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What makes Pathfinder Online Different

13

Comments

  • itchmonitchmon west islip, NYPosts: 1,714Member Uncommon
    Sounds like eve and d&d ed 3.75 have a baby.

    And for my tastes a very awesome baby.

    Gonna crowdfund this for 25 or 30 right now!

    RIP Ribbitribbitt you are missed, kid.

    Currently Playing EVE, DFUW

    Every gun that is made, every warship launched, every rocket fired signifies, in the final sense, a theft from those who hunger and are not fed, those who are cold and not clothed.

    Dwight D Eisenhower

    My optimism wears heavy boots and is loud.

    Henry Rollins

  • xmentyxmenty SingaporePosts: 679Member

    I seriously hate these people who donate to the 1 million kickstarter.

    They get caught up by the Pathfinder fanboys that hype up the game to push their agenda so that they can hit kickstarter 1 mill.

     

    Seriously don't give them the money guys.

    Tell them to come back do a kickstarter again when they are at 70% completion.

    Show us some quality gameplay then we support them.

    They already got the Kickstarter Demo money and the investor money, they don't really need the 1 million now. 

    FFS the game not even 10% complete and they already going for kickstarter asking for a million.

    Gamers should learn to stop being easily emotional blackmail by all the sweet talks.

     

    Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language :)

  • BlackUhuruBlackUhuru Of Angels, CAPosts: 770Member
    Did you see all the swag you get for your pledge? It's worth more then the pledge itself!

    I say money well spent !!!

    "It would be awesome if you could duel your companion. Then you could solo pvp".--Thanes

  • ignore_meignore_me Apple Valley, CAPosts: 1,987Member
    Originally posted by adam_nox
    I hate offline skill training.  It's just a way for devs to string players along for months rather than let them progress at their own pace.  I'm all for some limits on progression, but if it's as slow as eve where it can take several months to get to max potential, then this game can suck it.

    Because maxing out in a month is great.

    Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  • tom_goretom_gore TamperePosts: 1,796Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by BlackUhuru
    Did you see all the swag you get for your pledge? It's worth more then the pledge itself!

    I say money well spent !!!

    Well that is of course assuming the game will ever launch :)

     

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by xmenty

    They already got the Kickstarter Demo money and the investor money, they don't really need the 1 million now. 

    Gamers should learn to stop being easily emotional blackmail by all the sweet talks.

    -snipping- the toxic comments (see: on fandom and toxic environments )

    The Budget for releasing Pathfinder Online is well South of 10m$, compare that to the 100m$ budgets: I don't they they are being greedy. I think if VC investment climate had been better they might have got more out of that for a larger dev team (20ppl). But that said, KS is a great platform for rasing cash from potential segment of market you are targetting, gaining marketing and early buy-in which boosts confidence there is a market. All good things.

    The ultimate analysis is to see if KS part-funded or otherwise mmorpgs are successful for the people that play and pay them: We find this out in next few years: So imo it's too early to say either way: Wait and see.

    Current KS is to increase headcount from 11-20 which speeds up dev and positve cash flow. Think it's a great plan and does lower risk not having a massive budget which would compromise the design vision.

    To explain my support: There's not much else that really interests or looks like a longevity mmorpg, except EVE which intend to get going in a few months, circumstances dependent.

     

  • GwapoJoshGwapoJosh Auburn, INPosts: 989Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by xmenty

    I seriously hate these people who donate to the 1 million kickstarter.

    They get caught up by the Pathfinder fanboys that hype up the game to push their agenda so that they can hit kickstarter 1 mill.

     

    Seriously don't give them the money guys.

    Tell them to come back do a kickstarter again when they are at 70% completion.

    Show us some quality gameplay then we support them.

    They already got the Kickstarter Demo money and the investor money, they don't really need the 1 million now. 

    FFS the game not even 10% complete and they already going for kickstarter asking for a million.

    Gamers should learn to stop being easily emotional blackmail by all the sweet talks.

     

    How is it a "Kickstarter" if they do it when the game is already 70% complete?  *confused*

    "You are all going to poop yourselves." BillMurphy
    image

  • BlueMountainBlueMountain Philadelphia, PAPosts: 147Member
    Originally posted by GwapoJosh
    Originally posted by xmenty

    I seriously hate these people who donate to the 1 million kickstarter.

    They get caught up by the Pathfinder fanboys that hype up the game to push their agenda so that they can hit kickstarter 1 mill.

     

    Seriously don't give them the money guys.

    Tell them to come back do a kickstarter again when they are at 70% completion.

    Show us some quality gameplay then we support them.

    They already got the Kickstarter Demo money and the investor money, they don't really need the 1 million now. 

    FFS the game not even 10% complete and they already going for kickstarter asking for a million.

    Gamers should learn to stop being easily emotional blackmail by all the sweet talks.

     

    How is it a "Kickstarter" if they do it when the game is already 70% complete?  *confused*

    Not sure where you got the impression that the game is 70% complete. They only just selected the client middleware.

    ~edit~ Oh! Sorry: took your point out of context.

    To dream, perhaps to be.

  • NicolauNicolau Harwich, MAPosts: 16Member
    Originally posted by WonderweissM
    I seriously doubt it will reach 1mil in 3 days though.

    I didn't think it would make its' goal either until the crowdforger custom $10k pledge appeared with only a couple of days left.  No listed rewards and some made-up description of how they were contacted by several backers who wanted to negotiate their own special terms in return for pledges of $10k or more.  If there is a likelihood of failure on the last day, this is where GW will insert their shill backers to ensure the project succeeds and they don't lose the chunk of money legitimately earned.  I'm not saying GW will make the pledges themselves but that the people who have already agreed to finance the game will.  I don't think there's anything technically wrong with this but a project should fail or succeed based on its' own merits.

  • RobokappRobokapp Dublin, OHPosts: 5,205Member Uncommon
    ""

    6. Real Battles- Large scale combat won't be the total chaos most MMO players are used to. PFO will make use of a formation system that gives groups significant bonuses for fighting in formation and coordinating their ability usage.

     ""

     

    What?

     

    wh...what is this ?

     

    like buff auras or ...

    image

  • steamtanksteamtank Rochester, NYPosts: 385Member
    Originally posted by Robokapp
    ""

    6. Real Battles- Large scale combat won't be the total chaos most MMO players are used to. PFO will make use of a formation system that gives groups significant bonuses for fighting in formation and coordinating their ability usage.

     ""

     

    What?

     

    wh...what is this ?

     

    like buff auras or ...

    my hope is a detection system in party that determines location (using the mini map type system) and rewards the group with certain buffs based on composition and proximal deployment.

     

    how its going to work i have no idea.  unless collision detection is both on and rather broad for front line fighters i dont see much way of keeping formation as soon as fighting gets to melee range.

  • BlueMountainBlueMountain Philadelphia, PAPosts: 147Member

    Guess we hafta stay tuned to find out.

    I wonder if each player has a group of NPC henchment that will stay in 'formation' and attack his target.

    To dream, perhaps to be.

  • RobokappRobokapp Dublin, OHPosts: 5,205Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by steamtank
    Originally posted by Robokapp
    ""

    6. Real Battles- Large scale combat won't be the total chaos most MMO players are used to. PFO will make use of a formation system that gives groups significant bonuses for fighting in formation and coordinating their ability usage.

     ""

     

    What?

     

    wh...what is this ?

     

    like buff auras or ...

    my hope is a detection system in party that determines location (using the mini map type system) and rewards the group with certain buffs based on composition and proximal deployment.

     

    how its going to work i have no idea.  unless collision detection is both on and rather broad for front line fighters i dont see much way of keeping formation as soon as fighting gets to melee range.

    the only MMO where fighting in close packs is done and relevant is EVE where you have 'drake anchor", "ahac anchor" and so on.

     

    but...in eve you also sometimes spread out a lot when you suspect enemy will use bombers.

     

    as i read the lines above I thought that bomer-like heavy-aoe groups will be extremely powerful if you're forced to play collapsed together. I need to know more about their combat but it raised an alarm. forcing a group together makes AOE hard-counter an obvious choice.

    image

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by Robokapp
    Originally posted by steamtank
    Originally posted by Robokapp
    ""

    6. Real Battles- Large scale combat won't be the total chaos most MMO players are used to. PFO will make use of a formation system that gives groups significant bonuses for fighting in formation and coordinating their ability usage.

     ""

     

    What?

     

    wh...what is this ?

     

    like buff auras or ...

    my hope is a detection system in party that determines location (using the mini map type system) and rewards the group with certain buffs based on composition and proximal deployment.

     

    how its going to work i have no idea.  unless collision detection is both on and rather broad for front line fighters i dont see much way of keeping formation as soon as fighting gets to melee range.

    the only MMO where fighting in close packs is done and relevant is EVE where you have 'drake anchor", "ahac anchor" and so on.

     

    but...in eve you also sometimes spread out a lot when you suspect enemy will use bombers.

     

    as i read the lines above I thought that bomer-like heavy-aoe groups will be extremely powerful if you're forced to play collapsed together. I need to know more about their combat but it raised an alarm. forcing a group together makes AOE hard-counter an obvious choice.

    Goblin Works Blog: You're in the Army Now!

    The formations are intended to work in a couple of ways:

    1) Allow the server to treat formations of players as single-objects for the server load, I believe is important/intentional.

    2) Each formation confers contributions to the individuals in the formation, so different formations and different combinations of players acting in formation influence it's defence and offence capabilities.

    I imagine the movement and positioning will influence the effectiveness and obviously drive zergs of players like a hot knife through butter! image

  • BlueMountainBlueMountain Philadelphia, PAPosts: 147Member

    ...so... what I am imagining is that say a party of six accepts formation command by a cleric at the inn, before they set out for a dungeon. The party is a rogue, a wizard, the cleric-commander, a paladin, and two fighters.

    The cleric-commander gets a new bank of icons with six multicolored dots or squares, each dot colored according to class. Upon creation of the formation but before combat initiation the commander defines who goes where. So the cleric-commander puts himself in the back where he can be protected to heal, the wizard to his right and the rogue to his left. He puts the paladin in the center of the fron tline flanked by the two fighters. This will be the default formation they will initially take if beset by hostiles. Other options might be a six-pointed defensive star with everyone facing out from a central point, or a five pointed star with their wizard in the center or what have you. Another might be echelon -left/right, or perhaps phalanx (wedge). In anticipation of having to fight in a corredor he has one in a column of twos. Finally he has one where the rogue is to flank, so he can take advantage of some rogue backstabbing advantages.

    He sets up these various formations as alt-function key assignments,  The wizard and cleric set up their ready spells, and the party leaves the Inn or camp for a destination dungeon and they begin to fast-travel.

    Along their route a party of six bandits waits in ambush, and as our party fast-travels the road the bandits spring their trap.

    The party appears in the road where they have been ambushed in default formation which is less than optimal if the bandits have set up in an enfilading fire configuration where they can fire their crossbows at the party from all sides. The cleric has the option of  changing formation to a defensive star or charging one side of the ambush in the current formation. Changing formation would take precious time so he decides to charge whichever side of the bandit formation the party is facing leaving their most vulnrable backs open but potentially reducing the offensive strength of the bandits by one opponent who is quickly overcome. To do so the cleric-commander is the only one who actually uses his WASD movement keys. Once the focused bandit is down he wheels the whole party to their next objective, an adjascent bandit, and also changes formation to send the Rogue to the right flank away from the greatest threat of missile fire from the bandits' remaining positions to set the rogue up for a backstab opportunity. The wizard decides to return fire casting magic missile. Because the wizard (I assume) must stand still to effectively cast his spell his action stops the rest of the party other than the rogue (already in motion) for his cast.

    This is just how I envision formations working. 

    To dream, perhaps to be.

  • bliss14bliss14 eleva, WIPosts: 565Member

    Even if they don't make the 1 million mark on KS it does give them something to approach other methods for alternate funding with.  It gives them the right to say look what regular people who have no personal stake in this project are willing to put up just to put them into a faster development.   If the CEO is as good as claimed in the first place he can use this to pump money in other ways. 

    I think it was Origins of Malu (?) who ended up cancelling their own kickstarter after finding alternate funding and then also decided to reward the pledgers with some of the rewards they would have gotten if KS had gone through.  I could see that happening especially with something that is an established IP in it's own right like Pathfinder.  Personally I had only heard of it in vague terms before this MMO project but I also never paid a whole lot of attention to P&P systems. 

    As of right now PO is at - who knows they might actually get a flood of existing pledges go further into it while adding more new ones and hit the goal:

    • $827,444 pledged
    • 34 hours to go                
  • newchemicalsnewchemicals San Gabriel, CAPosts: 43Member
    Originally posted by BlueMountain

    ...so... what I am imagining is that say a party of six accepts formation command by a cleric at the inn, before they set out for a dungeon. The party is a rogue, a wizard, the cleric-commander, a paladin, and two fighters.

    The cleric-commander gets a new bank of icons with six multicolored dots or squares, each dot colored according to class. Upon creation of the formation but before combat initiation the commander defines who goes where. So the cleric-commander puts himself in the back where he can be protected to heal, the wizard to his right and the rogue to his left. He puts the paladin in the center of the fron tline flanked by the two fighters. This will be the default formation they will initially take if beset by hostiles. Other options might be a six-pointed defensive star with everyone facing out from a central point, or a five pointed star with their wizard in the center or what have you. Another might be echelon -left/right, or perhaps phalanx (wedge). In anticipation of having to fight in a corredor he has one in a column of twos. Finally he has one where the rogue is to flank, so he can take advantage of some rogue backstabbing advantages.

    He sets up these various formations as alt-function key assignments,  The wizard and cleric set up their ready spells, and the party leaves the Inn or camp for a destination dungeon and they begin to fast-travel.

    Along their route a party of six bandits waits in ambush, and as our party fast-travels the road the bandits spring their trap.

    The party appears in the road where they have been ambushed in default formation which is less than optimal if the bandits have set up in an enfilading fire configuration where they can fire their crossbows at the party from all sides. The cleric has the option of  changing formation to a defensive star or charging one side of the ambush in the current formation. Changing formation would take precious time so he decides to charge whichever side of the bandit formation the party is facing leaving their most vulnrable backs open but potentially reducing the offensive strength of the bandits by one opponent who is quickly overcome. To do so the cleric-commander is the only one who actually uses his WASD movement keys. Once the focused bandit is down he wheels the whole party to their next objective, an adjascent bandit, and also changes formation to send the Rogue to the right flank away from the greatest threat of missile fire from the bandits' remaining positions to set the rogue up for a backstab opportunity. The wizard decides to return fire casting magic missile. Because the wizard (I assume) must stand still to effectively cast his spell his action stops the rest of the party other than the rogue (already in motion) for his cast.

    This is just how I envision formations working. 

    Sounds more like Federation and Empire Online.

  • revcasyrevcasy Oneonta, ALPosts: 9Member
    The formations are going to be tricky, mainly because you are starting out on something pretty complex and new for MMO's without much history of systems that have been tried before to draw on, but if they are done well they could make this game, and possibly solve the eternal problem of zergs being more-or-less unstoppable in MMO PvP.
  • VannorVannor YorkshirePosts: 2,970Member Uncommon

    When things just sound too good to be true, they usually arn't.

    What is listed there would probably make this one of the best games ever made. It's a tall order so I'm not holding my breath. All just sounds a little TOO good.

  • BlackUhuruBlackUhuru Of Angels, CAPosts: 770Member
    Well so far Goblinworks has been very transparent and realistic with the community.

    They have said mounted combat will not be in at early enrollment, it would take twice the amount of character and mount animations.

    Battle formations as a game mechanic has been disgust briefly on the forums and is something Ryan really wants in the game, but no timeframe has been discussed yet.

    So we don't really have much to go on yet, ill try to bring it up on Paizo message boards and see what they have to say.

    Time will tell as to what makes it in-game for early enrollment, and we will have to see how fast they can crank out new systems.

    The nice thing about Crowdforging is when the Dev team is ready to work on new systems a poll is presented to the community and we get to vote on what gets worked on first.

    Of course there are fundamental game designs and systems being worked automatically like crafting system, trade, settlements, gods etc etc.


    "It would be awesome if you could duel your companion. Then you could solo pvp".--Thanes

  • AzrileAzrile Houston, MDPosts: 2,582Member
    Originally posted by Vannor

    When things just sound too good to be true, they usually arn't.

    What is listed there would probably make this one of the best games ever made. It's a tall order so I'm not holding my breath. All just sounds a little TOO good.

    It could also be really simple.  For instance if the game detects you have a party member withing 5 yards to your right and to your left, you get increased damage absorption or decreased chance of being hit.

    Again, this is one of my problems with following games very early.  These guys barely have a working demo out now (and it is pretty bad)... thinking about them adding anything revolutionary is, as of right now, a dream.

    I am following this game under the premise that it will be like UO, with better graphics, and a guild and skill system more similar to EVE.  Just throwing those things together, which have already all been done, is enough to make a great game.

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by Azrile
    Originally posted by Vannor

    When things just sound too good to be true, they usually arn't.

    What is listed there would probably make this one of the best games ever made. It's a tall order so I'm not holding my breath. All just sounds a little TOO good.

    It could also be really simple.  For instance if the game detects you have a party member withing 5 yards to your right and to your left, you get increased damage absorption or decreased chance of being hit.

    Again, this is one of my problems with following games very early.  These guys barely have a working demo out now (and it is pretty bad)... thinking about them adding anything revolutionary is, as of right now, a dream.

    I am following this game under the premise that it will be like UO, with better graphics, and a guild and skill system more similar to EVE.  Just throwing those things together, which have already all been done, is enough to make a great game.

    Spot on. They're reaching for some great ideas: Plenty of which could easily fall short. But the fact they're gunning for it without the threat of appealing to everyone and no-one to pay off a massive dev budget; and their various backgrounds with roots in the PnP rpgs - I think it's worth supporting to see if players/devs can make it happen.

    The formations in particular hinges on how fun they can make it for individuals. But the idea that it could help with the server load is a solid place to start from AND resolve the zerg problem all in one - I think there's some players out there who'd like nothing more than to simulate battle strategies, if it could be taken to that level and if it really is a TEAM effort, think it could be satisfying for all to form some sort of chain of command and orchestrate a successful victory under terms of war.

  • BlueMountainBlueMountain Philadelphia, PAPosts: 147Member
    Mine was speculation. Speculation is easy. I was just trying to forecast one way that what they have suggested could be realized.  I am interested in their making the game 'right', so naturally it sounds too good to be true: I was describing something like an ideal, based on minimal hints the developer left open.

    To dream, perhaps to be.

  • MardukkMardukk Posts: 1,556Member Uncommon

    Not a big fan of that EvE skill training.  So basically I do nothing except to be online to advance?  Doesn't sound too exciting.  I don't mind grinding at least I'm doing something.  Also how is PvE more meaningful if you don't have to do anything to advance?  I imagine killing NPC's has to give you some kind of character progression/reward?  I suppose as long as you do get something from killing mobs it wouldn't matter too much that skill training involves just being online.

     

     

  • DakcenturiDakcenturi Nashville, TNPosts: 29Member

    Grinding mobs will still provide loot and coin.

     

    Additionally, in order to advance some skills you have to earn certain merit badges which may require you to do things, possibly including killing so many mobs of a certain type or other things.

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