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New Player: Race Questions
WargRider2
Member UncommonPosts: 12
Hey there MMORPG EVE Community, I am planning on subbing to this game, and I am having some difficulty choosing the right faction. Honestly, I _love_ the Ammar empire, their lore just sounds badass to me and I think their ship design is amazing.... HOWEVER even with this new "hml" nerf or w.e it is called, a lot of people speculate that missiles are still the DPS dealers. In most fantasy games, I prefer the DPS dealers and also a good amount of survivability.
Now I know that when you choose a race , you can still fly the other guy's ships, however what is most detrimental to me in MMOs is when I see a lack of players in an area. I hear the Caldari (my second choice) are vastly more popular, so if this is true would it be true that I would see more caldari players in Cal. Empire space rather than Ammar empire space? I plan to pick up the game during trial (to get the extra free days) so I cannot really playtest that theory. So would there be any suggestions on how to do this, because some time down the line I do want to be a viable PVP pilot in New Eden!
Thanks!
Comments
All damage types/methods are viable. Don't listen to the whiners and their cries of OMGNERF!!! Amarr can dish it out just fine too. And some will argue that Caldari are the worst at PVP and you should just roll Winmatar. Again, ignore em.
As far as population in Caldari High Sec vs Amarr, yes, Caldari is much more populated. That said, any mission/market/mining hub in any area of space is busy. There's also no reason you can't roll Amarr and then fly over to Caldari space and setup shop.
The 2 week free trial is plenty of time to roll up a char from each race and poke around initially. And hell, if it isn't enough time... use a differenet email address and start another trial! That said, you hit the nail on the head when you mentioned being able to fly the other guys ships. Doesn't matter where and who you start as. Anyone can fly and fit anything once they've trained the correct skills thus, beyond lore/RP/ and starting area, initial character race matters very little.
GL HF Fly Safe - join a corp as soon as you leave trial (most won't take trial accounts)
o7
It doesn't matter what you start as.
Other than its easier to fly that type of ship for a while.
Honestly, il give you the truth. Everyone does just fine, you'll never be like aww man i got nothing. I would avoid Gal atm, everything is shooting drones over ships because of a "bug" (that may not be fixed for months) G are some of the better mission going ships for low skill , normally but thast becuase they ahve a ton of drone boats , which atm would not be helpful to you.
PVP Small scale : doesn't matter always something viable. What think Gal is the weakest here .
PVP large scale : if anything Cal weak . Missle just do not do great in large fleet battles (its the delayed damage, however, i think some of this might have just changes with faster missles i forget). Min prob the best ammar have some boons.
PVE - anything works. Best are really expensive and really not all that important to you.
Starting out Cal and Min easily shine, they have some the easiet and strongest pve all the way up to battleships. Then i would say Cal have the best cheap pve battleships. But when you move into the really expensive ships and played for like 2-3 years its all gun and drone ships. rattlesnake with missle and drones is an exception. (however what i think is and will continue to be the best solo pve ship is part CAl and part amarr, using turrents however).
Cal is tempting in pve statrting out in that it is the easist, high dps and better tank and less time and money is needed. Its freaking amazing for new players. But missles are largely a Cal thing (i know there are tones of ships that use them w/e). A few Min ships etc. (for the most part you can find somethign better to use than missle on these ships). In this way when you train all the gunnery skills you can easily switch between Min, Gal, and Amarr (or more easily) Picking Cal means you may not want to switch but if you do it will take more time to train up those basic skills. (however cheap/fast when comapred to ship skills themselves).
Go Min.. they call it Winmatar for a reason, they do everything and are super fast to boot. (only downfall is they progress slower [require more skill training as you will be using drones and gun and shield or armor, or missles] ) They do everything which is fun.
Just a quick note, Don't feel to pigeon holed like i said you can do anythign and be fine. Such as Im cal and i want to gun what now? Well train some gunnery skills and buya rokh , there you have a turret Battleship now (is it the best ever ever, no its it good enough that it doesn't matter yes). Same goes for every faction.
Restated
Caldari are great for easy of play, tank, and generaly play. They kinda keep you playing them with the lack of gunnery skills, which is ok because they are kinda op for starting players.
Minmatar just win. Take a bit longer in training requirements, but overall do everything well.
Gal are great pve and pvp drone boats, but with the current pve AI i would say not a good time to start with these. (some people might sa hey they are gun boats also, yes but their str for new players is their large drone bays allowing for very high dps with cheap equipment).
Amarr seem weak off the bat (imho) they are fine however, and their ammo is lens for their lasers which means switching damage types in missiosn is easier as they take up less room.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Amarr is a very fine and valid choice, your right that their ships look awesome too. If you like them conceptually, fly them.
Also i get what you mean population wise, i too hate it when i find no players around me in other games. That being said, there are still alot of players in amarr space. Caldari space ... well crowded is putting it mildly. Personally i don't need hundreds of people spamming local chat in my system(jita usually has well over 1k people). 10-50 is fine, you'll have people to talk too and the chat is flowing at a pace that you can actually follow.
The hubs in amarr, well i havn't been there in a long time but it should be around 200 people give or take a hundred. Trust me this is sufficent for socialization, people go to caldari space for shopping, not because they get lonely at home.
Weapon system wise Amarr is perfect for a new player, they cover Lasers, HAMs(heavy assault missiles, i.e. those that didn't just get nerfed) and drones.
There were over 700 people in Amarr when I went shopping a few hours ago.
-k
Just saying that you want to deal DPS doesn’t really tell me anything. Eventually you can fly any ship from any faction or use any weapon with enough training time so starting faction loses a lot of its importance. However, when starting a new character it does impact how quickly you can get into the job you want. For example, if you want to learn ewar and do mission running fly Caldari or if you want to tackle in PVP, get into small gang action or do some exploration on the side fly Gallente. What is it you want to do with your EVE life OP?
As you correctly say there is no penalty for cross training. Your starting character choice should be entirely based on aesthetics and RP.
In fact once you get trained up to Battlecruiser level, I would encourage you to consider cross-training, it opens up so many options. You can be very viable indeed as a small & medium ship specialist. That's where all the fun is IMO.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Keep in mind there was just a big balance patch very recently among the T1 sub Battlecruiser ships, i.e. the kinds of ships you will fly. Many information you will find will be "outdated" in regards to this.
As to your choice between EWAR and juggernaut i would advise you to go with the latter at first. Reason being it will help you in PvP aswell as PvE(earning money, missions exploration etc). Its a bit of a foundation builder really, for example by aiming for Assault Frigates first you would be forced to learn alot of really important skills due to their prerequisites, skills that might look boring but are really extremely important(engineering and electronics for example, 5% PG and CPU per level respectively). 5% might not sound like a lot to a new player, but it will be the difference on being able to fit a ship like you want and being 9 PG or cpu short and having to do unspeakable compromises.
That being said take a look at the certificates that are suggested for the ships, it will help you choose your skills.
Assault Frigates <-- Frigate sized Juggernauts, T2 but quick to learn. If you have good skills for them all you need to do is "scale up" your gun and ship skills.
EWAR Frigates <-- Again T2, if your good with them, all you need to do is scale up ship skills(i.e. train cruisers to be able to fly cruiser sized ewar ships)
Ofc you can also just train Battlecruisers, and that will work, however they are very much a blunt tool. Lacking finesse if you so will. Also you will be at the lower end of the foodchain with them early on. T2 frigates, especially AFs, have a good chance to avoid fights they can't win. Also frigates are more fun, and they pack a hell of a punch. Just to put things into perspective i was using AFs for ratting in 0.0 when they came out. They can very easily deal even with a bunch of BS sized NPCs while using a pvp fit. Also you won't have to worry much about camps in lowsec and stuff, few have the means to lock, catch and kill MWDing frigs.
few points
amarr lore should make you feel sick (read more thay are kid lovers and reliogous zeelots)
the dmg
Caldari
For missions and some anoms/plexing can't beat them they can omni tank sleepers and run lvl 4's and 7/10-9/10's
w/o much issues
Perks:they can do all damage types in the game
con:ranges and explosion radius I.E. Hitting little targets with bigger missiles can be an issue
pvp:dont bother unless using ECM ships or tacklers some of the frigs and a few of the other ships are pvp worthy but fall short most times compared to other races of the same ship class
Amarr
Solid armor tank great DPS WHEN they hit (I say this cause they do hit like a bus BUT they dont hit as offten)
con:ships look like golden dild0's
pve:not the greatest can be done with limited dmg types
pvp: some nasty ships. best armor logi
Min
Best instant dmg in the game really with the right tracking skills and t2 guns you can put steady dmg down pve or pvp
PVE: cycle times on the arty's can be a major bore to say the lest and tracking issues in missions can leave you at the bane of your drones pending your fit has them (some loki fits dont use drones in most cases they are autocannon fit which makes then kinda pointless anyhow) limited dmg types
PVP: great dmg dealers good for shiled and some armor fits. Best shield logi
Gallent
Well they can armor tank and they are the drone bunnies of new eden
PVE: easy mode with solid tank Launch drones walk away (dont do that in 0.0 ) agian limited dmg types
PVP: very good utility ships
At the end of the day it really depends on what you as a player plan on doing.
Thats outdated info. Drones get killed quickly by all rats nowadays. Amarr has the best trackign of all long range systems(beam laser) and their pulse laser still track very good at the ranges they tend to be used at.
Also ALL races can run lvl 4 missions, and many do it better than caldari. The days CNRs ruled the sky are sadly long over. Minmatar i feel do extremely well at the cruiser/BC tier(t2 especially), but suffer a bit at the BS end. 1400mm arties really can hardly be used for anything but fleetfights, and only the Vargur has a falloff bonus at BS tier which kinda hurts AC use until you can fly that one.
Gallente suffer from low range on blasters and excessive range on rails. They don't really have a weapon system for those 20-40km fights that tend to happen alot in pvp gangs and pve alike. Drone nerf does the rest imho.
Amarr pulse lasers have perfect range(with scorch), and can almost instantly switch ammo to shortrange high damage ammo if need be. Damage type is a issue, thats true. But in PvE its easy to pick your agents/region in a way you fight people weak to therman/em, and in PvP it doesn't matter since everyone is running omnitanks anyway.
But as stated before you can Amarr character but fly min ships or w/e It doesn't take long for the first ship skills anyway.
As stated before Everythign is viable pvp and pve. Don't limit yourself to flyighn only your race. However, when startign its good to rush to cruiser and battlecruiser. Avoid assultships and destroyer. Everyone is always liek skilsl to fly this and that w/e You get in a cruiser asap and lvl 1 missions are cake reguardless of your skills (with lvl 2 doable). this simple. get in a BC and lvl2 are cake reguardless and lvl 3 are easy enough.
Also whern train the first 2 (TWO) lvls of a skill is super fast to learn, as a new character do not try to train skills to 4 unless 100% needed. 2-3 and stop move up to bigger ships fill-in the skills that benefit you the most.
Cross training doesn't work well with caldari and switching from armor and shield tanking. (you can do it but its entire different set of skills generally). This makes picking caldari problematic to fly (as missle are required). As of right now i urge new players to be w/e race they want but attempt to fly Gal or Min, as they do everything, with ease (Note i am Amarr and Cal.. guess i like it rough) . PS you make your own standing in this game, its not like you are on any races's side becuase you are a specific race. Despite this all races are very viable.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Give me liberty or give me lasers
Pick whichever you like the story or name of I'd say.
My personal choice was Minmatar. This was when I thought having my highest stat in Charisma was a very good thing and was long before the ability to reallocate stats. However, no matter which race you are, there is something to be said for Minmatar ships. People say they are wrecks capable of flight, or held together just barely by duct tape and rust. It is then exceptionally satisfying to best their 'shiny' ships in PVP with one they had referred to as a junkheap.
Heh Minmatar hasn't been the "hard mode" race since they big Projectiles/TE buff in 2010
I do like arty ships though. I was a bit :sadface: when rail Nagas took over from arty Tornados as the doctrine tier 3 of choice.
But Nagas look so damb cool that I wasn't sad for long.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
You can rail fit a Talos to 80 km as well and you don't run in to the PG issues I seem to have with Naga. I like the Naga, I like the shield tank but that base PG is murder when standing it up along side the other Tier 3 battle cruisers.
Back to the OP. Race really doesn't matter. You won't see the greater game of EVE in a new player corp and will want to be in a player one. There, race won't be something you notice. If you do seem determined to stay in new player corp and just keep it low intensity, cycle your creation in Gallente until you get Center for Advanced Studies (CAS for short) or go Caldari State War Academy using the same method. CAS and SWA in that order are the busiest new player corps.
Just one quick tip. If you plan to buy/sell for the (mostly) best price, be aware that Minmatarr starter systems are 28 jumps away from Jita in "safest" mode, and in "fastest" mode (13 jumps) you will traverse some of the most camped lowsec gates in the universe.
Also, the trade hub in Amarr is second only to Jita & provides some interesting milk runs, plus rats in Amarrian space usually drop interesting salvage, and Amarrian space is the only place where you can find Kernite mineral in hisec.
You don't need to be Amarr to take avantage of the above, but I would not leave a noob alone stranded in minmatarr space unless I held a grudge on him...
Give me liberty or give me lasers
lol , EVe-Online goes beyond DPS / Survivability , X's and O's. Yea sure you can PVE on your own and all , but in PvP all that goes out the window. PvP goes down on heavy planning and playing your cards right. Unlike traditional MMO"RPG" where 99% of the time the battle is already decided on which ever team has the best gear overall and numbers. In EVE-Online , the old saying "It ain't over till the fat lady sings" is 100% accurate. 8 men fleet owning 30+ men fleets. EVE-Online goes beyond conventional MMORPG playing style , and why not many likes it , and why those who do enjoy it , REALLY enjoys it. EVE-Online keeps idiots and cry babies out, since the game is a "Free for all" mentality. Anything goes. People say EVE sucks because of the leveling system , noobs can never catch up to veterans and cry cry cry. That's so full of crap , join the right clan / corporation and I promise within 2 months of learning the in's and out's of PvP , you'll be feeling like a pro in no time while making a difference. EVE-Online is probably the only game that I know of where clans give out a LOAD of money to new members every day to help them enjoy the game better and all. Let's say you go on a PvP roam with 5-6 clan members , you lose your ship , they will replace it free of charge , hell they even PAY you to go PvP!! EVE-Online is the game of the decade , just that peoples IQ aren't high enough to grasp the full awesomness of this amazing sci-fi MMO. Instead they hop to MMORPG to MMORPG that looks the same , TSW , play 2 weeks , hops to SWTOR , play 2 weeks , hops to GW2 , play 2 weeks , hops to PS2 , play 2 weeks , hops back to WoW , it's a sad and unfortunate reality.
I chose Amarr for the nice ship design and I'm getting my sexy new cruiser tonight for missions so don't regret that choice.
For trade, from the starter system it is around 3-4 jumps to Amarr and a lot lot more to Jita (around 15 jumps maybe?).
I've found that Jita is the best place to sell salvaged goods but Amarr is good for buying ship components (using http://eve-central.com/ as a price guide). For big purchases like ships you'll want to track down the lowest price you can in a safe system. I saved 2 million ISK on my Omen by making a 11 jump trip out to a 0.6 system on the border of low-sec space.
The Enlightened take things Lightly
J. B.