Give the players the ability to run their own servers.
I really don't know what the big hurdle is there. 4th Coming offered that well over a decade ago, and barely anyone else has tried it since.
Well SWG, CoX, and Tabula Rasa shouldve offered it tbh.
''/\/\'' Posted using Iphone bunni ( o.o) (")(") **This bunny was cloned from bunnies belonging to Gobla and is part of the Quizzical Fanclub and the The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club**
Originally posted by Castillle Most important feature of all : Give the players the ability to run their own servers.
I really don't know what the big hurdle is there. 4th Coming offered that well over a decade ago, and barely anyone else has tried it since.
Well SWG, CoX, and Tabula Rasa shouldve offered it tbh.
The problem* with them doing this now is that they are built to run as a set of servers, not as a single server on a single machine. They can spend the time developing for a massive number of players, or a number of players limited by the memory and processing power available on a single machine. They choose the massively side.
I can't think of an MMO where it wouldn't be cool to have my own server, where I could invite my friends to play. Especially if the server let me tweak things and even mod the available content.
* I guess the real problem is they are no longer running, but you know what I mean.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I have my own project, only it will not be a game but like virtual world with game spaces inside it (looking if it interesting and how much can it cost).
As games I guess if instate make more crap they could re-look WoW, may be change just a few, add some features (like may be revamp PvP, make housing and mini games inside this great game).
I would love also to develop GW line and forget about GW2 same time. This project has capacity to became great game but need almost total revamp, I keep asking to myself why A-net killed such great game(s).
Last of my though is about cool browser game similar to runsecape of many years ago (with unique quests story, sense of humor, and, sure, wildness), only I'll never make it such grind-fest, will try to use best graphic and make it fun rather then money making space.
try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises. Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2
Start with character creation. I would like the something complex character creation with sliders for everything. Lots of different hair styles/colors with sliders for all options. There is no reason why we couldn't all have unique toons.
Themepark or sandbox? A combination of both sounds about right, a la EQ. No more "?" above quest givers heads, make it so the players have to interact with environment to discover quests. interactive housing where I can change everything along with decorating/displaying my trophies. Real death penalties like having to do corpse runs naked to recover my gear then have it damaged and in need of repair. Bring back KOS. For those that might not know, that's Kill On Sight for going into an opposing factions area by NPCs. Open world without invisible walls. Reward exploration with XP and discovery of quests, dungeons, etc. Allow for skill progression along the lines of the Elder Scrolls.
Absolutely no group finder, chat bubbles, gear score, and keep instances to a bare minimum. Dungeons should be contested. I used to hate this, but now that it is almost lost, I miss camps and the dreaded "TRAIN!!!!!!" In the chat window. Sure there were fights back then, but this forced the players to OMG talk to each other!
for a setting, lets go Sci Fi. There are plenty of fantasy games out there so I'd like to see something along the lines of a Road Warrior style MMO with mutant races. It would be post apocalyptic after all. Name, I suck at names so I'd leave that to them. But I always liked the old drivers ed video Bloody Asphalt.
Originally posted by jimdandy26 That simply wouldn't happen. Its like going to LA and having someone walk up to you off the street and ask if you have a great idea for a movie cause they are fresh out. Whats more, considering that the majority of the playerbase is not capable of seperating systems from gameplay all you will be getting is laundry lists of random crap, like "Its going to have the housing from Swg, but action combat like Tera, and puzzle quests like TSW that all spawn dynamically like Rift! Oh and its sandbox (cause this is mmorpg.com, home of the sandbox!) and graphics like Gw2!". Your question, while not bad, you can already find plastered all over the forums by armchair developers who honestly do not know their ass from a hole in the ground.
Get off your high horse, it was a simple question, do you really think he anticipated a developer doing this? It's a fun thread to discuss what your perfect MMO looks like. If you didn't want to get involved next time don't bother posting.
See, you are the very reasons why these sorts of threads never actually go anywhere. Look at your suggestion! FFA, is pretty obvious, but why full loot? Is it because your first game was UO and you want to go home again? I have played Shadowbane, Darkfall, UO, Mortal Online, Eve Online. Is it because you want "meaningful" pvp? Of course I want meaningful pvp, I want dynamic pvp, concequences, I want to fight over something with my guild at my back. Have you never played a system that doesn't have anything but a full loot system, Ie no other games interest you but the ones that have included that? I have played More MMORPGs than most people, I started in 2000, and have played nearly every tripple A release since then. Do you just enjoy the negative aspects of it? Ie "rape and pillage"?You know very little of what makes a sandbox gamer tick. We long for that massive scale guild versus guild battle, my guild in particular has always remained smaller, we enjoy fighting the zergs and coming out ontop. The fun factor for us is the adrenalin rush of the fight, the chance to lose gear, how much more important every move you make becomes because that risk hovers above your head. You obviously haven't really invested time in a FFA system if you ask that question, in your mind it's nothing but bloodshed, yet in ALL sandboxes, we have the reds, and the blues, and fighting as a blue can be a whole lot of good fun, nothing ruining the day of another guy who came to ruin someone elses day.
I am more than willing to bet that if everything you asked for was actually put into a game you would not actually enjoy it. or it would only hold your attention for a brief time. I say this because rarely do the players actually know what they want with a title. They forget the little things that actually keep them playing. The saying "everything in moderation" is very true in that too much of any one kind of activity will dull whatever that activity does for you. Games are much the same way, as its very often the very smallest of things that actually keep us playing. The changes to the genre over the years have really changed a large many from staying with the same game for meaningful amounts of time, and even when we do, its often for a specific thing that the devs themselves keep us moderated on. Many call this behavior content locusts but in all honesty I feel its more a response on how developers have created content. You cannot blame it on options, as even back in the day you had those, with Ac, Uo, Eq, Daoc, Lineage, Ao etc, yet you did not see the surges between games and content patches that you see today. This thread in general is worse than masturbation, as that atleast makes you feel good. The best that can be hoped to gain from this is a reinforcement that what you want is what the market should do, which is virtually every way is incorrect.
I'll respond to that second paragraph here. I have already played such a game as the one i describe, Shadowbane, UO, Darkfall, Eve Online. You have made an assumption and like most assumptions was wrong. Of course people know what they want in a title. Do I like raiding? Yes. Would I like it in another game? Yes. You are sorely mistaken, of course people know what they want, in your mind do developers hold some secret power over the minds of us all? Have your never stopped to think about what you want for your self. No it isn't the smallest of things that keeps someone playing, that's drivel, the core features keep someone playing. I don't play Vanguard because it lacks pvp. I stopped short of end game in FFXI because it lacked any kind of player versus player.
Let me ask you a question, name EVERY sandbox you have played, and explain where this idea formulated from that the world has nothing but rape and pillaging around every corner? Eve Online is one of the few MMOs to grow over the years since its release, it has time and again increased its subscription base yet has everything you believe is wrong in an MMO, an MMO I have played since 2007.
You sir are a sheep, who flocks to the next big title, because in your mind you dont know what you want, so might as well try them all regardless.
Ha Ha Ha.. I'd have better luck from a genie in the bottle..
I don't see it happening.. Today's devs are much like politicians.. They spend way too much time discussing ideas and plans then actually "WORKING".. I've never seen an industry so filled with lazy idea makers, then workers.. This hive needs more worker bees, and less queens.. I have heard and read countless interviews and I'm not impressed.. Anyways..
I'd probably kick him in the balls because I know he would ignore what I say and make a steaming pile of crap WoW clone like Swtor
SWTOR is an exception to the rule. Since Bioware was trying to make a Multiplayer KoTOR with a game world. Not knowing to them that there is more to MMORPG, then just being a multiplayer single playerRPG.
Also anything else you'd like to see in YOUR MMO, IM erger to hear what poeples ideas would be
btw im not a developer or anything like this i'd just like to know whats everyones dream mmo would be and what everyone wants these days
Personally im old school and i want a turn-based mmo like the FF series from the snes days... but thats just me
Once again this is YOUR mmo it can be anything u want not just the ones i listed
Cheers :-)
If the Dev/Company wants to make truckloads of money then I'd have to decline.
That's mainly because I'd like to experiment with P&P/Tabletop rulesets and try to not make too many compromises to make it as viable as a mainstream MMO. Making believable NPCs/AI would as well require too much dev time (scripting events/reactions is so old school). In the end such a game wouldn't really work with the numbers of players that most companys are targeting at (for sake of profitability). Rather it would end up similar to a NWN1/2 PW.
Declining such a tempting offer and realizing the idea as an open source/pet project is a more realistic approach.
I'd say make DAOC 2 or its spiritual equivalent based roughly on how that game was like from release through the SI expansion. That comes closest to the kind of MMO I'd like to play. You'd have:
3 sides each with their own set of classes and races
housing
crafted gear that you could customize with spellcrafting
a few optional end game PvE raids where the gear rewards would not be mandatory to compete in RvR
battleground RvR for sub-50s
frontier RvR for 50s with relics, realm points, realm titles, and realm abilities
You could add a few later features such as horses, faster leveling, battleground quests, buff NPCs, plus things they never got around to like in game mail. But the important thing would be to keep the infinite progression and sandbox nature of RvR while leaving out the gear grind they decided to add in later expansions to chase after EQ and WOW subscribers.
Originally posted by jimdandy26 That simply wouldn't happen. Its like going to LA and having someone walk up to you off the street and ask if you have a great idea for a movie cause they are fresh out. Whats more, considering that the majority of the playerbase is not capable of seperating systems from gameplay all you will be getting is laundry lists of random crap, like "Its going to have the housing from Swg, but action combat like Tera, and puzzle quests like TSW that all spawn dynamically like Rift! Oh and its sandbox (cause this is mmorpg.com, home of the sandbox!) and graphics like Gw2!". Your question, while not bad, you can already find plastered all over the forums by armchair developers who honestly do not know their ass from a hole in the ground.
Get off your high horse, it was a simple question, do you really think he anticipated a developer doing this? It's a fun thread to discuss what your perfect MMO looks like. If you didn't want to get involved next time don't bother posting.
See, you are the very reasons why these sorts of threads never actually go anywhere. Look at your suggestion! FFA, is pretty obvious, but why full loot? Is it because your first game was UO and you want to go home again? I have played Shadowbane, Darkfall, UO, Mortal Online, Eve Online. Is it because you want "meaningful" pvp? Of course I want meaningful pvp, I want dynamic pvp, concequences, I want to fight over something with my guild at my back. Have you never played a system that doesn't have anything but a full loot system, Ie no other games interest you but the ones that have included that? I have played More MMORPGs than most people, I started in 2000, and have played nearly every tripple A release since then. Do you just enjoy the negative aspects of it? Ie "rape and pillage"?You know very little of what makes a sandbox gamer tick. We long for that massive scale guild versus guild battle, my guild in particular has always remained smaller, we enjoy fighting the zergs and coming out ontop. The fun factor for us is the adrenalin rush of the fight, the chance to lose gear, how much more important every move you make becomes because that risk hovers above your head. You obviously haven't really invested time in a FFA system if you ask that question, in your mind it's nothing but bloodshed, yet in ALL sandboxes, we have the reds, and the blues, and fighting as a blue can be a whole lot of good fun, nothing ruining the day of another guy who came to ruin someone elses day.
I am more than willing to bet that if everything you asked for was actually put into a game you would not actually enjoy it. or it would only hold your attention for a brief time. I say this because rarely do the players actually know what they want with a title. They forget the little things that actually keep them playing. The saying "everything in moderation" is very true in that too much of any one kind of activity will dull whatever that activity does for you. Games are much the same way, as its very often the very smallest of things that actually keep us playing. The changes to the genre over the years have really changed a large many from staying with the same game for meaningful amounts of time, and even when we do, its often for a specific thing that the devs themselves keep us moderated on. Many call this behavior content locusts but in all honesty I feel its more a response on how developers have created content. You cannot blame it on options, as even back in the day you had those, with Ac, Uo, Eq, Daoc, Lineage, Ao etc, yet you did not see the surges between games and content patches that you see today. This thread in general is worse than masturbation, as that atleast makes you feel good. The best that can be hoped to gain from this is a reinforcement that what you want is what the market should do, which is virtually every way is incorrect.
I'll respond to that second paragraph here. I have already played such a game as the one i describe, Shadowbane, UO, Darkfall, Eve Online. You have made an assumption and like most assumptions was wrong. Of course people know what they want in a title. Do I like raiding? Yes. Would I like it in another game? Yes. You are sorely mistaken, of course people know what they want, in your mind do developers hold some secret power over the minds of us all? Have your never stopped to think about what you want for your self. No it isn't the smallest of things that keeps someone playing, that's drivel, the core features keep someone playing. I don't play Vanguard because it lacks pvp. I stopped short of end game in FFXI because it lacked any kind of player versus player.
Let me ask you a question, name EVERY sandbox you have played, and explain where this idea formulated from that the world has nothing but rape and pillaging around every corner? Eve Online is one of the few MMOs to grow over the years since its release, it has time and again increased its subscription base yet has everything you believe is wrong in an MMO, an MMO I have played since 2007.
You sir are a sheep, who flocks to the next big title, because in your mind you dont know what you want, so might as well try them all regardless.
For someone who went out of their way to respond (and insult! kudos!) you completely missed my point. I honestly find it amusing that you actually answered my rhetorical questions, lol! The point of those first questions was an attempt to make you actually think about WHY you demand full loot. Your answer is actually pretty funny since generally speaking full loot systems are far less gear reliant because of the gear drop. Its almost always fairly easy to replace. Not to say there are not peices of gear that give you slight advantages (high quality level) but in the grand scheme its so minor that the bonuses are not statistically relevent. I mean honestly, accusing me of making an assumption (I didn't, perhaps you should reread and make the attempt to comprehend) and then turn around and make one yourself is pretty laughable. I do not mind full loot system (I have played Eve of and on since 2004) and I too have played pretty much every noteworthy title thats been around (it helps having a very good friend who has been in the game reviewing industry for some time, not a "sheep" as you say, LOL) often for many different reasons. Some because something interested me (I love new things, even if they are variations) or because friends were playing, or just to see what all of the hullabaloo was about. Many of those games I have even made it to max level in, basking in the stories and systems those developers have told. I mean actually look at your answers! You state inconsistancies like you are in it for the fight, but its only rewarding with full loot, when that is NOT the only system that large percentages of the playerbase find "meaningful" (I truly hate that word because in this context its actually meaningless), as you can see by any ladder system. LoL does not have full loot drop, many consider it meaningful, same with Sc2, WoW, Ps2, etc etc. I mean you even go so far as to say that FF11 did not have pvp, when it did, just not pvp that you particularly enjoyed (any competition between 2 people/groups is a form of pvp, and fighting over spawns and bosses most certainly was a competition).
I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.
To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.
Also anything else you'd like to see in YOUR MMO, IM erger to hear what poeples ideas would be
btw im not a developer or anything like this i'd just like to know whats everyones dream mmo would be and what everyone wants these days
Personally im old school and i want a turn-based mmo like the FF series from the snes days... but thats just me
Once again this is YOUR mmo it can be anything u want not just the ones i listed
Cheers :-)
Sandox: Wild West MMORPG Let's call it "Way of the Gun"
Based in the Old West (Obviously), encompassing the areas north to south (Lower Canada to Mexico), and east to west (Mississippi River to the Pacific Ocean). This area would be VAST.
You could be Caucasian, African American, Mexican, or any of the various types of American Indians of the day (Sioux, Cheyenne, etc.) From here, you are plopped into the world depending on your race selection. From there, you are on your own.
You can be anything or do anything. Be a...
Bank Robber, Train Robber, Horse Thief, Wrangler, Gun Slinger, Saloon Owner, Farmer, Blacksmith, Tailor, lead a gang you make or be in one, Sherriff, Deputy, Bounty Hunter, Indian fighting for your land and survival, U.S. Calvaryman, etc. All buildings and shops would have the jobs available in those days available to players to do. Any jobs not occupied by a Player will be assumed by an NPC.
First or third person shooter. No rules but those made by the players, just as it was in the Wild West. Player made towns that can be set up anywhere (Namely around resources like rivers, lakes, areas for mines, etc).
VAST character creation options and clothing options. Think Red Dead Redemption MMO and then some.
kinda like "red dead redemtion"?? when i had that game before i traded it in i always thought that would be a great setting for a mmo :-) nice one
Start with character creation. I would like the something complex character creation with sliders for everything. Lots of different hair styles/colors with sliders for all options. There is no reason why we couldn't all have unique toons.
Themepark or sandbox? A combination of both sounds about right, a la EQ. No more "?" above quest givers heads, make it so the players have to interact with environment to discover quests. interactive housing where I can change everything along with decorating/displaying my trophies. Real death penalties like having to do corpse runs naked to recover my gear then have it damaged and in need of repair. Bring back KOS. For those that might not know, that's Kill On Sight for going into an opposing factions area by NPCs. Open world without invisible walls. Reward exploration with XP and discovery of quests, dungeons, etc. Allow for skill progression along the lines of the Elder Scrolls.
Absolutely no group finder, chat bubbles, gear score, and keep instances to a bare minimum. Dungeons should be contested. I used to hate this, but now that it is almost lost, I miss camps and the dreaded "TRAIN!!!!!!" In the chat window. Sure there were fights back then, but this forced the players to OMG talk to each other!
for a setting, lets go Sci Fi. There are plenty of fantasy games out there so I'd like to see something along the lines of a Road Warrior style MMO with mutant races. It would be post apocalyptic after all. Name, I suck at names so I'd leave that to them. But I always liked the old drivers ed video Bloody Asphalt.
Cheers and OMG yes i hated invisable walls your imersion would die so quickly... i remember exploring places like in EQ and even the most recent GW2 and id b hitting walls... so annoying nice imput mate :-)
Originally posted by jimdandy26 That simply wouldn't happen. Its like going to LA and having someone walk up to you off the street and ask if you have a great idea for a movie cause they are fresh out. Whats more, considering that the majority of the playerbase is not capable of seperating systems from gameplay all you will be getting is laundry lists of random crap, like "Its going to have the housing from Swg, but action combat like Tera, and puzzle quests like TSW that all spawn dynamically like Rift! Oh and its sandbox (cause this is mmorpg.com, home of the sandbox!) and graphics like Gw2!". Your question, while not bad, you can already find plastered all over the forums by armchair developers who honestly do not know their ass from a hole in the ground.
Get off your high horse, it was a simple question, do you really think he anticipated a developer doing this? It's a fun thread to discuss what your perfect MMO looks like. If you didn't want to get involved next time don't bother posting.
See, you are the very reasons why these sorts of threads never actually go anywhere. Look at your suggestion! FFA, is pretty obvious, but why full loot? Is it because your first game was UO and you want to go home again? I have played Shadowbane, Darkfall, UO, Mortal Online, Eve Online. Is it because you want "meaningful" pvp? Of course I want meaningful pvp, I want dynamic pvp, concequences, I want to fight over something with my guild at my back. Have you never played a system that doesn't have anything but a full loot system, Ie no other games interest you but the ones that have included that? I have played More MMORPGs than most people, I started in 2000, and have played nearly every tripple A release since then. Do you just enjoy the negative aspects of it? Ie "rape and pillage"?You know very little of what makes a sandbox gamer tick. We long for that massive scale guild versus guild battle, my guild in particular has always remained smaller, we enjoy fighting the zergs and coming out ontop. The fun factor for us is the adrenalin rush of the fight, the chance to lose gear, how much more important every move you make becomes because that risk hovers above your head. You obviously haven't really invested time in a FFA system if you ask that question, in your mind it's nothing but bloodshed, yet in ALL sandboxes, we have the reds, and the blues, and fighting as a blue can be a whole lot of good fun, nothing ruining the day of another guy who came to ruin someone elses day.
I am more than willing to bet that if everything you asked for was actually put into a game you would not actually enjoy it. or it would only hold your attention for a brief time. I say this because rarely do the players actually know what they want with a title. They forget the little things that actually keep them playing. The saying "everything in moderation" is very true in that too much of any one kind of activity will dull whatever that activity does for you. Games are much the same way, as its very often the very smallest of things that actually keep us playing. The changes to the genre over the years have really changed a large many from staying with the same game for meaningful amounts of time, and even when we do, its often for a specific thing that the devs themselves keep us moderated on. Many call this behavior content locusts but in all honesty I feel its more a response on how developers have created content. You cannot blame it on options, as even back in the day you had those, with Ac, Uo, Eq, Daoc, Lineage, Ao etc, yet you did not see the surges between games and content patches that you see today. This thread in general is worse than masturbation, as that atleast makes you feel good. The best that can be hoped to gain from this is a reinforcement that what you want is what the market should do, which is virtually every way is incorrect.
I'll respond to that second paragraph here. I have already played such a game as the one i describe, Shadowbane, UO, Darkfall, Eve Online. You have made an assumption and like most assumptions was wrong. Of course people know what they want in a title. Do I like raiding? Yes. Would I like it in another game? Yes. You are sorely mistaken, of course people know what they want, in your mind do developers hold some secret power over the minds of us all? Have your never stopped to think about what you want for your self. No it isn't the smallest of things that keeps someone playing, that's drivel, the core features keep someone playing. I don't play Vanguard because it lacks pvp. I stopped short of end game in FFXI because it lacked any kind of player versus player.
Let me ask you a question, name EVERY sandbox you have played, and explain where this idea formulated from that the world has nothing but rape and pillaging around every corner? Eve Online is one of the few MMOs to grow over the years since its release, it has time and again increased its subscription base yet has everything you believe is wrong in an MMO, an MMO I have played since 2007.
You sir are a sheep, who flocks to the next big title, because in your mind you dont know what you want, so might as well try them all regardless.
For someone who went out of their way to respond (and insult! kudos!) you completely missed my point. I honestly find it amusing that you actually answered my rhetorical questions, lol! The point of those first questions was an attempt to make you actually think about WHY you demand full loot. Your answer is actually pretty funny since generally speaking full loot systems are far less gear reliant because of the gear drop. Its almost always fairly easy to replace. Not to say there are not peices of gear that give you slight advantages (high quality level) but in the grand scheme its so minor that the bonuses are not statistically relevent. I mean honestly, accusing me of making an assumption (I didn't, perhaps you should reread and make the attempt to comprehend) and then turn around and make one yourself is pretty laughable. I do not mind full loot system (I have played Eve of and on since 2004) and I too have played pretty much every noteworthy title thats been around (it helps having a very good friend who has been in the game reviewing industry for some time, not a "sheep" as you say, LOL) often for many different reasons. Some because something interested me (I love new things, even if they are variations) or because friends were playing, or just to see what all of the hullabaloo was about. Many of those games I have even made it to max level in, basking in the stories and systems those developers have told. I mean actually look at your answers! You state inconsistancies like you are in it for the fight, but its only rewarding with full loot, when that is NOT the only system that large percentages of the playerbase find "meaningful" (I truly hate that word because in this context its actually meaningless), as you can see by any ladder system. LoL does not have full loot drop, many consider it meaningful, same with Sc2, WoW, Ps2, etc etc. I mean you even go so far as to say that FF11 did not have pvp, when it did, just not pvp that you particularly enjoyed (any competition between 2 people/groups is a form of pvp, and fighting over spawns and bosses most certainly was a competition).
wow i read through like 2/3 of your reponses mate, and you've taken this like i've killed a small kitten or something, it was a simple question and a bit of fun, and you've responded like its a policitical question...chill down and don't take it personaial like your seeming like it is... its a MMO site talking about MMO's thats all plain and simple so lets talk MMO's aye?
Originally posted by jimdandy26 That simply wouldn't happen. Its like going to LA and having someone walk up to you off the street and ask if you have a great idea for a movie cause they are fresh out. Whats more, considering that the majority of the playerbase is not capable of seperating systems from gameplay all you will be getting is laundry lists of random crap, like "Its going to have the housing from Swg, but action combat like Tera, and puzzle quests like TSW that all spawn dynamically like Rift! Oh and its sandbox (cause this is mmorpg.com, home of the sandbox!) and graphics like Gw2!". Your question, while not bad, you can already find plastered all over the forums by armchair developers who honestly do not know their ass from a hole in the ground.
Get off your high horse, it was a simple question, do you really think he anticipated a developer doing this? It's a fun thread to discuss what your perfect MMO looks like. If you didn't want to get involved next time don't bother posting.
See, you are the very reasons why these sorts of threads never actually go anywhere. Look at your suggestion! FFA, is pretty obvious, but why full loot? Is it because your first game was UO and you want to go home again? I have played Shadowbane, Darkfall, UO, Mortal Online, Eve Online. Is it because you want "meaningful" pvp? Of course I want meaningful pvp, I want dynamic pvp, concequences, I want to fight over something with my guild at my back. Have you never played a system that doesn't have anything but a full loot system, Ie no other games interest you but the ones that have included that? I have played More MMORPGs than most people, I started in 2000, and have played nearly every tripple A release since then. Do you just enjoy the negative aspects of it? Ie "rape and pillage"?You know very little of what makes a sandbox gamer tick. We long for that massive scale guild versus guild battle, my guild in particular has always remained smaller, we enjoy fighting the zergs and coming out ontop. The fun factor for us is the adrenalin rush of the fight, the chance to lose gear, how much more important every move you make becomes because that risk hovers above your head. You obviously haven't really invested time in a FFA system if you ask that question, in your mind it's nothing but bloodshed, yet in ALL sandboxes, we have the reds, and the blues, and fighting as a blue can be a whole lot of good fun, nothing ruining the day of another guy who came to ruin someone elses day.
I am more than willing to bet that if everything you asked for was actually put into a game you would not actually enjoy it. or it would only hold your attention for a brief time. I say this because rarely do the players actually know what they want with a title. They forget the little things that actually keep them playing. The saying "everything in moderation" is very true in that too much of any one kind of activity will dull whatever that activity does for you. Games are much the same way, as its very often the very smallest of things that actually keep us playing. The changes to the genre over the years have really changed a large many from staying with the same game for meaningful amounts of time, and even when we do, its often for a specific thing that the devs themselves keep us moderated on. Many call this behavior content locusts but in all honesty I feel its more a response on how developers have created content. You cannot blame it on options, as even back in the day you had those, with Ac, Uo, Eq, Daoc, Lineage, Ao etc, yet you did not see the surges between games and content patches that you see today. This thread in general is worse than masturbation, as that atleast makes you feel good. The best that can be hoped to gain from this is a reinforcement that what you want is what the market should do, which is virtually every way is incorrect.
I'll respond to that second paragraph here. I have already played such a game as the one i describe, Shadowbane, UO, Darkfall, Eve Online. You have made an assumption and like most assumptions was wrong. Of course people know what they want in a title. Do I like raiding? Yes. Would I like it in another game? Yes. You are sorely mistaken, of course people know what they want, in your mind do developers hold some secret power over the minds of us all? Have your never stopped to think about what you want for your self. No it isn't the smallest of things that keeps someone playing, that's drivel, the core features keep someone playing. I don't play Vanguard because it lacks pvp. I stopped short of end game in FFXI because it lacked any kind of player versus player.
Let me ask you a question, name EVERY sandbox you have played, and explain where this idea formulated from that the world has nothing but rape and pillaging around every corner? Eve Online is one of the few MMOs to grow over the years since its release, it has time and again increased its subscription base yet has everything you believe is wrong in an MMO, an MMO I have played since 2007.
You sir are a sheep, who flocks to the next big title, because in your mind you dont know what you want, so might as well try them all regardless.
For someone who went out of their way to respond (and insult! kudos!) you completely missed my point. I honestly find it amusing that you actually answered my rhetorical questions, lol! The point of those first questions was an attempt to make you actually think about WHY you demand full loot. Your answer is actually pretty funny since generally speaking full loot systems are far less gear reliant because of the gear drop. Its almost always fairly easy to replace. Not to say there are not peices of gear that give you slight advantages (high quality level) but in the grand scheme its so minor that the bonuses are not statistically relevent. I mean honestly, accusing me of making an assumption (I didn't, perhaps you should reread and make the attempt to comprehend) and then turn around and make one yourself is pretty laughable. I do not mind full loot system (I have played Eve of and on since 2004) and I too have played pretty much every noteworthy title thats been around (it helps having a very good friend who has been in the game reviewing industry for some time, not a "sheep" as you say, LOL) often for many different reasons. Some because something interested me (I love new things, even if they are variations) or because friends were playing, or just to see what all of the hullabaloo was about. Many of those games I have even made it to max level in, basking in the stories and systems those developers have told. I mean actually look at your answers! You state inconsistancies like you are in it for the fight, but its only rewarding with full loot, when that is NOT the only system that large percentages of the playerbase find "meaningful" (I truly hate that word because in this context its actually meaningless), as you can see by any ladder system. LoL does not have full loot drop, many consider it meaningful, same with Sc2, WoW, Ps2, etc etc. I mean you even go so far as to say that FF11 did not have pvp, when it did, just not pvp that you particularly enjoyed (any competition between 2 people/groups is a form of pvp, and fighting over spawns and bosses most certainly was a competition).
What is rewarding is an opinion. My opinion is that full loot increases my adrenalin levels, makes the fight so much more entertaining knowing that I stand to lose so much more. To me, taking World of Warcraft as an example, bragging rights and a paltry amount of honor points is not in anyway rewarding.
Yes you are correct Final Fantasy XI had ballista, which was a joke. The game was not balanced around pvp, it was a mini-game, a side attraction. My brother had the skills and ability to face down absolute virtue and he himself states that Ballista is no kind of pvp, especially when you consider how a blue mage can shut down the entire thing, they have no equal, it isn't a true pvp system, more of a side attraction.
This thread was created, to ask everyone what their ideal MMO would be. I responded with mine, and you responded by telling me what I want isn't what I really want, and that what I want in an MMO is the reason this thread will go nowhere, when in actual fact people are happily discussing either what they would want in their MMO, and in other cases, questioning how likely it would be for someone to walk upto you in the street and ask you to create an MMO, not understandhing it was a hypothetical situation, used to facilitate discussion.
And yes I answered all your questions, what was rhetorical about them? Have I ever played a game with full loot? What is rhetorical about that? The question has an answer - yes. This is besides the point I did not make my post to argue about language, thread layout, understanding what is and isn't - this isn't an english paper. This thread is about what I want in an MMO, which so far you seem to have a problem with, or else you would not have quoted me initially in the first place.
To leave this pointless line of discussion behind, I will add to my original post with some extras about what I would like.
fully fleshed out housing, with the ability to organize furniture.
The ability to sit in chairs, a paltry thing I know, but I find it aids in my roleplaying, which I enjoy greatly.
It's pie in the sky because I know it leads to griefing - but the ability to drop items, not furniture, just look at Dawntide to see how well that went.
Significant GM presence in the world. Tera has this, their general chat on the pvp server always has a GM active.
Books! I love books in TES, I also love the way your could write your own in UO, would love to see that return.
Ships, from row boats upto galleons - I have been in the Archeage CBT5 and boats were an amazing element.
Aboslutely nothing immersion breaking - I hate fluff items like EQ2 for example is littered with, or the jump suits in Tera, I want to feel constantly immersed in my world.
Keep the mounts within the realms of normality. A giant cat cannot be mounted, its spine just wont allow it, leading to damage.
A quality UI, something I love World of Warcraft for, only when i can mod it however, my WoW UI is minimalistic but also makes use of some great mod features.
Addons - limited however in what they can achieve. Deadly Boss Mods isn't something I agree with.
Originally posted by kadepsyson So if you give players the ability to run their own servers, Minecraft style, how would this work with a subscription game?Just wondering.
You wouldn't have a subscription, or the server owner would pay a subscription so their server is shown to be authenticated. Same thing for players. Either you don't have a subscription at all, or end users pay a sub so that their client is authenticated.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
Originally posted by jimdandy26 That simply wouldn't happen. Its like going to LA and having someone walk up to you off the street and ask if you have a great idea for a movie cause they are fresh out. Whats more, considering that the majority of the playerbase is not capable of seperating systems from gameplay all you will be getting is laundry lists of random crap, like "Its going to have the housing from Swg, but action combat like Tera, and puzzle quests like TSW that all spawn dynamically like Rift! Oh and its sandbox (cause this is mmorpg.com, home of the sandbox!) and graphics like Gw2!". Your question, while not bad, you can already find plastered all over the forums by armchair developers who honestly do not know their ass from a hole in the ground.
Get off your high horse, it was a simple question, do you really think he anticipated a developer doing this? It's a fun thread to discuss what your perfect MMO looks like. If you didn't want to get involved next time don't bother posting.
See, you are the very reasons why these sorts of threads never actually go anywhere. Look at your suggestion! FFA, is pretty obvious, but why full loot? Is it because your first game was UO and you want to go home again? I have played Shadowbane, Darkfall, UO, Mortal Online, Eve Online. Is it because you want "meaningful" pvp? Of course I want meaningful pvp, I want dynamic pvp, concequences, I want to fight over something with my guild at my back. Have you never played a system that doesn't have anything but a full loot system, Ie no other games interest you but the ones that have included that? I have played More MMORPGs than most people, I started in 2000, and have played nearly every tripple A release since then. Do you just enjoy the negative aspects of it? Ie "rape and pillage"?You know very little of what makes a sandbox gamer tick. We long for that massive scale guild versus guild battle, my guild in particular has always remained smaller, we enjoy fighting the zergs and coming out ontop. The fun factor for us is the adrenalin rush of the fight, the chance to lose gear, how much more important every move you make becomes because that risk hovers above your head. You obviously haven't really invested time in a FFA system if you ask that question, in your mind it's nothing but bloodshed, yet in ALL sandboxes, we have the reds, and the blues, and fighting as a blue can be a whole lot of good fun, nothing ruining the day of another guy who came to ruin someone elses day.
I am more than willing to bet that if everything you asked for was actually put into a game you would not actually enjoy it. or it would only hold your attention for a brief time. I say this because rarely do the players actually know what they want with a title. They forget the little things that actually keep them playing. The saying "everything in moderation" is very true in that too much of any one kind of activity will dull whatever that activity does for you. Games are much the same way, as its very often the very smallest of things that actually keep us playing. The changes to the genre over the years have really changed a large many from staying with the same game for meaningful amounts of time, and even when we do, its often for a specific thing that the devs themselves keep us moderated on. Many call this behavior content locusts but in all honesty I feel its more a response on how developers have created content. You cannot blame it on options, as even back in the day you had those, with Ac, Uo, Eq, Daoc, Lineage, Ao etc, yet you did not see the surges between games and content patches that you see today. This thread in general is worse than masturbation, as that atleast makes you feel good. The best that can be hoped to gain from this is a reinforcement that what you want is what the market should do, which is virtually every way is incorrect.
I'll respond to that second paragraph here. I have already played such a game as the one i describe, Shadowbane, UO, Darkfall, Eve Online. You have made an assumption and like most assumptions was wrong. Of course people know what they want in a title. Do I like raiding? Yes. Would I like it in another game? Yes. You are sorely mistaken, of course people know what they want, in your mind do developers hold some secret power over the minds of us all? Have your never stopped to think about what you want for your self. No it isn't the smallest of things that keeps someone playing, that's drivel, the core features keep someone playing. I don't play Vanguard because it lacks pvp. I stopped short of end game in FFXI because it lacked any kind of player versus player.
Let me ask you a question, name EVERY sandbox you have played, and explain where this idea formulated from that the world has nothing but rape and pillaging around every corner? Eve Online is one of the few MMOs to grow over the years since its release, it has time and again increased its subscription base yet has everything you believe is wrong in an MMO, an MMO I have played since 2007.
You sir are a sheep, who flocks to the next big title, because in your mind you dont know what you want, so might as well try them all regardless.
For someone who went out of their way to respond (and insult! kudos!) you completely missed my point. I honestly find it amusing that you actually answered my rhetorical questions, lol! The point of those first questions was an attempt to make you actually think about WHY you demand full loot. Your answer is actually pretty funny since generally speaking full loot systems are far less gear reliant because of the gear drop. Its almost always fairly easy to replace. Not to say there are not peices of gear that give you slight advantages (high quality level) but in the grand scheme its so minor that the bonuses are not statistically relevent. I mean honestly, accusing me of making an assumption (I didn't, perhaps you should reread and make the attempt to comprehend) and then turn around and make one yourself is pretty laughable. I do not mind full loot system (I have played Eve of and on since 2004) and I too have played pretty much every noteworthy title thats been around (it helps having a very good friend who has been in the game reviewing industry for some time, not a "sheep" as you say, LOL) often for many different reasons. Some because something interested me (I love new things, even if they are variations) or because friends were playing, or just to see what all of the hullabaloo was about. Many of those games I have even made it to max level in, basking in the stories and systems those developers have told. I mean actually look at your answers! You state inconsistancies like you are in it for the fight, but its only rewarding with full loot, when that is NOT the only system that large percentages of the playerbase find "meaningful" (I truly hate that word because in this context its actually meaningless), as you can see by any ladder system. LoL does not have full loot drop, many consider it meaningful, same with Sc2, WoW, Ps2, etc etc. I mean you even go so far as to say that FF11 did not have pvp, when it did, just not pvp that you particularly enjoyed (any competition between 2 people/groups is a form of pvp, and fighting over spawns and bosses most certainly was a competition).
What is rewarding is an opinion. My opinion is that full loot increases my adrenalin levels, makes the fight so much more entertaining knowing that I stand to lose so much more. To me, taking World of Warcraft as an example, bragging rights and a paltry amount of honor points is not in anyway rewarding.
Yes you are correct Final Fantasy XI had ballista, which was a joke. The game was not balanced around pvp, it was a mini-game, a side attraction. My brother had the skills and ability to face down absolute virtue and he himself states that Ballista is no kind of pvp, especially when you consider how a blue mage can shut down the entire thing, they have no equal, it isn't a true pvp system, more of a side attraction.
This thread was created, to ask everyone what their ideal MMO would be. I responded with mine, and you responded by telling me what I want isn't what I really want, and that what I want in an MMO is the reason this thread will go nowhere, when in actual fact people are happily discussing either what they would want in their MMO, and in other cases, questioning how likely it would be for someone to walk upto you in the street and ask you to create an MMO, not understandhing it was a hypothetical situation, used to facilitate discussion.
And yes I answered all your questions, what was rhetorical about them? Have I ever played a game with full loot? What is rhetorical about that? The question has an answer - yes. This is besides the point I did not make my post to argue about language, thread layout, understanding what is and isn't - this isn't an english paper. This thread is about what I want in an MMO, which so far you seem to have a problem with, or else you would not have quoted me initially in the first place.
To leave this pointless line of discussion behind, I will add to my original post with some extras about what I would like.
fully fleshed out housing, with the ability to organize furniture.
The ability to sit in chairs, a paltry thing I know, but I find it aids in my roleplaying, which I enjoy greatly.
It's pie in the sky because I know it leads to griefing - but the ability to drop items, not furniture, just look at Dawntide to see how well that went.
Significant GM presence in the world. Tera has this, their general chat on the pvp server always has a GM active.
Books! I love books in TES, I also love the way your could write your own in UO, would love to see that return.
Ships, from row boats upto galleons - I have been in the Archeage CBT5 and boats were an amazing element.
Aboslutely nothing immersion breaking - I hate fluff items like EQ2 for example is littered with, or the jump suits in Tera, I want to feel constantly immersed in my world.
Keep the mounts within the realms of normality. A giant cat cannot be mounted, its spine just wont allow it, leading to damage.
A quality UI, something I love World of Warcraft for, only when i can mod it however, my WoW UI is minimalistic but also makes use of some great mod features.
Addons - limited however in what they can achieve. Deadly Boss Mods isn't something I agree with.
This response is what i wanted nothing else :-) whats your MMO called man!! it sounds awesome
Free for all, full loot, twitch based combat in the first person/third person, free form house building/city building, guild v guild city sieging system, No auction house, no instance, tradeskill supported, skill based horizontal progression system, no safe zones, group based progression, player generated quests that aren't exp rewarded, no questing to level system.
Fantasy Setting, subscription model.
Obviously a Sandbox.
Call it something like this,
Freedom.
Yup, that's it right there, but add perma-death to keep everyone honest.
Comments
Well SWG, CoX, and Tabula Rasa shouldve offered it tbh.
''/\/\'' Posted using Iphone bunni
( o.o)
(")(")
**This bunny was cloned from bunnies belonging to Gobla and is part of the Quizzical Fanclub and the The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club**
The problem* with them doing this now is that they are built to run as a set of servers, not as a single server on a single machine. They can spend the time developing for a massive number of players, or a number of players limited by the memory and processing power available on a single machine. They choose the massively side.
I can't think of an MMO where it wouldn't be cool to have my own server, where I could invite my friends to play. Especially if the server let me tweak things and even mod the available content.
* I guess the real problem is they are no longer running, but you know what I mean.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
I have my own project, only it will not be a game but like virtual world with game spaces inside it (looking if it interesting and how much can it cost).
As games I guess if instate make more crap they could re-look WoW, may be change just a few, add some features (like may be revamp PvP, make housing and mini games inside this great game).
I would love also to develop GW line and forget about GW2 same time. This project has capacity to became great game but need almost total revamp, I keep asking to myself why A-net killed such great game(s).
Last of my though is about cool browser game similar to runsecape of many years ago (with unique quests story, sense of humor, and, sure, wildness), only I'll never make it such grind-fest, will try to use best graphic and make it fun rather then money making space.
try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises.
Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2
So if you give players the ability to run their own servers, Minecraft style, how would this work with a subscription game?
Just wondering.
Hmm, good question there OP.
Start with character creation. I would like the something complex character creation with sliders for everything. Lots of different hair styles/colors with sliders for all options. There is no reason why we couldn't all have unique toons.
Themepark or sandbox? A combination of both sounds about right, a la EQ. No more "?" above quest givers heads, make it so the players have to interact with environment to discover quests. interactive housing where I can change everything along with decorating/displaying my trophies. Real death penalties like having to do corpse runs naked to recover my gear then have it damaged and in need of repair. Bring back KOS. For those that might not know, that's Kill On Sight for going into an opposing factions area by NPCs. Open world without invisible walls. Reward exploration with XP and discovery of quests, dungeons, etc. Allow for skill progression along the lines of the Elder Scrolls.
Absolutely no group finder, chat bubbles, gear score, and keep instances to a bare minimum. Dungeons should be contested. I used to hate this, but now that it is almost lost, I miss camps and the dreaded "TRAIN!!!!!!" In the chat window. Sure there were fights back then, but this forced the players to OMG talk to each other!
for a setting, lets go Sci Fi. There are plenty of fantasy games out there so I'd like to see something along the lines of a Road Warrior style MMO with mutant races. It would be post apocalyptic after all. Name, I suck at names so I'd leave that to them. But I always liked the old drivers ed video Bloody Asphalt.
I'll respond to that second paragraph here. I have already played such a game as the one i describe, Shadowbane, UO, Darkfall, Eve Online. You have made an assumption and like most assumptions was wrong. Of course people know what they want in a title. Do I like raiding? Yes. Would I like it in another game? Yes. You are sorely mistaken, of course people know what they want, in your mind do developers hold some secret power over the minds of us all? Have your never stopped to think about what you want for your self. No it isn't the smallest of things that keeps someone playing, that's drivel, the core features keep someone playing. I don't play Vanguard because it lacks pvp. I stopped short of end game in FFXI because it lacked any kind of player versus player.
Let me ask you a question, name EVERY sandbox you have played, and explain where this idea formulated from that the world has nothing but rape and pillaging around every corner? Eve Online is one of the few MMOs to grow over the years since its release, it has time and again increased its subscription base yet has everything you believe is wrong in an MMO, an MMO I have played since 2007.
You sir are a sheep, who flocks to the next big title, because in your mind you dont know what you want, so might as well try them all regardless.
Ha Ha Ha.. I'd have better luck from a genie in the bottle..
I don't see it happening.. Today's devs are much like politicians.. They spend way too much time discussing ideas and plans then actually "WORKING".. I've never seen an industry so filled with lazy idea makers, then workers.. This hive needs more worker bees, and less queens.. I have heard and read countless interviews and I'm not impressed.. Anyways..
SWTOR is an exception to the rule. Since Bioware was trying to make a Multiplayer KoTOR with a game world. Not knowing to them that there is more to MMORPG, then just being a multiplayer single playerRPG.
Philosophy of MMO Game Design
If the Dev/Company wants to make truckloads of money then I'd have to decline.
That's mainly because I'd like to experiment with P&P/Tabletop rulesets and try to not make too many compromises to make it as viable as a mainstream MMO. Making believable NPCs/AI would as well require too much dev time (scripting events/reactions is so old school). In the end such a game wouldn't really work with the numbers of players that most companys are targeting at (for sake of profitability). Rather it would end up similar to a NWN1/2 PW.
Declining such a tempting offer and realizing the idea as an open source/pet project is a more realistic approach.
I'd say make DAOC 2 or its spiritual equivalent based roughly on how that game was like from release through the SI expansion. That comes closest to the kind of MMO I'd like to play. You'd have:
DAOC Live (inactive): R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R6 Healer
For someone who went out of their way to respond (and insult! kudos!) you completely missed my point. I honestly find it amusing that you actually answered my rhetorical questions, lol! The point of those first questions was an attempt to make you actually think about WHY you demand full loot. Your answer is actually pretty funny since generally speaking full loot systems are far less gear reliant because of the gear drop. Its almost always fairly easy to replace. Not to say there are not peices of gear that give you slight advantages (high quality level) but in the grand scheme its so minor that the bonuses are not statistically relevent. I mean honestly, accusing me of making an assumption (I didn't, perhaps you should reread and make the attempt to comprehend) and then turn around and make one yourself is pretty laughable. I do not mind full loot system (I have played Eve of and on since 2004) and I too have played pretty much every noteworthy title thats been around (it helps having a very good friend who has been in the game reviewing industry for some time, not a "sheep" as you say, LOL) often for many different reasons. Some because something interested me (I love new things, even if they are variations) or because friends were playing, or just to see what all of the hullabaloo was about. Many of those games I have even made it to max level in, basking in the stories and systems those developers have told. I mean actually look at your answers! You state inconsistancies like you are in it for the fight, but its only rewarding with full loot, when that is NOT the only system that large percentages of the playerbase find "meaningful" (I truly hate that word because in this context its actually meaningless), as you can see by any ladder system. LoL does not have full loot drop, many consider it meaningful, same with Sc2, WoW, Ps2, etc etc. I mean you even go so far as to say that FF11 did not have pvp, when it did, just not pvp that you particularly enjoyed (any competition between 2 people/groups is a form of pvp, and fighting over spawns and bosses most certainly was a competition).
I did battle with ignorance today, and ignorance won.
To exercise power costs effort and demands courage. That is why so many fail to assert rights to which they are perfectly entitled - because a right is a kind of power but they are too lazy or too cowardly to exercise it. The virtues which cloak these faults are called patience and forbearance.
kinda like "red dead redemtion"?? when i had that game before i traded it in i always thought that would be a great setting for a mmo :-) nice one
if a developer aproaching me before he starts to speak ill ask him a question
''what company u represent?''
if he says EA he will get the biggest kick in his b****
Cheers and OMG yes i hated invisable walls your imersion would die so quickly... i remember exploring places like in EQ and even the most recent GW2 and id b hitting walls... so annoying nice imput mate :-)
heheh i'd have to agree with you on that point, put all major companys aside. just someone out of the bue would be fine :-)
wow i read through like 2/3 of your reponses mate, and you've taken this like i've killed a small kitten or something, it was a simple question and a bit of fun, and you've responded like its a policitical question...chill down and don't take it personaial like your seeming like it is... its a MMO site talking about MMO's thats all plain and simple so lets talk MMO's aye?
What is rewarding is an opinion. My opinion is that full loot increases my adrenalin levels, makes the fight so much more entertaining knowing that I stand to lose so much more. To me, taking World of Warcraft as an example, bragging rights and a paltry amount of honor points is not in anyway rewarding.
Yes you are correct Final Fantasy XI had ballista, which was a joke. The game was not balanced around pvp, it was a mini-game, a side attraction. My brother had the skills and ability to face down absolute virtue and he himself states that Ballista is no kind of pvp, especially when you consider how a blue mage can shut down the entire thing, they have no equal, it isn't a true pvp system, more of a side attraction.
This thread was created, to ask everyone what their ideal MMO would be. I responded with mine, and you responded by telling me what I want isn't what I really want, and that what I want in an MMO is the reason this thread will go nowhere, when in actual fact people are happily discussing either what they would want in their MMO, and in other cases, questioning how likely it would be for someone to walk upto you in the street and ask you to create an MMO, not understandhing it was a hypothetical situation, used to facilitate discussion.
And yes I answered all your questions, what was rhetorical about them? Have I ever played a game with full loot? What is rhetorical about that? The question has an answer - yes. This is besides the point I did not make my post to argue about language, thread layout, understanding what is and isn't - this isn't an english paper. This thread is about what I want in an MMO, which so far you seem to have a problem with, or else you would not have quoted me initially in the first place.
To leave this pointless line of discussion behind, I will add to my original post with some extras about what I would like.
You wouldn't have a subscription, or the server owner would pay a subscription so their server is shown to be authenticated. Same thing for players. Either you don't have a subscription at all, or end users pay a sub so that their client is authenticated.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
This response is what i wanted nothing else :-) whats your MMO called man!! it sounds awesome
Yup, that's it right there, but add perma-death to keep everyone honest.