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No chat bubbles again ?

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  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Kabaal
    As long as they are off by default and don't indicate a persons location then i also dont see a problem, but i also dont see why theyre such a big deal.

    This is why: (Pretty neat eh?!)

     

     

    I think at its core this is a good visual of exactly what AV wanted to change about an MMO. Not just the fact of all the chat but the fact that everyone is sitting down not doing anything in game other than chatting

    Invalid argument.  Some people are sitting around doing nothing.  Other people are trading, finding groups. 

    and talking is also 'doing something'

    venture to suggest you knew what I am really saying?

    Your English is not the best so no, I don't always understand what you're trying to say.

    Name one valid arguement for not putting in toggleable chat bubbles.  If you don't want them, uncheck them and BOOM, normal Darkfall.

    Why put in a feature that the vast majortiy of your players are not intrested in? I am not sure how long you were in the darkfall community but I was in for a long time and from the start, the vast majority of players wouldnt be all that intrested in chat bubbles and a good amount of them might have even decided not to play because of them so why bother with the dev time?

     

    AV wanted people to be in battles, combat, running around and exploring. Not sitting around chatting. Is it common that people sit around in chat to gather groups and trade? sure. Is it an expression of VAST inexperience to think that there isnt also a lot of simple social chit chat going on as well? yes

     

    Like my example, I turn off all the chat windows and am in vent.  If there was a chat bubble I would be able to see what they are saying.  The problrm with a chat box is you dont know where the person is.  A lot of people want chat bubbles in Darkfall and there is no reason not to give it to them as long as they are toggleable/optional.

  • hcoelhohcoelho Rio de JaneiroPosts: 529Member
    Originally posted by Wizlock23

    Sorry but i have to report for NDA, as ur commenting on features in a game that is under NDA still.

     

    Edit: specific to the OP posting info that could only be found by playing beta, thus related directly to an ingame feature that is under NDA -

     

     Thanks ,

     

    care to quote ?

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom

     

    Like my example, I turn off all the chat windows and am in vent.  If there was a chat bubble I would be able to see what they are saying.  The problrm with a chat box is you dont know where the person is.  A lot of people want chat bubbles in Darkfall and there is no reason not to give it to them as long as they are toggleable/optional.

    I dispute that many people in darkfall want chat bubbles. I know when I played the vast majority of people I played with would have laughed at such a suggestion. I also know that public chat was not very busy because most people were on vent, but maybe I am wrong.

     

    never the less, I vote no for chat bubbles pending no personal detailed review on how it could be exploited to ones pvp advantage.

    Correlation does not imply causation

  • YamotaYamota LondonPosts: 6,620Member
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

  • LatronusLatronus Lexington Park, MDPosts: 692Member
    Originally posted by Wizlock23

    Sorry but i have to report for NDA, as ur commenting on features in a game that is under NDA still.

     

    Edit: specific to the OP posting info that could only be found by playing beta, thus related directly to an ingame feature that is under NDA -

     

     Thanks ,

     

    Party pooper!   Just kidding, but to the topic, I want play a game that has chat bubbles.  I have no problem using a chat window.

    image
  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom

     

    I dispute that many people in darkfall want chat bubbles. I know when I played the vast majority of people I played with would have laughed at such a suggestion. I also know that public chat was not very busy because most people were on vent, but maybe I am wrong.

     

    never the less, I vote no for chat bubbles pending no personal detailed review on how it could be exploited to ones pvp advantage.

    It could not be exploited because it would be optional. 

  • LatronusLatronus Lexington Park, MDPosts: 692Member
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

    I totally disagree.  Stupid chat bubbles popping up looks crude, amateurish, and low budget design to me.  We just have opposite likes it appears.

    image
  • Justin9820Justin9820 Somewhere, BCPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom

     

    I dispute that many people in darkfall want chat bubbles. I know when I played the vast majority of people I played with would have laughed at such a suggestion. I also know that public chat was not very busy because most people were on vent, but maybe I am wrong.

     

    never the less, I vote no for chat bubbles pending no personal detailed review on how it could be exploited to ones pvp advantage.

    It could not be exploited because it would be optional. 

    not exploitable, but chat bubbles would give an advantage to the people with them on.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

    I guess my adversion to it outside of the fact that I personally cant stand them is that I fear it gives way to a different direction for Darkfall which I suspect is already happening anyway.

     

    I mean, from what I have seen on the videos they have already given up on one of their main tentants which was 'no targeting systems target just like you would in real life!'

    Correlation does not imply causation

  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Wizlock23

    Sorry but i have to report for NDA, as ur commenting on features in a game that is under NDA still.

     

    Edit: specific to the OP posting info that could only be found by playing beta, thus related directly to an ingame feature that is under NDA -

     

     Thanks ,

     

    Party pooper!   Just kidding, but to the topic, I want play a game that has chat bubbles.  I have no problem using a chat window.

    The problem with the chat window is:

    a) You shut it off.

    b) You don't see someone was trying to talk to you until an hour later and now they are logged off

    c) You don't know where the person is who is talking

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom

     

    I dispute that many people in darkfall want chat bubbles. I know when I played the vast majority of people I played with would have laughed at such a suggestion. I also know that public chat was not very busy because most people were on vent, but maybe I am wrong.

     

    never the less, I vote no for chat bubbles pending no personal detailed review on how it could be exploited to ones pvp advantage.

    It could not be exploited because it would be optional. 

    that is not how a pvp game works.

    Take shadows for example.

    Having shadows on is an optiion, if you have them on however you are very likely to lose every single pvp battle because the frame rate even on greeat computers was compromised as well as your visiablity

    So..is it optional? not really

    Correlation does not imply causation

  • Justin9820Justin9820 Somewhere, BCPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

     

    ARE YOU SERIOUS? did you just compare chat bubbles to ears or tongue????

     

    Without chat bubbles you can still communicate just fine...

  • LatronusLatronus Lexington Park, MDPosts: 692Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Wizlock23

    Sorry but i have to report for NDA, as ur commenting on features in a game that is under NDA still.

     

    Edit: specific to the OP posting info that could only be found by playing beta, thus related directly to an ingame feature that is under NDA -

     

     Thanks ,

     

    Party pooper!   Just kidding, but to the topic, I want play a game that has chat bubbles.  I have no problem using a chat window.

    The problem with the chat window is:

    a) You shut it off.

    b) You don't see someone was trying to talk to you until an hour later and now they are logged off

    c) You don't know where the person is who is talking

    Never been a problem for me sorry, and I've been playing MMOs since 1999.  Just sayin, it's personal pref and I hate chat bubbles.

    image
  • YamotaYamota LondonPosts: 6,620Member
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

    I totally disagree.  Stupid chat bubbles popping up looks crude, amateurish, and low budget design to me.  We just have opposite likes it appears.

    Chat bubbles show you, visually, who is saying what. That is objectively better than chat boxes which cannot show that beside the name of the person saying it.

    Sure, it would be much better if the person saying it would just be able to say it and you would be able to distinguish who is saying what, but we are years from having that properly working.

  • Justin9820Justin9820 Somewhere, BCPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

    I totally disagree.  Stupid chat bubbles popping up looks crude, amateurish, and low budget design to me.  We just have opposite likes it appears.

    Chat bubbles show you, visually, who is saying what. That is objectively better than chat boxes which cannot show that beside the name of the person saying it.

    Sure, it would be much better if the person saying it would just be able to say it and you would be able to distinguish who is saying what, but we are years from having that properly working.

    You can distinguish who said what... its called a name. Matching a character to a name is only important in trade, and it really isn't hard to tell who you are trading with, since if there are a lot of people around where you would need chat bubbles, there would be too many for you to be able to effectively locate them regardless. Also, you cannot move through people in this game, so people dont generally mass up in one place, for if there is too many people for trade, you wont be able to get to the bank anyways.

     

    EDIT: also, most chat bubbles do not show your name, so in a large amount of people chat bubbles are incredibly ineffective, unless you know what the person looks like already, in which case why the hell would need chat bubbles...

  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom

     

    I dispute that many people in darkfall want chat bubbles. I know when I played the vast majority of people I played with would have laughed at such a suggestion. I also know that public chat was not very busy because most people were on vent, but maybe I am wrong.

     

    never the less, I vote no for chat bubbles pending no personal detailed review on how it could be exploited to ones pvp advantage.

    It could not be exploited because it would be optional. 

    that is not how a pvp game works.

    Take shadows for example.

    Having shadows on is an optiion, if you have them on however you are very likely to lose every single pvp battle because the frame rate even on greeat computers was compromised as well as your visiablity

    So..is it optional? not really

    Let me explain the option that would work.  You go into your settings and select option to turn on chat bubbles.  Now your chat is in a bubble and people can see you talk and you can see other people talk.  If you don't want to see chat bubbles you uncheck the option and viola, you don't see any chat.

  • LatronusLatronus Lexington Park, MDPosts: 692Member
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

    I totally disagree.  Stupid chat bubbles popping up looks crude, amateurish, and low budget design to me.  We just have opposite likes it appears.

    Chat bubbles show you, visually, who is saying what. That is objectively better than chat boxes which cannot show that beside the name of the person saying it.

    Sure, it would be much better if the person saying it would just be able to say it and you would be able to distinguish who is saying what, but we are years from having that properly working.

    I understand why those of you that like them actually do like them, I just hate them.  Clogs up my screen and I can't stand that.  Give me a chat window any day.  Everything is right there and my screen stays clear.  Again, it's personal pref and we just like different things, no biggie.  

    image
  • BadaboomBadaboom Moose Jaw, SKPosts: 2,380Member
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Wizlock23

    Sorry but i have to report for NDA, as ur commenting on features in a game that is under NDA still.

     

    Edit: specific to the OP posting info that could only be found by playing beta, thus related directly to an ingame feature that is under NDA -

     

     Thanks ,

     

    Party pooper!   Just kidding, but to the topic, I want play a game that has chat bubbles.  I have no problem using a chat window.

    The problem with the chat window is:

    a) You shut it off.

    b) You don't see someone was trying to talk to you until an hour later and now they are logged off

    c) You don't know where the person is who is talking

    Never been a problem for me sorry, and I've been playing MMOs since 1999.  Just sayin, it's personal pref and I hate chat bubbles.

    Then you could have it off and it would not affect you.  So there is no reason not to have it.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Yamota
    Originally posted by Justin9820
    OMG did you really just blame your lack of socializing on a lack of chat bubbles????

    Yeah, so? Would not the lack of tongue or ears hinder socializing? Same thing with chat bubbles, its a means of communicating which is far better than a stupid chat box hidden in the corner.

    I totally disagree.  Stupid chat bubbles popping up looks crude, amateurish, and low budget design to me.  We just have opposite likes it appears.

    Chat bubbles show you, visually, who is saying what. That is objectively better than chat boxes which cannot show that beside the name of the person saying it.

    Sure, it would be much better if the person saying it would just be able to say it and you would be able to distinguish who is saying what, but we are years from having that properly working.

    I understand why those of you that like them actually do like them, I just hate them.  Clogs up my screen and I can't stand that.  Give me a chat window any day.  Everything is right there and my screen stays clear.  Again, it's personal pref and we just like different things, no biggie.  

    actually that brings up a point. If I am trading (for an example) until the final trade is decided does it really matter where the person is on my screen? once the price is decided its simply 'where are you?' 'I am the guy jumping up and down'

     

    dones

    Correlation does not imply causation

  • Justin9820Justin9820 Somewhere, BCPosts: 49Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom

    Then you could have it off and it would not affect you.  So there is no reason not to have it.

    There is a reason, and ive stated it. If it is long range enough to work, then it will not be fair as it will give away players position the second they talk. If you had them offf, you would lose out on this advantage.

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom

     

    I dispute that many people in darkfall want chat bubbles. I know when I played the vast majority of people I played with would have laughed at such a suggestion. I also know that public chat was not very busy because most people were on vent, but maybe I am wrong.

     

    never the less, I vote no for chat bubbles pending no personal detailed review on how it could be exploited to ones pvp advantage.

    It could not be exploited because it would be optional. 

    that is not how a pvp game works.

    Take shadows for example.

    Having shadows on is an optiion, if you have them on however you are very likely to lose every single pvp battle because the frame rate even on greeat computers was compromised as well as your visiablity

    So..is it optional? not really

    Let me explain the option that would work.  You go into your settings and select option to turn on chat bubbles.  Now your chat is in a bubble and people can see you talk and you can see other people talk.  If you don't want to see chat bubbles you uncheck the option and viola, you don't see any chat.

    no I understand it would be an option I am saying that just because something is an option doesnt mean by default it really is an option when talking about pvp games.

    I am not suggesting there is a hole in chat bubbles I am just saying if there is any advantage in a pvp game at all even in the smallest about then it quickly becomes not a realistic option just like my shadows example.

    Correlation does not imply causation

  • QuicksandQuicksand Aurora, COPosts: 604Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by SEANMCAD
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Kabaal
    As long as they are off by default and don't indicate a persons location then i also dont see a problem, but i also dont see why theyre such a big deal.

    This is why: (Pretty neat eh?!)

     

     

    I think at its core this is a good visual of exactly what AV wanted to change about an MMO. Not just the fact of all the chat but the fact that everyone is sitting down not doing anything in game other than chatting

    Invalid argument.  Some people are sitting around doing nothing.  Other people are trading, finding groups. 

    and talking is also 'doing something'

    venture to suggest you knew what I am really saying?

    Your English is not the best so no, I don't always understand what you're trying to say.

    Name one valid arguement for not putting in toggleable chat bubbles.  If you don't want them, uncheck them and BOOM, normal Darkfall.

    Why put in a feature that the vast majortiy of your players are not intrested in? I am not sure how long you were in the darkfall community but I was in for a long time and from the start, the vast majority of players wouldnt be all that intrested in chat bubbles and a good amount of them might have even decided not to play because of them so why bother with the dev time?

     

    AV wanted people to be in battles, combat, running around and exploring. Not sitting around chatting. Is it common that people sit around in chat to gather groups and trade? sure. Is it an expression of VAST inexperience to think that there isnt also a lot of simple social chit chat going on as well? yes

     

    You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means.

     

    But on to your claim "AV wanted people to be in battles, combat, running around and exploring. Not sitting around chatting."

     

    So what you are saying is, the reason chat bubbles are not an option (and should not be an option in the devs opinions) is because the developer of a SANDBOX game only wants people playing the SANDBOX game the way they think it should be played instead of just giving the players all the sand they need to build whatever gaming experience they want?

     

    I think what your describing is a THEMEPARK game.

     

    But anyways... Maybe DF isn't really a sandbox game anyways...

    www.90and9.net
    www.prophecymma.com

  • LatronusLatronus Lexington Park, MDPosts: 692Member
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Badaboom
    Originally posted by Latronus
    Originally posted by Wizlock23

    Sorry but i have to report for NDA, as ur commenting on features in a game that is under NDA still.

     

    Edit: specific to the OP posting info that could only be found by playing beta, thus related directly to an ingame feature that is under NDA -

     

     Thanks ,

     

    Party pooper!   Just kidding, but to the topic, I want play a game that has chat bubbles.  I have no problem using a chat window.

    The problem with the chat window is:

    a) You shut it off.

    b) You don't see someone was trying to talk to you until an hour later and now they are logged off

    c) You don't know where the person is who is talking

    Never been a problem for me sorry, and I've been playing MMOs since 1999.  Just sayin, it's personal pref and I hate chat bubbles.

    Then you could have it off and it would not affect you.  So there is no reason not to have it.

    If it were optional, I'd have no issue with that.  Now I'm not a programmer but I wonder how hard it would be to make it an option because as far as I know, most of the games I've played didn't make it selectable.  Makes me think it is either a pain or the devs didn't allocate time to include it due to time/money issues or ignorance to the desire of the player base.  Just saying.

    image
  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Quicksand

    You keep using that word... I do not think it means what you think it means.

     

    But on to your claim "AV wanted people to be in battles, combat, running around and exploring. Not sitting around chatting."

     

    So what you are saying is, the reason chat bubbles are not an option (and should not be an option in the devs opinions) is because the developer of a SANDBOX game only wants people playing the SANDBOX game the way they think it should be played instead of just giving the players all the sand they need to build whatever gaming experience they want?

     

    I think what your describing is a THEMEPARK game.

     

    But anyways... Maybe DF isn't really a sandbox game anyways...

    your trying to have a different conversation that I am not having. I do not have sandbox vs themepark conversations because they are class A stupid.

    Correlation does not imply causation

  • SEANMCADSEANMCAD Houston, TXPosts: 5,348Member
    Originally posted by Latronus

    If it were optional, I'd have no issue with that.  Now I'm not a programmer but I wonder how hard it would be to make it an option because as far as I know, most of the games I've played didn't make it selectable.  Makes me think it is either a pain or the devs didn't allocate time to include it due to time/money issues or ignorance to the desire of the player base.  Just saying.

    I am a programmer but not in the gaming industry, my gut tells me it wouldnt be hard to create and it wouldnt be hard to have as an option. However, what I havent give much consideration to is would there be a pvp advantage for one over the other and my gut (without having a specific example) is that there would be.

    That said, the Darkfall community is likely changing a lot and in some respects from a business side I totally think is the right move. The community I came from was extreemly toxic even though much of the gaming principles I agreed with so we are seeing a change in the game and most likely the community as well.

    Correlation does not imply causation

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