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EVE Online F2P

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  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    oh no.. how can that be?  Some were ranting earlier that EVE shouldn't and can't have PvE content, because it will destroy the game..  hmmmmmmm  /snicker

    They are extremist as much as you are, just from opposite end but neither of you can see EVE as a whole.

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Krematory

    What if a player is ganked while he is killing rats/sleepers and it's an NPC the one who deal the final blow? Is that considered a "pve loss"? :-P

    Yes, it is. The stats are based on final blows.

    It works the other way round too tho - if you land final blow while NPC did major damage, it will be counted as PVP loss.

  • tom_goretom_gore TamperePosts: 1,796Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    Where are all these explosions happening? First up, let’s take a look by security group:

                                        PVP             PVE              Total

    High Sec             1,974,022     6,317,926     8,291,948

    Low Sec               4,126,911       510,683     4,637,594

    Null Sec                7,061,988       568,353     7,630,341

    Wormhole Space    377,786      162,126        539,912

                                  13,540,707   7,559,088  21,099,795

     

    http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=3235

    oh no.. how can that be?  Some were ranting earlier that EVE shouldn't and can't have PvE content, because it will destroy the game..  hmmmmmmm  /snicker

    Whoever was ranting that EVE couldn't have PvE content? It already has and more is added in every patch, more or less.

    We were talking about PvE servers. Those would destroy EVE. The chart above does nothing to change that fact.

     

  • sadeyxsadeyx leicesterPosts: 1,553Member
    Originally posted by Elsabolts
    Originally posted by jpnz

    A PVE server in EVE-Online would be similar to having PVE server for PlanetSide2 or CounterStrike.

    Doesn't fit at all.

    If this is not true then why did CCP give china there own server ?

    image

    Because there are different laws surrounding videos games in that part of the world, laws that require them to change some fundemental aspects of the game.   Its nothing to do with Pve or Pvp

  • RydesonRydeson Canton, OHPosts: 3,858Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by tom_gore
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    Where are all these explosions happening? First up, let’s take a look by security group:

                                        PVP             PVE              Total

    High Sec             1,974,022     6,317,926     8,291,948

    Low Sec               4,126,911       510,683     4,637,594

    Null Sec                7,061,988       568,353     7,630,341

    Wormhole Space    377,786      162,126        539,912

                                  13,540,707   7,559,088  21,099,795

     

    http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=3235

    oh no.. how can that be?  Some were ranting earlier that EVE shouldn't and can't have PvE content, because it will destroy the game..  hmmmmmmm  /snicker

    Whoever was ranting that EVE couldn't have PvE content? It already has and more is added in every patch, more or less.

    We were talking about PvE servers. Those would destroy EVE. The chart above does nothing to change that fact.

     

         Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Rydeson

    Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

    EVE was designed to have a single server, that is how the game is supposed to work and how it works.

    PVE server simply makes no sense.

  • OltzuOltzu Esbo, AKPosts: 105Member
    HighSec Systems are basically PVE servers
  • Dantae87Dantae87 Camloops, ABPosts: 166Member
    this game should b free to play...just seems liek the kind of game that should be

    image

  • HazelleHazelle Brampton, ONPosts: 760Member
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    Where are all these explosions happening? First up, let’s take a look by security group:

                                        PVP             PVE              Total

    High Sec             1,974,022     6,317,926     8,291,948

    Low Sec               4,126,911       510,683     4,637,594

    Null Sec                7,061,988       568,353     7,630,341

    Wormhole Space    377,786      162,126        539,912

                                  13,540,707   7,559,088  21,099,795

     

    http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=3235

    "To be fair a lot of those are rookie ships and such, but either way – that’s a lot of explosions."

  • WraithoneWraithone Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 3,592Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Elsabolts

    I forsee " High Winds and Heavy Seas " coming for this thread. F2P or PVE servers will upset the " Hive "

    image

    Not just the hive, but the Swarm... ^^  Goonies are likely to be out in full force for this.

  • HazelleHazelle Brampton, ONPosts: 760Member
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by tom_gore
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    Where are all these explosions happening? First up, let’s take a look by security group:

                                        PVP             PVE              Total

    High Sec             1,974,022     6,317,926     8,291,948

    Low Sec               4,126,911       510,683     4,637,594

    Null Sec                7,061,988       568,353     7,630,341

    Wormhole Space    377,786      162,126        539,912

                                  13,540,707   7,559,088  21,099,795

     

    http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=3235

    oh no.. how can that be?  Some were ranting earlier that EVE shouldn't and can't have PvE content, because it will destroy the game..  hmmmmmmm  /snicker

    Whoever was ranting that EVE couldn't have PvE content? It already has and more is added in every patch, more or less.

    We were talking about PvE servers. Those would destroy EVE. The chart above does nothing to change that fact.

     

         Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

    It would distract the developer and if you knew anything about CCP that's the last thing they need happen to them, aside from that - it's not nessessary at all.  EvE needs consumers as well as manufacturers.  It needs sellers as well as buyers.  It needs people to generate wealth and people to lose wealth.  Eve online needs more people not less people to make it a better game.  There's more than enough room for PvPers and PvEers within eve's current universe.  PvE players are required in the current version of eve online and to lock them away behind a different shard means that their presence would be missed sorely because they are all of the things I listed above.

     

  • dave6660dave6660 New York, NYPosts: 2,543Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Gdemami

    Where are all these explosions happening? First up, let’s take a look by security group:

                                        PVP             PVE              Total

    High Sec             1,974,022     6,317,926     8,291,948

    Low Sec               4,126,911       510,683     4,637,594

    Null Sec                7,061,988       568,353     7,630,341

    Wormhole Space    377,786      162,126        539,912

                                  13,540,707   7,559,088  21,099,795

     

    http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=3235

    It's interesting to look at those PvP numbers as a ratio of the number of systems in each of those security classes...

    There are 1090 high sec systems... that's about 1811 kills per system.

    There are 817 low sec systems... that's about 5051 kills per system.

    There are 3524 null sec systems but only 3294 are reachable (Jove systems are not)... so that's 2144 kills per system.

    There are 2499 w-space systems... that's about 151 kills per system.

    So new players, it looks like you're much safer in worm holes than high sec and only marginally less safe in 0.0.

    “There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.”
    -- Herman Melville

  • RydesonRydeson Canton, OHPosts: 3,858Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson

    Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

     

    EVE was designed to have a single server, that is how the game is supposed to work and how it works.

    PVE server simply makes no sense.

         That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

  • GdemamiGdemami Beau VallonPosts: 7,860Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by RydesonThat doesn't answer my question.. 

    It does, you just ignore the answer. As said above:


    Originally posted by RydesonHighSec Systems are basically PVE servers
  • BanquettoBanquetto CityPosts: 1,037Member Uncommon


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

  • ZinzanZinzan NorthPosts: 1,351Member
    Originally posted by Banquetto

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

     

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

    EVE with no risk would not be worth playing.

    Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy :)

  • simmihisimmihi -Posts: 615Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Banquetto

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

     

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

    *Somehow offtopic here, i dont want to steal the thread, even if it already derailed from the F2P discussion to the PvE servers discussion*

     

    I'm someone who tried the game through 3 trials now, could not get past some point. I want to be one of them "producers", I like the idea of research, economics, trade, a game who gravitates around money. Before every trial i've started reading guides, boards etc. only to find out that mining is useless as a single account (you compete with people having 5 accounts) and to focus on production you need serious ISK to start with. Is there a chance to "get somewhere" focusing on production/mining/invention from start? What would be a good "path" for me? Please consider that I'm someone who can play probably 1-3 hours a day, single account, and focusing on RL more than games. And I consider myself sane, so something like "scan radar sites for 3 months 5 hours per day to get you started" won't work for me.

  • WraithoneWraithone Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 3,592Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson

    Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

     

    EVE was designed to have a single server, that is how the game is supposed to work and how it works.

    PVE server simply makes no sense.

         That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

    Less targets to gank and grief, this is a Bad Thing(tm) in Goonie terms. ^^

    Not to mention CCP is VERY pro PvP.  They have only changed the rules of high sec, and evolved Concord to protect their business model.   If I remember right, there are two clusters. One for China, and one for the rest of the world. 

  • WraithoneWraithone Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 3,592Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Banquetto

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

     

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

    "Zero"?  With the sleeper AI being introduced and expanded upon in all of the missions?  It would be less certainly, but its not going to be anything like zero. 

  • MalcanisMalcanis LondonPosts: 3,191Member
    Originally posted by Wraithone
    Originally posted by Banquetto

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

     

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

    "Zero"?  With the sleeper AI being introduced and expanded upon in all of the missions?  It would be less certainly, but its not going to be anything like zero. 

     

    I think you're overestimating how difficult the sleeper "AI" is. And for missions the only difference it makes is that you have to pay a little attention with your drones. Sleeper "AI" is not the same as sleeper DPS. Doing missions in a Tengu = absolutely no difference whatsoever.

    Give me liberty or give me lasers

  • dave6660dave6660 New York, NYPosts: 2,543Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Zinzan
    Originally posted by Banquetto

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

     

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

    EVE with no risk would not be worth playing.

    I agree with CCP's message to the players, "HTFU".

    I also believe the only way Eve can take a major turn for the worse is if CCP does something stupid like create a PvE server or make the game F2P.

     

    “There are certain queer times and occasions in this strange mixed affair we call life when a man takes this whole universe for a vast practical joke, though the wit thereof he but dimly discerns, and more than suspects that the joke is at nobody's expense but his own.”
    -- Herman Melville

  • WraithoneWraithone Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 3,592Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Malcanis
    Originally posted by Wraithone
    Originally posted by Banquetto

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson
    That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

     

    EVE's economy requires a balance of producers and consumers. If PvE players all upped and left for a new server, it would destroy the economies of BOTH servers. How long do you think people would play a PvE EVE for when there was absolutely zero demand for any commodities mined or farmed there?

    "Zero"?  With the sleeper AI being introduced and expanded upon in all of the missions?  It would be less certainly, but its not going to be anything like zero. 

     

    I think you're overestimating how difficult the sleeper "AI" is. And for missions the only difference it makes is that you have to pay a little attention with your drones. Sleeper "AI" is not the same as sleeper DPS. Doing missions in a Tengu = absolutely no difference whatsoever.

    True for some, not so much for others.  I also noted that the Sleeper system as it exists, is just the start.  They have stated that it will be expanded and refined over time.  I doubt it will ever be as dangerous as a human player, but then it doesn't need to be. 

  • HazelleHazelle Brampton, ONPosts: 760Member
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson

    Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

     

    EVE was designed to have a single server, that is how the game is supposed to work and how it works.

    PVE server simply makes no sense.

         That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

    Your entire premise is faulty - there is no such thing as easy prey in eve online.  Eve is far safer than a game like world of warcraft in terms of being ganked.

    There are many factors to consider before you attack a player in eve's high security space and most of them are based on risk Vs. reward or potencial gain vs. expected loss; which oddly enough, are the exact same factors that all players consider before they leave a station and embark on any activity.

    It's not necessary for a PvE server since there are controls in place to prevent a mass murdering serial killer that don't exist in typical PvE games.

     

  • WraithoneWraithone Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 3,592Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Hazelle
    Originally posted by Rydeson
    Originally posted by Gdemami

     


    Originally posted by Rydeson

    Do tell me how a PvE server would destroy EVE.. This should be entertaining.. A PvE seperate of your normal server has NO effect on your gameplay whatsoever.. NONE, ZILTCH..  If you are worried that many players will LEAVE your server to play on a non PvP one that is a different issue all together..  But the mechancis of a PvE server would have NO effect.. In fact I bet it would increase the number of subs.. 

     

    EVE was designed to have a single server, that is how the game is supposed to work and how it works.

    PVE server simply makes no sense.

         That doesn't answer my question..  EVE currently sits at about 250-300k subs I think on one PvP server.. So if EVE was to start a new PvE server, how does that effect your PvP server of 300k people..... Other then thousands of people defecting to the new server.. Is that what you're truely worried about?  That thousands of PvE minded people that are EASY targets on the PvP server  will leave to a safer playground where ganking and bounties is not available?   Sure sounds like it to me..  So it's not really about saving EVE, as much as it's saving YOUR fun on easy prey?   Lets me honest here..

    Your entire premise is faulty - there is no such thing as easy prey in eve online.  Eve is far safer than a game like world of warcraft in terms of being ganked.

    There are many factors to consider before you attack a player in eve's high security space and most of them are based on risk Vs. reward or potencial gain vs. expected loss; which oddly enough, are the exact same factors that all players consider before they leave a station and embark on any activity.

    It's not necessary for a PvE server since there are controls in place to prevent a mass murdering serial killer that don't exist in typical PvE games.

     

    Odd... Then the Goonies must operate on a differenht "risk vs reward" system... ^^ Given their hulk smashing sprees in high sec, and other antics, its not nearly as safe as one of WoW's PvE servers... ^^ 

  • tom_goretom_gore TamperePosts: 1,796Member Uncommon

    Wow this debate is still going on and I see the only ones vouching for F2P or PvE servers are those who have not played EVE or have no clue how the economy in it works.

    Of course no one of us knows what would happen to EVE if it went F2P or introduced a PvE server. I would, however, wager some money that it would ultimately lose CCP more money than it would bring.

    You may disagree, but at least my opinion is based on actually playing EVE.

     

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