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ESO - will it be a GW2 clon?

AreQAreQ JaroslawPosts: 7Member

Well im reading and watching some stuff about ESO, and i see its a lot like GW2:

In big  PvP you got really the same mechanic that GW2 has (big castle, small castle, and suply camps - viliges, machines and stuff). Ok it want be realm vs realm, but faction vs faction, and thats cool, but otherways.. same mechanic.

In case of trinity, well they both dont want it in game.

Combat mechanic proly will be diferent (without cooldowns?) thou.

 

So, will ESO be a GW2 in diverent settings? What do you guys think?

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Comments

  • Ice-QueenIce-Queen USA, GAPosts: 2,451Member Uncommon
    From their descriptions it seems a lot like the typical themepark.

    image

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  • AreQAreQ JaroslawPosts: 7Member

    Thats not the issue here. SWTOR and TSW are Themeparks, but there are much different in mechanic etc from each other.

    Thread about tempark/sandbox its two doors left from here:P

  • DestaiDestai Detroit, MIPosts: 574Member
    I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.
  • Effin_RabbitEffin_Rabbit Pittsburgh, PAPosts: 773Member Uncommon
    It looks like GW2 but strictly themepark and none of the dynamic content (that ive seen, not following it too closely) which in my opinion is what makes GW2 fun. Skyrim has it to an extent and I hope ESO has it too but what im curious to see what pay type they try to use, I hope for their sake they do buy to play.
  • kevjardskevjards carlislePosts: 1,463Member
    Originally posted by AreQ

    Well im reading and watching some stuff about ESO, and i see its a lot like GW2:

    In big  PvP you got really the same mechanic that GW2 has (big castle, small castle, and suply camps - viliges, machines and stuff). Ok it want be realm vs realm, but faction vs faction, and thats cool, but otherways.. same mechanic.

    In case of trinity, well they both dont want it in game.

    Combat mechanic proly will be diferent (without cooldowns?) thou.

     

    So, will ESO be a GW2 in diverent settings? What do you guys think?

    i dont think eso will be anything like gw2..it will be suicide if they do that..there are enough people that have left gw2 to signal that although gw2 is a great game it lacks anysort of real depth.god knows what they have in store for us but  they better make it good ,thats for sure or the backlash will be immense.especially given that it is an Elder Scrolls game.

  • DiemosDiemos Portsmouth, VAPosts: 129Member
    It sounds like its going to be very similar to GW2. With WoW adding jumping puzzles and leaning more towards cooperative mob tagging people are delusional if they cant see that GW2 has made an influence on evolving the genre.

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  • boxsndboxsnd Kraxton, ARPosts: 438Member Uncommon
    But GW2 copied a lot of things from other games too. WvW from DAoC/WAR, sPvP from WoW arenas/bgs, dynamic events from WAR/RIFT etc. 

    DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,066Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Tayah
    From their descriptions it seems a lot like the typical themepark.

    What descriptions is that?

     

    http://kotaku.com/5918689/the-elder-scrolls-online-is-not-as-world-of-warcraft-as-you-might-fear

    Making an MMO is making an MMO. I worked in the industry before World of Warcraft, so I can tell you that World of Warcraft had a lot of influences from a lot of games. Our priority is to make a great game and not to make a clone of anything. You saw a lot of things [in the demo today] that have no analogue in pretty much any other MMO. I think the answer there is: the more information that comes out about it—and when people sit down and play it, they'll realize it's different. Like our whole real-time combat system of blocking and dodging is all pretty much new. And the fact that it's based on health, stamina and magicka—you have to maintain your stamina bar to block and it's all real-time—gives it a completely different feel from any MMO."

    But things like attacks that have cooldowns and are keyed to a toolbar and all that, which is something we're used to seeing in most MMOs, you feel that's a necessity…"

    Firor: "Some attacks have cooldowns; some don't…"

    Paul Sage, ESO game director: "I think the key thing there is when you look at [things like the clickable toolbar], think of it more as an accessibility thing. When it's designed and laid out, it's there to give you the ability to do something very quickly. So, versus thinking of it as 'it's-the-ability-bar' combat, think of it more as "that's a tool being used to give it a real-time feel.' Certainly some things would have a cooldown, but a lot of things have no cooldown whatsoever. So you're seeing a very reactive, fast-paced combat."

    Firor: "That big two-handed power-up attack I was using in combat, that was from the toolbar. But it wasn't based on cooldown, it was based on how long I held it down. But you have to get hands-on with it. "

    Me: "Right. Just a final thought on this, and then I'll leave you guys be: I think some of this reaction was coming out of the sense that-and you guys had nothing to do with [EA's] The Old Republic-but that was pushed as: 'finally we're going to get something significantly different from what everybody had been making, [from all those] games similar to World of Warcraft.' And there was an expectation and maybe even some promotion by EA that the game would feel like, 'Okay, this is finally the alternative MMO for people who may not have been into those trappings.' I think now maybe you guys are freighted with those same expectations. Are those appropriate expectations? Or are maybe people conflating what they call World of Warcraft with just the necessities of MMO games?"

    Firor: "I think really they just need to sit down and play it when it goes into beta. Games are a lot about feel. When you see them in a magazine it's hard to get an idea of exactly what's in it and how it plays and what features work and how, so…"

    [One of the magazine editors in the room laughed]

    Me: "I hate magazines, too." [everyone laughs]

    Firor: I didn't mean it that way.. when explanations went out, when videos of Paul and I went out, and people actually heard about it.. explaining it [helps]…"

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • InFlamestwoInFlamestwo HindPosts: 662Member
    It seems like GW2 made its impact on the genre, people are already talking about GW2 copies. Great for the GW2 community.

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  • bcbullybcbully Westland, MIPosts: 8,274Member Uncommon
    They would be fools if it went that route. Their development team does say some stupid things like the gw2 development just less ATM .
  • Rthuth434Rthuth434 uniondale, NYPosts: 346Member

    the only major differences so far is more tiers of gear and possibly open world pvp.

     

    otherwise shared nodesloot and exp, no trinity, able to freely move about and attack/aim projectiles but still has tab targeting, limited weapon skill based hotbar with some utility skills and an elite, public event system in place of regular quests, has some open world dungeons and regular instanced dungeons, cross-class combo system.

     

  • NadiaNadia Canonsburg, PAPosts: 11,866Member Common
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    But GW2 copied a lot of things from other games too. WvW from DAoC/WAR, sPvP from WoW arenas/bgs, dynamic events from WAR/RIFT etc. 

    WOW did not add BGs until June 2005  http://www.wowwiki.com/Battleground

     

    GW1 had sPVP before WOW

  • TorvalTorval Oregon CountryPosts: 7,204Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    But GW2 copied a lot of things from other games too. WvW from DAoC/WAR, sPvP from WoW arenas/bgs, dynamic events from WAR/RIFT etc. 

    Yeah, but they were also some of the people who developed systems on those original games.  GW2 took all that and has a distinct feel to it.  TSW has a similar feel as well.  It's like fast moving tab combat with some action elements.  I think it's pretty fun.  If TESO can offer that with integrated open pvp zones then I think it might be a big hit.

    There will probably be some people who are pissed it's not going to be Daggerfall, Oblivion, or Skyrim, but I'm guessing there are enough people that like those games and DAoC and would love to play 3 faction open pvp.

    We'll see though.

  • hikaru77hikaru77 buenos airesPosts: 1,035Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Destai
    I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.

    GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all. 

  • MrJones77MrJones77 Dayton, OHPosts: 17Member
    ESO will be a damn gorgeous game at least.
  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,838Member Uncommon

    i liked GW2 but its boring as hell and the WvW pvp is a pointless zerg.

    the pvp in ESO looks to be much better in concept than GW2

    i am definitely going to give this one a chance and at least check it out and play if for a few months, like all the other mmo's that have been coming out lately.

  • RazperilRazperil Lewiston, MEPosts: 289Member
    Originally posted by hikaru77
    Originally posted by Destai
    I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.

    GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all. 

    GW2 has lost players faster than the crap that is D3? Delusion sets in fast I guess. Funny, it wasn't a push forward in your eyes, yet, it's ideas are being "copied" galore. We all know which company is taking the ideas that GW2 has and trying to make it so that "they" created them. Truly pathetic.

    Back on topic, worrying about wether or not a game will be a clone is foolish. Noone knows how the game will be until they have either tested it or played it on it's release date. Even if it does have things like GW2, I don't think that is a bad thing. At least it's staying away from Borecraft. Let's hope it remains that way. From what I have seen, it is looking great. I won't speculate on how it will truly will be because I have no idea, just like none of you do. (Unless they are doing alpha testing that noone knows about). Don't forget, Matt Firor is leading this. I don't think it will disappoint at all (opinion wise). I know for one that I am looking forward to it, regardless of game bandwagon propaganda.

     

  • Caliburn101Caliburn101 LondonPosts: 636Member
    Originally posted by hikaru77
    Originally posted by Destai
    I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.

    GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all. 

    This is an entirely unsupportable statement which has been disproven again and again on these forums.

    I am not a GW2 'fanboi' - I don't play GW2 anymore. But that's because it's set in a 'popcorn and bubblegum' world, not because it was a copy of the average to crapola games mentioned (except for DaoC ofc).

    Dynamic events and the fluid combat are both excellent in GW2, and they made a non-trinity model really work.

    So yes it was a push forwards, in all kinds of ways - it just didn't come together as a whole for me due to the fluff and the lack of guild features and support.

  • Rthuth434Rthuth434 uniondale, NYPosts: 346Member
    Originally posted by Caliburn101
    Originally posted by hikaru77
    Originally posted by Destai
    I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.

    GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all. 

    This is an entirely unsupportable statement which has been disproven again and again on these forums.

    I am not a GW2 'fanboi' - I don't play GW2 anymore. But that's because it's set in a 'popcorn and bubblegum' world, not because it was a copy of the average to crapola games mentioned (except for DaoC ofc).

    Dynamic events and the fluid combat are both excellent in GW2, and they made a non-trinity model really work.

    So yes it was a push forwards, in all kinds of ways - it just didn't come together as a whole for me due to the fluff and the lack of guild features and support.

    stroll throuh hikaru's post history.

  • PurutzilPurutzil East Stroudsburg, PAPosts: 2,924Member Uncommon

    ... Guildwars 2 didn't invent the system WvW used at all... that and its only 1 feature of the game....

     

    Do you know what an actual 'clone' of a game is?

  • botrytisbotrytis In Flux, MIPosts: 2,567Member
    Originally posted by boxsnd
    But GW2 copied a lot of things from other games too. WvW from DAoC/WAR, sPvP from WoW arenas/bgs, dynamic events from WAR/RIFT etc. 

    No - copied from GW1. GW1 had arenas BEFORE WoW. GW2 was planned with dynamic events before Rift was even a glint in the developers eye also. HoH in GW1 was 3 teams playing against each other - WvWvW is just bigger.

     

    Rift DE's are not dynamic - they happen every day at the same time (they are scripted).

     

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    "In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
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  • FoxxenFoxxen Fort Worth, TXPosts: 20Member

    Where to begin.....

    GW2 pretty much sucks after you reach a certain point.  All it is is the same thing, zone after zone after zone.  That's definitely not going to be for ESO.  I've 3 max leveled characters in GW2, played GW1 till I had 9 level 20's with 4 of them all geared with all the fancy faction armors and so on....  Just like GW1, GW2 got boring fast.  Fun to play but gets boring.  They didn't do ANYTHING that I would call over the top in innovation for MMO's.   Warhammer Online had Dynamic events before either Rift or GW2 and the problem with them is the same across the bored.  People just aren't all that interested in most of them.  There was nothing truely rewarding about them and their dungeon system is no different.  They just reinvented the GRIND was all they did.

    ESO isn't without flaws already, I have my gripes with it as well and it's not even out.  Like I don't care for the way they're doing the Class thing based on Race.  I'd rather them give you the choice of a Race to play, level to a certain point in a Racial Starting Zone.  Then say at 15 or 20 you have to decide which side of the fence you're playing on.  From that point on you're permanently on that side with that character, no going back once you make your decision.  This would have let the players get to play the Race they want without having to worry or not about which side their friends had chosen.  Which is how the Elder Scrolls games have always been.  You chose your race, then later you picked your side to follow.  This is the biggest gripe I have which to some will be looked at as minor.

    The other thing I'd like to point out about all the hotbar gripes, of ESO having one to begin with.  All a hotbar is, is a set of skills that are -HOTKEYED- onto those keys.  Which you did in Skyrim and previous games.  Just you could not visually see them on your screen which ment you had to memorize them well.  So the gripes about this game having one is stupid.  More than likely you can turn the UI off like in other games and not worry about it? Who knows, but it's no different than hotkeyed skills just you can visually see them.  Big deal!

    Quite frankly I have worries over this stupid Mega Server System, I see nothing but bad coming from this.  Yeah looks good, sounds good, on paper and on their limited amount of people at this time having access to it.  But we all know when you put everyone on basically one big server, cluster or whatever and have it all tied together with thousands of other players.  It normally causes a lot more problems once something like this goes live than it ever even was thought of while they are testing it and using it as it is currently.  So I do worry about that.

    The other thing I don't like is the Zerg-Fest mantality this game ( As did GW2 and Rift ) promotes.  Just means all this game is looking to be is another one of those play it for a month and beat the end game scenarios.  That is NOT what an MMORPG should ever have become but today's lazy players want everything handed to them so that is what these game companies now cater to.  Quick buck, turn around rinse and repeate.  When you pretty much make it so people can share kills without grouping and get full experience and rewards, all they do is zerg the entire game to  the end and wala!  Completed in no time without any major challenge once so ever.  Now I can't say that ESO is going to be like this, all I am saying is from what I've read and heard from others posting that is what we're heading for.

    This is why I'd rather had Elder Scrolls just have a bloody Multiplayer ability to games like Skyrim where the game would have a host server or you could host it yourself and have 2 to 3 others join your game and just have the game become a tad harder for every extra person over you joining.  That would have been PERFECT for Skyrim, I hope they do it for ESVI because MMO's in my opinion are becoming so short lived they're not worth the money anymore.  They might as well hand you a fully leveled and decently geared character at the start and be done with it.  Because lately that's all the MMO's are worth.

    I've been in MMO's since 2001, started with DAoC, did WoW, LotRO, AoC, SWG, SWTOR, Vanguard ( Which was great for a while ), RIFT, Lineage II, Warhammer Online along with countless others I've been in Beta with and tried out for a free month and just could not stand them.  Now I understand something that others do not wish to.  No game company is ever going to please everyone, so I wish they'd stop trying to.  in the early days of gaming, this goes for all games, not just MMORPG's...  When you got a preview copy, trial, whatever you wish to call it, you could play a little of it and decide if you were going to be interested enogh to buy it or not.  Once you bought the game, you could get a lot further, but at least you got a good enough start in it to find out if you liked it or not.

    Point I'm trying to make, no game should be tailored to a majority of anything.  It should be designed from the ground up to be DIFFERENT and CHALLENGING in it's own UNIQUE way.  If the player doesn't like it?  They don't buy it, they get one they do like and play that one.  Game companies need to get off of this Quantity over Quality and go back to the old ways of doing these games.  Then they'll last longer than a month, have far less bugs, become far more in-depth, have far more options for players that are of the most demanding in skill and want the best.  Not just settle for whatever a COMPANY says is or claims is the best just because they make it.

    Lastly, I do hope that ESO is a lot better than what I'm feeling it is as of this time.  I absolutely LOVE Elder Scrolls, I've almost 900 hours played in Skyrim alone and still playing it.  I have the same with Oblivion, fixing to start playing Morrowind, but I've been an RPG fan for decades.  I've done D&D Table Top, loved the Forgotten Realms games, I love a lot of lore, detail, exploration, crafting, questing, I love it all and a lot.  So here is to hoping for the best for ESO, I'm just not going to hold my breath on it.....

    Guild Leader

    The Order of Sanity

  • Eir_SEir_S Argyle, NYPosts: 4,623Member

    I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet.  Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".

    Pretty naive if you ask me.  If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen.  And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.

  • LeucentLeucent Penticton, BCPosts: 2,371Member
    I sure hope it isn't. That would be a big downer.
  • winterwinter El Paso, TXPosts: 2,276Member Uncommon

     Hehe you knew it was only time before every new MMo coming out was gonna be refer to as a GW2.

    WoW is so 2010.

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