Originally posted by boxsnd But GW2 copied a lot of things from other games too. WvW from DAoC/WAR, sPvP from WoW arenas/bgs, dynamic events from WAR/RIFT etc.
No - copied from GW1. GW1 had arenas BEFORE WoW. GW2 was planned with dynamic events before Rift was even a glint in the developers eye also. HoH in GW1 was 3 teams playing against each other - WvWvW is just bigger.
Rift DE's are not dynamic - they happen every day at the same time (they are scripted).
GW2 De's are not Dynamic they are scripted loops that repeat over and over with no permanent changes to the world
I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet. Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".
Pretty naive if you ask me. If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen. And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.
gw2 has a longer dev cycle than teso and four people who worked on the rvr part of daoc vs one person who contributed a gear treadmill to doac(aka its demise) for teso.
GW2 pretty much sucks after you reach a certain point. All it is is the same thing, zone after zone after zone. That's definitely not going to be for ESO. I've 3 max leveled characters in GW2, played GW1 till I had 9 level 20's with 4 of them all geared with all the fancy faction armors and so on.... Just like GW1, GW2 got boring fast. Fun to play but gets boring. They didn't do ANYTHING that I would call over the top in innovation for MMO's. Warhammer Online had Dynamic events before either Rift or GW2 and the problem with them is the same across the bored. People just aren't all that interested in most of them. There was nothing truely rewarding about them and their dungeon system is no different. They just reinvented the GRIND was all they did.
ESO isn't without flaws already, I have my gripes with it as well and it's not even out. Like I don't care for the way they're doing the Class thing based on Race. I'd rather them give you the choice of a Race to play, level to a certain point in a Racial Starting Zone. Then say at 15 or 20 you have to decide which side of the fence you're playing on. From that point on you're permanently on that side with that character, no going back once you make your decision. This would have let the players get to play the Race they want without having to worry or not about which side their friends had chosen. Which is how the Elder Scrolls games have always been. You chose your race, then later you picked your side to follow. This is the biggest gripe I have which to some will be looked at as minor.
The other thing I'd like to point out about all the hotbar gripes, of ESO having one to begin with. All a hotbar is, is a set of skills that are -HOTKEYED- onto those keys. Which you did in Skyrim and previous games. Just you could not visually see them on your screen which ment you had to memorize them well. So the gripes about this game having one is stupid. More than likely you can turn the UI off like in other games and not worry about it? Who knows, but it's no different than hotkeyed skills just you can visually see them. Big deal!
Quite frankly I have worries over this stupid Mega Server System, I see nothing but bad coming from this. Yeah looks good, sounds good, on paper and on their limited amount of people at this time having access to it. But we all know when you put everyone on basically one big server, cluster or whatever and have it all tied together with thousands of other players. It normally causes a lot more problems once something like this goes live than it ever even was thought of while they are testing it and using it as it is currently. So I do worry about that.
The other thing I don't like is the Zerg-Fest mantality this game ( As did GW2 and Rift ) promotes. Just means all this game is looking to be is another one of those play it for a month and beat the end game scenarios. That is NOT what an MMORPG should ever have become but today's lazy players want everything handed to them so that is what these game companies now cater to. Quick buck, turn around rinse and repeate. When you pretty much make it so people can share kills without grouping and get full experience and rewards, all they do is zerg the entire game to the end and wala! Completed in no time without any major challenge once so ever. Now I can't say that ESO is going to be like this, all I am saying is from what I've read and heard from others posting that is what we're heading for.
This is why I'd rather had Elder Scrolls just have a bloody Multiplayer ability to games like Skyrim where the game would have a host server or you could host it yourself and have 2 to 3 others join your game and just have the game become a tad harder for every extra person over you joining. That would have been PERFECT for Skyrim, I hope they do it for ESVI because MMO's in my opinion are becoming so short lived they're not worth the money anymore. They might as well hand you a fully leveled and decently geared character at the start and be done with it. Because lately that's all the MMO's are worth.
I've been in MMO's since 2001, started with DAoC, did WoW, LotRO, AoC, SWG, SWTOR, Vanguard ( Which was great for a while ), RIFT, Lineage II, Warhammer Online along with countless others I've been in Beta with and tried out for a free month and just could not stand them. Now I understand something that others do not wish to. No game company is ever going to please everyone, so I wish they'd stop trying to. in the early days of gaming, this goes for all games, not just MMORPG's... When you got a preview copy, trial, whatever you wish to call it, you could play a little of it and decide if you were going to be interested enogh to buy it or not. Once you bought the game, you could get a lot further, but at least you got a good enough start in it to find out if you liked it or not.
Point I'm trying to make, no game should be tailored to a majority of anything. It should be designed from the ground up to be DIFFERENT and CHALLENGING in it's own UNIQUE way. If the player doesn't like it? They don't buy it, they get one they do like and play that one. Game companies need to get off of this Quantity over Quality and go back to the old ways of doing these games. Then they'll last longer than a month, have far less bugs, become far more in-depth, have far more options for players that are of the most demanding in skill and want the best. Not just settle for whatever a COMPANY says is or claims is the best just because they make it.
Lastly, I do hope that ESO is a lot better than what I'm feeling it is as of this time. I absolutely LOVE Elder Scrolls, I've almost 900 hours played in Skyrim alone and still playing it. I have the same with Oblivion, fixing to start playing Morrowind, but I've been an RPG fan for decades. I've done D&D Table Top, loved the Forgotten Realms games, I love a lot of lore, detail, exploration, crafting, questing, I love it all and a lot. So here is to hoping for the best for ESO, I'm just not going to hold my breath on it.....
Thats not a minor thing at all, honestly its something more mmos should do. Sadly ESO looks more and more like an atempt to just shove the TES IP into an mmo.
Originally posted by Eir_S I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet. Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".Pretty naive if you ask me. If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen. And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.
except that there will be other meaningful things to do in cyridiil besides zerging keeps, like GW2
the WvW in GW2 feels like an over sized battle ground. from reading about teso, the entire zone wuil have pve and pvp elements.
it will be a true open pvp zone with players doing other things besides mindless zerging.
Originally posted by Eir_S I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet. Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".
Pretty naive if you ask me. If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen. And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.
except that there will be other meaningful things to do in cyridiil besides zerging keeps, like GW2
the WvW in GW2 feels like an over sized battle ground. from reading about teso, the entire zone wuil have pve and pvp elements.
it will be a true open pvp zone with players doing other things besides mindless zerging.
You just proved my point. That's EXACTLY what ANet said about WvW. And yeah, when people read about it, it sounded unlike what it turned out to be... which might be exactly what you're doing now. We'll know when it's done, but until then, promises, promises... ones I think will fall flat. Again.
I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet. Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".
Pretty naive if you ask me. If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen. And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.
gw2 has a longer dev cycle than teso and four people who worked on the rvr part of daoc vs one person who contributed a gear treadmill to doac(aka its demise) for teso.
your friend is really in for it.
She's no different than most people on these forums. She hypes herself up for something then gets upset when it doesn't blow her away. I don't see anything mindblowing on the MMORPG horizon, just fun time wasters (hence why I'm rarely disappointed). Maybe if people calmed down, they wouldn't jump from game to game hoping for something godlike, because as far as I can see, it's not going to happen this year either.
Originally posted by Eir_S I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet. Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".
Pretty naive if you ask me. If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen. And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.
except that there will be other meaningful things to do in cyridiil besides zerging keeps, like GW2
the WvW in GW2 feels like an over sized battle ground. from reading about teso, the entire zone wuil have pve and pvp elements.
it will be a true open pvp zone with players doing other things besides mindless zerging.
You just proved my point. That's EXACTLY what ANet said about WvW. And yeah, when people read about it, it sounded unlike what it turned out to be... which might be exactly what you're doing now. We'll know when it's done, but until then, promises, promises... ones I think will fall flat. Again.
I have yet to see large scale pvp that isn't zergball. The ability to control players and their behavior is rather limited.
Yeah, that's what I'm getting at. This isn't an RTS. Whether the obstacle is a gate or a boss, people will group up and they will mash buttons. Does that mean it won't be fun? I don't see it that way, but people expecting something wildly different are in for a shock. Don't expect anyone to follow orders either, "Commanders" in GW2 already try and no one listens to them.
Originally posted by Destai I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.
GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all.
This is an entirely unsupportable statement which has been disproven again and again on these forums.
I am not a GW2 'fanboi' - I don't play GW2 anymore. But that's because it's set in a 'popcorn and bubblegum' world, not because it was a copy of the average to crapola games mentioned (except for DaoC ofc).
Dynamic events and the fluid combat are both excellent in GW2, and they made a non-trinity model really work.
So yes it was a push forwards, in all kinds of ways - it just didn't come together as a whole for me due to the fluff and the lack of guild features and support.
While I play the game, I can certainly relate to your sentiment. The world lacks drama in the way an Elder Scrolls world would, or even World of Warcraft. I feel like ArenaNet is too tolerant, too unity-focused. Not to mention their writers are horrible...the personal story, oy vey.
GW2 pretty much sucks after you reach a certain point. All it is is the same thing, zone after zone after zone. That's definitely not going to be for ESO. I've 3 max leveled characters in GW2, played GW1 till I had 9 level 20's with 4 of them all geared with all the fancy faction armors and so on.... Just like GW1, GW2 got boring fast. Fun to play but gets boring. They didn't do ANYTHING that I would call over the top in innovation for MMO's. Warhammer Online had Dynamic events before either Rift or GW2 and the problem with them is the same across the bored. People just aren't all that interested in most of them. There was nothing truely rewarding about them and their dungeon system is no different. They just reinvented the GRIND was all they did.
ESO isn't without flaws already, I have my gripes with it as well and it's not even out. Like I don't care for the way they're doing the Class thing based on Race. I'd rather them give you the choice of a Race to play, level to a certain point in a Racial Starting Zone. Then say at 15 or 20 you have to decide which side of the fence you're playing on. From that point on you're permanently on that side with that character, no going back once you make your decision. This would have let the players get to play the Race they want without having to worry or not about which side their friends had chosen. Which is how the Elder Scrolls games have always been. You chose your race, then later you picked your side to follow. This is the biggest gripe I have which to some will be looked at as minor.
The other thing I'd like to point out about all the hotbar gripes, of ESO having one to begin with. All a hotbar is, is a set of skills that are -HOTKEYED- onto those keys. Which you did in Skyrim and previous games. Just you could not visually see them on your screen which ment you had to memorize them well. So the gripes about this game having one is stupid. More than likely you can turn the UI off like in other games and not worry about it? Who knows, but it's no different than hotkeyed skills just you can visually see them. Big deal!
Quite frankly I have worries over this stupid Mega Server System, I see nothing but bad coming from this. Yeah looks good, sounds good, on paper and on their limited amount of people at this time having access to it. But we all know when you put everyone on basically one big server, cluster or whatever and have it all tied together with thousands of other players. It normally causes a lot more problems once something like this goes live than it ever even was thought of while they are testing it and using it as it is currently. So I do worry about that.
The other thing I don't like is the Zerg-Fest mantality this game ( As did GW2 and Rift ) promotes. Just means all this game is looking to be is another one of those play it for a month and beat the end game scenarios. That is NOT what an MMORPG should ever have become but today's lazy players want everything handed to them so that is what these game companies now cater to. Quick buck, turn around rinse and repeate. When you pretty much make it so people can share kills without grouping and get full experience and rewards, all they do is zerg the entire game to the end and wala! Completed in no time without any major challenge once so ever. Now I can't say that ESO is going to be like this, all I am saying is from what I've read and heard from others posting that is what we're heading for.
This is why I'd rather had Elder Scrolls just have a bloody Multiplayer ability to games like Skyrim where the game would have a host server or you could host it yourself and have 2 to 3 others join your game and just have the game become a tad harder for every extra person over you joining. That would have been PERFECT for Skyrim, I hope they do it for ESVI because MMO's in my opinion are becoming so short lived they're not worth the money anymore. They might as well hand you a fully leveled and decently geared character at the start and be done with it. Because lately that's all the MMO's are worth.
I've been in MMO's since 2001, started with DAoC, did WoW, LotRO, AoC, SWG, SWTOR, Vanguard ( Which was great for a while ), RIFT, Lineage II, Warhammer Online along with countless others I've been in Beta with and tried out for a free month and just could not stand them. Now I understand something that others do not wish to. No game company is ever going to please everyone, so I wish they'd stop trying to. in the early days of gaming, this goes for all games, not just MMORPG's... When you got a preview copy, trial, whatever you wish to call it, you could play a little of it and decide if you were going to be interested enogh to buy it or not. Once you bought the game, you could get a lot further, but at least you got a good enough start in it to find out if you liked it or not.
Point I'm trying to make, no game should be tailored to a majority of anything. It should be designed from the ground up to be DIFFERENT and CHALLENGING in it's own UNIQUE way. If the player doesn't like it? They don't buy it, they get one they do like and play that one. Game companies need to get off of this Quantity over Quality and go back to the old ways of doing these games. Then they'll last longer than a month, have far less bugs, become far more in-depth, have far more options for players that are of the most demanding in skill and want the best. Not just settle for whatever a COMPANY says is or claims is the best just because they make it.
Lastly, I do hope that ESO is a lot better than what I'm feeling it is as of this time. I absolutely LOVE Elder Scrolls, I've almost 900 hours played in Skyrim alone and still playing it. I have the same with Oblivion, fixing to start playing Morrowind, but I've been an RPG fan for decades. I've done D&D Table Top, loved the Forgotten Realms games, I love a lot of lore, detail, exploration, crafting, questing, I love it all and a lot. So here is to hoping for the best for ESO, I'm just not going to hold my breath on it.....
Thats not a minor thing at all, honestly its something more mmos should do. Sadly ESO looks more and more like an atempt to just shove the TES IP into an mmo.
Great post btw. I don't think the highlighted is a minor thing either, I think it's a plus. True faction rivalry is good for a game like this.
Alliance v Horde is a true rivalry in part due to appearences. As alliance lock, I hated the Horde, Blood Elves where snooty sissies (can I say sissy?), Orc were kinda scary, Turans just looked stupid, Trolls were stupid, and the Forsaken couldn't be trusted. The rivalry was even better when shamen and pallys were faction locked.
I believe it was a big mistake that GW2 had no factions.
I'm already turned off by the change in direction with the combat being more action oriented with a limited hotbar. I could at least overlook it in the single player game thanks to an open ended world with a lot of non-combat options and the all important 'pause' function. Add to that even more GW2 mechanics and I no longer want to even try the game. Thank God for EverQuest Next!
Originally posted by Eir_S I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet. Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".
Pretty naive if you ask me. If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen. And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.
except that there will be other meaningful things to do in cyridiil besides zerging keeps, like GW2
the WvW in GW2 feels like an over sized battle ground. from reading about teso, the entire zone wuil have pve and pvp elements.
it will be a true open pvp zone with players doing other things besides mindless zerging.
You just proved my point. That's EXACTLY what ANet said about WvW. And yeah, when people read about it, it sounded unlike what it turned out to be... which might be exactly what you're doing now. We'll know when it's done, but until then, promises, promises... ones I think will fall flat. Again.
I have yet to see large scale pvp that isn't zergball. The ability to control players and their behavior is rather limited.
Yeah, that's what I'm getting at. This isn't an RTS. Whether the obstacle is a gate or a boss, people will group up and they will mash buttons. Does that mean it won't be fun? I don't see it that way, but people expecting something wildly different are in for a shock. Don't expect anyone to follow orders either, "Commanders" in GW2 already try and no one listens to them.
Maybe it's due to the fact that when people split up, they tend to die horribly. Safety in numbers is as natural to us as it is to the animal kingdom. It's easy enough for 'Commanders' to send people off to their likely deaths when they themselves stick around with the main force. Even in PvP, people play to have fun and it's not fun when you have to constantly run back from your long distanced spawn point.
Originally posted by Vorthanion I'm already turned off by the change in direction with the combat being more action oriented with a limited hotbar. I could at least overlook it in the single player game thanks to an open ended world with a lot of non-combat options and the all important 'pause' function. Add to that even more GW2 mechanics and I no longer want to even try the game. Thank God for EverQuest Next!
"combat being more action oriented" ... "limited hotbar" ... Have you ever played ES game before???
ESO WILL FAIL! and that ANGERS ME. We waited for something like this for a long time and this is what we get after all those years, what ever developers, WHAT EVER!
I think the game will be strong in its own sense. Guild Bores 2 was a strong start but it caters waaaaayyyy to much to only one side, that side being the pvp side and even that is limited to the point of it being elected mayor of snoresville. I understand they wanted to get rid of the gear grind and the trinity but then that just pushed people who enjoy tanking, healing and that gear grind away. I enjoy raiding, i enjoy advancing my character when i cap. GW2 didnt offer any of that and i hope ESO takes a note and takes a few things from GW2 but stays away from their PVE system cuz it suuuuuuuuucked.
Originally posted by darkrain21 I think the game will be strong in its own sense. Guild Bores 2 was a strong start but it caters waaaaayyyy to much to only one side, that side being the pvp side and even that is limited to the point of it being elected mayor of snoresville. I understand they wanted to get rid of the gear grind and the trinity but then that just pushed people who enjoy tanking, healing and that gear grind away. I enjoy raiding, i enjoy advancing my character when i cap. GW2 didnt offer any of that and i hope ESO takes a note and takes a few things from GW2 but stays away from their PVE system cuz it suuuuuuuuucked.
Ok, sure. Seeing as I've played the game TWICE as long as Skyrim and only did 5 Spvp matches, every other hour being spent in PvE zones and dungeons, you're not convincing me. But then you are the same person who said 3 million copies of a game sold in 5 months was "kinda bad".
I don't think this will be a "raiders first" game like wow and its various clones. It should share that with gw2 at least, which is good as raiders have been the squekiest wheel that gets oiled to the detriment of everyone else for many years.
This game is far from being a clone of GW2 for a lot of reasons. Skills for one, Quests and Lore is another, Graphics are far far above anything in GW2, mechanics is another. Just because a game has similar aspects, does NOT make a clone. Read what the word "Clone" means in the dictionary, it's an exact copy of something already in existance. What I have breifly pointed out here already far exceeds GW2 which wouldn't have taken much at all. GW2 is only good for a short play period, same with GW1. It's something to do when you're bored with everything else in my opinion.
Where I feel ESO is going to come up short is the way the server is set up. One Mega Server means everyone will just zerg through the content. There is going to be way too many on one server for it to be any fun. To me being on the highest populated servers in games has always been frustrating. The one thing I miss in MMORPG's is the true Guild aspect. No game since DAoC has done Guilds right. There is no need to be in them, no need to form groups, no need to be a part of anything really. I blame this one on WoW, definitely after they put in the Group Finding tools for both dungeons and raids. They just pulled the nail on any reason once so ever to be part of a guild.
GW2 is even worse because the perks you get as a guild? You pay for them, then have to wait to use them so you have to plan things in advance. But if people don't show up like it's their job, you can't always bank on that going well for you. So that was a bad design right there, they should have made the effect happen then, then make you wait x-amount of time to use it again. Every game so far I've been in has been very much less and less about Guilds. DAoC had a damn good system and made it even better over time. They recognized the power of Guilds and that was great. Now days, it's just about get me and out as fast as possible, to the end of the game as fast as possible, raid, raid, raid, then rage quit because there is nothing left to do till the next content patch or expansion.
PvP is another sore topic, because it's plaqued with the biggest whiners across the globe. None of them are ever happy even after they get what they want. They just find something else to complain about it seems. Don't get me wrong, I once was HUGE on PvP, especially coming from DAoC. I had eight level 50's and three were RR5+ and two were RR7+ one of them two were almost RR8 when I quit. I personally would have made it to max rank had I stayed, but all my friends left for WoW. I didn't feel up to dealing with the dwindling numbers. So I went with them. But PvP has never been that good since and I don't see it ever becoming as good again. Today's gamers don't want it. They want Quake or Call of Duty style pvp is seems.
What makes an MMO a RPG is that the RPG doesn't just mean Role Playing Game here. The RPG aspect of it also brings with it a lot of standards that are followed. These standards include Stat Points that you put where you want each level, Racial Choices, Armor and Weapon choices, Character Creation Choices that are very detailed. This list is HUGE and that was but a short and I mean very short list. RPG also meant that the game was HUGE on story and content. So to understand as to why it's so hard to make PvP work properly in this setting is to make someone very unhappy at times because they can't take getting hit by an archer while wearing cloth. They can't stand also getting destroyed by a fireball while wearing plate.
RPG aspects dictated weaknesses and strengths in everything. People don't like that, they want balance. There is no such a thing as -balance- where RPG comes in. What does come in, is you adapt and move on, or die. Recently I did this in Skyrim, as I chose to finally make a pure caster. No light armor, no heavy armor, pure zero rated cloth. What I used to find minute and pointless to worry about suddenly became my worst enemy. Heck, even those stupid bear traps hurt early on. I had to learn how to play all over again because I refused to take the game off of Adept till later when I pushed it to Expert. Now I'm still playing that character, not even close to being done, but at some point I'll put the game on Master I'm sure of it.
Point is, I'm the type that adapts and moves on. Not one to let my weaknesses get the best of me and start complaining that I want my cloth armor to protect me better. No no... Instead I decided to reinvent myself from my archer ways to approach the game differently. That is something I'd like to see more players do, less whining, more adapting and moving on. But PvP will always have zergs of one kind or another unless it's instanced off arenas. Which I wouldn't mind them setting up the old Oblivion style arena in ESO where we could go in with Arena gear given to us before the fight and being able to place bets and so on.... That would RULE!
Anyway, I've rambled on long enough... Have fun everyone!
The only thing i can see thats like gw2 is the limited action bar and the "anchors"
It has raids, trinity, gear progression, a deep skill progression (my favourite announcement to date tbh), factions and no limits when it comes to items types.
Sure ive missed some, but either way not really a "clon" of anything
Comments
GW2 De's are not Dynamic they are scripted loops that repeat over and over with no permanent changes to the world
gw2 has a longer dev cycle than teso and four people who worked on the rvr part of daoc vs one person who contributed a gear treadmill to doac(aka its demise) for teso.
your friend is really in for it.
Thats not a minor thing at all, honestly its something more mmos should do. Sadly ESO looks more and more like an atempt to just shove the TES IP into an mmo.
https://ashesofcreation.com/r/Y4U3PQCASUPJ5SED
except that there will be other meaningful things to do in cyridiil besides zerging keeps, like GW2
the WvW in GW2 feels like an over sized battle ground. from reading about teso, the entire zone wuil have pve and pvp elements.
it will be a true open pvp zone with players doing other things besides mindless zerging.
You just proved my point. That's EXACTLY what ANet said about WvW. And yeah, when people read about it, it sounded unlike what it turned out to be... which might be exactly what you're doing now. We'll know when it's done, but until then, promises, promises... ones I think will fall flat. Again.
She's no different than most people on these forums. She hypes herself up for something then gets upset when it doesn't blow her away. I don't see anything mindblowing on the MMORPG horizon, just fun time wasters (hence why I'm rarely disappointed). Maybe if people calmed down, they wouldn't jump from game to game hoping for something godlike, because as far as I can see, it's not going to happen this year either.
Yeah, that's what I'm getting at. This isn't an RTS. Whether the obstacle is a gate or a boss, people will group up and they will mash buttons. Does that mean it won't be fun? I don't see it that way, but people expecting something wildly different are in for a shock. Don't expect anyone to follow orders either, "Commanders" in GW2 already try and no one listens to them.
While I play the game, I can certainly relate to your sentiment. The world lacks drama in the way an Elder Scrolls world would, or even World of Warcraft. I feel like ArenaNet is too tolerant, too unity-focused. Not to mention their writers are horrible...the personal story, oy vey.
Great post btw. I don't think the highlighted is a minor thing either, I think it's a plus. True faction rivalry is good for a game like this.
Alliance v Horde is a true rivalry in part due to appearences. As alliance lock, I hated the Horde, Blood Elves where snooty sissies (can I say sissy?), Orc were kinda scary, Turans just looked stupid, Trolls were stupid, and the Forsaken couldn't be trusted. The rivalry was even better when shamen and pallys were faction locked.
I believe it was a big mistake that GW2 had no factions.
Maybe it's due to the fact that when people split up, they tend to die horribly. Safety in numbers is as natural to us as it is to the animal kingdom. It's easy enough for 'Commanders' to send people off to their likely deaths when they themselves stick around with the main force. Even in PvP, people play to have fun and it's not fun when you have to constantly run back from your long distanced spawn point.
"combat being more action oriented" ... "limited hotbar" ... Have you ever played ES game before???
Ok, sure. Seeing as I've played the game TWICE as long as Skyrim and only did 5 Spvp matches, every other hour being spent in PvE zones and dungeons, you're not convincing me. But then you are the same person who said 3 million copies of a game sold in 5 months was "kinda bad".
GW2 is best selling new mmo,companies going to make same games,just as was with WoW in past
I hope ESO ll be GW2 clone with no asian shiny graphic
Well depending on who you ask, GW2 was a mix of some of those games too.
Clon wars.
This game is far from being a clone of GW2 for a lot of reasons. Skills for one, Quests and Lore is another, Graphics are far far above anything in GW2, mechanics is another. Just because a game has similar aspects, does NOT make a clone. Read what the word "Clone" means in the dictionary, it's an exact copy of something already in existance. What I have breifly pointed out here already far exceeds GW2 which wouldn't have taken much at all. GW2 is only good for a short play period, same with GW1. It's something to do when you're bored with everything else in my opinion.
Where I feel ESO is going to come up short is the way the server is set up. One Mega Server means everyone will just zerg through the content. There is going to be way too many on one server for it to be any fun. To me being on the highest populated servers in games has always been frustrating. The one thing I miss in MMORPG's is the true Guild aspect. No game since DAoC has done Guilds right. There is no need to be in them, no need to form groups, no need to be a part of anything really. I blame this one on WoW, definitely after they put in the Group Finding tools for both dungeons and raids. They just pulled the nail on any reason once so ever to be part of a guild.
GW2 is even worse because the perks you get as a guild? You pay for them, then have to wait to use them so you have to plan things in advance. But if people don't show up like it's their job, you can't always bank on that going well for you. So that was a bad design right there, they should have made the effect happen then, then make you wait x-amount of time to use it again. Every game so far I've been in has been very much less and less about Guilds. DAoC had a damn good system and made it even better over time. They recognized the power of Guilds and that was great. Now days, it's just about get me and out as fast as possible, to the end of the game as fast as possible, raid, raid, raid, then rage quit because there is nothing left to do till the next content patch or expansion.
PvP is another sore topic, because it's plaqued with the biggest whiners across the globe. None of them are ever happy even after they get what they want. They just find something else to complain about it seems. Don't get me wrong, I once was HUGE on PvP, especially coming from DAoC. I had eight level 50's and three were RR5+ and two were RR7+ one of them two were almost RR8 when I quit. I personally would have made it to max rank had I stayed, but all my friends left for WoW. I didn't feel up to dealing with the dwindling numbers. So I went with them. But PvP has never been that good since and I don't see it ever becoming as good again. Today's gamers don't want it. They want Quake or Call of Duty style pvp is seems.
What makes an MMO a RPG is that the RPG doesn't just mean Role Playing Game here. The RPG aspect of it also brings with it a lot of standards that are followed. These standards include Stat Points that you put where you want each level, Racial Choices, Armor and Weapon choices, Character Creation Choices that are very detailed. This list is HUGE and that was but a short and I mean very short list. RPG also meant that the game was HUGE on story and content. So to understand as to why it's so hard to make PvP work properly in this setting is to make someone very unhappy at times because they can't take getting hit by an archer while wearing cloth. They can't stand also getting destroyed by a fireball while wearing plate.
RPG aspects dictated weaknesses and strengths in everything. People don't like that, they want balance. There is no such a thing as -balance- where RPG comes in. What does come in, is you adapt and move on, or die. Recently I did this in Skyrim, as I chose to finally make a pure caster. No light armor, no heavy armor, pure zero rated cloth. What I used to find minute and pointless to worry about suddenly became my worst enemy. Heck, even those stupid bear traps hurt early on. I had to learn how to play all over again because I refused to take the game off of Adept till later when I pushed it to Expert. Now I'm still playing that character, not even close to being done, but at some point I'll put the game on Master I'm sure of it.
Point is, I'm the type that adapts and moves on. Not one to let my weaknesses get the best of me and start complaining that I want my cloth armor to protect me better. No no... Instead I decided to reinvent myself from my archer ways to approach the game differently. That is something I'd like to see more players do, less whining, more adapting and moving on. But PvP will always have zergs of one kind or another unless it's instanced off arenas. Which I wouldn't mind them setting up the old Oblivion style arena in ESO where we could go in with Arena gear given to us before the fight and being able to place bets and so on.... That would RULE!
Anyway, I've rambled on long enough... Have fun everyone!
Guild Leader
The Order of Sanity
The only thing i can see thats like gw2 is the limited action bar and the "anchors"
It has raids, trinity, gear progression, a deep skill progression (my favourite announcement to date tbh), factions and no limits when it comes to items types.
Sure ive missed some, but either way not really a "clon" of anything