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Why the MMO Market isn't 'Dying' or Anything Of the Kind

TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member

http://www.newzoo.com/infographics/infographic-2012-us/

On the surface, these info graphics aren't that complementary. MMOs represent the smallest platform for gaming.

Think about that for a second. Wait for it...

MMOs are represented as a platform in themselves. The other platforms are "PC/Mac", "Mobile" and "Console", among others. More money is spent on MMOs than on Social Networks and Casual Websites. More money is spent on MMOs than on Mobile games.

The only downside is that games like LoL, CoD, etc. are included as MMOs. So it's not all roses there, but still...big enough to be represented as a gaming platform, and more money is being pumped in than in Mobile gaming. Not too bad MMO Genre, not too bad.

I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

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Comments

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by lizardbones

    http://www.newzoo.com/infographics/infographic-2012-us/

    On the surface, these info graphics aren't that complementary. MMOs represent the smallest platform for gaming.

    Think about that for a second. Wait for it...

    MMOs are represented as a platform in themselves. The other platforms are "PC/Mac", "Mobile" and "Console", among others. More money is spent on MMOs than on Social Networks and Casual Websites. More money is spent on MMOs than on Mobile games.

    The only downside is that games like LoL, CoD, etc. are included as MMOs. So it's not all roses there, but still...big enough to be represented as a gaming platform, and more money is being pumped in than in Mobile gaming. Not too bad MMO Genre, not too bad.

    for the MMO slice ..

    50M players

    $2.9B

    10% of gaming time ..

    Not too shabby.

  • AmarantharAmaranthar OhioPosts: 2,428Member Uncommon

    Ok, let me ask something here.

    Since MMO's (including their examples like WoW) are played on various platforms, which they also listed as separate sources of gamers....then how is it that the totals add up to 100%? With cross references like that, the individual "platforms" they use should add up to more than the total use.

    It's bull****. And I'm damned tired of this industry's propaganda campaigns and lies.

    This industry is really in sad shape when it's resorting to this level.

    Once upon a time....

  • OnomasOnomas Rock Hill, SCPosts: 1,128Member Uncommon

    Longevity of older mmo's would last years upon years. Today you are lucky to get 1 in one hundred to last more than six months.

    I call that an issue and a bad sign. Sorry for all those that like their free to play, fast, easy, change games more than your underwear type gamers, but this is all a bad sign.

     

    But hopefuly things will look up in the near future since some game companies are finaly taking a stand against these types of games and going against the console/wow clones.

    Problem is there isnt enough variety of mmo's. Almost everyone is slapping mmo infront of their favorite 3 letters and think its going to be a hit. The games released today are just a shadow of what mmo's use to be, and the sad thing is many of you caused this and want this.

  • RoxtarrRoxtarr Freeland, MI, MIPosts: 1,122Member

    MMO's are evolving, not dying. 

    It's like music - there hasn't been good music since the 80's but that's because I admit that I'm old.  That doesn't mean that music is dying, although people who are getting old and crusty may say it is.  It's simply changed in a  way that I can't stand.  It doesn't mean music is dying. 

    Same is true with MMO's.  Many players cut their MMO teeth on games and features that are no longer in fashion.  It's easier to blame the developers and games because admitting that we're getting older and out of touch with where games are going is more than many gamers can bear.

    If in 1982 we played with the current mentality, we would have burned down all the pac man games since the red ghost was clearly OP. Instead we just got better at the game.
    image

  • OnomasOnomas Rock Hill, SCPosts: 1,128Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Roxtarr

    MMO's are evolving, not dying. 

    It's like music - there hasn't been good music since the 80's but that's because I admit that I'm old.  That doesn't mean that music is dying, although people who are getting old and crusty may say it is.  It's simply changed in a  way that I can't stand.  It doesn't mean music is dying. 

    Same is true with MMO's.  Many players cut their MMO teeth on games and features that are no longer in fashion.  It's easier to blame the developers and games because admitting that we're getting older and out of touch with where games are going is more than many gamers can bear.

    No, it is the developers fault. See they rush a game and put the "features" on the back burner. Promise to release them in later patches, but something always comes up and its either half-a$$ed or just not put in. As time goes on more and more "features" start to lose out due to rushing, pvp, and the "i want" crowd that rush to max level in 3 days and pound the developers for more content. And thus the "features" are always put last because they spend more time making content than features.

    As newer gamers come in and are introduced to the newer mmo's they actualy have no clue of some of the older features that made mmo's what they were. Now you are stuck with console style rpg's that multiple people can play. But they are not better nor offer the features to make a mmo have longevity, and die off after 3-6 months.

    Over time, this has become the norm. But thats about to change.

    Lot of newer gamers (young or just starting to explore mmo's) just have no clue to compare the "features" since the majority of mmo's are rushed and time isnt put into them like they use to.

     

    I can think of a few dozen newer mmo;s that have promised features, and have yet been added due to time, money, content more important, or something else. If you read many of these posts, majority oare screaming for open world, player made content, good story/game, crafting, housing, longevity, social hubs, interaction, etc.... The devs just arent putting it in.

     

    Thank god for this huge cluster of sandboxes coming up in the next year or two. Finaly some variety instead of the degraded style of mmo's today have become.

     

  • QuirhidQuirhid TamperePosts: 5,969Member Common
    Great thread, lb. I already see a couple "I reject the reality and substitute my own"-replies.

    I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  • BanaghranBanaghran HuisoPosts: 869Member

    Well, one must wonder about what a "mmo platform" really is, so out of context it does seem like some sham for investors.

    Anyways, the mmorpg business is not dying, we dont see blizz bankrupt or things like that, the problem is more in the area of MTV dying, you know, once MUSIC television, now there is more rality shows there than music...

    Flame on!

    :)

  • jpnzjpnz SydneyPosts: 3,529Member
    Originally posted by Onomas

    Longevity of older mmo's would last years upon years. Today you are lucky to get 1 in one hundred to last more than six months.

    I call that an issue and a bad sign. Sorry for all those that like their free to play, fast, easy, change games more than your underwear type gamers, but this is all a bad sign.

     

    But hopefuly things will look up in the near future since some game companies are finaly taking a stand against these types of games and going against the console/wow clones.

    Problem is there isnt enough variety of mmo's. Almost everyone is slapping mmo infront of their favorite 3 letters and think its going to be a hit. The games released today are just a shadow of what mmo's use to be, and the sad thing is many of you caused this and want this.

    'Bad sign' for who?

    As someone who plays games and frequently hop from one MMO to another, I am loving the playing / experience lots of different games.

    Oh, you don't like how I play video games? Tough.

    Gdemami -
    Informing people about your thoughts and impressions is not a review, it's a blog.

  • nariusseldonnariusseldon santa clara, CAPosts: 22,441Member
    Originally posted by jpnz
    Originally posted by Onomas

    Longevity of older mmo's would last years upon years. Today you are lucky to get 1 in one hundred to last more than six months.

    I call that an issue and a bad sign. Sorry for all those that like their free to play, fast, easy, change games more than your underwear type gamers, but this is all a bad sign.

     

    But hopefuly things will look up in the near future since some game companies are finaly taking a stand against these types of games and going against the console/wow clones.

    Problem is there isnt enough variety of mmo's. Almost everyone is slapping mmo infront of their favorite 3 letters and think its going to be a hit. The games released today are just a shadow of what mmo's use to be, and the sad thing is many of you caused this and want this.

    'Bad sign' for who?

    As someone who plays games and frequently hop from one MMO to another, I am loving the playing / experience lots of different games.

    Oh, you don't like how I play video games? Tough.

    LOL .. i am going to say exactly the same.

    Gaming is getting better. MMOs are much better games than in the UO days, from my viewpoint of course.

    In fact, it is pretty obvious that no one is going to change minds on forums, so people have to accept what the market preferences are.

     

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by Amaranthar
    Ok, let me ask something here.

    Since MMO's (including their examples like WoW) are played on various platforms, which they also listed as separate sources of gamers....then how is it that the totals add up to 100%? With cross references like that, the individual "platforms" they use should add up to more than the total use.

    It's bull****. And I'm damned tired of this industry's propaganda campaigns and lies.

    This industry is really in sad shape when it's resorting to this level.



    If a game is running on the PC, but it's an MMO, then it counts as an MMO.

    There's another info graphic showing the % of gamers who use a particular platform. Since gamers generally use more than one platform, on that chart the total is well over 100%.

    ** edit **
    Also, this company just puts together info graphics and information.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by Onomas
    Longevity of older mmo's would last years upon years. Today you are lucky to get 1 in one hundred to last more than six months.I call that an issue and a bad sign. Sorry for all those that like their free to play, fast, easy, change games more than your underwear type gamers, but this is all a bad sign. But hopefuly things will look up in the near future since some game companies are finaly taking a stand against these types of games and going against the console/wow clones.Problem is there isnt enough variety of mmo's. Almost everyone is slapping mmo infront of their favorite 3 letters and think its going to be a hit. The games released today are just a shadow of what mmo's use to be, and the sad thing is many of you caused this and want this.

    The MMO genre has gone from a fringe element to something large enough to be considered a gaming platform comparable to the PC itself. There may be signs that the games making billions of dollars are not to your liking, but that's not a bad sign for the industry.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by Banaghran
    Well, one must wonder about what a "mmo platform" really is, so out of context it does seem like some sham for investors.Anyways, the mmorpg business is not dying, we dont see blizz bankrupt or things like that, the problem is more in the area of MTV dying, you know, once MUSIC television, now there is more rality shows there than music...Flame on!:)

    The different platforms are explained at the bottom of the info graphic.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • XAPKenXAPKen Northwest, INPosts: 4,918Member Uncommon
    MMOs aren't dying.  What about MMORPGs?

    Ken Fisher - Semi retired old fart Network Administrator, now turned Amateur Game Developer.  I don't Forum PVP.  If you feel I've attacked you, it was probably by accident.  Realm Lords 2 on MMORPG.com
  • LawlmonsterLawlmonster Dallas, TXPosts: 953Member Uncommon

    It depends how you view the genre, and to what context. Personally, I wouldn't say that MMO's are dying, or have died, so much as they are mutating, however positive or negative that may be. My issue with MMO being used as a definition of a platform is that we already have one that does exactly the same thing: they're called online games. To use MMO strictly and literally, we're talking about a multiplayer game, played online, with a massive amount of players, and that may as well be fucking anything. By that standard, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare is an MMO, just as much as Diablo 3 or Team Fortress 2. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with these games on an individual, mechanical basis, but they don't bare any of the specific features that come to mind when thinking of MMORPG's, which is where the term originated, such as persistant worlds.

    "This is life! We suffer and slave and expire. That's it!" -Bernard Black (Dylan Moran)

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,316Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by XAPGames
    MMOs aren't dying.  What about MMORPGs?

     Well that one is pretty debatable.  Most old games did not offer any features that encouraged role playing (again UO and SWG were the exception).  Thus role playing has always been you make up your own backstory and act a certain way, and thats it.

    That hasn't changed today, most games still don't offer any features that encourage role playing so you are still limited to making up your own backstory and acting a certain way.  So from that perspective it is not dying but is status quo.

    However possibly there was a greater percentage of the MMO population that enjoyed role playing in days gone by than in today.  While the absolutely number of roleplayers may be much bigger, the percentage may be much smaller. 

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • TheLizardbonesTheLizardbones Arkham, VAPosts: 10,910Member


    Originally posted by Lawlmonster
    It depends how you view the genre, and to what context. Personally, I wouldn't say that MMO's are dying, or have died, so much as they are mutating, however positive or negative that may be. My issue with MMO being used as a definition of a platform is that we already have one that does exactly the same thing: they're called online games. To use MMO strictly and literally, we're talking about a multiplayer game, played online, with a massive amount of players, and that may as well be fucking anything. By that standard, Call of Duty: Modern Warfare is an MMO, just as much as Diablo 3 or Team Fortress 2. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with these games on an individual, mechanical basis, but they don't bare any of the specific features that come to mind when thinking of MMORPG's, which is where the term originated, such as persistant worlds.

    This is the only fly in the ointment that I can see. It seems like the industry has chosen an expanded definition of the term that is well beyond what the people who created the genre intended. There's no way to tell how much is the traditional MMO and how much is the expanded MMO.

    I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.

  • DavisFlightDavisFlight Talahasee, FLPosts: 2,556Member

    The fact that LoL and CoD are included makes all the data entirely meaningless.

    And even if we ignore that, the fact that a ton of money is being spent in the genre doesn't change the fact that the quality is rock bottom.

  • VengeSunsoarVengeSunsoar Posts: 5,316Member Uncommon

    Good thing, "the fact that the quality is rock bottom" is not factual.

    I think the quality is better than ever.

    Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  • WizardryWizardry Ontario, CanadaPosts: 8,444Member Uncommon

    That is such a lopsided number that represents really NOTHING.You could have 5 million people register for a facebook game ,but only 1k active users,the rest saw how crap the game is and quit altogether.Then some marketing firm or media outlet adds all those millions of registered users and counts them as gamers.If i try 150 different games,are you going to take all those 150 registrations as being 150 gamers?

    The actual monetary values are  just guessing,no different than TV ratings,just a bunch of guessing.

    For example ,marketing and developers tried to push browser or app game because Farmville struck it rich.That game is a super cheap pile of crap and what they DON'T tell you is that the majority of devs getting int othe same markets are losing money,they are not striking it rich.

    Of course the MMO market will never die,it carries the same economics as real life.If an industry becoems saturated,eventually the market is so competitive,too many lose theri shiort and fold up shop.This eventually brings the market back to where there is only a viable amount of developers competing for those dollars.The whole cycle will repeat itself over and over.


    Samoan Diamond

  • TjedTjed Baltimore, MDPosts: 162Member

    This is pretty cool news.  I'm in the camp that would love to have a game that is more like older games.  Give me EQ1 with updated graphics and I'm happy.  

    This doesn't mean that I'm going to bash all the new games that come out that are much different than what I like.  Actually I see this as a great opportunity for someone to make a game that I would like.  Just one, that's all I want.  If the genre is thriving that means that there is room for one.

  • ezpz77ezpz77 Beale, CAPosts: 227Member
    Realistic logical thinking people know this. The only people who truly believe the genre is dying or "devolving" or anything like that are over-emotional, angsty, burned out vets. MMORPG.com just happens ot have an extmrely high ratio of burned out vets to regular old MMO players. And boy, those burned out vets are noisy as hell. They're basically MMO hipsters, and we all know hipsters suck.
  • apocolusterapocoluster newport news, VAPosts: 1,321Member Uncommon
      I didnt bother to look at the chart. Its pointless for this here forum.  Peeps gonna argue how they "feel" anywasy.  Only three pages in and we already seeing the : nuh uh, yah huh  arguements appear.  Its like we never left pre-school.

    No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  • TjedTjed Baltimore, MDPosts: 162Member
    Originally posted by ezpz77
    Realistic logical thinking people know this. The only people who truly believe the genre is dying or "devolving" or anything like that are over-emotional, angsty, burned out vets. MMORPG.com just happens ot have an extmrely high ratio of burned out vets to regular old MMO players. And boy, those burned out vets are noisy as hell. They're basically MMO hipsters, and we all know hipsters suck.

    It's all perspective.  I tend to view the instant gratification crowd as the hipsters.  The vets have aptly been described as the "get off my lawn" crowd.  Well, that's who I want to get off my lawn, the LFD LFR, hipsters.  Those who say things like, "Cool story bro."  and facetiously ask if I am mad while once again refering to me as a sibling knowing that we are not of relation.  You know?  Hipsters.

    Now off of my lawn I'm going to go die in an MMORPG and then not allow myself to res until I can get a naked lvl 1 alt back to my corpse!  (with help from my friends of course)

     

  • MumboJumboMumboJumbo LondonPosts: 3,221Member
    Originally posted by Tjed
    Originally posted by ezpz77
    Realistic logical thinking people know this. The only people who truly believe the genre is dying or "devolving" or anything like that are over-emotional, angsty, burned out vets. MMORPG.com just happens ot have an extmrely high ratio of burned out vets to regular old MMO players. And boy, those burned out vets are noisy as hell. They're basically MMO hipsters, and we all know hipsters suck.

    It's all perspective.  I tend to view the instant gratification crowd as the hipsters.  The vets have aptly been described as the "get off my lawn" crowd.  Well, that's who I want to get off my lawn, the LFD LFR, hipsters.  Those who say things like, "Cool story bro."  and facetiously ask if I am mad while once again refering to me as a sibling knowing that we are not of relation.  You know?  Hipsters.

    Now off of my lawn I'm going to go die in an MMORPG and then not allow myself to res until I can get a naked lvl 1 alt back to my corpse!  (with help from my friends of course)

    rofl! I think there is room enough for both "quick fix" and "how far does the rabbit hole go?" types of mmorpgs, especially looking at the size of all those stats.image

  • TjedTjed Baltimore, MDPosts: 162Member
    Originally posted by MumboJumbo
    Originally posted by Tjed
    Originally posted by ezpz77
    Realistic logical thinking people know this. The only people who truly believe the genre is dying or "devolving" or anything like that are over-emotional, angsty, burned out vets. MMORPG.com just happens ot have an extmrely high ratio of burned out vets to regular old MMO players. And boy, those burned out vets are noisy as hell. They're basically MMO hipsters, and we all know hipsters suck.

    It's all perspective.  I tend to view the instant gratification crowd as the hipsters.  The vets have aptly been described as the "get off my lawn" crowd.  Well, that's who I want to get off my lawn, the LFD LFR, hipsters.  Those who say things like, "Cool story bro."  and facetiously ask if I am mad while once again refering to me as a sibling knowing that we are not of relation.  You know?  Hipsters.

    Now off of my lawn I'm going to go die in an MMORPG and then not allow myself to res until I can get a naked lvl 1 alt back to my corpse!  (with help from my friends of course)

    rofl! I think there is room enough for both "quick fix" and "how far does the rabbit hole go?" types of mmorpgs, especially looking at the size of all those stats.image

    I agree.  I was mostly just joking with my previous reply.  I try to be a glass half full kind of guy.  The fact that the market is doing well while I am not content with any of the current titles, could be viewed as a bad thing.  I prefer to view the implied profitability as a means to provide even more choices in the future.  Hopefuly one that I can sink my teeth into. 

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