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[Editorial] Star Wars: The Old Republic: Give BioWare a Break

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  • IstavaanIstavaan CorkPosts: 1,350Member
    so we have f2p, p2p p2w,b2p.. does this create a new acronym. p2g?
  • TalonsinTalonsin Posts: 1,468Member Uncommon

    With all the things they could do to improve the game, I dont think adding man-on-man love is in the top 50% of gameplay improvements needed.  I seriously wonder about the person or persons actually making the decisions.  I can honestly imagine somewhere in an EA boardroom this taking place...  "Hey guys, gay players account for almost 10% of our base.  Lets milk them and add gay romance options in a pay-only place.  We can add full breast shots in the following expansion and start milking the nerdy teenager playerbase we have next!  We believe this will increase sales of the expansion by almost 6%!"

     

     

     

  • reploidxreploidx Pittsburgh, PAPosts: 320Member
    I see what they are doing with the whole thing. Start in one area, see how it goes and go from there. It seems like the planet only gayness is just a knee jerk reaction and adding more fuel to the "let's hate on TOR" fire. I don't like the game that much, so i don't play it and i don't follow up on it. But from someone who can see the whole picture, it seems BIOWARE will have to do voice acting with everyone's NPCs and PCs just to add all that same gender stuff. Only the haters will be championing this outright and not looking at what kind of logistics are needed to put all aspects of the SGR into the game.
  • DistopiaDistopia Baltimore, MDPosts: 16,904Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by baphamet

    it just gives another thing for people to cry about. no matter what they do people will complain unless it involves them giving the people a completely free game and even then i bet people would complain.

    i understand people have legitimate gripes with this game but people complain and over-exaggerate so much about this game, it doesn't even matter anymore.

    its the boy who cried wolf and i don't listen anymore.

    I have to agree with this completely, as well as with the original article. The "pay to gay" thing had me rolling my eyes as soon as I first saw it. A team can only cram so much into one expansion, and typically a team doesn't attempt to overhaul an entire MMO worth of content during the course of an expansion development period. Nor are they normally expected to.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

    It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  • BadOrbBadOrb ManchesterPosts: 791Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by floreairfoot

    I guess being gay is not "family friendly"?

     

    According to a few of you.

     
     

    The funny thing is SWTOR is not a family friendly game it has a 16+ cert here in the UK. If anyone had played either a sith warrior or an IMP agent they would see this too , amoungst other classes. The sith warrior can have sex with someone and opt to have their companion Vette watch. Also the IMP agent gets tortured and it is quite disturbing. So no it ain't family friendly and people who say it is haven't even played many if any character classes all the way through.

    So I don't think a few flirt options from NPC's be they same sex or SGR should annoy anyone at all. You can opt not to chose the flirt reply in the convos. As for people thinking that now they have to pay for the privalidge to have SGR then well it's only $10 and you get a level cap increase , new planet and a few other things. I'm quite amazed that all this has caused such a mass wave of media attention do we not live in the year 2013 or is this 1953 ?

    As to giving them a break , we'll yeah I agree really they listened to me and a couple of other people the other month. We protested about possibly having to pay to unlock characters that where merged onto a single server. So they didin't charge us. I can play all my 16 chracters for free still. They listened to the complaints about not having  LFG. They are quite secretive but that is only because of the uproar about a patch being a aweek late and taking out RWZ's at the last min. So again I don't blame them. PC gamers ( IMO ) on forums are a real bunch of crying , hating , abusive little brats , I only witnessed this on MMO forums though , not sure about other styles of games. I thought console forum users where bad , how I was wrong.

    Also I have never heard the term Pay 2 Gay and I'm glad I haven't. There is so much hate for BW and EA on this forum itself that two of my recent posts where thought to be negative about SWTOR and DIsney when in fact they weren't . What does that tell you ? It is presummed that a person gears their posts against EA , BW , SWTOR and/or Disney , it's a sad state of affairs.

    Try the game yourself if you haven't make up your own mind about it and don't act like sheep for gods sake. It's $4.99 for 4 action bars , 6 character slots and you can play the whole game all the way through , that's a bargain.

    End of long post.

    Cheers,

    BadOrb. 

    PSO 4 years , EQOA 4 months , PSU 7 years , SWTOR launch ongoing , PSO2 SEA launch ongoing , Destiny 360 launch ongoing.
    "SWG was not fun. Let it go buddy." quote from iiNoSkillzii 10/18/13
    The original propoganda pixie dust villain :[]

  • OnomasOnomas Rock Hill, SCPosts: 1,128Member Uncommon
    Should never mix real world topics with games. We play games to escape real world issues and to have fun. Does it really matter if your boy toon can hold hands with another boy toon? Lot of people don't even make their character the same sex that they are.
    Just improve the game stop wasting time on trivial things.
  • TrunksZTrunksZ PanamaPosts: 263Member
    Originally posted by Aeonblades

    Glitches, falling through objects, black screen at character select half the time (still) unbelievable lag if more than 10ish people are on the screen, horrendously slow combat/button recognition just to name a few. Don't use WoW as a reference, it's a game from 2006 which they have pulled most of their developers off of for another project. I don't play WoW anymore for the same reasons SWTOR is going down the drain, lack of credible development of features people actually want and not fluff filler content.

    Not to mention WoW hasn't had truly challenging content since TBC. I'm not trying to be negative against Bioware or SWTOR, but a fan boy can only be a fan boy so long before he gets fed up with it.

    Leaving WoW aside, Neither my brother and I have experience any of those bugs, the most annoying bug I have experienced so far is the casual stuck between a rock and that Kira's lightsaber doesn't goes off when she puts it away, I am going to assume you have a gaming rig, but I can tell you that I don't experience any lag if more than 10 people in my screen, I think you are just simply bored of the game and I understand that, game gets old, but every game does.

  • MMOGamer71MMOGamer71 Pittsburgh, PAPosts: 1,930Member Common
    Originally posted by Talonsin

    With all the things they could do to improve the game, I dont think adding man-on-man love is in the top 50% of gameplay improvements needed.  I seriously wonder about the person or persons actually making the decisions.  I can honestly imagine somewhere in an EA boardroom this taking place...  "Hey guys, gay players account for almost 10% of our base.  Lets milk them and add gay romance options in a pay-only place.  We can add full breast shots in the following expansion and start milking the nerdy teenager playerbase we have next!  We believe this will increase sales of the expansion by almost 6%!"

     

     

     

    ^

    This. almost an impossible to imagine business decision made to pander to the "minority" of your playerbase. 

     

    Executive #1:  "Lets talk about adding new races to the Cartel Market to increase the playerbase by an estimated 15%"

    Executive #2:  "Nah, lets talking about adding a gay planet that decreases our playerbase by 10%"

  • ThorkuneThorkune Eastern, KYPosts: 1,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Onomas
    Should never mix real world topics with games. We play games to escape real world issues and to have fun.

    My thoughts exactly, unless the game is based on real world. SWTOR is obviously not based on real world topics.

  • VannorVannor YorkshirePosts: 2,969Member Uncommon

    All bioware needed to do was not list the gay interactions as a feature. Would have saved a lot of trouble. They could still have included it and it would have been an interesting surprise like is was in Dragon Age when Zevran comes onto a male character.

    Listing it as a featue though.. like it's something special? Too thought provoking. It was bound to draw attention.. maybe that's what they wanted anyway?

    You don't see adverts for any of their other games showing they have possible same sex interactions in the game even though they do.

  • ObiClownobiObiClownobi CoruscantPosts: 186Member
    I slept with a Twilek, is that better or worse than an SGR?

    image
    "It's a sandbox, if you are not willing to create a castle then all you have is sand" - jtcgs

  • EyesgoodEyesgood Richmond, VAPosts: 49Member Uncommon
    THIS!!!!!!!!!  That kind of junk has no place in an MMO, much less being PROMOTED by the game.  
  • OzmodanOzmodan Hilliard, OHPosts: 7,183Member Uncommon
    If they were going to implement such, they just should have made it game wide.  Kind of ridiculous making it for one planet if you ask me.  Bioware has so besmudged their past reputation the only thing I can say is they had a huge brainfart when they sold out to EA.  Everything EA touches turns to lead.
  • AeonbladesAeonblades Home, GAPosts: 2,083Member
    Originally posted by TrunksZ

    Leaving WoW aside, Neither my brother and I have experience any of those bugs, the most annoying bug I have experienced so far is the casual stuck between a rock and that Kira's lightsaber doesn't goes off when she puts it away, I am going to assume you have a gaming rig, but I can tell you that I don't experience any lag if more than 10 people in my screen, I think you are just simply bored of the game and I understand that, game gets old, but every game does.

    I too, used to act like this. One too many failures will change someone. I'm sure your threshold will eventually be reached. I do have a gaming rig, and I call shenanigans on anyone who has not had issues with this game since day 1. I have yet to meet someone in game, or IRL (several of my friends played/play still) that didn't have problems with the way the game ran. Why can I run Rift on max settings (sans shadows) with no problems in a zone event with 50 people around? Meanwhile, SWTOR is a slideshow if there were that many people on screen. I mean, the game doesn't even look that great on max settings yet I have to run it on low-medium just to get it playable in a lot of areas.

    You are right about one thing however, I am bored of the game, but with a lot of other games (see my sig, I still play EQ1) they actually release content and keep me interested. There is not even hardly an effort here.

    Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
    Have played: You name it
    If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  • rojoArcueidrojoArcueid hell, NJPosts: 6,766Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kaynos1972
    What does sexual orientation has to do with a game anyway ?  Can you keep that kind of stuff outside of gaming.

    If the game has romance options (Bioware RPGs are well known for it), i dont see why there cant be different sexual orientations for different characters (like mass effect, which is also Bioware). Some people will like it, some people wont like it, some people just wont care, but the option is there which is fine. What they should keep out of the game is any content that resemble a fantasy mmo, or even sci-fi outside of star wars universe (starting with the level 1 fantasy axe lol).

    image
  • Crusix221Crusix221 Richmond, VAPosts: 100Member

    1. As a whole society shouldn't be using video games as an outlet for their romantic life. If its to tell a story fine, but its pretty sad when its simply "for the sake of being able to". As someone above stated, it should NOT be a feature, if its just part of the game then fine but it shouldn't be a selling point.

    2. I see no issue with there being a limited number of SGR because in fact (for our population as whole) there are a limited number of those relationships. I have no problem with SGR or that they are in games but I don't see why people have to scream and complain that something a minorty of people want is not in the majority of the game.

  • RyukanRyukan Mason, MIPosts: 706Member Uncommon
    The only problem I have with same gender romance in SWTOR is that is it content with a limited appeal and seems like a complete waste of time, resources and effort when there is so much more they need to focus on. The game still has the same crappy "grow at your feet" draw distance for foilage that it had day one...among other things.
  • NorseGodNorseGod Behind Enemy Lines, FLPosts: 856Member
    Originally posted by SBFord

    @BigSmiff:

    While I totally see what you're saying, BioWare has a long history with being progressive advocates of SGRs from the days of Dragon Age and Mass Effect even though these are not the same folks who created those games. If you ask me, they are remaining true to their corporate ideal in this case.

    I can agree with that.

    What is your opinion about the way they implemented SGRAs into the expansion? People are upset that this took priority over more important issues. The fact that the 8-10 LGBT subscribers started a letter writing campaign from EAs' own website to GLAAD, who strongarmed EA into putting this in? This is the second time this has happened and people have noticed.

    Is it fair to these people that have no activist group to fight for what they want added into the game? Maybe this is where the frustration lies.

    It seems to be a concern that a company would be so easily willing to bend when a small minority makes noise. Where does it end? How many features will be pushed back because EA have to meet the demands of a small few? What does this mean for the game and community?

    Sorry for all the questions. :D

    Censorship is intended to create an illusion that one side of the debate is correct and unopposed. Silence is not consent.

  • Bastian_StarBastian_Star KANSAS CITY, MOPosts: 36Member
    Originally posted by Crusix221

    1. As a whole society shouldn't be using video games as an outlet for their romantic life. If its to tell a story fine, but its pretty sad when its simply "for the sake of being able to". As someone above stated, it should NOT be a feature, if its just part of the game then fine but it shouldn't be a selling point.

    2. I see no issue with there being a limited number of SGR because in fact (for our population as whole) there are a limited number of those relationships. I have no problem with SGR or that they are in games but I don't see why people have to scream and complain that something a minorty of people want is not in the majority of the game.

    welcome to the interwebz,,,where people come to whine, bitch and moan about EVERYTHING image

  • TsumoroTsumoro EozeaPosts: 408Member Uncommon

    Myself personally I will fight fierecly for everyone to be entitled to love and be intimate with anyone they want to love be it man with woman, woman with woman, man on man, a combination of those elements, heck as long as its vocally consenting, sheep. But, this is a game which sadly the character, your avatar doesn't really have a personal experience to it. I don't really feel like the character is 'mine' so to speak as I am following a story arch.

    To me its like playing a single player to which the character gets the woman, Think Capcoms Onimusha 2 when you have the ability to get the girl in the end. It was kinda relevant to your characters story and his sexuality. In SWTOR, the same kinda applies, the fact the romances were designed as such indicates to me they meant for the main character to be straight and this same sex romance is an after-thought, to be added in to pander to the forum-bashing arm chair keyboard bandits.

    Let's face it, this is not about equality, something that should be a given right without the need for thought, or after thought etc. The fact this is being added in, later tells me its about placated gay individuals who are outraged their character can't romance other men. I feel for them, I really do, for there aren't many games out there that have a 'gay' central lead.

    But the forcing of the issue isnt equality, its about special treatment. In honest, I think Bioware messed up big time. This isn't a mature game, so deep philosophical issues such as sexuality aren't going to be well receieved when fundermentalists within faith and right wing politics start placing ads and news interviews 'BIOWARE WANTS YOUR CHILDREN TO BE GAY!' and the other bat-shit crazy stuff they sprout.

    Heck! I remember the outrage they went on about when Mass Effect came out and the romance with Liara showed the cleft of her butt. Which is no more nudity, in fact, it is equal measure to the amount of nudity from Julia Roberts in Nottinghill.

    So I think Bioware messed up because they were concerned about the title not being an 'M' rating, where such issues can be discussed maturely and was worried that the religious and political backlash would impact their game. The trouble they are having now, about implementing these same sex romances into the game is evidence that they have never intended for them to be there in the first instance.

    So, I would say Bioware need to either stick to their artistic vision of the game, and some people on the forums need to grow up a bit and perhaps look for their ideal same sex partner outside of SWTOR.

    Or Bioware needs to add same-sex to the game for all to benefit from at the outset, and not in DLC based content, which is what is taking place right now.

    Myself personally, I tend to play all sexes and pursue all romances, man and woman. I am a straight man, but I like good dialog and character interaction. Although, MMO's tend to make me tink twice as soon as I pick a female character I tend to be whispered a lot asking to 'cyber' and things although not come across this issue too much in SWTOR.

    I should remark, that I don't feel at all strongly about this, same sex relationships in the game wont affect me at all. To be honest, nor do the straight romances affect me. This is like what I said above, I am playing a character with a story pre-established. I am not really interacting the with the world with my own set of ideals and morales. The dialog options all lead to the same place at the end of the day. There is no development beyond that, its just like an interactive movie and your leveling progressing pretty much just tells you how long through the video you are.

  • Cod_EyeCod_Eye jarrowPosts: 1,016Member
    Sounds like the OP is on their payroll.
  • SenadinaSenadina San Diego, CAPosts: 896Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Kaynos1972
    What does sexual orientation has to do with a game anyway ?  Can you keep that kind of stuff outside of gaming.

     Since you can romance your NPCs in SWTOR, it's already IN gaming. The entitled majority never see the problem because it's no problem for them.

    image
  • erictlewiserictlewis Cottondale, ALPosts: 3,026Member Uncommon

    To me it really is not about sga stuff,  really it should not be in game at all. 

    The real problem was they went about hearing s small vocal minority and wasted time putting this into game when they got so many other big things that need to be fixed.  

    In other words the sga stuff was a waste of resources. 

     

  • RazeeksterRazeekster Solon, MEPosts: 2,201Member Uncommon

    My problem isn't with Bioware, it's with many of it's players who are saying being gay friendly makes the game non-family oriented. Since when did the gender that someone loves make a game "unfriendly" for families. I guess there are still a lot of bigots out there that don't know how to teach their children that all love, no matter what kind it is, is still love.

     

    Also since when was same gender marriage for the real word only? You really think that in the world of Star Wars, which is set thousands and thousands of years in the future... You really think that they haven't evolved by then to allow same sex gender options, such as marriage? If this is how people think they are in for a rude awakening as more states approve same sex gender marriage in the real world.

     

    Not only that but those who are saying it's a waste of resources really tick me off. I'd like to see them scrap anything romantic involving straight sex options and then see if players think that those are a "waste of resources." I mean really, the gall of some of the statements I see just make me really sad for people in this world.

     
     
     

    Smile

  • TribeofOneTribeofOne Wellford, SCPosts: 1,006Member Uncommon
    Unless they are FORCING you to CHOOSE the SGR dialogues, then I see no issues with this. If you are against SGR's then dont choose it.
    homosexuality is here to stay people. you cant cure it, you cant pray it away and you cant censor it out of existence. As long as its handled in a mature, sensitive way, I say more power to Bioware/EA
This discussion has been closed.