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I kinda want a console MMO. Am I the only one?

2

Comments

  • gordiflugordiflu BarcelonaPosts: 757Member
    Originally posted by blognorg

     


    Originally posted by gordiflu Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter. MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware. I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.  
     

     

    Wow... just wow. This argument again? If it not for the consoles, the gaming market would be much, much smaller; ergo, there would less money in the industry, and less money spent on technology advancement. Not only that, but even if you were right and consoles did nothing but hinder technology, there would still be a roof (not far from where we currently are). High-end computer hardware is expensive, both to manufacture and for consumers to buy. And the market for it wouldn't be big enough on its own without the software support driven by consoles. So no, it wouldn't be a super-happy gaming future without consoles. Not to mention that games are getting crazy-expensive. We're advancing too quickly as is, and developers can hardly keep their doors open because of development costs. Your argument stems from a microscopic view of high-end PCs being more powerful than consoles at the end of their cycle, and somewhat hindering graphical fidelity. However, most games which are multi-platform are designed to go beyond consoles... like all of them. I have a solid gaming PC and there are games that I can't run at max settings. For some reason, people seem to think that graphical advancement stops for the duration of each console cycle. It doesn't. Just compare any launch game with a game now.


    Secondly, I really dislike the "dumbing down" phrase. It's usually just used by people who don't like something, but can't come up with any reasoning as to why. And the fact that you're blaming consoles for the "dumbing down" of a, nearly exclusive, PC genre is hilarious. There are plenty of "deep" games around, but you have to think about how much larger the industry is now. Games, as a whole, used to be pretty niche; and the fact is that you're not going to be able to market a ridiculously complicated game to a mass audience. It's always been that way. The only reason complicated games migrate to the PC is because of the installed base. Back in the 90's, during the PC boom, people realized that they could make almost any kind of game and instantly have some kind of audience. They didn't need mass appeal, because there are infinite-million people with PCs. It's not due to some mystical dumbing down pattern.


    Lastly, games shouldn't be needlessly complicated. They should be designed to fit the intended experience. Many times "deep" mechanics just bog down the game or feel out of place, and senselessly increase the learning curve. Rainbow Moon is a perfect example of this. There's nothing wrong with a game that's inherently simple, and this elitist attitude that there is, irritates me. There are still plenty of over-complicated games out there, so there's no need to complain about the contrary. The notion that console gamers can infect the glorious PC master race is pretty laughable.

    Star Citizen´s extremelly successful crowdfunding campaign, openly saying that it's going to be computers only, and not any computer but a beast of a computer, invalidates pretty much all your wall of text.

  • NetSageNetSage Lake Geneva, WIPosts: 1,040Member Uncommon
    Either of the final fantasy's will work. Both wore built for the playstation as well.  Hell it's near impossible to play XI with a mouse (so much easier even just using keyboard only).
  • asmkm22asmkm22 Anchorage, AKPosts: 1,788Member

    Most MMO's use a lot of key-mappings, so you'd have to design a console MMO with fewer buttons in mind.  Something like Guild Wars 2 would carry over just fine, but anything more complex would be a nightmare.

    For what it's worth, I have played WoW using a PS3 controller before, out of curiosity.  It was doable, but only for certain classes.  And PvP was entirely out of the question.  There were also issues with the fact that you simply need a mouse for many things, like selecting items.

    You make me like charity

  • TheocritusTheocritus Gary, INPosts: 3,731Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by gordiflu

    Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter.

    MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware.

    I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.

     

           Yeah I dont understand why someone would want a MMO to be severely limited by the console either......

  • GishgeronGishgeron Princeton, KYPosts: 1,287Member
    Originally posted by gordiflu

    Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter.

    MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware.

    I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.

     

     

      Well this is the least thought-out thing I've ever read.  To begin with, neither medium is responsible for your shift in the gaming core.  THAT happened because the average gamer is an older demographic now.  Older and with far more responsibilities in life.  Where the curve used to be 10-18 it is now 20-25 and that is around the time most people start kicking out babies.  Babies kill free time, and that happens to be why you are seeing a large rise in quick consume games.

      MMO gaming has gotten simpler because the market is larger now.  Before it was entirely based off of serious, full time gamers (whom also tended to lie within the aforementioned demographic before change).  Now, thanks to large commercial success like WoW and a couple others, the MMO audience is wider.  Very few people LIKE to play virtual spreadsheets, (I actually DO like that...) so the developers had to find ways to rework the systems in these games to cater to people who just wanted to play a game and not have to break out a graphing calculator each time new gear dropped.

      Finally, you will NEVER have a time where PC gaming is superior.  The trouble with PC gaming is that there are entirely too many possible hardware configurations.  The hardware market refuses to standardize in an intelligent way.  So when developers sit down to make a console game, they already know what ever user is working wth and can maximize THAT setup for optimal playability.  PC game creators have to consider everything on the market, from what is popular NOW to what was popular 5 years ago to what the average "non-computer-savvy" user might buy from Best Buy.  I'm a living example of why PC gaming fails.  I have a really nice laptop.  I can play most things on high settings.  However the particular video card I have is exactly ONE which seems to have issues with how Minecraft is dealt with inside Java and I cannot play that game without crashing constantly.  Yes, I have looked up every possible solution.  No, none of them worked.  I even tried a few solutions of my own before finally looking up my specific video card and reading about how many people had similar issues.

      The bottom line is that you are obviously blind and oblivious to what is actually going on in the real world. 

      That said, I'd play a console MMO today if I could.  I used to, EQOA on the PS2.  Loved it.  I also think that the freemium, F2P market setup would work perfectly from that medium.

    image

  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    If its just controllers you need get xpadder or joy2key.

    I've set up a ps3 arcade stick for planetside 2 in such a way. Use the stick for wasd, mouse for looking.
  • ShakyMoShakyMo BradfordPosts: 7,207Member
    Hmm most people "kick out babies" much later than 20-25 imo. I was a dad at 28, I'm the 2nd youngest dad in my daughters class and 4th youngest in my sons (was 30 when had him)
  • AmsaiAmsai Montgomery, ALPosts: 88Member Uncommon

    @ Gordiflu

    Could you define depth? I just want to make sure that first, you actually know what it means. And second what specific type of depth are we talking about? You mean like mechanics? Technology? What?

    Just so you know, I'm already thinking of console games with depth. So choose your definition and category wisely ^.~

  • k11keeperk11keeper Kalama, WAPosts: 1,056Member Uncommon
    Why wait for FFXIV to come out on ps3 when ffxi can be played on ps2 and xbox 360 right now. Or like everyone else said pick up a gamepad. If you want to play it while chilling on the couch most TVs nowadays have a PC input for jus that reason. I actually set up my pc to plug into my old TV cause it's 40' and now I can lounge on the couch while MMOing it up.
  • gordiflugordiflu BarcelonaPosts: 757Member
    Originally posted by Gishgeron
    Originally posted by gordiflu

    Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter.

    MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware.

    I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.

     

     

      Well this is the least thought-out thing I've ever read.  To begin with, neither medium is responsible for your shift in the gaming core.  THAT happened because the average gamer is an older demographic now.  Older and with far more responsibilities in life.  Where the curve used to be 10-18 it is now 20-25 and that is around the time most people start kicking out babies.  Babies kill free time, and that happens to be why you are seeing a large rise in quick consume games.

      MMO gaming has gotten simpler because the market is larger now.  Before it was entirely based off of serious, full time gamers (whom also tended to lie within the aforementioned demographic before change).  Now, thanks to large commercial success like WoW and a couple others, the MMO audience is wider.  Very few people LIKE to play virtual spreadsheets, (I actually DO like that...) so the developers had to find ways to rework the systems in these games to cater to people who just wanted to play a game and not have to break out a graphing calculator each time new gear dropped.

      Finally, you will NEVER have a time where PC gaming is superior.  The trouble with PC gaming is that there are entirely too many possible hardware configurations.  The hardware market refuses to standardize in an intelligent way.  So when developers sit down to make a console game, they already know what ever user is working wth and can maximize THAT setup for optimal playability.  PC game creators have to consider everything on the market, from what is popular NOW to what was popular 5 years ago to what the average "non-computer-savvy" user might buy from Best Buy.  I'm a living example of why PC gaming fails.  I have a really nice laptop.  I can play most things on high settings.  However the particular video card I have is exactly ONE which seems to have issues with how Minecraft is dealt with inside Java and I cannot play that game without crashing constantly.  Yes, I have looked up every possible solution.  No, none of them worked.  I even tried a few solutions of my own before finally looking up my specific video card and reading about how many people had similar issues.

      The bottom line is that you are obviously blind and oblivious to what is actually going on in the real world. 

      That said, I'd play a console MMO today if I could.  I used to, EQOA on the PS2.  Loved it.  I also think that the freemium, F2P market setup would work perfectly from that medium.

    Did you notice the word "partially" on the second sentence of my short post?

    See, while you are right, you are not totally right. You are missing a few things.

    Also, younger kids play way more video-games than we did when we were kids(I ll be 40 tomorrow). While we may not have the time, they do. And while they are kids, they are not stupid. Many of them are more computer savvy than we are and certainly are than we were at their age.

    Computer gaming is superior becouse computerscan do more things than consoles. That is a fact. Check the games that have been listed here, like Oblivion or Fallout. The PC version has better graphic resolution and is moddable. Old hits like Diablo II or Starcraft would have not worked on any console of the time, not to mention even older ones like UO or AC.

  • blognorgblognorg Roseburg, ORPosts: 643Member


    Originally posted by gordiflu

    Originally posted by blognorg  

    Originally posted by gordiflu Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter. MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware. I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.  
        Wow... just wow. This argument again? If it not for the consoles, the gaming market would be much, much smaller; ergo, there would less money in the industry, and less money spent on technology advancement. Not only that, but even if you were right and consoles did nothing but hinder technology, there would still be a roof (not far from where we currently are). High-end computer hardware is expensive, both to manufacture and for consumers to buy. And the market for it wouldn't be big enough on its own without the software support driven by consoles. So no, it wouldn't be a super-happy gaming future without consoles. Not to mention that games are getting crazy-expensive. We're advancing too quickly as is, and developers can hardly keep their doors open because of development costs. Your argument stems from a microscopic view of high-end PCs being more powerful than consoles at the end of their cycle, and somewhat hindering graphical fidelity. However, most games which are multi-platform are designed to go beyond consoles... like all of them. I have a solid gaming PC and there are games that I can't run at max settings. For some reason, people seem to think that graphical advancement stops for the duration of each console cycle. It doesn't. Just compare any launch game with a game now. Secondly, I really dislike the "dumbing down" phrase. It's usually just used by people who don't like something, but can't come up with any reasoning as to why. And the fact that you're blaming consoles for the "dumbing down" of a, nearly exclusive, PC genre is hilarious. There are plenty of "deep" games around, but you have to think about how much larger the industry is now. Games, as a whole, used to be pretty niche; and the fact is that you're not going to be able to market a ridiculously complicated game to a mass audience. It's always been that way. The only reason complicated games migrate to the PC is because of the installed base. Back in the 90's, during the PC boom, people realized that they could make almost any kind of game and instantly have some kind of audience. They didn't need mass appeal, because there are infinite-million people with PCs. It's not due to some mystical dumbing down pattern. Lastly, games shouldn't be needlessly complicated. They should be designed to fit the intended experience. Many times "deep" mechanics just bog down the game or feel out of place, and senselessly increase the learning curve. Rainbow Moon is a perfect example of this. There's nothing wrong with a game that's inherently simple, and this elitist attitude that there is, irritates me. There are still plenty of over-complicated games out there, so there's no need to complain about the contrary. The notion that console gamers can infect the glorious PC master race is pretty laughable.
    Star Citizen´s extremelly successful crowdfunding campaign, openly saying that it's going to be computers only, and not any computer but a beast of a computer, invalidates pretty much all your wall of text.
     


    Um, no. No, it doesn't. You're talking about one game, one plot point, the exception. There's also the possibility that it wouldn't have existed without consoles. You've clearly missed my point entirely, which is not uncommon with people whom share your opinion. The gaming industry wouldn't be where it is today without consoles. Not to belittle Star Citizen (as I'm actually a supporter), but I wouldn't classify it as 'extremely successful'. Successful for what it is, yes, but it's still just a niche game. And how many supporters were first introduced to gaming via consoles; probably many. You're not seeing the big picture; you just seem to be an elitist who likes to condemn those whom don't think as you do.

  • apocolusterapocoluster newport news, VAPosts: 1,321Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Rydeson
         I'll pass on any console MMO..  That is part of the issue I have now with gaming is that the devs have wanted to date the "console" gamer and their wallets.. It is why genre has changed over time, and not for the better in my opinion..  MMO gaming is starting to feel like arena football.. It's NOT FOOTBALL dammit.. lolo
    oh but it is sir...its bad football  :)

    No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  • blognorgblognorg Roseburg, ORPosts: 643Member


    Originally posted by ShakyMo If its just controllers you need get xpadder or joy2key. I've set up a ps3 arcade stick for planetside 2 in such a way. Use the stick for wasd, mouse for looking.
     

    I mentioned in a previous post that I've done this with several games. I got Xpadder some time ago, and it has made gaming more enjoyable with some games (I probably wouldn't have gotten nearly as far as I did in Rift had I not been able to use a controller). However, like I mentioned, it's often a lot of work to set up a control scheme that works well, sometimes with several caveats. First-person shooters are actually one genre in which I prefer mouse and keyboard... for multi-player, anyway. I played through Far Cry 3 and Rage with a controller. Controllers have a lot of potential, and anyone who has used Xpadder will tell you that, but I would like to see some interface support, for once.

  • blognorgblognorg Roseburg, ORPosts: 643Member


    Originally posted by asmkm22 Most MMO's use a lot of key-mappings, so you'd have to design a console MMO with fewer buttons in mind.  Something like Guild Wars 2 would carry over just fine, but anything more complex would be a nightmare. For what it's worth, I have played WoW using a PS3 controller before, out of curiosity.  It was doable, but only for certain classes.  And PvP was entirely out of the question.  There were also issues with the fact that you simply need a mouse for many things, like selecting items.
     

    I agree with you somewhat, as it's the basis for my argument. My argument being that an interface designed for a controller would be better than they are now (for controller use). I played Rift (a well-accepted WoW clone), and I did fine with it. Actually, I mainly did PvP, and I did pretty well (usually in the top 5%-10%). Any shortcomings had to do with me, as a player. I bet the people I played with/against had no idea that I was using a controller. But yeah, there were some things that I did need the cursor for (like selecting things), which isn't the best with an analog stick. However, these would be issues if the interface was designed for a controller.

  • blognorgblognorg Roseburg, ORPosts: 643Member


    Originally posted by dbstylin34 Undead labs class 4 will be a zombie mmo for the xbox 360, although they are bringing out there XBLA title "state of decay" first, I think we are in for a bit of a wait before developers realize the potential for a console mmo dude.
     

    I've heard about that, and I'm looking forward to it. I'm sure I'll pick up State of Decay (Class 3) when it comes out.

  • JemcrystalJemcrystal Champaign, ILPosts: 1,548Member Uncommon
    I want the opposite.  I want game makers to make a computer game station and sell it cheap to everyone all over the world.


  • gordiflugordiflu BarcelonaPosts: 757Member
    Originally posted by blognorg

     


    Originally posted by gordiflu

    Originally posted by blognorg  

    Originally posted by gordiflu Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter. MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware. I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.  
        Wow... just wow. This argument again? If it not for the consoles, the gaming market would be much, much smaller; ergo, there would less money in the industry, and less money spent on technology advancement. Not only that, but even if you were right and consoles did nothing but hinder technology, there would still be a roof (not far from where we currently are). High-end computer hardware is expensive, both to manufacture and for consumers to buy. And the market for it wouldn't be big enough on its own without the software support driven by consoles. So no, it wouldn't be a super-happy gaming future without consoles. Not to mention that games are getting crazy-expensive. We're advancing too quickly as is, and developers can hardly keep their doors open because of development costs. Your argument stems from a microscopic view of high-end PCs being more powerful than consoles at the end of their cycle, and somewhat hindering graphical fidelity. However, most games which are multi-platform are designed to go beyond consoles... like all of them. I have a solid gaming PC and there are games that I can't run at max settings. For some reason, people seem to think that graphical advancement stops for the duration of each console cycle. It doesn't. Just compare any launch game with a game now. Secondly, I really dislike the "dumbing down" phrase. It's usually just used by people who don't like something, but can't come up with any reasoning as to why. And the fact that you're blaming consoles for the "dumbing down" of a, nearly exclusive, PC genre is hilarious. There are plenty of "deep" games around, but you have to think about how much larger the industry is now. Games, as a whole, used to be pretty niche; and the fact is that you're not going to be able to market a ridiculously complicated game to a mass audience. It's always been that way. The only reason complicated games migrate to the PC is because of the installed base. Back in the 90's, during the PC boom, people realized that they could make almost any kind of game and instantly have some kind of audience. They didn't need mass appeal, because there are infinite-million people with PCs. It's not due to some mystical dumbing down pattern. Lastly, games shouldn't be needlessly complicated. They should be designed to fit the intended experience. Many times "deep" mechanics just bog down the game or feel out of place, and senselessly increase the learning curve. Rainbow Moon is a perfect example of this. There's nothing wrong with a game that's inherently simple, and this elitist attitude that there is, irritates me. There are still plenty of over-complicated games out there, so there's no need to complain about the contrary. The notion that console gamers can infect the glorious PC master race is pretty laughable.
    Star Citizen´s extremelly successful crowdfunding campaign, openly saying that it's going to be computers only, and not any computer but a beast of a computer, invalidates pretty much all your wall of text.
     

     


    Um, no. No, it doesn't. You're talking about one game, one plot point, the exception. There's also the possibility that it wouldn't have existed without consoles. You've clearly missed my point entirely, which is not uncommon with people whom share your opinion. The gaming industry wouldn't be where it is today without consoles. Not to belittle Star Citizen (as I'm actually a supporter), but I wouldn't classify it as 'extremely successful'. Successful for what it is, yes, but it's still just a niche game. And how many supporters were first introduced to gaming via consoles; probably many. You're not seeing the big picture; you just seem to be an elitist who likes to condemn those whom don't think as you do.

    If we follow your logic, MMOs (and any online game for that matter) wouldn't exist without PCs. No console was able to support that type of games when the first ones appeared. I guess you see the flaw in your argument.

    Fact is, hardware on computers is superior, and has always been. Fact is, PC games offer more stuff than console ones and have always done. You can especulate as much as you fancy with your "what if"'s, but the facts are the facts.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,765Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by killahh
    There's a reason the us gov uses ps3's slaved yo make supercomputers.

    And that reason is likely that Sony very heavily subsidized them making one for PR purposes, as happens with a lot of supercomputers.  Notice that you never hear what hardware companies like Google or Facebook use internally.  You rarely find out what hardware a company is using if it isn't subsidized for PR.

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,765Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by BadSpock

    I want an MMO specifically for consoles - not a 3rd rate port from the PC version (just like PC gamers (which I am too) very much hate the 3rd rate console ports).

    It's always easy to tell if a game was made for PC then ported to console or vice versa.

    I want an MMO specifially made and designed exclussively for console from a AAA dev studio.

    -Fully optimized engine/network code for the platform (identical hardware is a + here)

    -Integrated voice chat - I may be a MMO veteran but I'm sick of text box chat in MMOs or having to use Vent/TS

    -Fully optimized control scheme

    And yes, I've hooked my PC up to my TV and played with Mouse/Keyboard and yes I've hooked up a game controller and tried both first party game support (TERA) and 3rd party controller support (WoW) and if the game isn't designed for controller 100% it's just clunky.

    And an extra high price tag to compensate for the console maker taking a large cut of the revenue.  And very slow patching times, even for game-breaking bugs, because everything has to be approved by the console maker.  There are compelling reasons why very few MMORPGs make it to consoles, and those aren't going away.

  • JonokuJonoku Cool, PAPosts: 645Member
    Before discussions like this, I first want to see what next gen consoles have to offer, new xbox coming out this year in december, whats it have to offer to expand mmo market over consoles?

    Looking at: The Repopulation
    Preordering: None
    Playing: Random Games

  • QuizzicalQuizzical Posts: 14,765Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Gishgeron

       Finally, you will NEVER have a time where PC gaming is superior.  The trouble with PC gaming is that there are entirely too many possible hardware configurations.  The hardware market refuses to standardize in an intelligent way.  So when developers sit down to make a console game, they already know what ever user is working wth and can maximize THAT setup for optimal playability.  PC game creators have to consider everything on the market, from what is popular NOW to what was popular 5 years ago to what the average "non-computer-savvy" user might buy from Best Buy.  I'm a living example of why PC gaming fails.  I have a really nice laptop.  I can play most things on high settings.  However the particular video card I have is exactly ONE which seems to have issues with how Minecraft is dealt with inside Java and I cannot play that game without crashing constantly.  Yes, I have looked up every possible solution.  No, none of them worked.  I even tried a few solutions of my own before finally looking up my specific video card and reading about how many people had similar issues.

    A time when PC gaming is superior?  Such as, oh, say, today?  Or any other time in about the last 15 years or so, for that matter.

    As for standardization, ever hear of OpenGL?  How about DirectX?  The standards are there and are very broadly used.  It would be helpful if game makers were to better communicate what the real system requirements for their games are, though.

    As for glitches, yeah, there can be odd bugs like that.  Sometimes it's actually an issue where there is a bug in the code, but some video drivers are able to handle it and make the code work right anyway.  For an example of this, in a project I'm working on, some of my fragment shaders set a vec4 equal to a vec3.  My desktop was able to figure out that what I meant was the first three components of the vec4 should be the three components of the vec3.  My laptop was able to figure out the same thing.  My parents' desktop, on the other hand, was not, and crashed.  Once I figured out to explicitly tell it to set the first three components of the vec4 equal to the vec3 I gave it, it worked.

  • evemaster00evemaster00 LondonPosts: 171Member

    You want one? This april you've got one. Defiance, pixel perfect shooter MMO on PC, PS3 and Xbox.

    Trion spent over 80 million dollars on it, which is a lot more than they spent on Rift, and considering Rift has had great success, things are looking up.

  • blognorgblognorg Roseburg, ORPosts: 643Member
    Originally posted by gordiflu
    Originally posted by blognorg

     


    Originally posted by gordiflu

    Originally posted by blognorg  

    Originally posted by gordiflu Consoles have been hindering and slowing down technology progress in computer games already for a few years. They are also partially responsible for many computer games getting dumber, easier and shorter. Specially shorter. MMOs have also been getting dumber easier and shorter as an indirect result of this mindset change in gamers and developers. Console MMOs will only accelerate the process, with newer MMOs beeing limited by console's inferior hardware. I actually wish all console gaming failed big time, so we could have superior PC games. Unfortunately I am aware this won't happen. Beta was superior to VHS. Minidisk was superior to CD. You get the idea, don't you.  
        Wow... just wow. This argument again? If it not for the consoles, the gaming market would be much, much smaller; ergo, there would less money in the industry, and less money spent on technology advancement. Not only that, but even if you were right and consoles did nothing but hinder technology, there would still be a roof (not far from where we currently are). High-end computer hardware is expensive, both to manufacture and for consumers to buy. And the market for it wouldn't be big enough on its own without the software support driven by consoles. So no, it wouldn't be a super-happy gaming future without consoles. Not to mention that games are getting crazy-expensive. We're advancing too quickly as is, and developers can hardly keep their doors open because of development costs. Your argument stems from a microscopic view of high-end PCs being more powerful than consoles at the end of their cycle, and somewhat hindering graphical fidelity. However, most games which are multi-platform are designed to go beyond consoles... like all of them. I have a solid gaming PC and there are games that I can't run at max settings. For some reason, people seem to think that graphical advancement stops for the duration of each console cycle. It doesn't. Just compare any launch game with a game now. Secondly, I really dislike the "dumbing down" phrase. It's usually just used by people who don't like something, but can't come up with any reasoning as to why. And the fact that you're blaming consoles for the "dumbing down" of a, nearly exclusive, PC genre is hilarious. There are plenty of "deep" games around, but you have to think about how much larger the industry is now. Games, as a whole, used to be pretty niche; and the fact is that you're not going to be able to market a ridiculously complicated game to a mass audience. It's always been that way. The only reason complicated games migrate to the PC is because of the installed base. Back in the 90's, during the PC boom, people realized that they could make almost any kind of game and instantly have some kind of audience. They didn't need mass appeal, because there are infinite-million people with PCs. It's not due to some mystical dumbing down pattern. Lastly, games shouldn't be needlessly complicated. They should be designed to fit the intended experience. Many times "deep" mechanics just bog down the game or feel out of place, and senselessly increase the learning curve. Rainbow Moon is a perfect example of this. There's nothing wrong with a game that's inherently simple, and this elitist attitude that there is, irritates me. There are still plenty of over-complicated games out there, so there's no need to complain about the contrary. The notion that console gamers can infect the glorious PC master race is pretty laughable.
    Star Citizen´s extremelly successful crowdfunding campaign, openly saying that it's going to be computers only, and not any computer but a beast of a computer, invalidates pretty much all your wall of text.
     

     


    Um, no. No, it doesn't. You're talking about one game, one plot point, the exception. There's also the possibility that it wouldn't have existed without consoles. You've clearly missed my point entirely, which is not uncommon with people whom share your opinion. The gaming industry wouldn't be where it is today without consoles. Not to belittle Star Citizen (as I'm actually a supporter), but I wouldn't classify it as 'extremely successful'. Successful for what it is, yes, but it's still just a niche game. And how many supporters were first introduced to gaming via consoles; probably many. You're not seeing the big picture; you just seem to be an elitist who likes to condemn those whom don't think as you do.

    If we follow your logic, MMOs (and any online game for that matter) wouldn't exist without PCs. No console was able to support that type of games when the first ones appeared. I guess you see the flaw in your argument.

    Fact is, hardware on computers is superior, and has always been. Fact is, PC games offer more stuff than console ones and have always done. You can especulate as much as you fancy with your "what if"'s, but the facts are the facts.

    My logic is that online games wouldn't exist without PCs? Um... I guess that's a possibility, but I'm not really sure what you mean by referring to that as my logic. Regardless, I never said that PCs haven't contributed to gaming, nor have I said that they are inferior to consoles. In terms of hardware, they objectively have more potential. My point was, and still is, that consoles have have contributed to the advancement of gaming as a whole, and they shouldn't be thought of as "holding the industry back". As much as you'd like to believe, graphics wouldn't be better now if consoles hadn't existed. Ignoring all of the economic reasons, there would still be a limit to what the consumer is willing to pay, the costs of manufacturing, and simply the advancement of tech. The only instance in which consoles can be thought of as a remedial component of gaming is the narrow-minded instance where a multi-platform game panders to the consoles. That can pinned on the devloper on an individual level, though.

  • blognorgblognorg Roseburg, ORPosts: 643Member
    Originally posted by evemaster00

    You want one? This april you've got one. Defiance, pixel perfect shooter MMO on PC, PS3 and Xbox.

    Trion spent over 80 million dollars on it, which is a lot more than they spent on Rift, and considering Rift has had great success, things are looking up.

    Thanks for the info and the stastic. That's crazy. It sounds vaguely familiar, but slipped under my radar for the most part.

  • madazzmadazz A town, ONPosts: 1,564Member Uncommon

    I would love a console mmorpg (specifcally mmorpg). I haven't tried any of the available ones yet (or games in similar style), so I wonder how communication works. If its over voice chat, not sure I'd like that so much unless there was a punishment system for abusing it. Such as running around with your music playing. Would be kind of cool to have your voice masked to sound like your character would too. 

    Totally off topic, but I HATE that stupid moving Avatar. It's distracting, has very poor looping and its a stupid poop face too.

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