It does sound like they are basically making FFXIV:ARR a WoW clone with a FF veneer. So be it. The WoW engine means it will be a solid game. The FF veneer means it will appeal to a lot of people. Don't underestimate the importance of a veneer: people tend to do what they do for stylistic reasons more than anything else.
Actually the veneer, (though fairly thick at first) are the WoW elements, true the UI and combat are a big permanent change, but the questing hub game play is finite, and there are a lot of classes to lvl with the armoury system, that is why leves from 1.0 and exp chains from FFXI will become more important the longer you play, until it won't feel remotely like WoW, (providing they get endgame combat right).
I can't think of anything worse than levees. What is the maximum exp chain you can get? I bet they are ultra fast and nonstop. I bet every class is just as playable for each race.
I do want to say one last thing . And this is truth and i really hope you all follow my logic with this . I really think what SE is doing is smart. People who still play WoW most from what i heard play because there is nothing better, Same with the die hard XIs. What Se is trying to do is take the things not ALL the things that make WoW , WoW and apply them for the WoW fan . Because like i said from what i hear WoW fans want something better but nothing fills the void. Maybe ARR can. Same with FF or FFXI fans (me) SE wants to bring everything in from past FFs. Golden Saucer , Crystal Tower all this is great , FF story lines are usually really great. graphics are always top notch . I am looking foward to this game V1 i did play for 10 months and after two 50s Lancer and Archer on one Chr and a 28 Lnc on another it just got old. At that time all there was , was the HNMs and the new NMs for level 30 gear. Fun at first then got old and stale. So i am hoping with this V2 i hope we can get the best of both world and come together and play something that can be great. But we have to learn to drop our basis can take off the blinders and look at something new for what it TRULY is . FFXIV:ARR will be what we all hoped it would be and both the WoW community and FF FFXI community can be happy with that. As we should be.
I can't think of anything worse than levees. What is the maximum exp chain you can get? I bet they are ultra fast and nonstop. I bet every class is just as playable for each race.
Leves are just a way to break up the grind, just as quests, only with more control over difficulty, (most pve is too easy in most mmos these days) True in 1.0 with nothing but leves it was a pain, but by the time you are more dependent on them you will be more invested (which I find takes the edge off), and they are only one of many ways to lvl now (also there will be a daily limit). No idea how many exp chains you can get, they will be harder to maintain solo due to the need to balance TP and health. Race makes no difference for class, same as 1.0.
Originally posted by DarknessReign thanks can't edit posts on cell phone
I wouldnt post using a cell here, it just gives people more things in your posts to nit pick. I would stick to the informative posts, its best not to get into the flame wars, no one comes out looking good.
"I think it would've been good if they tried seeing what happened if they turned World of Warcraft into Final Fantasy. So, because they tried only to make something that was 'different from FFXI,' they ended up with not much of anything.
"They should have said, 'Hey you, go play WoW for a year [for inspiration].'
It is very publicly known that the producer is borrowing heavily from World of Warcraft, as he feels that is the direction the game should have gone in the first instance.
Yep. Yoshi-P's been quite open about that from the beginning, that WoW was a major influence on the direction he was taking 2.0/ARR.
Somehow when you point that out, give examples of the things we now know will be very much taken from WoW and its derivatives - based on Yoshi-P's remarks, screenshots and official Alpha vids - and then dare say you aren't happy about it... people like the OP get all bent out of shape over it. They post threads trying to challenge people on it. As though folks have to defend and justify their opinions to the OP's satisfaction in order for them to be considered "valid".
Incidentally, when someone calls a MMO a WoW clone, what they mean is very simply that it's a game that is designed from a similar "template" that WoW established due to its popularity. Calling it a WoW clone is not necessarily a negative if you enjoy WoW and other games with similar designs/gameplay mechanics. WoW did borrow from MMOs to come before it, but it borrowed those features and systems and then implemented them in a very specific way, which has become the "definition" of WoW-like gameplay.
Here's some reasons people will or have had a negative feeling about a game being a WoW clone...
1. "Been there, done that". That formula has been copied time and again. Even for people who enjoyed Blizzard's take on the MMORPG, they'd like to see something different. They'd like to see someone bring fresh ideas to the genre. To take what's come before and put some new and interesting twist on it, like Blizzard took ideas from its predecessors and put its own twist on them.
2. They didn't like the WoW format to begin with, and are waiting for someone to try/do somethign different.
3. They don't like the overly helpful, hand-holding and extremely linear nature of the questing and content progression in WoW and its derivatives. They'd like to see something different, more open and less guided.
In short... people have simply had 8 years of MMOs built around the same systems, with the same kind of gameplay, the same overall feel and setups, just wrapped in different styled graphics (and in some cases, even the graphics are made to look as WoW-like as possible) and with one or two "gimmicks" that make the game seem a little different at first... but only for a short while until those gimmicks lose their novelty and people realize what they're left with is another WoW clone.
It's like when something like 3D in movies came back to the forefront. Suddenly, everyone and their uncle was putting out a movie in 3D. Some people love it and could watch them all day. Others thought they were kinda cool at first, but then it got to be a bit much and they're ready to move on. Yet others never liked it in the first place, felt it was a gimmick to distract people from the fact that the movie industry is pretty much creatively bankrupt, and can't wait 'til the fad is over.
The better question, for people like the OP is, why do you care what others think? If others don't like the WoW model of MMO development and would like something different, and speak out about it... why do you care? Why do people have to explain and justify themselves to you? They're entitled to not like it every bit as much as you're entitled to like it.
People have different views, opinions and preferences... how about you let people express theirs, just as you express yours without the "20 questions" BS? Not sure who you think you are, exactly.. but no one owes you an explanation or justification for what they think.
You could do what normal, mature and reasonable people do: accept that they have an opinion different from yours, respect their right to have one, and move on.
it was 10 questions not 20 let's get facts straight. And this post wad ment to be a BS post from the start. Mainly do to the haters hating on a Alpha . Some not all but some come in with zero productive things to say. If you don't like final fantasy or this mmo then why even waste time degrading it? I am sure 90% of the people who come here on this site in these forums do so to talk about the subject final fantasy xiv a realm reborn. not its a garbage game don't try it . even this post witch is a garbage post when you look at all my real informative posts had a goal and it succeed in showing the people who really care about the game and want genuine information to the posters that don't. I ask the people who posted on this ridiculous topic and kept it going what have you offered that is a positive to the main topic at hand final fantasy xiv a realm reborn ? I don't mind negatives but only when there is validity . Not BS like WoW clone it will suck don't play . Won't last its just like WoW. And the info YOU leave out in regards to Yoshi-P and WoW he also said he had the team play OTHER mmos to gain inspiration NOT JUST WoW. It is sad when in today's world people only present half truths and justify them as whole truths. People may not like V2 because it is like WoW ok so what. V1 did not really start out like WoW and people hated it. Now its changed for the better I think and most of these same people hate it. Blame the community for that. Yoshi built almost 1/2 the game off community criticisms from V1 . So there is no pleasing anyone it seems. But I like most hear will play it and will enjoy it or at least give it the benefit if the doubt and try it. Before I cast total judgment on it.
Originally posted by DarknessReign it was 10 questions not 20 let's get facts straight. And this post wad ment to be a BS post from the start. Mainly do to the haters hating on a Alpha . Some not all but some come in with zero productive things to say. If you don't like final fantasy or this mmo then why even waste time degrading it? I am sure 90% of the people who come here on this site in these forums do so to talk about the subject final fantasy xiv a realm reborn. not its a garbage game don't try it . even this post witch is a garbage post when you look at all my real informative posts had a goal and it succeed in showing the people who really care about the game and want genuine information to the posters that don't. I ask the people who posted on this ridiculous topic and kept it going what have you offered that is a positive to the main topic at hand final fantasy xiv a realm reborn ? I don't mind negatives but only when there is validity . Not BS like WoW clone it will suck don't play . Won't last its just like WoW. And the info YOU leave out in regards to Yoshi-P and WoW he also said he had the team play OTHER mmos to gain inspiration NOT JUST WoW. It is sad when in today's world people only present half truths and justify them as whole truths. People may not like V2 because it is like WoW ok so what. V1 did not really start out like WoW and people hated it. Now its changed for the better I think and most of these same people hate it. Blame the community for that. Yoshi built almost 1/2 the game off community criticisms from V1 . So there is no pleasing anyone it seems. But I like most hear will play it and will enjoy it or at least give it the benefit if the doubt and try it. Before I cast total judgment on it.
So you admit to making a shitpost, continue to post for like eight pages mainly being comabitve and baiting, and now you complain about the quality and content of other peoples posts. What were you expecting? You post like a goatfucking jerk and then get uppity about it when your topics get derailed, trolled, flamed, etc.
Despite your shittiness as a poster and the claim that there was no positive discussion in this thread, there was a good bit of productive discussion.
yes I succeed in baiting the WoW trolls . And enjoyed there class and relentless put downs directed to me witch like in reality I don't back away from . Think about it for a moment all my posts except this one are informative. The information thread , the new music thread I posted today , contrasts between V1 and V1 from zones. Then I make this post right after the top 2 posts were It's like WoW /sadface and I won't play this. So this post did its job . I am shocked MMORPG let it go as long as it has to be honest
Comments
I can't think of anything worse than levees. What is the maximum exp chain you can get? I bet they are ultra fast and nonstop. I bet every class is just as playable for each race.
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link
Leves are just a way to break up the grind, just as quests, only with more control over difficulty, (most pve is too easy in most mmos these days) True in 1.0 with nothing but leves it was a pain, but by the time you are more dependent on them you will be more invested (which I find takes the edge off), and they are only one of many ways to lvl now (also there will be a daily limit). No idea how many exp chains you can get, they will be harder to maintain solo due to the need to balance TP and health. Race makes no difference for class, same as 1.0.
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link
I wouldnt post using a cell here, it just gives people more things in your posts to nit pick. I would stick to the informative posts, its best not to get into the flame wars, no one comes out looking good.
Yep. Yoshi-P's been quite open about that from the beginning, that WoW was a major influence on the direction he was taking 2.0/ARR.
Somehow when you point that out, give examples of the things we now know will be very much taken from WoW and its derivatives - based on Yoshi-P's remarks, screenshots and official Alpha vids - and then dare say you aren't happy about it... people like the OP get all bent out of shape over it. They post threads trying to challenge people on it. As though folks have to defend and justify their opinions to the OP's satisfaction in order for them to be considered "valid".
Incidentally, when someone calls a MMO a WoW clone, what they mean is very simply that it's a game that is designed from a similar "template" that WoW established due to its popularity. Calling it a WoW clone is not necessarily a negative if you enjoy WoW and other games with similar designs/gameplay mechanics. WoW did borrow from MMOs to come before it, but it borrowed those features and systems and then implemented them in a very specific way, which has become the "definition" of WoW-like gameplay.
Here's some reasons people will or have had a negative feeling about a game being a WoW clone...
1. "Been there, done that". That formula has been copied time and again. Even for people who enjoyed Blizzard's take on the MMORPG, they'd like to see something different. They'd like to see someone bring fresh ideas to the genre. To take what's come before and put some new and interesting twist on it, like Blizzard took ideas from its predecessors and put its own twist on them.
2. They didn't like the WoW format to begin with, and are waiting for someone to try/do somethign different.
3. They don't like the overly helpful, hand-holding and extremely linear nature of the questing and content progression in WoW and its derivatives. They'd like to see something different, more open and less guided.
In short... people have simply had 8 years of MMOs built around the same systems, with the same kind of gameplay, the same overall feel and setups, just wrapped in different styled graphics (and in some cases, even the graphics are made to look as WoW-like as possible) and with one or two "gimmicks" that make the game seem a little different at first... but only for a short while until those gimmicks lose their novelty and people realize what they're left with is another WoW clone.
It's like when something like 3D in movies came back to the forefront. Suddenly, everyone and their uncle was putting out a movie in 3D. Some people love it and could watch them all day. Others thought they were kinda cool at first, but then it got to be a bit much and they're ready to move on. Yet others never liked it in the first place, felt it was a gimmick to distract people from the fact that the movie industry is pretty much creatively bankrupt, and can't wait 'til the fad is over.
The better question, for people like the OP is, why do you care what others think? If others don't like the WoW model of MMO development and would like something different, and speak out about it... why do you care? Why do people have to explain and justify themselves to you? They're entitled to not like it every bit as much as you're entitled to like it.
People have different views, opinions and preferences... how about you let people express theirs, just as you express yours without the "20 questions" BS? Not sure who you think you are, exactly.. but no one owes you an explanation or justification for what they think.
You could do what normal, mature and reasonable people do: accept that they have an opinion different from yours, respect their right to have one, and move on.
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link
So you admit to making a shitpost, continue to post for like eight pages mainly being comabitve and baiting, and now you complain about the quality and content of other peoples posts. What were you expecting? You post like a goatfucking jerk and then get uppity about it when your topics get derailed, trolled, flamed, etc.
Despite your shittiness as a poster and the claim that there was no positive discussion in this thread, there was a good bit of productive discussion.
http://absoluteretribution.enjin.com/ Guild Website and Recruitment link