Originally posted by nariusseldonThe funny thing is that i am more than capable to deciding how to have fun, and some will come in speaking as if i won't be having any fun.Well ... if i am not .. i will do something else .. duh!
Cause you have nothing invested in said game.
Charging a player money for a game they don't have fun playing isn't going to make the game fun to play. If a player is having fun in a game, they will invest time into the game, even if they don't spend money on the game.
and that makes them less of a parasite how?
Please explain your comment a bit more.
Easy enough. Every player in a game uses resources, bandwidth, power, CSR. (Don't think for a instant F2P players don't submit titckets if they get stuck or their ubersword suddenly disappears.) granted this may not be alot but it is something. As the F2P such as the OP doesn't pay for the the game (thats B2P) and has no intent of ever paying any money in the game. (Op states he expects whales ie big players to fund his free playing fun) this makes them a drain or parasite to it put bluntly on the game.
In most F2P cases the player can't ascess most of the content thus making them worthless even as pug cannon fodder for the paying players.
One could argue that the free to play player like the OP who already knows he's just in it for a month or 2 of free fun before skipping off to the next F2P title has little to no care for the games community as such one would imagie they are more likely to be the games Asshats spamming how the game sucks compared to game X etc, or purposely wiping raids/ pugs they do get into as they have no long term commitment and are playing the game solely for their own fun.
I imagine the Op has a job and probably has no trouble paying 15 dollars on a nights entertainment to see a movie, yet balks at paying said 15 dollars for a months entertainment as he can simply get it free and have others pay the bill.
Perhaps this is a huge jump in reeasoning but how really is this different then say having a healthy 21 y/o decide he doesn't want to work and wants to live on welfare the rest of his life? Sure there are rich "whales" that will pay the taxes for him to do so but its still technically a parasitic relationship.
Do games really benefit in any way from gamers that have decided to play for a few months to have the most fun they can other players be damned and never pay anything to the games company/developers as we are all entiltled to free stuff since theres always someone how makes more then us etc.? I'm probably rocking the boat, might even get banned for what I wrote, and hell I'm neither rich nore a republican. I do however take responsibilty for myself and my actions. I pay for the entertainment I use because in the end I know nothing in this world is for free.
In a F2P MMO, the free players are often as important as the paying ones. The model is managed very differently from a subscription game. While there may very well be back of the queue prioritizing sometimes, the free player is understood to be a very valuable user of the service.
Look at the home page for any F2P game and you will see there are constant events, festivals and special weekends. When you hop in game, you will often see there are GMs and staffers that are hanging out in channel, chatting with the players. The towns or NPCs are usually redecorated for holidays and events. This content is just as much for the free player as the paying player. The reason being is that the free players are, to a certain degree, content for paying players.
Players being content for other players is absolutely true of subscription MMOs, as well. Veteran players will leave a server that feels ‘dead’. When new players log into a ‘dead’ server, they aren’t too likely to stick around. The vanity players need people to show their stuff off to, the entertainers need people to entertain, the raiders and grinders need people to group with, and the socialisers need people to chat with.
In the F2P model, you already know that you’re only getting cash from a small percentage, so it’s not like you are putting much effort into getting cash from the rest – they had no intention of spending anything to begin with, so you focus your energies primarily on those who will. You concentrate your efforts in two areas
providing engaging content to bring in as many free players as you can
providing desirable items in the mall for the players looking to invest extra in their hobby/entertainment
The vanity case isn’t going to buy new bling if there’s no one to show it off to. The raider/grinder isn’t going to buy the xp boosts if he doesn’t have players to group with or compete against. The socialiser isn’t going to run his tavern or buy new toys if he’s logging in and just playing alone.
Without the free players, the paying ones quickly leave.
originally posted by Loktofelt - think it answers the question rather nicely.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Originally posted by CalmOceans Good luck on spending more on F2P to enjoy the game.
Don't worry. I will join the majority of MMO players in the US, and pay nothing. I will let teh whales to subsidize my gaming. It is not like i haven't play F2P before, jsut that i have to wait till my annual pass is over before killing the last sub.
Cool story?
A majority of gamers don't pay? Yeah.... keep on dreaming and wishing kiddo.
F2P games are typically more costly on the consumer, oh and Aion is doing pretty bad right now with its truely free to play....
We're going to see a lot of these free to play games go under and be cancled in the next year. It was a failed experiment, Free to play games just can't last, they leave a bad taste in everyones' mouth.
Several different studies from several different sources confirm this. If you have data, other than your own subjective opinion, disputing this feel free to post it.
Aion was always doing bad in the west, in the east it is hugely successfull.
F2P games have been around since before UO, therefore they are just as much of a failed experiment as p2p.
Um how about falling NCSoft stock prices? how about their layoffs and restructuring that is occuring? Yeah...
Sorry but NCSoft is doing much worse after the free to play transition...
I googled NCSoft layoffs, they've lay'd off people multiple times this year already...
Originally posted by CalmOceans Good luck on spending more on F2P to enjoy the game.
Don't worry. I will join the majority of MMO players in the US, and pay nothing. I will let teh whales to subsidize my gaming. It is not like i haven't play F2P before, jsut that i have to wait till my annual pass is over before killing the last sub.
Cool story?
A majority of gamers don't pay? Yeah.... keep on dreaming and wishing kiddo.
F2P games are typically more costly on the consumer, oh and Aion is doing pretty bad right now with its truely free to play....
We're going to see a lot of these free to play games go under and be cancled in the next year. It was a failed experiment, Free to play games just can't last, they leave a bad taste in everyones' mouth.
Several different studies from several different sources confirm this. If you have data, other than your own subjective opinion, disputing this feel free to post it.
Aion was always doing bad in the west, in the east it is hugely successfull.
F2P games have been around since before UO, therefore they are just as much of a failed experiment as p2p.
Um how about falling NCSoft stock prices? how about their layoffs and restructuring that is occuring? Yeah...
Sorry but NCSoft is doing much worse after the free to play transition...
I googled NCSoft layoffs, they've lay'd off people multiple times this year already...
So how does that support your view that most people do pay for f2p? It seems that if a game company is doing worse after f2p, that then implies that most people are not paying.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Originally posted by CalmOceans Good luck on spending more on F2P to enjoy the game.
Don't worry. I will join the majority of MMO players in the US, and pay nothing. I will let teh whales to subsidize my gaming. It is not like i haven't play F2P before, jsut that i have to wait till my annual pass is over before killing the last sub.
Cool story?
A majority of gamers don't pay? Yeah.... keep on dreaming and wishing kiddo.
F2P games are typically more costly on the consumer, oh and Aion is doing pretty bad right now with its truely free to play....
We're going to see a lot of these free to play games go under and be cancled in the next year. It was a failed experiment, Free to play games just can't last, they leave a bad taste in everyones' mouth.
Several different studies from several different sources confirm this. If you have data, other than your own subjective opinion, disputing this feel free to post it.
Aion was always doing bad in the west, in the east it is hugely successfull.
F2P games have been around since before UO, therefore they are just as much of a failed experiment as p2p.
Um how about falling NCSoft stock prices? how about their layoffs and restructuring that is occuring? Yeah...
Sorry but NCSoft is doing much worse after the free to play transition...
I googled NCSoft layoffs, they've lay'd off people multiple times this year already...
So how does that support your view that most people don't pay for f2p? It seems that if a game company is doing worse after f2p, that then implies that most people are not paying.
NCSoft, owners of Arenanet, and Aion..
You know two very well known figure heads in the Free to Play industry?'
Yeah... and yet that company is failing...
Hmmm...
The point is this, Free to play didn't save them. Is it better than Pay to play? Not for them.
Originally posted by CalmOceans Good luck on spending more on F2P to enjoy the game.
Don't worry. I will join the majority of MMO players in the US, and pay nothing. I will let teh whales to subsidize my gaming. It is not like i haven't play F2P before, jsut that i have to wait till my annual pass is over before killing the last sub.
Cool story?
A majority of gamers don't pay? Yeah.... keep on dreaming and wishing kiddo.
F2P games are typically more costly on the consumer, oh and Aion is doing pretty bad right now with its truely free to play....
We're going to see a lot of these free to play games go under and be cancled in the next year. It was a failed experiment, Free to play games just can't last, they leave a bad taste in everyones' mouth.
Several different studies from several different sources confirm this. If you have data, other than your own subjective opinion, disputing this feel free to post it.
Aion was always doing bad in the west, in the east it is hugely successfull.
F2P games have been around since before UO, therefore they are just as much of a failed experiment as p2p.
Um how about falling NCSoft stock prices? how about their layoffs and restructuring that is occuring? Yeah...
Sorry but NCSoft is doing much worse after the free to play transition...
I googled NCSoft layoffs, they've lay'd off people multiple times this year already...
So how does that support your view that most people don't pay for f2p? It seems that if a game company is doing worse after f2p, that then implies that most people are not paying.
NCSoft, owners of Arenanet, and Aion..
You know two very well known figure heads in the Free to Play industry?'
Yeah... and yet that company is failing...
Hmmm...
The point is this, Free to play didn't save them. Is it better than Pay to play? Not for them.
Once again.
You implied that most people DO pay for f2p.
If a company is worse financially after switching to f2p, that implies they have less funds which means less people were paying.
So how does a company doing worse mean that most will pay for f2p?
f2p will not save a bad game. The studies that you dispute say that the majority do NOT pay for f2p.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Originally posted by nariusseldonThe funny thing is that i am more than capable to deciding how to have fun, and some will come in speaking as if i won't be having any fun.Well ... if i am not .. i will do something else .. duh!
Cause you have nothing invested in said game.
Charging a player money for a game they don't have fun playing isn't going to make the game fun to play. If a player is having fun in a game, they will invest time into the game, even if they don't spend money on the game.
and that makes them less of a parasite how?
Please explain your comment a bit more.
Easy enough. Every player in a game uses resources, bandwidth, power, CSR. (Don't think for a instant F2P players don't submit titckets if they get stuck or their ubersword suddenly disappears.) granted this may not be alot but it is something. As the F2P such as the OP doesn't pay for the the game (thats B2P) and has no intent of ever paying any money in the game. (Op states he expects whales ie big players to fund his free playing fun) this makes them a drain or parasite to it put bluntly on the game.
In most F2P cases the player can't ascess most of the content thus making them worthless even as pug cannon fodder for the paying players.
One could argue that the free to play player like the OP who already knows he's just in it for a month or 2 of free fun before skipping off to the next F2P title has little to no care for the games community as such one would imagie they are more likely to be the games Asshats spamming how the game sucks compared to game X etc, or purposely wiping raids/ pugs they do get into as they have no long term commitment and are playing the game solely for their own fun.
I imagine the Op has a job and probably has no trouble paying 15 dollars on a nights entertainment to see a movie, yet balks at paying said 15 dollars for a months entertainment as he can simply get it free and have others pay the bill.
Perhaps this is a huge jump in reeasoning but how really is this different then say having a healthy 21 y/o decide he doesn't want to work and wants to live on welfare the rest of his life? Sure there are rich "whales" that will pay the taxes for him to do so but its still technically a parasitic relationship.
Do games really benefit in any way from gamers that have decided to play for a few months to have the most fun they can other players be damned and never pay anything to the games company/developers as we are all entiltled to free stuff since theres always someone how makes more then us etc.? I'm probably rocking the boat, might even get banned for what I wrote, and hell I'm neither rich nore a republican. I do however take responsibilty for myself and my actions. I pay for the entertainment I use because in the end I know nothing in this world is for free.
That's a pretty good analogy although there are obviously a few more dynamics to it than that. I'd add to that the "junkie" and "addict" mentality whereas developers count on having plenty of ignorant gamers to fund their machine. Get 'em hooked on the game, introduce gambling and other paid devices to their *cough* "free" model and BAM!
As they say, there's one born every second.
"Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever." - Noam Chomsky
Originally posted by nariusseldonThe funny thing is that i am more than capable to deciding how to have fun, and some will come in speaking as if i won't be having any fun.Well ... if i am not .. i will do something else .. duh!
Cause you have nothing invested in said game.
Charging a player money for a game they don't have fun playing isn't going to make the game fun to play. If a player is having fun in a game, they will invest time into the game, even if they don't spend money on the game.
and that makes them less of a parasite how?
Please explain your comment a bit more.
Easy enough. Every player in a game uses resources, bandwidth, power, CSR. (Don't think for a instant F2P players don't submit titckets if they get stuck or their ubersword suddenly disappears.) granted this may not be alot but it is something. As the F2P such as the OP doesn't pay for the the game (thats B2P) and has no intent of ever paying any money in the game. (Op states he expects whales ie big players to fund his free playing fun) this makes them a drain or parasite to it put bluntly on the game.
In most F2P cases the player can't ascess most of the content thus making them worthless even as pug cannon fodder for the paying players.
One could argue that the free to play player like the OP who already knows he's just in it for a month or 2 of free fun before skipping off to the next F2P title has little to no care for the games community as such one would imagie they are more likely to be the games Asshats spamming how the game sucks compared to game X etc, or purposely wiping raids/ pugs they do get into as they have no long term commitment and are playing the game solely for their own fun.
I imagine the Op has a job and probably has no trouble paying 15 dollars on a nights entertainment to see a movie, yet balks at paying said 15 dollars for a months entertainment as he can simply get it free and have others pay the bill.
Perhaps this is a huge jump in reeasoning but how really is this different then say having a healthy 21 y/o decide he doesn't want to work and wants to live on welfare the rest of his life? Sure there are rich "whales" that will pay the taxes for him to do so but its still technically a parasitic relationship.
Do games really benefit in any way from gamers that have decided to play for a few months to have the most fun they can other players be damned and never pay anything to the games company/developers as we are all entiltled to free stuff since theres always someone how makes more then us etc.? I'm probably rocking the boat, might even get banned for what I wrote, and hell I'm neither rich nore a republican. I do however take responsibilty for myself and my actions. I pay for the entertainment I use because in the end I know nothing in this world is for free.
That's a pretty good analogy although there are obviously a few more dynamics to it than that. I'd add to that the "junkie" and "addict" mentality whereas developers count on having plenty of ignorant gamers to fund their machine. Get 'em hooked on the game, introduce gambling and other paid devices to their *cough* "free" model and BAM!
As they say, there's one born every second.
I wouldn't start talking about junkie and addict, especially as it relates to video games unless you have a thorough understanding of the medical and psychological causes of "addiction" And since you referenced junkie and video games in the same breath, you don't.
HInt - There has not been any peer reviewed credible study linking addiction and games, there have been several refuting them. Addiction as a word is being phased out in the medical community and moving towards receptor disregulation and abuse to reflect 2 different treatments and 2 diffent locus of control. So far gaming seems to be abuse, not addiction. And no anyone cannot get addicted to anything, but anyone can abuse anything.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
The user and all related content has been deleted.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Your aware that TSW is now a non sub game once you have purchased it right?
Much better than the so called FTP model. More games in the future should folllow Arenanet and FC with this model.
I'm very aware that FC has turned to B2P, but they'll add a cash shop shortly. I personally believed that they would have done this anyways. The game screamed F2P from the start.
Why did it screen f2p from the start? please tell us what it was about this game that said to you F2P.
You mean other than the fact that every other game Funcom had were F2P?
Yes it has. More games, more players, more choice, more choice in how I play each game than most old games.
edit - so you admit you haven't established that there is a console mentality and yet you accuse someone of being a console gamer based on their statements, despite that those same statements state they don't have a console. Yep makes sense to me.
I don't know what to say to the guy. He's just provoking just for the laughs I suppse. I thoroughly believe anything a console can do a PC/MAC or what have you can do better. My case still stands against this guy. I don't know any MMO's that bombard me with advertisements to buy from their cash shop.
Once again. Im not the one that brought that up.
You haven't brought anything to the table other than trying to offend people. You asked me to name F2P games that I've played that do not bombard me with advertisements, I gave you a few of the games that I played that didn't and decided to just give you a massive list of games that I've personally gone through. Then you accuse me to being a console gamer because I gave you a response.
So, if you have nothing positive to bring to what we're talking about why are you still in this topic?
Just one more time so that you can understand...
I wasnt that one that said anything about adds in f2p games. i never asked for a list of the games you have played.
I did however call you call console gamer becuase you talk like one. You are part of the entitelment crowd. Wants everything for free and whats other to pay for it.
Then why are you here if you have nothing productive to add to the conversation?
Im here because i had something to say about OUR conversation and that was you act and think like a console gamer. Now with that i hope our conversation is over.
I wasnt that one that said anything about adds in f2p games. i never asked for a list of the games you have played.
I did however call you call console gamer becuase you talk like one. You are part of the entitelment crowd. Wants everything for free and whats other to pay for it.
Are you suggesting these are the same? Because last I checked, console games were not free.
yes. maybe not brother and sister but definitely cousins.
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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Yeah, because F2P games don't have people with elitist mindsets.... right.
FYI, people are the same in every game. The difference is that, with a sub, you actually are entitled to 99.9% of the content in the game, and your gameplay is not continuously disturbed by advertisements and restrictions trying to get you to buy things from a cash shop.
That in itself is worth the sub fee, in my opinion. F2P games in general just feel inferior in nearly every way and quickly become annoying, at least to me.
So, when you pay the fee of 15 dollars that .1% is the 20-30 items in the cash shops these subscription based games are implimenting? Are you no entitled to the the celestial mounts that they add? Or the special pets that they're selling? Are those not entitled for the loyal customers that have been with them for so many years?
I don't play games where my gameplay is being continuously bombarded by advertisements, to tell you the truth, I don't know any in a very long time that have done that. I suppose there's a hidden section of MMO's that you're playing that I haven't noticed. Because I'm played 2-3 right now and I have yet to receive these "advertisements".
Lol btw, if anyone noticed Have a merry Christmas, and happy holidays!
The mounts on the side don't really matter as long as the rest of the game is completely open, because all the mounts do is add something incredibly small.
Almost every F2P game I've played has had restricted items that made me purchase something to unlock them, constantly had loading screens telling me about the cash shop stuff, have an icon or multiple icons on the screen leading to the cash shop, constantly having pop ups telling me that I can do this and that if I drop the money.
I'm gonna flip this and ask what games you're actually playing that DOESN'T do this, and maybe I'll give it a go.
I've played several f2p and while there were things I wanted in the cs there was nothing I needed. And the only advertisements I saw where in emails (not in game mail) and when I first load up the game at the same time as the update. I've never had an ingame advertisement pop up or load screen.
FE, Aion, EQ, EQ2, CoH, CO so far and a few others I've forgotten about. Not one pop up or load screen after the initial game loading up.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Almost every F2P game I've played has had restricted items that made me purchase something to unlock them, constantly had loading screens telling me about the cash shop stuff, have an icon or multiple icons on the screen leading to the cash shop, constantly having pop ups telling me that I can do this and that if I drop the money.
I'm gonna flip this and ask what games you're actually playing that DOESN'T do this, and maybe I'll give it a go.
PS2 .. never have anything pop up when i am playing.
I imagine the Op has a job and probably has no trouble paying 15 dollars on a nights entertainment to see a movie, yet balks at paying said 15 dollars for a months entertainment as he can simply get it free and have others pay the bill.
You are right. I have been paying for WOW for multiple year. $15 is .. like you said .. less than a movie with my wife. Note that it is not a choice of paying or not paying only, it is also about the game. I tried and like PS2 .. now i can't pay a sub there, even if i want right?
And you are also right that if some whales want to pay for it for me, hey, who am i to say no.
Perhaps this is a huge jump in reeasoning but how really is this different then say having a healthy 21 y/o decide he doesn't want to work and wants to live on welfare the rest of his life? Sure there are rich "whales" that will pay the taxes for him to do so but its still technically a parasitic relationship.
And technically you are right. Games are just entertainment. I feel no problem free riding. I pay my taxes, and i think it is too high. If the Fed lower my tax rate, you are damn right that i will welcome that with open arms. There are always somewhere else i can spend my money.
Do games really benefit in any way from gamers that have decided to play for a few months to have the most fun they can other players be damned and never pay anything to the games company/developers as we are all entiltled to free stuff since theres always someone how makes more then us etc.? I'm probably rocking the boat, might even get banned for what I wrote, and hell I'm neither rich nore a republican. I do however take responsibilty for myself and my actions. I pay for the entertainment I use because in the end I know nothing in this world is for free.
May be .. may be not. The devs seems to want free players for two reasons. 1) We are content for the whales. 2) They are hoping they can lure us into paying.
None of this ... of course .. is predicated on the assumption gamers want to "benefit the games". Personally i don't care less. All i am doing .. is playing games to have fun. Not to "benefit" the games. not to "benefit" the "community", and certainly not to benefit the devs.
I highly doubt the devs are under any illusions that it is not the case.
"I know nothing in this world is for free" ... PS2, DDO, and a host of other F2P games just prove you wrong. I just played some PS2 last night. I paid nothing (well .. i did pay electricity, and internet access, but certainly NOTHING to SOE).
Originally posted by CalmOceans Good luck on spending more on F2P to enjoy the game.
I'm of this belief as well, for the most part. I know I spent almost as much as a sub on GW2 and it really only had fluff stuff, extra bag and bank space, and gold to buy with gems. Still....I managed to spend almost a sub amount on it each month. Guess I don't have very good self control, maybe. If there's fun stuff to buy in a game.....I'm probably going to buy it. lol
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Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
I personally agree with you, you shouldn't limit yourself to a specific payment model. However, the current subscription games don't truly have more that what F2P models have to offer.
I also know that Darkfall is not the type of game that everyone would like. I personally love it. It's a hardcore PvP MMO. But a lot of the casual gamers will most likely dislike it because of the fact that the game is not forgiving at all.
And its population tells you how popular it is.
Going back to the topic of the thread, it is really about competition. I wouldn't go F2P only, if there weren't so many F2P games, and personally i found many to be fun.
troll B: im gonna gang up on you with Troll A because im weak
Poster: Here is why i think the way i do
Troll A: Here is why your wrong with no proof
Troll B: YEAH!!
Person A: I think poster has a few good points
Troll A: Im gonna take 1 word and build on it cause its all i have
Troll B: HAHA Troll A burned you!
Person B: DIdnt Apoc just burn these trolls to bits?
Person A: I though he did too
Troll A: nuu uhh!
Troll B: your stupid!!
Seriously you all just fight to fight, I would love to see a conversation like
this happen in real life, It would end up with troll A and B both on the ground
wishing they had never been born.
You all know who is troll A and B here dont you?
O
Destiny has cheated me By forcing me to decide upon The woman that I idolise Or the hands of an automaton
Without these hands I can't complete The opera that was captivating her But if I keep them, and she marries him Then he probably won't want me dating her
Comments
Here's how F2P works:
In a F2P MMO, the free players are often as important as the paying ones. The model is managed very differently from a subscription game. While there may very well be back of the queue prioritizing sometimes, the free player is understood to be a very valuable user of the service.
Look at the home page for any F2P game and you will see there are constant events, festivals and special weekends. When you hop in game, you will often see there are GMs and staffers that are hanging out in channel, chatting with the players. The towns or NPCs are usually redecorated for holidays and events. This content is just as much for the free player as the paying player. The reason being is that the free players are, to a certain degree, content for paying players.
Players being content for other players is absolutely true of subscription MMOs, as well. Veteran players will leave a server that feels ‘dead’. When new players log into a ‘dead’ server, they aren’t too likely to stick around. The vanity players need people to show their stuff off to, the entertainers need people to entertain, the raiders and grinders need people to group with, and the socialisers need people to chat with.
In the F2P model, you already know that you’re only getting cash from a small percentage, so it’s not like you are putting much effort into getting cash from the rest – they had no intention of spending anything to begin with, so you focus your energies primarily on those who will. You concentrate your efforts in two areas
The vanity case isn’t going to buy new bling if there’s no one to show it off to.
The raider/grinder isn’t going to buy the xp boosts if he doesn’t have players to group with or compete against. The socialiser isn’t going to run his tavern or buy new toys if he’s logging in and just playing alone.
Without the free players, the paying ones quickly leave.
originally posted by Loktofelt - think it answers the question rather nicely.
Um how about falling NCSoft stock prices? how about their layoffs and restructuring that is occuring? Yeah...
Sorry but NCSoft is doing much worse after the free to play transition...
I googled NCSoft layoffs, they've lay'd off people multiple times this year already...
So how does that support your view that most people do pay for f2p? It seems that if a game company is doing worse after f2p, that then implies that most people are not paying.
NCSoft, owners of Arenanet, and Aion..
You know two very well known figure heads in the Free to Play industry?'
Yeah... and yet that company is failing...
Hmmm...
The point is this, Free to play didn't save them. Is it better than Pay to play? Not for them.
Once again.
You implied that most people DO pay for f2p.
If a company is worse financially after switching to f2p, that implies they have less funds which means less people were paying.
So how does a company doing worse mean that most will pay for f2p?
f2p will not save a bad game. The studies that you dispute say that the majority do NOT pay for f2p.
That's a pretty good analogy although there are obviously a few more dynamics to it than that. I'd add to that the "junkie" and "addict" mentality whereas developers count on having plenty of ignorant gamers to fund their machine. Get 'em hooked on the game, introduce gambling and other paid devices to their *cough* "free" model and BAM!
As they say, there's one born every second.
"Censorship is never over for those who have experienced it. It is a brand on the imagination that affects the individual who has suffered it, forever." - Noam Chomsky
I wouldn't start talking about junkie and addict, especially as it relates to video games unless you have a thorough understanding of the medical and psychological causes of "addiction" And since you referenced junkie and video games in the same breath, you don't.
HInt - There has not been any peer reviewed credible study linking addiction and games, there have been several refuting them. Addiction as a word is being phased out in the medical community and moving towards receptor disregulation and abuse to reflect 2 different treatments and 2 diffent locus of control. So far gaming seems to be abuse, not addiction. And no anyone cannot get addicted to anything, but anyone can abuse anything.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
And for those of us who don't give a damn about "winning"? Stop your dick-waving and just have fun for once!
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
You mean other than the fact that every other game Funcom had were F2P?
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
Im here because i had something to say about OUR conversation and that was you act and think like a console gamer. Now with that i hope our conversation is over.
yes. maybe not brother and sister but definitely cousins.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
The mounts on the side don't really matter as long as the rest of the game is completely open, because all the mounts do is add something incredibly small.
Almost every F2P game I've played has had restricted items that made me purchase something to unlock them, constantly had loading screens telling me about the cash shop stuff, have an icon or multiple icons on the screen leading to the cash shop, constantly having pop ups telling me that I can do this and that if I drop the money.
I'm gonna flip this and ask what games you're actually playing that DOESN'T do this, and maybe I'll give it a go.
I've played several f2p and while there were things I wanted in the cs there was nothing I needed. And the only advertisements I saw where in emails (not in game mail) and when I first load up the game at the same time as the update. I've never had an ingame advertisement pop up or load screen.
FE, Aion, EQ, EQ2, CoH, CO so far and a few others I've forgotten about. Not one pop up or load screen after the initial game loading up.
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
PS2 .. never have anything pop up when i am playing.
I'm of this belief as well, for the most part. I know I spent almost as much as a sub on GW2 and it really only had fluff stuff, extra bag and bank space, and gold to buy with gems. Still....I managed to spend almost a sub amount on it each month. Guess I don't have very good self control, maybe. If there's fun stuff to buy in a game.....I'm probably going to buy it. lol
President of The Marvelously Meowhead Fan Club
I have paid more on Planetside 2 than if I had paid 6 months worth of subs, although I know some people are able to just not spend money.
imo dont limit yourself to games based on their payment method, you'll miss out on great games, like Darkfall UW
Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.
And its population tells you how popular it is.
Going back to the topic of the thread, it is really about competition. I wouldn't go F2P only, if there weren't so many F2P games, and personally i found many to be fun.
Poster: here is a thoughts and my Opinions
troll A: your wrong because of this symantic
troll B: im gonna gang up on you with Troll A because im weak
Poster: Here is why i think the way i do
Troll A: Here is why your wrong with no proof
Troll B: YEAH!!
Person A: I think poster has a few good points
Troll A: Im gonna take 1 word and build on it cause its all i have
Troll B: HAHA Troll A burned you!
Person B: DIdnt Apoc just burn these trolls to bits?
Person A: I though he did too
Troll A: nuu uhh!
Troll B: your stupid!!
Seriously you all just fight to fight, I would love to see a conversation like
this happen in real life, It would end up with troll A and B both on the ground
wishing they had never been born.
You all know who is troll A and B here dont you?
O
Destiny has cheated me
By forcing me to decide upon
The woman that I idolise
Or the hands of an automaton
Without these hands I can't complete
The opera that was captivating her
But if I keep them, and she marries him
Then he probably won't want me dating her