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[Column] Elder Scrolls Online: Avoiding the Wall

SBFordSBFord Associate Editor - News ManagerThe Land of AZPosts: 16,581MMORPG.COM Staff Uncommon

One of the things that gets to many players is the proverbial wall that's hit once level cap is reached and there is little else to do. In today's Elder Scrolls Online column, we take a look at that phenomenon and what ESO devs are doing to avoid it. Read on and then join the conversation in the comments.

It’s been awhile since I got to sit down and play Elder Scrolls Online back in October, but one thing stood out to me while there. It wasn’t even part of the gameplay demo. It was the presentation that came after. Matt Firor and his team showed us some plans for their Alliance vs. Alliance system (think RVR or WVW). They also told us that they plan on continually opening more and more regions of Tamriel as the game ages, at an alarming planned rate of one a month. Matt’s taken to calling these “Adventure Zones”, and they will serve as new and fresh content for the level-capped players (or so I gathered). 

Read more of Bill Murphy's The Elder Scrolls Online: Avoiding the Wall.

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Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

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Comments

  • Rthuth434Rthuth434 uniondale, NYPosts: 346Member
    should stick with lore discussion. otherwise the game sounds exactly like GW2. good for those like me who like it, bad for the rest of your readers.
  • RohnRohn Saint Peters, MOPosts: 3,740Member Uncommon

    In this game, what can a player do other than kill things?

    Social?  Economic?  Political?  How deep will these types of meta-systems be?

    Will the world be meaningful?  Will the virtual society be functional?

    These are the shortfalls that make most themeparks seem shallow and limited.  How will TESO be different?

    Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.

  • zomard100zomard100 karlovacPosts: 228Member
    If TESO is the choice of smartest man from MMORPG team what can we mortals say :). Well, it is my choice to
  • RasereiRaserei webster, MAPosts: 1,011Member
    This game would be good if they played Asheron's Call 2 and copy pasted there ideas. Asherons Call 2 is the only good MMORPG ever created.
  • YamotaYamota LondonPosts: 6,620Member
    Say no to ThemeParks. Specially one based on one of the best single player sandbox RPGs.
  • PyrateLVPyrateLV Las Vegas, NVPosts: 1,096Member Common

    Whats a player to do when they hit the Level cap "Wall"?

    Thats easy, grind your Artifacts....I mean Scrolls for Realm...uh sorry... Faction Points.

    Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
    Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
    Playing: Skyrim
    Following: The Repopulation
    I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
    ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)

  • koboldfodderkoboldfodder Danbury, DEPosts: 390Member Uncommon

    MMo fans do not want to play this game because it looks like another WOW clone and Elder Scrolls fans do not want to play this game because it is nothing like the single player games.

     

    So they managed to piss off two player bases....yea, this game is going nowhere.

  • MaelwyddMaelwydd CrawleyPosts: 1,123Member
    Are we talking about the 'End of Game' wall or the 'This area is out of bounds to your faction' wall?
  • MavekMavek Voorhees, NJPosts: 138Member
    Originally posted by Maelwydd
    Are we talking about the 'End of Game' wall or the 'This area is out of bounds to your faction' wall?

    read the article and find out?

  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,601Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Rthuth434
    should stick with lore discussion. otherwise the game sounds exactly like GW2. good for those like me who like it, bad for the rest of your readers.
    Thats fine.


    GW2 had a lot of good ideas but implementation problems, so if TESO can improve on that then they will have a good MMO.


    However, we will have to see if that alone will be enough to break through the blind hatred thats already cementing.

  • MaelwyddMaelwydd CrawleyPosts: 1,123Member
    Originally posted by Mavek
    Originally posted by Maelwydd
    Are we talking about the 'End of Game' wall or the 'This area is out of bounds to your faction' wall?

    read the article and find out?

    I read the article but....if I have to explain.....never mind.

  • jtcgsjtcgs New Port Richey, ILPosts: 1,777Member

    As the newer video shows...There is no emperor, the three kindoms fight for control and players have a chance to have themselves crowned as the new emperor...worst thing an MMO can do is create player hierarchy's.

    This takes the PvP ranking system to a whole new elitist level. This now smacks of a game focused on elitists.

    “I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  • BurntvetBurntvet Baltimore, MDPosts: 2,937Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Maelwydd
    Are we talking about the 'End of Game' wall or the 'This area is out of bounds to your faction' wall?

    Heh.

    Good point.

    This game is already saddled with so many poor design decisions (invisible border guards FTL) that it is going to have to go out of its way to do everything perfectly, to have any chance of being good (and especially considering how much is being intentionally left out).

    Personally, I think TESO will be nothing more than the "themepark of the week" with ES on the box in order to sell copies.

    I'd be happy to be wrong, but I doubt I will be.

     

  • EzraSteelEzraSteel Coral Springs, FLPosts: 16Member

     

    I think one of the aspects that should be included to address the issue that you raised is a system like the "Foundry" that is going to be implemented in NWN.  By giving the users tools to create their own content, it relieves some of the burden from the developers.  I do believe that this will be a terrific addition to the MMO world and how games are designed and created.

     

    Just my two cents, your mileage may vary...

     

     

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Tes single player games aren't sandboxes by the way.

    They are more hybrid, the single player equivelent of something like AC in mmo terms.

    Minecraft is a single player sandbox, elite is a single player sandbox.

    Skyrim isn't, it has story arcs, it has vertical progression, you can't build stuff with the vanilla game.

    Exception being if you have hearthfire, that sort of pushes into sandbox territory.
  • NC-JohnNC-John burlington, WIPosts: 113Member

    I think it's going to be a tough sell for zenimax to move forward with the general gaming community trying to convince them this is NOT just another themepark.

    What they should do is reel-back release date projections, ask their investors to give them another year of development, and focus on bridging thegap between the original elder scrolls RPG and making the multiplayer version more like it.

    Players want to steal your furniture from your home, travel anywhere anytime with out borders and they want crafting to be the primary way to obtain gear. If you leave your horse out, they want to take it for a joy ride.

    Until you can add some of those features I would roll-back release date and get to cracking on it. It's not impossible to make a hybrid sandbox still, and that's the only other option they have at this point, if they want to NOT just be another themie with the same grind.

    But again...This is my opinion and at the end of the day it's just that.

     

    "Not even a cray super computer can make this game run well. Thats what happens when you code an MMO in pascal. " - miglor

  • GishgeronGishgeron Princeton, KYPosts: 1,287Member
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Say no to ThemeParks. Specially one based on one of the best single player sandbox RPGs.

     

      TES have never been sandboxes.  Morrowind touched on many, many, aspects...but its was still very much a themepark.  Skyrim doesn't even touch a few.  Its open, and KIND OF freeform in how you approach its rails.  But its still an on rails experience, it just happens to have more rails.  Morrowind, at least, you could outright KILL main story important NPCs if you wanted.  The game would shoot you a "well, guess you can't do the story now" message but it LET you make that choice.

      The only real LASTING, world changing, choice you get to make in Skyrim is between Stormcloaks or Empire.  Conratulations, that makes the most recent TES game as much of a sandbox and Knights of the Old Republic.

      The fact you people keep saying that TES is a giant sanbox is half the trouble with why you seem to hate TESO.  Its doing nothing different from its core games.  Its an open world, with tons of lore and side quests that are in random little holes all over the place and tons to see and do.  No, you can't take over a city and claim it as your own.  You can't do that in any other TES game BUT Morrowind, and even then its not YOUR city...there just isn't anyone alive left to contest the fact.  At least TESO is going to let you sort of do that in its PvP zone.

      The bottom line is, if any of you played Skyrim and loved it then you basically have admitted that the game, as its being presented to us, is exactly something you'll like it.  They are trying to keep the combat similar, and you're certain to have plenty of crap to harvest.  The only thing you won't be able to do in TESO that you can in recent TES games is gather 1000 bones and pillows for no reason. 

      Again, though, that is based on what I've seen and read.  What we GET is another story.  I cannot comment on that.  I know what they are SAYING they want to do with it.  People that have played demo versions of it have said it has the TES flow.  I don't know what else to say except that, once again, TES have always been themepark RPGs.  You guys are just dense as hell and don't even realize it.

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  • mistmakermistmaker viennaPosts: 231Member Uncommon
    the elder scrolls online could have been a gret sandboxy game
  • PyrateLVPyrateLV Las Vegas, NVPosts: 1,096Member Common
    Originally posted by Gishgeron
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Say no to ThemeParks. Specially one based on one of the best single player sandbox RPGs.

     

      TES have never been sandboxes.  Morrowind touched on many, many, aspects...but its was still very much a themepark.  Skyrim doesn't even touch a few.  Its open, and KIND OF freeform in how you approach its rails.  But its still an on rails experience, it just happens to have more rails.  Morrowind, at least, you could outright KILL main story important NPCs if you wanted.  The game would shoot you a "well, guess you can't do the story now" message but it LET you make that choice.

      The only real LASTING, world changing, choice you get to make in Skyrim is between Stormcloaks or Empire.  Conratulations, that makes the most recent TES game as much of a sandbox and Knights of the Old Republic.

      The fact you people keep saying that TES is a giant sanbox is half the trouble with why you seem to hate TESO.  Its doing nothing different from its core games.  Its an open world, with tons of lore and side quests that are in random little holes all over the place and tons to see and do.  No, you can't take over a city and claim it as your own.  You can't do that in any other TES game BUT Morrowind, and even then its not YOUR city...there just isn't anyone alive left to contest the fact.  At least TESO is going to let you sort of do that in its PvP zone.

      The bottom line is, if any of you played Skyrim and loved it then you basically have admitted that the game, as its being presented to us, is exactly something you'll like it.  They are trying to keep the combat similar, and you're certain to have plenty of crap to harvest.  The only thing you won't be able to do in TESO that you can in recent TES games is gather 1000 bones and pillows for no reason. 

      Again, though, that is based on what I've seen and read.  What we GET is another story.  I cannot comment on that.  I know what they are SAYING they want to do with it.  People that have played demo versions of it have said it has the TES flow.  I don't know what else to say except that, once again, TES have always been themepark RPGs.  You guys are just dense as hell and don't even realize it.

    No its not

    3 Faction locked areas (ie-"zones") and Cyrodiil for PvP

     

    Sounds more like core DAOC than anything ES

    Tried: EQ2 - AC - EU - HZ - TR - MxO - TTO - WURM - SL - VG:SoH - PotBS - PS - AoC - WAR - DDO - SWTOR
    Played: UO - EQ1 - AO - DAoC - NC - CoH/CoV - SWG - WoW - EVE - AA - LotRO - DFO - STO - FE - MO - RIFT
    Playing: Skyrim
    Following: The Repopulation
    I want a Virtual World, not just a Game.
    ITS TOO HARD! - Matt Firor (ZeniMax)

  • FallguyArmyFallguyArmy Davenport, FLPosts: 80Member
    Originally posted by koboldfodder

    MMo fans do not want to play this game because it looks like another WOW clone and Elder Scrolls fans do not want to play this game because it is nothing like the single player games.

     

    So they managed to piss off two player bases....yea, this game is going nowhere.

    ^ Pretty much this.

     

    I've followed the vids and interviews (mind you, 90% of them are all about the lore and not the gameplay) and so far I'm disappointed. Being both an MMORPG player and one who enjoys TES games, I can't believe the direction that TESO is heading. It's certainly not the online TES game I hoped for, at least not at the moment based on what I've researched thus far. Even the visuals are a step-down from Skyrim.

     

    The fact that this game is already in beta has me concerned and alarmed. It's usually at this development phase where changes are mere fixes and tweaks, but no longer game-changing overhauls. The game truly needs serious help to the core, but of course, what do we get? Social networking integration!

     
  • FearumFearum Cinnaminson, NJPosts: 1,166Member Uncommon
    Sounds great so far, cant wait to get in game. I hope they have some good end game stuff to do, the continued skill development will keep me playing longer than just capping. Also the full exploration of 3 different factions sounds pretty sweet. Other games rolling an alt or new character can be pretty boring, having to rehash the same old story and reexploring the same old land. With TESO I can atleast play the game differently 3 times and have 3 different experiences.[mod edit] But anyway like I said, can't wait to get in game and will cya there Bill.
     
  • OgreRaperOgreRaper Detroit, MIPosts: 376Member
    DAOC's realm rank/ability system is my favorite end game progression. I expect to see something like that in TESO.
  • black_isleblack_isle IstanbulPosts: 238Member Uncommon
    It would be good if instead of invisible walls, you could go into other faction territories but npcs ignore and insult you while guards and such warn you to leave and remind you that no one will trade with you or do business with you so you'll have to leave eventually. And if you participated in any pvp the game knows it and makes the guards attack you after warning or something. Of course nothing stopping you grinding creatures and such but majority of players won't choose to play that way probably so no big deal maybe. And if you come across any native pcs you get a debuff when attacking them so you are at a considerable disadvantage if you try to gank people there (or you can't even attack them or something).
  • XiaokiXiaoki White Pigeon, MIPosts: 2,601Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by koboldfodder
    MMo fans do not want to play this game because it looks like another WOW clone and Elder Scrolls fans do not want to play this game because it is nothing like the single player games.
    Yeah, and MMO fans call EVERY upcoming MMO a WoW clone so why would TESO be treated any different?


    Being called a "WoW clone" isnt an insult anymore to MMOs, its just part of the initiation process now.

  • jtcgsjtcgs New Port Richey, ILPosts: 1,777Member
    Originally posted by Fearum
    I think its a great idea and can only add to longevity and variety which are both important to an MMO. But anyway like I said, can't wait to get in game and will cya there Bill.
     
     

     It isnt a "new" idea...its just like DaoC...even WoW had two factions. Its the same game, just different zones as a "warrior" plays exactly the same no matter which faction you choose.

    Or did you believe that a Human Paladin was a "new game" when playing a Blood Elf Paladin just because its FOR THE HORDE!

    Nope. Youll get one game, chopped into 3 smaller games because you are only allowed to play in 1/3rd of it.

    Imagine how much smaller WoW would have been if you couldnt get into the opposing factions zones. Not only would the game have been half the size, you could never invade their cities or attack their towns. Its like SWTOR is now...small because you cant get into half of it.

    “I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

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