You guys are praising TSW's f2p strategy but I have one caveat for you -- let's see which game if either is still running in a year.
Honestly, there's a better business bet on SWTOR being operational in another year than TSW, no matter what you are saying now about Funcom being nicer guys than EA. Companies, alas, do not run on nice. They don't pay staff on nice. They don't run server farms on nice.
Let's check in on December 2013 and see which game lasts longer, and if either is still going, shall we? Because it won't matter if you like TSW to pieces if they fold.
And if SWTOR seems to suck to you, but a few hundred thousands or so of us are still loving it and buying cartel packs and paying subs in a year? You can burn a lot of bytes here on the boards saying how we have no taste. Yup. And that's just fine. EA will still have made the right decision, because I suspect no way in hell is TSW going to make it.
You guys are praising TSW's f2p strategy but I have one caveat for you -- let's see which game if either is still running in a year.
Honestly, there's a better business bet on SWTOR being operational in another year than TSW, no matter what you are saying now about Funcom being nicer guys than EA. Companies, alas, do not run on nice. They don't pay staff on nice. They don't run server farms on nice.
Let's check in on December 2013 and see which game lasts longer, and if either is still going, shall we? Because it won't matter if you like TSW to pieces if they fold.
And if SWTOR seems to suck to you, but a few hundred thousands or so of us are still loving it and buying cartel packs and paying subs in a year? You can burn a lot of bytes here on the boards saying how we have no taste. Yup. And that's just fine. EA will still have made the right decision, because I suspect no way in hell is TSW going to make it.
Yet AoC is still running... Even if Funcom has their issues cutting and running isn't one of them. With Bioware doing things like charging for actionbars they aren't making people want to give them their money, they are driving them away.
I actually liked this game, but I didn't like it more than WoW or Rift. And I only have enough time (actually I don't have enough time) to play 2 MMOs at a time. I went back after it went F2P, expecting there to be a fairly normal game, like lord of the rings. Where I would have some restrictions yes, but nothing that was too bad since I had been a previous subber (like lotro again). However upon my return I found that only 1 piece of my main's gear, I could use (which made him practically useless). I couldn't do anything reall with my main since any quest or raid wasn't open to him. So I went to some other characters, and noticed it was even worse. I couldn't get QUEST REWARDS. This is by far the most restrictive f2p in the history of the world lol. I'm suprised I didn't have to pay $1 for every character in my password or something like that...
It's basically a demo mode for brand new players not a real F2P option. With the restrictions that go with the current implementation, I just can't muster the interest to play again. The worst was requiring a sub to get the "complementary" cartel coins given for having bought the game and subscribed previously. I'm sure I'm not the only one who, after seeing that, had my determination not to pay a penny more for the game hardened into unbreakable resolve.
Could care less actually, but if it gets put in then please use it to change things up a bit like have different mobs come out at night or something so its a little more realistic. Oh wait, then peeps will cry because now they will have to wait until their quest mobs start to spawn. You can't keep everyone happy.
- any form of housing
Shouldn't be that damn hard. I mean EQ2/SWG/Vanguard have it just to name a few games with different models.
- pazzaak
It would be nice to have something to do besides kill kill kill regardless of which phase of the game you are doing it in.
- swoop racing
See above
- space exploration off the freakin rails
I've always found it ironic that Star Wars had little free roaming space content (the space shots in the movies are essentially a rail system i.e. both Death Star scenes, the asteroid scene, and on and on). I know a lot want this option but if you actually think about it, there wasn't much of Star Wars that actually took place in open space. It was mostly on planets/moons or inside capitol ships. Star Trek is where the interactions between ships was at the center of the story. Just sayin.
- water and swimming
Why? What ever happened in the water in Star Wars that is worth remembering? Luke disapeared in the garbage smasher. There is no need to swim in SWTOR. Adding it as part of an expansion would work, but really, we are playing Star Wars, not Water Wars. I'd rather see a revamp of the space system to this any day. Besides, blasters and light sabers in water just make me shudder.
- optimize the horrible engine and plethora of loading screens
It is a pain to get to a planet with all the wasted time of cut scenes and space stations. Just let us go where we are supposed to go. I do enjoy the full voice scenes though, as long as I haven't done the quest before, then there is the space bar. I do think they chose the wrong engine though.
I think the legacy system was a great idea my problem with it was that you had to buy the perks not earn them which cheapened the full thing. They should have made it like RiFT's PA system where you had to earn everything through playing the game, as it stands it's a great idea poorly implemented. In hindsight this was done so it would work when they added the cash shop and they could cash in on people yet again.
As so far I guess everyone knows :-) Swtor is best game ever for me, most fun, enjoyable, .... so I do not care for f2p which I consider in general worst thing that happend to good gaming.
As someone who subbed a month after release for a couple months, I am happy that ToR is F2P now since I didn't think the game was worth a $15/month sub. It is better to play with some restrictions and just unlock a thing here and there as a casual player, playing it as a secondary MMO. For people who are not playing casually, it is better to get a sub and forget about the F2P model. As a 'froob', I do not expect to be able to get ahold of everything that a subber can get. That is ok since I doink around in ToR when I do not want to play WoW. Players who expect to play ToR heavily without spending any cash may have unreal expectations. Do I feel that EA went overboard on restrictions? Yes, but the game is still playable.
I find the legacy system very interesting, and I wish that other devs would consider these types of roleplay options in the future for their games.
The groupfinder tool in theory was important, but it seems like no one uses it.
The other aspects mentioned in the article I can't really comment on since I never really bothered with the rakhgoul event and I am not particularly interested in getting an OP'ed bot companion.
"If going by that logic then Everquest must be a WoW rip off as well. "
Now that is a silly comment considering that Everquest original was released more than 4 years prior to wow, and even EQII was released around a month before also.
I am not happy with this F2P model. Action bars??? REALLY? I have to pay for action bars. That alone tells me where their intentions lie. I'll wait and see if they give us action bars. If not, I'll keep playing other games.
If the game was decent enough, the $15 fee would not have been an issue. None of the stuff that got added to SWTOR was decent enough.
The Legacy and Group Finder should have been in at launch. HK-51 and events are the only good things, but the events seem to have now stopped with the Cartel Market.
Where is all the content to make KOTOR 3-9 and beyond? If they had all that content, and released something worthwhile from it each month, people would have kept subbing. Then when the content dried out, then make the game F2P, if needed.
As far as themepark MMO's good SWTOR is one of the few worth playing. Its worthwhile playing through each character class as each has it's own story. The flashpoints and operations are fun to do a few times.
The space missions are pretty meh and it woulda been nice to have actual in content in space but for being just a minigame they aren't to bad and are great for xp. The PVP is a joke. It's nothing but a minigame. With the Star Wars ip any pvp should be meaningful faction vs faction warfare. There should be fighting for territory and resource control.
I still pay the sub for it because at least until I finish each class it's worth it for me. Their F2P model is pretty terrible though. The only upside to it is that anything you get from the cartel market you can sell/buy on the in game market for credits. Since credits are pretty easy to make it is easily F2P with no restrictions.
Right now it's the only themepark worth playing.
TSW is like a diseased infested hooker who will rob you afterwards.
SWTOR is like that pretty girl that just lays there and doesn't do much.
Eve is the sultry seductress that does that killer trick with her tongue that keeps you coming back again and again.
I am still having fun working my way through the various storylines in SWToR. The HK addition was fun and I hope to see more like it in the future. Legacy was cool in that I could mail to my alts on the other faction. I had a good time during the events as well.
However, f2p is not listed among my top five things from SWToR. The community has suffered some due to f2p as well as server crowding.
I love the posts below stating that if you bash SWTOR in any form, you are an entitlement douche bag. Now granted I'm sure some of SWTOR's former subs were, but that statement is so biased it's not even funny. I'm not suprised the comment was made by what many would deem a "fanboy".
Game isn't a 0, it's a decent game for sure. I beta tested it, bought CE and played for several months. Problem with the game as what will happen again in 2013 is player retention. SWTOR just doesn't offer enough in terms of things to do compared to other games. The fans wanted open world space, pod racing and meaningful open world pvp to name a few. Bioware gives us a legacy system, couple of rinse repeat raids and then a F2P conversion with a cash shop. Then instead of adding in those features they still choose to milk their fans.
I find the latter the most insulting of them all. They hid in the dark about F2P for months while they secretly were developing it. They essentially let their game die out and pulled a SOE in the hopes that fresh blood would refill the ranks of players. Just like the NGE, the F2P has been doing the same thing to turn off former subs and even prevent new players from enjoying the game. I for one feel a bit ripped off with funding their F2P conversion. Why do I feel this way? Well James Ohlen made a Twitter account and started asking for feedback here and there from the fans. He stopped posting for months now because it pretty much was all BS to make us believe that they were actually listening.
Players wanted new species, we get nothing, maybe Cathar "eventually" but then more types depend on how well it sells on the Cartel Market. Pazaak, Pod Racing, Sabaac, Space? A pipe dream and Jeff Hickman (being the douche he has been known for) even had the nerve to carrot the fans into saying he's played it, it rocks and you can't haha.
The game when it released I would say probably was a good 7-8/10 for production values. Post launch though they've been 3/10 at best, they have just lost touch with their community.
It's sad to think SWG died for this game. Even though SWG had problems, it had a way better community and tools then SWTOR will EVER HAVE.
Originally posted by GwapoJosh These massive paid advertisements on this site are becoming ridiculous.. The f2p conversion EA came up with is a joke and there is nothing at all to praise about it.
I agree.
It's as if some executives on this site are actually being paid to puff these games not review them.
According to EA, roughly 60% of the users who quit Star Wars: The Old Republic reported the subscription business model as the main reason they stopped playing the game.
Only because "Game is crap" wasn't an option on the exit pole. Saying it's not worth the sub fee is as close as one can get. EA can read that however they want I guess.
I Re-Tried it today as free-to-play and i can tell you it's the worse model i have ever seen. I bought the game as digital delux and still as free-to-play user i only have 2 characters on all servers..... which is just wrong...
Sorry - just downloaded the 40Gigs this game takes and i think i will just delete it now....
EDIT: TSW did it right - i think i will just buy the box version, enjoy what i can till i reach a point i need/want more content and then maybe buy it or not.... Bioware you suck!!!!!
40gigs?
EA knows how to punish f2p players since im subbed and the game its only 20.5gigs^^
fan of SWG, XCOM, Defiance, Global Agenda, Need For Speed, all Star Wars single player games. And waiting the darn STAR CITIZEN
Wish Bioware was independent again.. Ea and there cash quick attitude is bad.. Just be wary of any mmo that's being released that has Ea as the publisher..
This game could have really blown the gate open with the f2p, but that was also rushed like the launch of the game
I finally caved in and downloaded the game but after having to download an additional 20gb or whatever at F2P rate (250kbs) I stopped and removed. Not going to download something at that rate when my ISP lets me get 1.7mbs - 2.1mbs.
Remove the rate cap for F2P accounts and I will try it.
While this game is acknowledged by most to have great potential it still remains the hottest controversy of this year in MMO's. The level of hype before launch skyrocketed the level of disappointment after a few months people played it.
It is also a fact that so many players left this game but there is a fewer number of people that feel TOR is their game. And that is ok. Opinions, as respected as they are, cannot hide the truth, TOR failed not because many people are the "entitled" MMO goons that cosnpired to hate this game but because it has basic and fundamental flaws upon its design and management, starting or current.
As for those 5 additions the game had in its first year there is not much to write home about, no reason to cheer firing your 25 free rockets on your fleet station.
5. Group Finder. Yes this must be the most welcomed addition, a feature that should have been from the start helping the minimal staying power this game has. This feature came very late.
4.HK 51 companion. It was an ok idea and a welcoming one but it was just some added content, like other MMO's add a small zone or a dungeon or a raid. In fact it was a content long awaited but quickly consumed not like the above mentioned examples. Nothing great or groundbreaking about it, but the lack of features in this game shows this content as something spectacular.
3. Events. The Rakghoul plague event was a good one, people enjoyed it but the acquisition race was not that great. I still remeber people waiting in line to open the box, is that sort of idea of fun? And talking about events i m counting the Cartel Shop Life Day event, i feel sad every time i am thinking about it . But again lacking other features we have to mention those, and try not to compare them with the events other new MMOs had at the same time.
2. Legacy. Some perks Legacy brings are very usefull to some, the buffs are extremelly useful when leveling an alt but many others are just fluff, imho. Yet it is good to have them than have nothing. But still, it is not a feature that will bring players in or help grow the game at its current state.
1. Free to Play. There is none. It is just a generous freemium model that never fails to remind the player how great it will be if the player was subbed. And to think that "F2P" was implemented because people "didnt want to pay a sub", it is crazy. Focused primarily on Cartel Shop sales even affecting their subscribers, it is the most hated feature in the game. It might bring some players back or make some new players play but its main usage is to constantly milk those cows still left in the farm.
TOR has many nice features, no auto attack and companion system are well made, the flashpoints and operations are very interesting when there are no bugs (And there are so many Known issues added in every patch), their WarZones were ok before 1.2, it really has the Star Wars essense. It is not a Great Game but it is an ok one with a huge retention problem.
I hope the second year of SWTOR will bring the notion of common sense to their developers and managers, to help them make a great game this company and this franchise deserves and not a first rate milking machine the game is now.
The SWTOR team left the feeling they can't do it right. What ever they did, it was a flawed copy of something or that uninspired it nearly hurts. And as they recognized, they had bet their money on the wrong horse, they did not change the horse, they tried to dope the old one. Look at the last added F2P model, it shows, they just don't understand, how to reach the playerbase.
It is time to either change the management or a good part of the game. The latter won't happen with the first, so...
Comments
You guys are praising TSW's f2p strategy but I have one caveat for you -- let's see which game if either is still running in a year.
Honestly, there's a better business bet on SWTOR being operational in another year than TSW, no matter what you are saying now about Funcom being nicer guys than EA. Companies, alas, do not run on nice. They don't pay staff on nice. They don't run server farms on nice.
Let's check in on December 2013 and see which game lasts longer, and if either is still going, shall we? Because it won't matter if you like TSW to pieces if they fold.
And if SWTOR seems to suck to you, but a few hundred thousands or so of us are still loving it and buying cartel packs and paying subs in a year? You can burn a lot of bytes here on the boards saying how we have no taste. Yup. And that's just fine. EA will still have made the right decision, because I suspect no way in hell is TSW going to make it.
Yet AoC is still running... Even if Funcom has their issues cutting and running isn't one of them. With Bioware doing things like charging for actionbars they aren't making people want to give them their money, they are driving them away.
No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin
DAOC Live (inactive): R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R6 Healer
Replies in orange.
"Still, this doesn’t mean that BioWare rested on its laurels with SWTOR."
What LAURELS ??? They have nothing to rest on ....
I think the legacy system was a great idea my problem with it was that you had to buy the perks not earn them which cheapened the full thing. They should have made it like RiFT's PA system where you had to earn everything through playing the game, as it stands it's a great idea poorly implemented. In hindsight this was done so it would work when they added the cash shop and they could cash in on people yet again.
As someone who subbed a month after release for a couple months, I am happy that ToR is F2P now since I didn't think the game was worth a $15/month sub. It is better to play with some restrictions and just unlock a thing here and there as a casual player, playing it as a secondary MMO. For people who are not playing casually, it is better to get a sub and forget about the F2P model. As a 'froob', I do not expect to be able to get ahold of everything that a subber can get. That is ok since I doink around in ToR when I do not want to play WoW. Players who expect to play ToR heavily without spending any cash may have unreal expectations. Do I feel that EA went overboard on restrictions? Yes, but the game is still playable.
I find the legacy system very interesting, and I wish that other devs would consider these types of roleplay options in the future for their games.
The groupfinder tool in theory was important, but it seems like no one uses it.
The other aspects mentioned in the article I can't really comment on since I never really bothered with the rakhgoul event and I am not particularly interested in getting an OP'ed bot companion.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.
Now that is a silly comment considering that Everquest original was released more than 4 years prior to wow, and even EQII was released around a month before also.
Free to play was the WORST change for THIS YEAR.
If the game was decent enough, the $15 fee would not have been an issue. None of the stuff that got added to SWTOR was decent enough.
The Legacy and Group Finder should have been in at launch. HK-51 and events are the only good things, but the events seem to have now stopped with the Cartel Market.
Where is all the content to make KOTOR 3-9 and beyond? If they had all that content, and released something worthwhile from it each month, people would have kept subbing. Then when the content dried out, then make the game F2P, if needed.
Star Trek Online - Best Free MMORPG of 2012
Everyone who is complaining about SWTOR is just an entitled sperglord.
Im having loads of fun and it's a blast to play it after it went F2P.
As far as themepark MMO's good SWTOR is one of the few worth playing. Its worthwhile playing through each character class as each has it's own story. The flashpoints and operations are fun to do a few times.
The space missions are pretty meh and it woulda been nice to have actual in content in space but for being just a minigame they aren't to bad and are great for xp. The PVP is a joke. It's nothing but a minigame. With the Star Wars ip any pvp should be meaningful faction vs faction warfare. There should be fighting for territory and resource control.
I still pay the sub for it because at least until I finish each class it's worth it for me. Their F2P model is pretty terrible though. The only upside to it is that anything you get from the cartel market you can sell/buy on the in game market for credits. Since credits are pretty easy to make it is easily F2P with no restrictions.
Right now it's the only themepark worth playing.
TSW is like a diseased infested hooker who will rob you afterwards.
SWTOR is like that pretty girl that just lays there and doesn't do much.
Eve is the sultry seductress that does that killer trick with her tongue that keeps you coming back again and again.
I am still having fun working my way through the various storylines in SWToR. The HK addition was fun and I hope to see more like it in the future. Legacy was cool in that I could mail to my alts on the other faction. I had a good time during the events as well.
However, f2p is not listed among my top five things from SWToR. The community has suffered some due to f2p as well as server crowding.
I love the posts below stating that if you bash SWTOR in any form, you are an entitlement douche bag. Now granted I'm sure some of SWTOR's former subs were, but that statement is so biased it's not even funny. I'm not suprised the comment was made by what many would deem a "fanboy".
Game isn't a 0, it's a decent game for sure. I beta tested it, bought CE and played for several months. Problem with the game as what will happen again in 2013 is player retention. SWTOR just doesn't offer enough in terms of things to do compared to other games. The fans wanted open world space, pod racing and meaningful open world pvp to name a few. Bioware gives us a legacy system, couple of rinse repeat raids and then a F2P conversion with a cash shop. Then instead of adding in those features they still choose to milk their fans.
I find the latter the most insulting of them all. They hid in the dark about F2P for months while they secretly were developing it. They essentially let their game die out and pulled a SOE in the hopes that fresh blood would refill the ranks of players. Just like the NGE, the F2P has been doing the same thing to turn off former subs and even prevent new players from enjoying the game. I for one feel a bit ripped off with funding their F2P conversion. Why do I feel this way? Well James Ohlen made a Twitter account and started asking for feedback here and there from the fans. He stopped posting for months now because it pretty much was all BS to make us believe that they were actually listening.
Players wanted new species, we get nothing, maybe Cathar "eventually" but then more types depend on how well it sells on the Cartel Market. Pazaak, Pod Racing, Sabaac, Space? A pipe dream and Jeff Hickman (being the douche he has been known for) even had the nerve to carrot the fans into saying he's played it, it rocks and you can't haha.
The game when it released I would say probably was a good 7-8/10 for production values. Post launch though they've been 3/10 at best, they have just lost touch with their community.
It's sad to think SWG died for this game. Even though SWG had problems, it had a way better community and tools then SWTOR will EVER HAVE.
I agree.
It's as if some executives on this site are actually being paid to puff these games not review them.
Only because "Game is crap" wasn't an option on the exit pole. Saying it's not worth the sub fee is as close as one can get. EA can read that however they want I guess.
40gigs?
EA knows how to punish f2p players since im subbed and the game its only 20.5gigs^^
This game could have really blown the gate open with the f2p, but that was also rushed like the launch of the game
I finally caved in and downloaded the game but after having to download an additional 20gb or whatever at F2P rate (250kbs) I stopped and removed. Not going to download something at that rate when my ISP lets me get 1.7mbs - 2.1mbs.
Remove the rate cap for F2P accounts and I will try it.
While this game is acknowledged by most to have great potential it still remains the hottest controversy of this year in MMO's. The level of hype before launch skyrocketed the level of disappointment after a few months people played it.
It is also a fact that so many players left this game but there is a fewer number of people that feel TOR is their game. And that is ok. Opinions, as respected as they are, cannot hide the truth, TOR failed not because many people are the "entitled" MMO goons that cosnpired to hate this game but because it has basic and fundamental flaws upon its design and management, starting or current.
As for those 5 additions the game had in its first year there is not much to write home about, no reason to cheer firing your 25 free rockets on your fleet station.
5. Group Finder. Yes this must be the most welcomed addition, a feature that should have been from the start helping the minimal staying power this game has. This feature came very late.
4.HK 51 companion. It was an ok idea and a welcoming one but it was just some added content, like other MMO's add a small zone or a dungeon or a raid. In fact it was a content long awaited but quickly consumed not like the above mentioned examples. Nothing great or groundbreaking about it, but the lack of features in this game shows this content as something spectacular.
3. Events. The Rakghoul plague event was a good one, people enjoyed it but the acquisition race was not that great. I still remeber people waiting in line to open the box, is that sort of idea of fun? And talking about events i m counting the Cartel Shop Life Day event, i feel sad every time i am thinking about it . But again lacking other features we have to mention those, and try not to compare them with the events other new MMOs had at the same time.
2. Legacy. Some perks Legacy brings are very usefull to some, the buffs are extremelly useful when leveling an alt but many others are just fluff, imho. Yet it is good to have them than have nothing. But still, it is not a feature that will bring players in or help grow the game at its current state.
1. Free to Play. There is none. It is just a generous freemium model that never fails to remind the player how great it will be if the player was subbed. And to think that "F2P" was implemented because people "didnt want to pay a sub", it is crazy. Focused primarily on Cartel Shop sales even affecting their subscribers, it is the most hated feature in the game. It might bring some players back or make some new players play but its main usage is to constantly milk those cows still left in the farm.
TOR has many nice features, no auto attack and companion system are well made, the flashpoints and operations are very interesting when there are no bugs (And there are so many Known issues added in every patch), their WarZones were ok before 1.2, it really has the Star Wars essense. It is not a Great Game but it is an ok one with a huge retention problem.
I hope the second year of SWTOR will bring the notion of common sense to their developers and managers, to help them make a great game this company and this franchise deserves and not a first rate milking machine the game is now.
The SWTOR team left the feeling they can't do it right. What ever they did, it was a flawed copy of something or that uninspired it nearly hurts. And as they recognized, they had bet their money on the wrong horse, they did not change the horse, they tried to dope the old one. Look at the last added F2P model, it shows, they just don't understand, how to reach the playerbase.
It is time to either change the management or a good part of the game. The latter won't happen with the first, so...