revenues at the end of 3rd quarter 2012?At that point there were 2 mill plus box sales.End of 3rd quarter was Sept 30 and 2 mill was announced as sold on Sept 13th.
Not saying they did bad,but $48 of $60 would be probably $18 plus dollar's over what companies actually get.Pretty sure I saw the game on sale online for $40 over the holidays,it was a short sale but still.I don't see a store taking an $8 loss even for a day or 2.
$48 a box just doesn't come close to the financial's I read.
Some day I'm going to put a sword through your eye and out the back of your skull!
Every time I try and get into this game (3 times or so now), I quit after leveling to around level 25. GW2 is incredibly shallow and will never be able to hold my attention for more than a week.
How is anything an indication of success or failure at this point? For an MMO to be successful it must overcome more hurdles than simply selling boxes, that goes for the B2P model point as well. An MMO's success greatly depends on how relevant it remains over a course of years not the first few months.
My major gripe with this form of success calculation is that many MMO's sell well when they release, be it 1-2 million or even 3 it really doesn't mean a game is going to be successful at offering a MMO experience. These are sales based on hype for the most part.
Come back two years from now and such a point will be relevant as well as accurate if things remain on the up for A-net.
Based on word of mouth right now, the retention based aspects of the game are suffering from some series problems. Much like they were in TOR at this point of it's life, the main factor here for success is how they deal with those issues.
It is quite simple.
GW2 has been out for over 4 months now.
In April 2012, SWTOR was out for 4 months - Layoffs.
Around that time (or even before) Blizzard did some layoffs (most in customer service) to accomodate the loss in subs.
TERA launched in the west in May, layoffs in August.
TSW launched in August, layoffs in September.
Trion "frozen" End of Nations (laying off 19 dudes and moving end of nation developement in house) and then proceeded to lay off 40 people (a third) shortly after launching Storm Legion.
Companies are very swift adjusting to lesser results.
All this says is that those other games didn't perform to expectations in terms of subs, for which ever reason pertaining to the individual game. It's no secret that expectations for GW2's release have been met. They passed hurdle one with that. Now they have to clear several more, like I said before, those can not be passed in mere months.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Originally posted by evilastro No matter what anyone says or who recognized GW2 as a good game, trolls are going to troll. I'm sorry that the game is so successful and has so many supporters, it must really kill you inside.
Does this game really have more supporters than SWTOR?
My server is a ghost town. Granted SWTOR has 20 servers, and GW2 has 10, Whenever I log onto SWTOR I see other people, in GW2 I could really use a Duke Nukem mirror, so at least I could see myself.
Really? SWTOR has 20 and GW2 10??
SWTOR has 20, yeah. (reduced from 250 last year).
And GW2 servers are ghost towns. It's fine if you want to defend GW2 .. blame it on people in dungeons .. blame it on how everyone is so spread out in the "vast" world. GW2 is about as populated as SWTOR, from what it seems. Go a long time without anyone, then see someone 10-30 minutes later.
According to XFire metrics SWTOR has less than half the players.
/facepalm
So the person I quote can talk about xfire but then I cant use xfire to respond to him?
Let me guess.
XFire can be used to:
-> Show that GW2 numbers droped from launch.
XFire can't be used to:
-> say it is #5 game in XFire behind LoL, COD4 & COD2 and WoW.
-> point that the launch numbers from where GW2 drop were even higher than WoW:MOP launch numbers.
-> point that GW2 has a population in XFire of around 2/3 of XFire WoW population.
-> point that SWTOR has less than half GW2 population on XFire.
Do you need an explanation for why what you through sarcasm consider to be ridiculous very may well be the actual case?
Dunno. Black Ops 2 sold 11M copies in one week. GW2 sold what, 3M in 5 months? Easy to see which of those two games was the successfull one.
And before someone says "but Black Ops 2 isn't neither a mmo nor a RPG" - GW2 wasn't even neither the best mmo nor the best RPG of 2012, as the most reputable sites (mmorpg and IGN) have shown and confirmed through their users and expert critics respectively.
No it just won PC game of the year on IGN... I don't like IGN much but I think that's pretty important lol
Who voted in the IGN poll?
Or any Game of the year poll?
Ahh .. those people who would vote, and felt stronfly about a game.
Lets consider other sources... but also, only those those inclined to vote at IGN will contribute.
See the similarity ??
GW2 is a non-#1 award as far as I'm concerned. It might be #1 to you .. but the metrics are off. Works both ways.
It was #1 on a ton of websites, most notably MMO sites. The metrics aren't off, just your bias.
Also, um.. the staff voted it PC game of the year. I don't know who you thought it was.
Ever since Massively gave SWTOR a "Game of the Year" award, people have reason to misstrust all official reviews for any MMORPG.
Comments
The thing is that the event's reset (at least in the zone's I've been in) and even though they may try and replace static quest's,they themselve's do a reset which make's them static.I mean they may have an area contested for awhile,they pretty much stay contested or reset once beaten.Nothing in the world has changed once a reset.
I agrre with the WOW only affecting you with phasing,They seem to want a person to feel they're the hero.It doesn't work though,once everyone get's to lvl cap it's hero's everywhere.
Some day I'm going to put a sword through your eye and out the back of your skull!
Arya Stark
context from wiki -- this is all time sales -- not just sales for 5 months
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_PC_video_games
GW2 is still coming to China
http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/08/30/guild-wars-2-is-heading-to-china/
i could be wrong but i think its realistic that GW2 will sell at least 10 million over a 3 year period
-- if it does, that places GW2 in top 10 PC games of all time for best sellers
EQ2 fan sites
Not that many B2P RPGs in the PC, certainly not many PC B2P MMORPGs.
And comparing offline RPGs with MMORPGs isn't apple to apple either.
A MMORPG need to maintain some population to keep selling.
But I guess 4 million won't be special either.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
It hasn't sold a million copies since 2 months after launch. As of Sept 13th the game had sold 2 million copies (roughly 2 weeks after its official launch date), so in the following 4 months it sold another million. Diablo 3 sold 3.5 million its first day (plus 1.2 million of the annual pass people) and through September 30th had sold 10 million copies according to http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-11-07-diablo-3-has-over-10-million-subscribers. So the game more than doubled its sales in the following months after release. It looks like Guild Wars 2 will also double its initial launch sales around the end of the summer at this pace, so good on them. It is worth the intial cost, in my opinion. But now I got trapped in the x game has y sales compared to z games sales. Arg.
Including the base game and not needing it in order for a standalone to function are two totally different things. No where on the box does it say gw1 is required to play Nightfall when you buy the Nightfall campaign but I sure Storm Legions requires having Rift installed or they wouldn't be including it in the first place.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
it was announced in Blizzards financial report that D3 sold 10 million thru July 30th
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-08-03-activision-diablo-3-has-over-10-million-players
i have no idea what D3 has sold beyond July
EQ2 fan sites
Storm Legions Infinity - does not require RIFT installed
my point regarding GW2 remains
if ANET sells bundles of the expansion (similar to RIFT)
- how do you differentiate the old players from new players?
I doubt ANET is going to list the bundles seperately in their financial reports
EQ2 fan sites
This is an important point to make. 3 Million units is the total to date. I think there were around 2 million units sold by the end of September. An additional milion units in the 4th quarter is very solid for ongoing MMO sales.
However, this also provides some important information on the success of the B2P business model. GW2 produced $110US revenue in Q4. Unit Sales directly from Arenanet may provide $60/unit revenue, but with the wholesale prices for units sold through other retailers, the average revenue per unti sold would be less than $60/unit.
The wholesale price is probably closer to $36/unit. It's not unreasonable to guesstimate that the average revenue per unit is somewhere around $45. That would mean ~$65 million in revenue was produced via gem sales. That's pretty healthy revenue. Roughly the equivalent of the revenue produced by a subscription based game with a paying player base of over 1.4 million players! (If all 3 million GW2 accounts were being actively played, that would mean roughly half the revenue per account as a subscription based game, but few AAA MMOs released in recent years can boast of 700,000 active, paying subscribers).
These numbers look even better, relative to the competition, when you consider how many of the AAA P2P titles released in recent years have transitioned to F2P models, in some cases less than a year after the initial release.
GW2 will continue to build the total player base via box sales over time. Among that playerbase, people will come and go as far as active play time goes, but the expanding pool should continue to provide enough active, gem purchasing players to maintain and even grow the revenue stream over time.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
This entire thread is becoming redonkulous.
People that hate the game is trying a little TOO HARD to make the game look bad.
Oooh 3 million sold for a buy to play isnt good because D3.
Yeah, it isnt even an actual MMORPG, its an ARPG with an IP that sold millions. The only thing different from D3 and D2 is that its 100% online.
The ACTUAL fact is that GW2 is a full fledged MMORPG and the list of MMORPGs that topped 3 million copies sold is VERY SMALL.
World of Warcraft, Guild Wars 1 and Lineage 2
Thats right, SWG did not come close. Ultima Online did not come close. EverQuest 1 or 2 did not come close. Age of Conan did not come close. Dark Age of Camelot did not come close...not even Lineage 1 which can be argued to be the second largest populated MMO in history sold more than 3 million because it went free so long ago.
So, how is it so many former MMORPGs that are held to be "good" or have "done well" did not come CLOSE to 3 million sold, but somehow GW2 does yet is held to a different standard? Simple, haters gonna hate...and they will hate with arguments that dont hold water.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
Haters and fanboys ^. Both equally irritating.
Its true, pointing out the argument that 3 million sold is not a lot based on D3 sales makes a person a fanboy. Must be a hater.
I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson
an analyst firm claimed ANET is making $48 a copy
http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/guild0-wars-2-thanksgiving-in-tyria/
NCSoft will receive $48 out of every $59.99 copy of GW2 sold
EQ2 fan sites
That's because it's included in the package. Here:
http://www.gamersgate.com/DD-RIFTSLIE/rift-storm-legion-infinity-edition
Furthermore that's a pretty bold assumption to think that ANet will follow the lead of a mmo that has a sub based revenue model. I for one would think it would be wiser to maximize box sales seeing as they have a totally different way to generate revenue. But that's just me.
That alone is reason enough to believe that there will be separate statistics for its first expansion. Now whether ANet will be willing to share that information as easily as it has about GW2's success is something we will have to see.
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
How is anything an indication of success or failure at this point? For an MMO to be successful it must overcome more hurdles than simply selling boxes, that goes for the B2P model point as well. An MMO's success greatly depends on how relevant it remains over a course of years not the first few months.
My major gripe with this form of success calculation is that many MMO's sell well when they release, be it 1-2 million or even 3 it really doesn't mean a game is going to be successful at offering a MMO experience. These are sales based on hype for the most part.
Come back two years from now and such a point will be relevant as well as accurate if things remain on the up for A-net.
Based on word of mouth right now, the retention based aspects of the game are suffering from some series problems. Much like they were in TOR at this point of it's life, the main factor here for success is how they deal with those issues.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Sucess for a game is when it provides value for money for the players and a profit for the developer. GW2 is a success based on this criteria alone. In addition it is hard to see the game not lasting for years considering the pedigree and that fact users can freely drop out and return at any time.
Not to mention the fact that even mediocre mmorgs can last for years.......
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
It is quite simple.
GW2 has been out for over 4 months now.
In April 2012, SWTOR was out for 4 months - Layoffs.
Around that time (or even before) Blizzard did some layoffs (most in customer service) to accomodate the loss in subs.
TERA launched in the west in May, layoffs in August.
TSW launched in August, layoffs in September.
Trion "frozen" End of Nations (laying off 19 dudes and moving end of nation developement in house) and then proceeded to lay off 40 people (a third) shortly after launching Storm Legion.
Companies are very swift adjusting to lesser results.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
NcSoft get $48 dollars out of the $60.
http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/guild0-wars-2-thanksgiving-in-tyria/
Guessing this is great news for Ncsoft since Gw2 and Blade & Souls which last heard seemed to be doing well in Korea were they're two main drivers of revenue.
Didn't the game have around $45-$46 mill in revenues at the end of 3rd quarter 2012?At that point there were 2 mill plus box sales.End of 3rd quarter was Sept 30 and 2 mill was announced as sold on Sept 13th.
Not saying they did bad,but $48 of $60 would be probably $18 plus dollar's over what companies actually get.Pretty sure I saw the game on sale online for $40 over the holidays,it was a short sale but still.I don't see a store taking an $8 loss even for a day or 2.
$48 a box just doesn't come close to the financial's I read.
Some day I'm going to put a sword through your eye and out the back of your skull!
Arya Stark
Proud MMORPG.com member since March 2004! Make PvE GREAT Again!
All this says is that those other games didn't perform to expectations in terms of subs, for which ever reason pertaining to the individual game. It's no secret that expectations for GW2's release have been met. They passed hurdle one with that. Now they have to clear several more, like I said before, those can not be passed in mere months.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Do you need an explanation for why what you through sarcasm consider to be ridiculous very may well be the actual case?
Ever since Massively gave SWTOR a "Game of the Year" award, people have reason to misstrust all official reviews for any MMORPG.