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Originally posted by hardicon i think alot of people are forgetting what made ac2 bad in the first place. first off all it was microsoft pushing the game early before it was ready. the devs did fix alot of the problems but the problem was it was making the wow dollars and microsoft pulled the plug because they wanted the wow dollars, much like swg, only they just recreated the game. the game was fine as it was although alot of ac1 players didnt like it because it changed so much from ac1. other than that it would have been a great game. still cant wait to try it out to see if my memories are the same of the game now that I have alot more gamer knowledge. back then i was a fledgling mmo player, i havent gotten as cynical about mmos as I am now.
That's not correct tho. It wasn't Microsoft that pulled the plug, it was Turbine. Turbine had already left MS and bought their games back from MS before AC2 was shutdown. In fact months before it was closed AC2 had gotten an exp pak, many of the bugs fixed and Turbine pretty much had the game to where it should've been at launch. But of course by then it was to late and wasn't making enough money to keep the game up.
Just hope now they keep working on it and keep it around a lot longer this time. But if mmo's like the Realm Online that Sierra made is still around after all these years I'm sure AC2 can be around for many more too.
Originally posted by Yamota I think you guys thinking how awesome this is have forgot what a sub-par game it was and why many of you quit it to begin with... Dont want to rain in on anyone's parade but I dont think people realise what a sub-par game this was.
Well for me AC was my first 3D mmorpg. And to me it was a ugly bland attempt to bring players from the detailed (but flat) world of Ultima Online to 3D. Nervertheless, two buddies pulled me in and we played there for a while until DAoC was released with superior graphics, better structured PvP, but a confined gameplay system. All three of us played for months until the announcement of AC2. Two of us got into the beta and the third continued playing DAoC. AC2 graphics were light years ahead of anything else out there at the time and at that time we cared only about two things really : (1) the ability to play in a gorgeous 3d world and (2) the freedom of a gameplay system like UO. But it seemd the goal of every game back then is the same as it is now, to trump the last game on the graphic department only. This is why games like EQ, AC, DAoC and SB lost their luster for me so quickly. I was young what can I say I was a graphics whore. And it's the same reason I can never go back to UO.
Because thing is, since making the jump from 2d so long ago to 3d my bar for graphics can only be lowered so much before I can accept a ugly mmorpg for it's superior gameplay system. And I'm sorry to say but AC1 is never gonna clear that huddle. No matter how superior you think their gameplay system is over AC2, if it ain't near UO quality, I'm NOT lowering my bar for graphics. Because honestly at this day and age, both games are subpar in both graphics of today and gameplay systems when compared to my ideal system (UO). But where AC2 wins it that the graphics are better than AC1's and the gameplay system is better that anything released today. That make sense to you?
"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."
Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by azzamasin Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by DEATHRAMENT Its only 10.00 it cant be worse then the crap that's out now.
This is crap from several years ago!
You know what they say:
One mans Crap is another mans Treasure.
good luck to all those giving this a shot because yea contrary to what Tam here says, most games released in the last 6+ years ahve been total crap and it will be nice to see what the games were like back then.
There's also a lot of people who were/are AC1 player who were "offended" that Turbine would "dare" to make an AC2 that wasn't AC1 with better graphics. They raged about it back then. They've raged about it almost any time someone brought up AC2 since, and they're right back at it, raging about it now. For a game that went offline 7 years ago.
And we thought the SWG/NGE people had trouble letting go and moving on?
Where are a lot of AC1 fans raging about this? Tam doesn't speak for the rest of us. AC1 players seem to really like this move.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Originally posted by Loktofeit Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by azzamasin Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by DEATHRAMENT Its only 10.00 it cant be worse then the crap that's out now.
Good grief it was a joke.
Grow a funny bone people. Sad. Do people even read entire threads to know what the hell they are even talking about. The page prior clearly shows my excitement over AC2's return.
AC1 was my all time favorite game. Those who played AC2 without playing AC1 will not understand our opinion. AC2 stands on it's own merits if you view it as an original IP upon launch ... but it wasn't. It was a sequel hence being called AC2. AC2 was an EQ rip off with classes and talent trees and a zoned style world which is completely and totally different than AC1. This fundamental change upset AC1 players more than anyone who hasn't played AC1 could possibly imagine.
You may have your own opinion of AC2 but it doesn't change the fact that it was an attempt at a money grap by cloning the themepark mmo trend that was growing at that time. Today we see the results. A slew of failed mmos and mmos doing nowhere near the level of success expected of them. Players today feel let down and the forums are awash with threads about this very subject. AC2 was one of the first games to jump onto this trend and suffered for it.
So get this straight: AC2 isn't being judged on whether or not it was a good game by itself my many AC1 players. It is being judged based on it being a complete and total sell out and slapping the core AC1 fanbase in the face for not continuing the IP based upon it's origins. Try to understand this.
I am personally extremely happy AC2 might be coming back. Not because it could ever bring back AC1 play style but because the franchise could very much be brought back to life and perhaps a new game may be created in the future. Let's get one thing straight though, the game shut down because hardly anyone even played it. The handful of players here praising it over all else tend to be (by their own works) people who never even played AC1. AC2 simply failed on it's own merits. The reason it is back in beta is simply because a small population can still earn income via Turbine's current F2P model. It wouldn't be back with out it.
The only and I repeat ONLY reason why AC1 players like this move is because ANY attention brought to AC is a good thing. Players who have stuck with AC for all these years are rabid fanbois and god love them because it was a unique and wonderful game. They want ANY ... ANY chance (just like me) for AC to come back to life and a chance for future AC products. They will take any bone thrown at them. If you asked nearly any AC1 player whether they prefered AC2 over a new AC product none of them would say yes. The total sad state of the AC IP discusts even the most rabid fanboi and any news is good news.
You stay sassy!
Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by Loktofeit Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by azzamasin Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by DEATHRAMENT Its only 10.00 it cant be worse then the crap that's out now.
Grow a funny bone people. Sad.
Um.... what themepark mmo trend that was growing at the time???? There wasn't such a trend yet and most people wouldn't call AC2 a theme park game in the first place.
Originally posted by SnarlingWolf Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by Loktofeit Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by azzamasin Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by DEATHRAMENT Its only 10.00 it cant be worse then the crap that's out now.
Research mmo history and you won't sound so silly stating what you just did. Compare AC1 to AC2 and the other actual popular mmo's at that time and come back and repeat what you said with a straight face.
They might not be raging about it now but back years ago MANY AC1 players refused to give AC2 a chance. Some gave it a tiny chance tho. I know of a number of AC1 players that was pissed that AC2 wasn't AC1 only with better graphics.
I've heard of some now stating they might give it a chance.
AC2 was my first MMORPG and got me in the genre. It was a game with a lot of problems but i loved it.
It is going to be wanderfull to walk again in the lands of Dereth.
Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by SnarlingWolf Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by Loktofeit Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by azzamasin Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by DEATHRAMENT Its only 10.00 it cant be worse then the crap that's out now.
No research necessary. I started playing MMOs with The Realm, then onto UO at release, EQ1, AC1, DAoC and on and on and on. I've played the whole history of MMOs as it was progressing and what you are saying is simply not correct.
Originally posted by Vesavius Originally posted by Torvaldr Originally posted by hockeyplayr Originally posted by Yamota I think you guys thinking how awesome this is have forgot what a sub-par game it was and why many of you quit it to begin with... Dont want to rain in on anyone's parade but I dont think people realise what a sub-par game this was.
I've never played any asherons call game before. I actually bought the first one and subbed just for a chance to try ac2. Personally, I am actually enjoying it. One of the first games in a while I actually want to play. May be sub par, but may also be better than some other offerings today
Nostalgia and reality don't mix well. You might miss it but after people get a peek I don't think it's going to be pretty unless everyone else goes insane too. I mean really, this game offers nothing that current games offer and certainly not better. To assert that throws all reason and logic to the wind.
C'mon now Tor... You know 'better' is subjective and often has nothing to do with logic.
And while I do not dismiss the power of nostalgia, it is also a fact that many people just simply prefer older games and the attached design philosophies.
To call people 'insane' for liking something you choose to dismiss as nostalgia (because you don't share their tastes) seems... churlish.
Will this be a game for the mass market? No, ofc not... but will it's relaunch be successful on it's own terms? I say, more than likely, yeah it will.
I never played it the first time around, in EQ land we kinda snorted at AC, but I am actually looking forward to giving it my time when it goes live.
Yeah, you caught me on the logic / better point. Feelings of appreciation and desire are rarely logical, in fact aren't really logical at all.
I like older games. I still wish Lineage was available in the west. I guess my puzzlement comes from the game doesn't really offer anything that any existing game doesn't do better, and by better I mean a more properly developed system. For open world FFA pvp Lineage 2, which is also an old grinder, still has a better system with some checks and balances to promote pvp not let indiscriminate ganking run wild. For pve there are still grinders and slow progression. I think Vanguard probably offers a superior experience for a similar style and it's subscription free. Those aren't the only games I could think of.
I'm not saying it's bad that they're reopening the game. I'm just seriously surprised at the positive reception when everything the game has to offer is already available. The wild excitement is what took me aback. I dont get why people would be so excited by this but not for similar offerings. I read through most of the thread and noticed many people who are excited have panned nearly every other game published. Why are they excited for this, but not excited about the same things being offered in other games?
as I think back about all these old games, I cant help but wonder
when did the term Quest become about doing a chore?
Even Everquest didnt have many quests, AC hardly any at all, but we went on Quests or Adventures all the time, it was called a Quest by us, hey lets go on a quest to explore Black Death Catacombs, nobody has ever cleared it out.
Those were quests, collect rat ears and kill 10 continually respawning mobs, arent quests.
Last night, even though AC2 does have kill quests, I just set out in one direction killing things as I went, loot was random (what a concept) a lot of people (noobs to AC franchise) didnt even realize that each Balanced Adventurer Sword could be completely different from the last one you found. People didnt know you could inspect the stats, some might be 14-22, another might be 16-27 and so on
Torrent available for the download. Helping seed it from a 100mb connection.
Grow a funny bone people. Sad. Do people even read entire threads to know what the hell they are even talking about.
I was going by your post history.
Originally posted by SnarlingWolf Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by SnarlingWolf Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by Loktofeit Originally posted by TangentPoint Originally posted by azzamasin Originally posted by Tamanous Originally posted by DEATHRAMENT Its only 10.00 it cant be worse then the crap that's out now.
Agreed. The game had come out at a time that there was a lot of diversity in the market, years prior to the post-WOW MMO monoculture explosion.
I explained why what I said was correct. My knowledge of the development of AC2 by Microsoft proves I am correct. The obvious class based direction and themepark structure of AC2 proves I am correct. The statements by the developer lead of AC2 talking about the EQ influence proves I am correct. The fact AC1 with it's seemless open world and total skill based character development was completely abandoned with AC2 proves I am correct. The history of AC1 players of the forums at that time blowing their minds out over the news of AC2 then being crushed when learning how AC2 was a completely new game with nearly no connection to the original game other than lore proves I am correct.
I will not explain further as you clearly reside within your bubble with zero interest in leaving it. I will not attack anyone for loving AC2 but there is a history behind the game that cannot be forgotten. I intend on trying it out again. I have already mentioned that I had a level cap character in AC2 which clearly you seem ignore along with my previous posts in this thread.
AC2 only ever existed as it did/does because of the jump to the class bases, themepark style mmo direction. It had an entirely different development team with designs toward grabbing the themepark style (remember this was an evolutionary term back them) fanbase as EQ had a playerbase many many times that of AC1. The development team fully admitted to this direction and when AC2 flopped the lead designer was canned (I am sure in more politically correct ways). I resided fully within the AC franchise back then and played no other mmo at that time. Nobody can tell me AC2 had no influence from the success of EQ. It simply isn't true.
If someone has an opinion of AC2 they must also understand the playerbase of AC1 which is entirely why AC2 was even created. It may be some players first mmo or a game they liked yet came from other mmorpgs at the time other than AC1. AC1 had one of tightest communities any mmo ever had. New players may not likely ever experiece this with modern games. AC1 players are the ones who created the chance for AC2 to ever exist yet their game wasn't even used as the base for it. This upset them on a level most won't grasp. They felt betrayed. It was like Turbine decided to support EQ players instead of AC1 players which gave the the money to even make game.
Yet I can't stress this enough: I am EXTREMELY happy AC2 is back even if only dipping it's toes into the market again. If ever AC3 is made and if it is simply a hybrid game I will also be happy. Just make it a good game with solid foundations to lore. AC2 is a bone thrown at starving AC players and hopes to bring new players into the IP. The incredible irony to this story is that the themepark direction AC2 took may be more easy and appealing for new players.
Once again as the last post also clearly misses the point entirely: There wasn't a trend at the time toward themepark games ... it was the START, as I stated, to the trend. EQ clearly was the influence behind why Turbine changed their IP's direction. You can ignore the fact Turbine even admitted to this or you can keep thinking AC2 appeared out nothing like the big bang or an act of immaculate conception.
I really loved this game. Then they shut it down. One of things I remember are the musical instuments. You could actually create your own songs.
Please let me know if I got this wrong. I remember sitting at the shorline playing my flute as I was looking at the Sun setting.
The graphics were beautiful at the time.
Originally posted by outfctrl I really loved this game. Then they shut it down. One of things I remember are the musical instuments. You could actually create your own songs. Please let me know if I got this wrong. I remember sitting at the shorline playing my flute as I was looking at the Sun setting. The graphics were beautiful at the time.
It was the first use of their new engine at the time. I believe the same one put toward Lotro which even today has some of the most beautiful landscapes of any mmo. Turbine had advertised the engine as one they wished to sell/license to other developers but then did an about face and threw out AC2 ... which shocked even the AC1 playerbase at the time. It all happened so fast.
In terms of the evolution of Lotro (and Turbines complete turn to the dark side ... themepark games) AC2 is where the whole instrument mechanics came from and the start of extremely decent mmo graphics at the time. Sadly it was ahead of it's time and released too early (even the engine and not just the game itself). It wasn't optimized and even the best systems at the time (upon release and shortly after) couldn't handle the environmental leaps forward. They even reduced the terrain graphics like trees and frill by huge amounts later on so the game didn't even look at nice as it did upon release.
Now that was the point I left (went back to AC1 for a bit) but I hear it got better after and had some interesting content prior to being shutdown. Sadly AC2 is more of a building block to Lotro than it's connection to AC1. This is where most debaters miss the point when it comes to the AC1 and AC2 debate. It is actually all about the engine. The engine now no longer supported the features AC1 had. It was a themepark building engine and therefore AC2 and Lotro became themeparks.
I have the original boxed version. Gonna dig it out tonight and look through it.
Wow....this is a shock. Usually when a game goes dead...it is dead. I almost threw the box out.
Originally posted by azzamasin most games released in the last 6+ years ahve been total crap and it will be nice to see what the games were like back then.
I've played most of these recent (AA+) games and while all of them only gave me the brief pleasure similar to what I assume a one night stand would (how could I know, I'm a one woman guy for life) I can't disagree with the above.
On the other hand:
- my parents think that FB is complete crap (we didn't need it back then)
- my daughter thinks that FB is complete crap (isn't FB what you used back then)
What I maybe am trying to say is this: if you can afford to pay for anything with your own money your opinion is already irrelevant. Sadly I think is the case for many people rallying for old times. That said, I'll be joining the luddites and trying out an older game this weekend hoping it'll be just like "back then". And I guess all "old" people know how trying to re-live old times will work out:)
While you can't create music like in LOTRO, there are 10 different /music options, and depending on the instrument you are using, you will play a different part of the song - melody, harmony, beat, etc. It is a great system, since you can get quite a good sound when 4 or 5 people with different instruments are all playing together.
The graphics haven't aged as badly as one might expect. The character models could definietly use an update, but the terrain still looks good - like a low-setting LOTRO.
Originally posted by outfctrl I have the original boxed version. Gonna dig it out tonight and look through it. Wow....this is a shock. Usually when a game goes dead...it is dead. I almost threw the box out.
Just an FYI, per their forums you will have to download the game fresh from them rather than install from cd, in case you were intending to do so. Due to some technical changes, I guess.
Can someone tell me what the loot system is like in AC2?
Is it like AC?
Trying to decide if I sohould sub a new account try to this out. Thanks.
got my 1st few levels..so great to be back..I forgive turbine for all the things,whatever they were ,in the past,that made me hate them. It falls short of giving me my old chars. back,but, I dont care because to run wild again through my beloved Dereth makes me very forgiving. Here's to a new beginning , Cheers !
Originally posted by Aconsar Originally posted by Ramonski7 Originally posted by Yamota I think you guys thinking how awesome this is have forgot what a sub-par game it was and why many of you quit it to begin with... Dont want to rain in on anyone's parade but I dont think people realise what a sub-par game this was.
AC was light years ahead of its gameplay. AC2 was complete garbage.
My post seems to have clearly flown over you adamant little head huh? I'll break it down for you: