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Why is there not an MMO that you can solo 100% of everything?

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Comments

  • KiljaedenasKiljaedenas New Westminster, BCPosts: 468Member

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    Where's the any key?

  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by nariusseldon
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by nariusseldon

    Mobs don't have to drop 10k gold. Mob can drop "personal" gold for each member of the group like in Diablo 3, or drop individual loot that cannot be ninja like in WOW LFR .. problem solved. Just need a little bit of programming.

    Well, i started with gold SPECIFICALLY to avoid this kind of discussion, since gold or money in most cases is subject to some autosplit mechanic, ie if any group member picks up a gold pile/loots a mob, the gold is automaticly split amongst the group members.

    As for the little bit of programming, these are the things, if pursued too far, that usually break the camels back.

    Personal drops (like in D3) that are not part of a fixed pool (in d3 a elite has x drops per player, not just x drops, last i checked) usually lead, in a mmo environment, into forcing the players to invite "filler" into groups, and why wouldnt they, if they can kill a mob and gain 5k for 5 members, why not kill it with 10 and gain 10k, same with quest items.

    Just saying.

    Flame on!

    :)

    Actually why would they? Invite a filler does not help me. It does not increase my gold drop (nor my loot drop). It won't decrease it either .. but that is not a reason to invite anyone.

    The only reason to invite anyone is so that you can kill faster, or more efficiently. In that case, i wouldn't want to invite any less gear players since they will just slow me down (note that mob health scales with number of players).

    So nope .. wouldn't invite filler since that give me no more loot, but tougher mobs.

    Filler can be your box, filler can be a lowbie that splits with you or gives you the money in exchange for the free exp.

    Remember that we are talking mmos, not d3, it was just a example of a loot system, in a soloable mmo people are already motivated to box for support and stuff, a situation where it is too much beneficial to have afk players (or boxes) in a group just for the rewards does not help, because we arrive at the fixed group size and/or bop problem from the other side, players will refuse to duo or trio without a full group of fillers, just for efficiency, or the drops become bop and gold looses its functions, very much like in wow, a resource just for cosmetic items.

    Noone is arguing here that soloable mmos are easy to do and that there are no pitfalls and problems, heck we probably arrived at the current solo or raid system because the devs wanted to fix most of the problems once and for all, throwing for some of us the baby out with the water.

    Flame on!

    :)

     

    And D3 loot system is similar to that in the WOW LFR system ... that you roll your individual loot. So the individual loot system does apply to MMOs.

    But the original point is that this kind of loot system do away with the issue of "inviting others means i got less". And it certainly works because no longer you are getting less.

    The issue about filler is a bit of a red herring ANYWAY because most of the groupings (in WOW and many other MMOs) are done automatically anyway.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)

    Banaghran is absolutely right. There are many ways of "multiplayer" than grouping in combat. I can solo combat, then trade, or chat, or duel, or even just show off my gear. I can't show off gear in a single player game, can i?

  • UsualSuspectUsualSuspect CardiffPosts: 1,243Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)

    If I gave a damn anymore I would rant about the stupidity of calling bidding on an item a multiplayer action, but I really don't. Human stupidity seems to have reached an all time high so I won't even bother as it probably wouldn't be understood anyway. Needless to say, if you ever gain the technical expertise, never write a multiplayer game, it'll be the biggest flop in history.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by UsualSuspect
    Originally posted by Banaghran

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)

    If I gave a damn anymore I would rant about the stupidity of calling bidding on an item a multiplayer action, but I really don't. Human stupidity seems to have reached an all time high so I won't even bother as it probably wouldn't be understood anyway. Needless to say, if you ever gain the technical expertise, never write a multiplayer game, it'll be the biggest flop in history.

    And i would call not recognizing an action (bidding and selling) that needs at least TWO players to complete .. "not multiplayer" is the pinnacle of ignoring reasoning and logic when it is not convenient.

    And who are you? Do you have any tehcnial expertise and ever wrote a multiplayer game? Needless to say, if you ever write any game, i suspect it will be as big a flop as if Bana wrote one.

     

  • loulakiloulaki PatrasPosts: 918Member
    everytime a dev try to say that you can do something solo all the base rages, the common sense in MMO communites is against that...

    image

  • CorvusCoraxCorvusCorax stockholmPosts: 38Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    image
  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    I do like when people repeat my point in their own words, dont get me wrong, but why?

    Flame on!

    :)

  • CorvusCoraxCorvusCorax stockholmPosts: 38Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    I do like when people repeat my point in their own words, dont get me wrong, but why?

    Flame on!

    :)

    You point is that it was all still multiplayer gameplay but in fact it never became multiplayer gameplay untill after the raid bosses were killed and the other player was engaged. Solo PvE is simply not multiplayer gameplay. Bidding on the AH is a really bad example of multiplayer gameplay because even if it still requires other people, the whole experience could be simulated so easily by npcs that very few individuals, if any at all would even notice.

    It is like saying I am interacting with with several people for buying a soda at the soda machine, one guy placed it there, another filled it up with soda cans so technically I am interacting with those two plus everyone who ever bought a soda at that specific soda machine, no one who ever buys a soda at a soda machine would in reality consider that to be interacting with other people or to be a social experience though. It is a weak argument at best and one that would only be brought up for the sake of argument. Ofcourse it still interacting with other people, but the level of interacting is so low its nearly non existant and has no effect at all for an individual.

    Soloing is not multiplayer gameplay because the very act of soloing is the exact opposite of multiplayer gameplay. That is not to say that soloing does not have a important place in MMORPG's, but to state that soloing is still multiplayer gameplay is pure nonsense.

    image
  • ThomasN7ThomasN7 87.18.7.148 1, NJPosts: 6,690Member
    Bad enough people can solo stuff now.
    30
  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    I do like when people repeat my point in their own words, dont get me wrong, but why?

    Flame on!

    :)

    You point is that it was all still multiplayer gameplay but in fact it never became multiplayer gameplay untill after the raid bosses were killed and the other player was engaged. Solo PvE is simply not multiplayer gameplay. Bidding on the AH is a really bad example of multiplayer gameplay because even if it still requires other people, the whole experience could be simulated so easily by npcs that very few individuals, if any at all would even notice.

    It is like saying I am interacting with with several people for buying a soda at the soda machine, one guy placed it there, another filled it up with soda cans so technically I am interacting with those two plus everyone who ever bought a soda at that specific soda machine, no one who ever buys a soda at a soda machine would in reality consider that to be interacting with other people though. It is a weak argument at best and one that would only be brought up for the sake of argument. Ofcourse it still interacting with other people, but the level of interacting is so low its nearly non existant and has no effect at all for an individual.

    Soloing is not multiplayer gameplay because the very act of soloing is the exact opposite of multiplayer gameplay. That is not to say that soloing does not have a important place in MMORPG's, but to state that soloing is still multiplayer gameplay is pure nonsense.

    For the purpose of that argument it is meaningless, the M in mmorpg does not at any point state WHEN and WHERE the multiplayer aspect must occur.

    That is why i mentioned cooperative gameplay, if you want to argue that it is a essential part of the mmorpg experience, do, but dont support a claim that the M in MMORPG means that there MUST be multiplayer WHERE YOU SAY it must be, and the solo experience CANNOT exist there.

    Flame on!

    :)

  • CorvusCoraxCorvusCorax stockholmPosts: 38Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    I do like when people repeat my point in their own words, dont get me wrong, but why?

    Flame on!

    :)

    You point is that it was all still multiplayer gameplay but in fact it never became multiplayer gameplay untill after the raid bosses were killed and the other player was engaged. Solo PvE is simply not multiplayer gameplay. Bidding on the AH is a really bad example of multiplayer gameplay because even if it still requires other people, the whole experience could be simulated so easily by npcs that very few individuals, if any at all would even notice.

    It is like saying I am interacting with with several people for buying a soda at the soda machine, one guy placed it there, another filled it up with soda cans so technically I am interacting with those two plus everyone who ever bought a soda at that specific soda machine, no one who ever buys a soda at a soda machine would in reality consider that to be interacting with other people though. It is a weak argument at best and one that would only be brought up for the sake of argument. Ofcourse it still interacting with other people, but the level of interacting is so low its nearly non existant and has no effect at all for an individual.

    Soloing is not multiplayer gameplay because the very act of soloing is the exact opposite of multiplayer gameplay. That is not to say that soloing does not have a important place in MMORPG's, but to state that soloing is still multiplayer gameplay is pure nonsense.

    For the purpose of that argument it is meaningless, the M in mmorpg does not at any point state WHEN and WHERE the multiplayer aspect must occur.

    That is why i mentioned cooperative gameplay, if you want to argue that it is a essential part of the mmorpg experience, do, but dont support a claim that the M in MMORPG means that there MUST be multiplayer WHERE YOU SAY it must be, and the solo experience CANNOT exist.

    Flame on!

    :)

    It is true that it does not state specifically when and where multiplayer must occur at the same time it says absolutely nothing at all about soloing. It does not change the fact however that multiplayer gameplay requires other players to be directly involved. It still does not make soloing into multiplayer gameplay because you had a completely unrelated multiplayer gameplay experience after you finished soloing. I never said the solo experience cannot exist, I simply said that soloing has nothing what so ever to do with multiplayer gameplay.

    image
  • scotty899scotty899 townsvillePosts: 166Member
    because sword art online is just an anime and neural gaming isn't out. 
  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    I do like when people repeat my point in their own words, dont get me wrong, but why?

    Flame on!

    :)

    You point is that it was all still multiplayer gameplay but in fact it never became multiplayer gameplay untill after the raid bosses were killed and the other player was engaged. Solo PvE is simply not multiplayer gameplay. Bidding on the AH is a really bad example of multiplayer gameplay because even if it still requires other people, the whole experience could be simulated so easily by npcs that very few individuals, if any at all would even notice.

    It is like saying I am interacting with with several people for buying a soda at the soda machine, one guy placed it there, another filled it up with soda cans so technically I am interacting with those two plus everyone who ever bought a soda at that specific soda machine, no one who ever buys a soda at a soda machine would in reality consider that to be interacting with other people though. It is a weak argument at best and one that would only be brought up for the sake of argument. Ofcourse it still interacting with other people, but the level of interacting is so low its nearly non existant and has no effect at all for an individual.

    Soloing is not multiplayer gameplay because the very act of soloing is the exact opposite of multiplayer gameplay. That is not to say that soloing does not have a important place in MMORPG's, but to state that soloing is still multiplayer gameplay is pure nonsense.

    For the purpose of that argument it is meaningless, the M in mmorpg does not at any point state WHEN and WHERE the multiplayer aspect must occur.

    That is why i mentioned cooperative gameplay, if you want to argue that it is a essential part of the mmorpg experience, do, but dont support a claim that the M in MMORPG means that there MUST be multiplayer WHERE YOU SAY it must be, and the solo experience CANNOT exist.

    Flame on!

    :)

    It is true that it does not state specifically when and where multiplayer must occur at the same time it says absolutely nothing at all about soloing. It does not change the fact however that multiplayer gameplay requires other players to be directly involved. It still does not make soloing into multiplayer gameplay because you had a completely unrelated multiplayer gameplay experience after you finished soloing. I never said the solo experience cannot exist, I simply said that soloing has nothing what so ever to do with multiplayer gameplay.

    I never claimed soloing raids is a multiplayer experience, i just claimed that soloing them and then engage in an unrelated multiplayer activity does make it multiplayer (the mmorpg, game). <-added for explanation

    Flame on!

    :)

    Edit: added explanation

  • CorvusCoraxCorvusCorax stockholmPosts: 38Member
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by CorvusCorax
    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Originally posted by Kiljaedenas

    Dude...what does the second M in MMORPG stand for? Oh yeah, that's right, MULTIPLAYER.

    That's why you can't solo everything. You're not supposed to.

    I think you mean "cooperative", which is technically not in mmorpg :)

    Unfortunately for you, killing all the raids solo in wow and then engage one member of the other faction or just bid on a item in the ah is still multiplayer.

    Flame on!

    :)


    Killing all the raid bosses solo in wow is not multiplayer gameplay because no other players would be involved, everything else though that required another player to happen would be multiplayer gameplay.

    I do like when people repeat my point in their own words, dont get me wrong, but why?

    Flame on!

    :)

    You point is that it was all still multiplayer gameplay but in fact it never became multiplayer gameplay untill after the raid bosses were killed and the other player was engaged. Solo PvE is simply not multiplayer gameplay. Bidding on the AH is a really bad example of multiplayer gameplay because even if it still requires other people, the whole experience could be simulated so easily by npcs that very few individuals, if any at all would even notice.

    It is like saying I am interacting with with several people for buying a soda at the soda machine, one guy placed it there, another filled it up with soda cans so technically I am interacting with those two plus everyone who ever bought a soda at that specific soda machine, no one who ever buys a soda at a soda machine would in reality consider that to be interacting with other people though. It is a weak argument at best and one that would only be brought up for the sake of argument. Ofcourse it still interacting with other people, but the level of interacting is so low its nearly non existant and has no effect at all for an individual.

    Soloing is not multiplayer gameplay because the very act of soloing is the exact opposite of multiplayer gameplay. That is not to say that soloing does not have a important place in MMORPG's, but to state that soloing is still multiplayer gameplay is pure nonsense.

    For the purpose of that argument it is meaningless, the M in mmorpg does not at any point state WHEN and WHERE the multiplayer aspect must occur.

    That is why i mentioned cooperative gameplay, if you want to argue that it is a essential part of the mmorpg experience, do, but dont support a claim that the M in MMORPG means that there MUST be multiplayer WHERE YOU SAY it must be, and the solo experience CANNOT exist.

    Flame on!

    :)

    It is true that it does not state specifically when and where multiplayer must occur at the same time it says absolutely nothing at all about soloing. It does not change the fact however that multiplayer gameplay requires other players to be directly involved. It still does not make soloing into multiplayer gameplay because you had a completely unrelated multiplayer gameplay experience after you finished soloing. I never said the solo experience cannot exist, I simply said that soloing has nothing what so ever to do with multiplayer gameplay.

    I never claimed soloing raids is a multiplayer experience, i just claimed that soloing them and then engage in an unrelated multiplayer activity does make it a multiplayer game.

    Flame on!

    :)

    I see, my mistake then ^^.

     

     

    image
  • ShubawkssShubawkss Canton, GAPosts: 55Member
    An MMORPG where you can solo everything is called an RPG.
  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by Shubawkss
    An MMORPG where you can solo everything is called an RPG.

    So where can i buy the box of Ultima Online RPG ?

    Flame on!

    :)

  • rimaxo14rimaxo14 chicopee, MAPosts: 118Member
    Well what kind of multi player game would that be...

    EVGA FTW-3 MOBO X58
    EVGA GTX 580
    G.SKILL RIPJAW 12GB
    INTEL I7 950
    CORSAIR H70 CPU COOLER
    CORSAIR 1200W 80+GOLD

    image
  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by rimaxo14
    Well what kind of multi player game would that be...

    D3? :)

    Flame on!

    :)

  • MukeMuke BredaPosts: 2,172Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by hockeyplayr

    You can't because then it loses the MM part in Mmorpg

    There has to be some group content in it otherwise it is a single player game that just requires an internet connection..

    wrong.

     

    a MMO can also mean many players on a single server/world interacting with each other.

    You have soldiers, carfters and the like doing their stuff and interacting with each other without having the need to do dungeons/raids.

    It's just that 99% have gotten used to the dps/heal/tank setups of WOW and THINK that should be the standard.

     

     

    "going into arguments with idiots is a lost cause, it requires you to stoop down to their level and you can't win"

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