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My tip to enjoy SWTOR more: Treat it like KOTOR

2

Comments

  • KyleranKyleran Tampa, FLPosts: 19,979Member Uncommon
    Not a bad idea, except I didn't enjoy KOTOR, since it was a single player game and I only enjoy playing MMORPGs. I actually enjoyed SWTOR for a month or so, but it was too much of a solo centric experience with an uninteresting end game (to me).

    In my day MMORPG's were so hard we fought our way through dungeons in the snow, uphill both ways.
    "I don't have one life, I have many lives" - Grunty
    Still currently "subscribed" to EVE, and only EVE!!!
    "This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member
    Originally posted by MurlockDance

    I disagree with you in the sense that you don't really need to play SW:ToR like KoToR3 to enjoy it. It is perfectly enjoyable as it is now. It does fall short a bit short as an MMORPG, but if you just play it single player and don't do any of the group content, which is actually pretty fun, that is a shame. Just play it as it was intended to be played, trying everything out that it has to offer.

    Agreed. There is plenty of group related content in this game. As a matter of fact, the game rewards you for grouping up. The funniest comnplaint I hear from people is when they say that the game is too single player, and yet they haven't touched an operation or flashpoint and haven't attempted to join a guild. There's even a group finder in game now so there is really no excuse at this point. 

    Granted, it is already a pretty single-player experience as it is even if you play it like an MMORPG. I think that more and more games seem to not capture the magic of the early times of MMORPGs and player communities and SW:ToR is no different. Such a shame because that was partly what made games like these so fun.

    Nothing will ever capture the magic of your first MMO.  If they could take the animations,story , cutscenes and dialogue choices or TOR and marry them with the original Star Wars Galaxies they would have the perfect game.

     

    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  • catlanacatlana Houston, TXPosts: 1,677Member
    Originally posted by Shadin

    I fully agree with the OP. I've been playing it like a co-op SRPG with my gf and been having a blast. Haven't touched endgame so far as it's the same repetative junk as in every other MMO, but up until 50 I'm having a great time with my chars.

    I admit, though, they DID market the game as an MMO.. Even so it's not very fun to play as an actual MMO. It's too bad, but as a co-op rpg or srpg, the game really shines still.

    Yeah, we have been treating SWToR as a co-op experience with some pvp as well. The game has been a lot of fun for us as well. I have come to realize that I enjoy playing co-op games quite a bit (Mass Effect 3 multiplayer / Borderlands 2 as well).  

  • meddyckmeddyck Athens, GAPosts: 1,140Member Uncommon
    This might have worked if I hadn't already played it for a few months at release. I liked the class stories (mostly) but really got tired of all the side quests. Playing the F2P version means reduced xp, many fewer warzones and space missions, and therefore even more need to do side quests. No thanks.

    Camelot Unchained Backer
    DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  • MurlockDanceMurlockDance ParisPosts: 1,223Member
    Originally posted by ktanner3
    Originally posted by MurlockDance

    I disagree with you in the sense that you don't really need to play SW:ToR like KoToR3 to enjoy it. It is perfectly enjoyable as it is now. It does fall short a bit short as an MMORPG, but if you just play it single player and don't do any of the group content, which is actually pretty fun, that is a shame. Just play it as it was intended to be played, trying everything out that it has to offer.

    Agreed. There is plenty of group related content in this game. As a matter of fact, the game rewards you for grouping up. The funniest comnplaint I hear from people is when they say that the game is too single player, and yet they haven't touched an operation or flashpoint and haven't attempted to join a guild. There's even a group finder in game now so there is really no excuse at this point. 

    Granted, it is already a pretty single-player experience as it is even if you play it like an MMORPG. I think that more and more games seem to not capture the magic of the early times of MMORPGs and player communities and SW:ToR is no different. Such a shame because that was partly what made games like these so fun.

    Nothing will ever capture the magic of your first MMO.  If they could take the animations,story , cutscenes and dialogue choices or TOR and marry them with the original Star Wars Galaxies they would have the perfect game.

     

    With respect to your second comment, I don't believe it has to do with fond memories of my first MMO. The games really have drifted away from promoting tightly-knit communities like in DAoC (which was not my first MMO) where realm pride was a necessity to get people to cooperate in large-scale PvP and take objectives or defend their turf. People also used to know all of the best crafters in their realm and on their server. Helpful people got good names, hurtful people were blacklisted. These days the games do not really require much in the way of long-term cooperative play so basically outside of a few exceptions, most characters and therefore players remain fairly anonymous.

    In SW:ToR, there are no dependencies really, not even amidst crafters, and also PvP does not really require knowing who you are fighting with or against, and there is no need for scouts, battlegroup leaders, strategic objectives, etc.

    Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.

    image
  • kalrhaelkalrhael Boston, MAPosts: 87Member
    You're not going to convince the band of cynics that parade these forums religiously, whom have been bashing this game for nearly more than a year now, and whom have nothing better to do with their sad lives but to beat the dead horse some more, and for months on end.

    Seriously they're fanatics, whom have nothing better to do with their sad, miserable lives, but to hate. A game flops, so what? Life moves on for most casual gamers, well, except for these folk.

    Enjoy being filled with hate, spite and cynicsm.
  • darkboazdarkboaz liverpool, NYPosts: 149Member
    It was an amusing game when viewed as single played until you realized your choices made no almost no differences in the game, the story or abilities mass effect at least had 3 endings this just one. The only bright spot was I was able finish out my 6th month sub before they took away my names so I stopped playing with no chance of going back. I hate to admit it but the whole thing left me feeling $medley and $OE had treated me and the star wars property better but that is not saying much.
  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member
    Originally posted by MurlockDance
    Originally posted by ktanner3
    Originally posted by MurlockDance

    I disagree with you in the sense that you don't really need to play SW:ToR like KoToR3 to enjoy it. It is perfectly enjoyable as it is now. It does fall short a bit short as an MMORPG, but if you just play it single player and don't do any of the group content, which is actually pretty fun, that is a shame. Just play it as it was intended to be played, trying everything out that it has to offer.

    Agreed. There is plenty of group related content in this game. As a matter of fact, the game rewards you for grouping up. The funniest comnplaint I hear from people is when they say that the game is too single player, and yet they haven't touched an operation or flashpoint and haven't attempted to join a guild. There's even a group finder in game now so there is really no excuse at this point. 

    Granted, it is already a pretty single-player experience as it is even if you play it like an MMORPG. I think that more and more games seem to not capture the magic of the early times of MMORPGs and player communities and SW:ToR is no different. Such a shame because that was partly what made games like these so fun.

    Nothing will ever capture the magic of your first MMO.  If they could take the animations,story , cutscenes and dialogue choices or TOR and marry them with the original Star Wars Galaxies they would have the perfect game.

     

    With respect to your second comment, I don't believe it has to do with fond memories of my first MMO. The games really have drifted away from promoting tightly-knit communities like in DAoC (which was not my first MMO) where realm pride was a necessity to get people to cooperate in large-scale PvP and take objectives or defend their turf. People also used to know all of the best crafters in their realm and on their server. Helpful people got good names, hurtful people were blacklisted. These days the games do not really require much in the way of long-term cooperative play so basically outside of a few exceptions, most characters and therefore players remain fairly anonymous.

    In SW:ToR, there are no dependencies really, not even amidst crafters, and also PvP does not really require knowing who you are fighting with or against, and there is no need for scouts, battlegroup leaders, strategic objectives, etc.

    Hey, I'm with you completely as I would LOVE to see that in this game. The trouble is, developers seem to think they have to create ALL the content instead of creating tools that allow the player to create their own. 

    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  • DeeweDeewe Long Beach, CAPosts: 1,965Member
    Originally posted by ktanner3
     

    Hey, I'm with you completely as I would LOVE to see that in this game. The trouble is, developers seem to think they have to create ALL the content instead of creating tools that allow the player to create their own. 

    If ever TOR would have been designed as a world versus a on rails cinematic experience, I mean at least a bit...

    Thing is TOR is the most lifeless MMO I ever played.

  • calranthecalranthe stoke on trentPosts: 356Member

    I wish I could but the really big difference between kotor and this is choices, this game was advertised that your choices mattered, hell they even said in early development you could loose a companion if you pissed them off enough but ohhh no we can't upset our player base and make them think about choices and consequences.

    that is why I can not play it even as a single player game :(

    Not hate filled just sad at what could have been.

  • adam_noxadam_nox hays, KSPosts: 2,073Member Uncommon
    This game is nothing like kotor.  Doesn't have the same type of combat, there's no real choices, you grind enemies and quests rather than just progressing through a story.  The story itself is horrible.  A talent tree isn't the same thing as a skill tree.  The latter being superior and kotor like.
  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,836Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by adam_nox
    This game is nothing like kotor.  Doesn't have the same type of combat, there's no real choices, you grind enemies and quests rather than just progressing through a story.  The story itself is horrible.  A talent tree isn't the same thing as a skill tree.  The latter being superior and kotor like.

    you did a main story and side quests in KOTOR as well, difference is there are a lot more in SWTOR.

    i do agree the story in KOTOR is far superior but then again, that story is superior to almost any RPG story i have ever seen.

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member

    The game was fine for a few months of play back at release, although it certainly wasn't worth the $75 total.  The F2P thing is ok for anyone who hasn't purchased it yet, and wants to sink $30 into some account unlocks to make the game fairly enjoyable as a single-player game.

    If you've already subbed though, it's painful to have to buy into all the account unlocks on top of the money you've spent hoping they'd fulfil their old promises of releasing new content every month, etc.

    Not only that, but if you do get the unlocks and enjoy the game that way until 50, then decide you'd like to subscribe for end-game content (ops and hfps), you basically lose out on the money spent for the unlocks.  It's because the way the F2P system is designed, free players are more or less isolated from subscribers.

    You make me like charity

  • PWN_FACEPWN_FACE SeoulPosts: 670Member

    I can see what OP is saying and I can see how that would be fun.  I really enjoyed the stories of my Imperials, but not the Republic side. I took my highest level character to 43. 

     

    The problem for me was that the chunks of story goodness where separated by what seemed to me to be boring spans of grinding in a lifeless world. If I could just cut all that grindy deadworld stuff out and just do the stories straight away, then it would be like a single player story-based game. I just don't want to do a lot of grinding to get to the good bits.

     

  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member
    Originally posted by PWN_FACE

    I can see what OP is saying and I can see how that would be fun.  I really enjoyed the stories of my Imperials, but not the Republic side. I took my highest level character to 43. 

     

    The problem for me was that the chunks of story goodness where separated by what seemed to me to be boring spans of grinding in a lifeless world. If I could just cut all that grindy deadworld stuff out and just do the stories straight away, then it would be like a single player story-based game. I just don't want to do a lot of grinding to get to the good bits.

     

    The grinding is only worse as a free player, since you gain xp slower...  wouldn't be so bad if you could run some dungeons to break things up, but I think you only get 3 of those per week, which isnt' enough to make much difference for most people.  

    You make me like charity

  • reid424reid424 Chi-Town, ILPosts: 488Member Uncommon
    I agree with you almost entirely. I enjoy SWTOR when i play solo and honestly that's what i've become is a solo casual player during the weekend with a more moderate play frame during the weekends. However someone mentioned Co-Op I still play with a few friends not 50 more like 3 an not consistently. I enjoy the exprience with other players pvp, FP and an occasional SM Op or HM EV KP. Fact is when the game started to become something I loathed logging into is when it felt mandatory to log in for a HM op....I could do SM for the rest of my playing days and still enjoy the game. Don't plan on leaving until server shut down I enjoy rerolling characters (16 character slots please).

    image
  • azzamasinazzamasin Butler, OHPosts: 3,066Member Uncommon
    Did that when it came out.  Its got a very good single player vibe to it.  Sadly it lasted all of about a month before I quit because once I ran the story of 2 classes to cap I got bored.  Crappy MMO great Story RPG.

    Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

    Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!

    Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!

    image

  • DeeweDeewe Long Beach, CAPosts: 1,965Member
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by adam_nox
    This game is nothing like kotor.  Doesn't have the same type of combat, there's no real choices, you grind enemies and quests rather than just progressing through a story.  The story itself is horrible.  A talent tree isn't the same thing as a skill tree.  The latter being superior and kotor like.

     

    you did a main story and side quests in KOTOR as well, difference is there are a lot more in SWTOR.

    i do agree the story in KOTOR is far superior but then again, that story is superior to almost any RPG story i have ever seen.

    How about Risen, The witcher, Planescape Torment?

    Kotor was nice but remove the SW setting and it's not as good as all the other above.

  • JKwervoJKwervo N. Las Vegas, NVPosts: 126Member
    The Witcher is a classic. I think may be better than KOTOR story. And I'm a star wars geek.
  • baphametbaphamet omaha, NEPosts: 2,836Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Deewe
    Originally posted by baphamet   Originally posted by adam_nox This game is nothing like kotor.  Doesn't have the same type of combat, there's no real choices, you grind enemies and quests rather than just progressing through a story.  The story itself is horrible.  A talent tree isn't the same thing as a skill tree.  The latter being superior and kotor like.
      you did a main story and side quests in KOTOR as well, difference is there are a lot more in SWTOR. i do agree the story in KOTOR is far superior but then again, that story is superior to almost any RPG story i have ever seen.
    How about Risen, The witcher, Planescape Torment?

    Kotor was nice but remove the SW setting and it's not as good as all the other above.


    i didn't say it was the best story, it is one of the best i have personally played.

    i think if they made a live action star wars movie based off of that story, it would be one of the better movies if done right.

    IMO it was a great story, if you don't agree, right on!


  • jpnzjpnz SydneyPosts: 3,529Member
    Originally posted by Deewe
    Originally posted by baphamet

     

    you did a main story and side quests in KOTOR as well, difference is there are a lot more in SWTOR.

    i do agree the story in KOTOR is far superior but then again, that story is superior to almost any RPG story i have ever seen.

    How about Risen, The witcher, Planescape Torment?

    Kotor was nice but remove the SW setting and it's not as good as all the other above.

    KOTOR and SWTOR is a good STAR WARS story.

    Whether you like Star Wars stories or not is another issue.

    Gdemami -
    Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.

  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member
    Originally posted by pioneer08
    Originally posted by superniceguy
     

    I had more fun with SWG and that cost a fee, but then that game had plenty of stuff to do in it, and the efforts that SOE (excluding the NGE and CU but then at least it was something even if they were wrong moves to improve the game) and the player community put into it, were well worth it.

    Even single player games, with no updates, some people can play forever and ever, if they really like it, but usually even the best single player game, most people just play them, and move on. This is what SWTOR is like

    If SWTOR was getting updated more frequently than it has been, then it too would be worthy of the $15 fee.

    ie SWG had a lifetime of fun, whereas SWTOR had a few months of fun.

     

    [mod edit]

    I liked both games, but SWG at launch was SO lacking. No mounts, no vehicles, no space, no jedi, few quests, lots of broken missions, and more bugs than you could shake a stick at. TOR has tons of more content than SWG had at the same point and very few bugs. I have recently encountered one on my jedi knight which was a side quest that I couldn't complete. That is the FIRST one of those I've come across and I've leveled three other characters to max. In SWG, I got them daily. There was times I would be stuck in the Tattoine starport and unable to get out. On PVE bounty missions my mark would be stuck in the middle of water or inside a wall. Not to mention that leveling in that was a major boring grind. You didn't have all the OPS, Flashpoints, warzones, world quests, side quests and class quests that TOR has. The fastest way to level was to join in groups that slaughtered beasts for hours on end. That was how you advanced if you were in one of the combat professions.  Like I said, I enjoyed SWG, but there are a lot of people here wearing rose colored glasses when it comes to that game. 

    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

  • SandboxSandbox SwedenPosts: 295Member
    Originally posted by ktanner3
    Originally posted by pioneer08
    Originally posted by superniceguy
     

    I had more fun with SWG and that cost a fee, but then that game had plenty of stuff to do in it, and the efforts that SOE (excluding the NGE and CU but then at least it was something even if they were wrong moves to improve the game) and the player community put into it, were well worth it.

    Even single player games, with no updates, some people can play forever and ever, if they really like it, but usually even the best single player game, most people just play them, and move on. This is what SWTOR is like

    If SWTOR was getting updated more frequently than it has been, then it too would be worthy of the $15 fee.

    ie SWG had a lifetime of fun, whereas SWTOR had a few months of fun.

     

    [mod edit]

    I liked both games, but SWG at launch was SO lacking. No mounts, no vehicles, no space, no jedi, few quests, lots of broken missions, and more bugs than you could shake a stick at. TOR has tons of more content than SWG had at the same point and very few bugs. I have recently encountered one on my jedi knight which was a side quest that I couldn't complete. That is the FIRST one of those I've come across and I've leveled three other characters to max. In SWG, I got them daily. There was times I would be stuck in the Tattoine starport and unable to get out. On PVE bounty missions my mark would be stuck in the middle of water or inside a wall. Not to mention that leveling in that was a major boring grind. You didn't have all the OPS, Flashpoints, warzones, world quests, side quests and class quests that TOR has. The fastest way to level was to join in groups that slaughtered beasts for hours on end. That was how you advanced if you were in one of the combat professions.  Like I said, I enjoyed SWG, but there are a lot of people here wearing rose colored glasses when it comes to that game. 

    More content, more bugs. Less content, less bugs!

  • superniceguysuperniceguy AnchorheadPosts: 2,278Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by pioneer08
    Originally posted by superniceguy
    Originally posted by baphamet

     


    Originally posted by superniceguy
    A MMO has a $15 fee, a single player game with co-op / online multiplayer does not.

     

    SWTOR can not be enjoyed like KOTOR until the monthly fee is removed / it goes B2P or the the F2P is not so restrictive.

    If it had been created like Mass Effect 3 then it would have been more of a solid experience.


     

    sorry but a sub or no sub has absolutely no bearing on the fun i have in any game.

    honestly? people actually have more fun playing a game when they think they are playing a free game?

    that is kind of odd.

    I had more fun with SWG and that cost a fee, but then that game had plenty of stuff to do in it, and the efforts that SOE (excluding the NGE and CU but then at least it was something even if they were wrong moves to improve the game) and the player community put into it, were well worth it.

    Even single player games, with no updates, some people can play forever and ever, if they really like it, but usually even the best single player game, most people just play them, and move on. This is what SWTOR is like

    If SWTOR was getting updated more frequently than it has been, then it too would be worthy of the $15 fee.

    ie SWG had a lifetime of fun, whereas SWTOR had a few months of fun.

     

    [mod edit]

    I never said it had more content, I said there was more things to do in it.

    Crafting, harvesting (these 2 took up most my time), housing, mission terminals, Cries of Alderaan series of quests,  levelling through the 32 profession, which each had their own unique content,  eg Creature Handler and Bio Engineer meant to you explore the worlds and tame train and level up your pet. Theme Parks - Rebel, Jabba, Imperial. There was also quite a few missions on NPCs around the place, the thing is, you had to go find the stuff, instead of run missions led by the hand.

    SWG content was only limited by your own imagination. No 2 players experience was ever the same.

  • ktanner3ktanner3 lakeland, FLPosts: 4,074Member
    Originally posted by superniceguy
     

    I never said it had more content, I said there was more things to do in it.

    Content IS things to do in a game and no, SWG in the first year did NOT have more things to do in it than TOR. 

    Crafting, harvesting (these 2 took up most my time),

    You can craft till your heart's content in TOR. You can't plop a harvestor on the ground and ugly the landscape, but you have companions that can gather for you. 

    housing

    Something you plop down, decorate and then forget about. ...but okay.

    , mission terminals, 

    Which were nothing more than random of the same thing. If they were faction missions it was always killing three guys guarding a pole. If it was hunting for animals it was always a pack guarding a mound of dirt. Yeah, great fun to be had there. 

    Cries of Alderaan series of quests,

    Yes, ONE series of quests. You also had the emperors retreat and jabba's palace. The quests were few and far between and they did little to help you gain XP. Hence, the reason for spin groups. In TOR I have the choice of class quests, world quests, side quests, operations ,flashpoints and heroics. Plus the quests are all fully voiced with diolague choices and companions that interact from time to time. It's hundreds of time's more fun to level than it ever was in SWG. 

      levelling through the 32 profession, which each had their own unique content,  eg Creature Handler and Bio Engineer meant to you explore the worlds and tame train and level up your pet.

    No, SOME professions allowed you your own unique content, not all of them. If you were TKM, Commando, Smuggler or one of those combat professions your content was nothing more than grinding bols and pickets. There were no special missions for pistoleers , carbineers, riflemen, or professions like that. Also many of those "32" professions were broken and never worked properly. 

    Theme Parks - Rebel, Jabba, Imperial. There was also quite a few missions on NPCs around the place, the thing is, you had to go find the stuff, instead of run missions led by the hand.

    This falls under mission terminals  amd quests which you already mentioned and I've already adressed. 

    SWG content was only limited by your own imagination.

    Yes, a LOT of imagination. For instance smugglers had to "imagine" that they were only good for splicing because the dream of smuggling things was non-existent. Commandos had to "imagine" that they were important  even though heavy weapons didn't work until after the NGE. 

     

     

    Currently Playing: Star Wars The Old Republic

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