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Ncsoft : Massive layoffs and offices undergoing 'realignment'

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  • HighMarshalHighMarshal Huntsville, ALPosts: 288Member Uncommon

    If you look at their past history, NCSoft is good at shutting down games here in the west. They have shut down around 6 so far and at lest three IMO did not need shutting down.

    They did it because the wanted to, not because they had to. They did it because they don't care about their western customers.

    NCSoft is dead to me.

    Soon they will be dead to everyone else.

    Then they will be just dead.

  • FromHellFromHell NY, NYPosts: 1,311Member
    Originally posted by clumsytoes44
    Somehow this really does not surprise me.

    ^

    QFT

    GW2 is not performing too well with - well, zero monthly subs.

    And the cost for ads must have been horrendous.

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  • LazzaroLazzaro chicago, ILPosts: 500Member Uncommon

    How does that work with A.net and Carbine Studios? Are they Subsidiary of NcSoft?

  • evolver1972evolver1972 Port Orchard, WAPosts: 1,118Member
    Originally posted by korvass

    Isn't NCSoft 'simply' the publisher of GW2? As far as I've seen from videos and interviews, the game is developed entirely by ArenaNet in their own offices.

    Given the evidence that I can see with my own eyes, there's nothing that says GW2 is underperforming.

    Stop using facts on this site!  Can't you see that GW2 is failing because some people want to believe it's failing?  Besides, everyone knows it's a superficial game with no endgame and an endless gear stats grind.  It's the lamest game ever and NCSoft's restructuring is just proof of that.  You know, because GW2 is the only game NCSoft is involved with.....

    image

    You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???

    Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!

  • MaggonMaggon CopenhagenPosts: 300Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Terranah

    Well, I'd be surprised if GW2 fails anytime soon.  It's a good game for $50.  But then again, I have not bought a single thing off of their store.  Nothing interests me.  What would interest me?  How about purchasing functionality.  Examples...

     

    1) Housing

    2) More armor skins

    3) Sell appearance tabs

    4) Sell the ability to change your character appearance.  The current system is bla.  I suggest it would be an optional functionality you could add to your house.  A mirror in your bedroom that would allow you to change your appearance any time.  Charge $15, only good for the character you purchase it for.

    5) The ability to send items coins to other toons.

    6)  The ability for level 80 characters to transfer experience to alts.

    7) Hair packs. 

    8) Face Packs

    9) Emote packs.

     

    Bla bla bla.  These are just a few ideas.  Charge $15 for each one.  Housing opens the door to a lot of things, like furniture, decorations.  Honestly, I have more creative ideas in my toe nails than their entire store team. 

    You might want to take a look here then ;o https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/makeovers-and-more-in-the-gem-store-now/

  • evolver1972evolver1972 Port Orchard, WAPosts: 1,118Member
    Originally posted by thetimes
    Originally posted by korvass

    Isn't NCSoft 'simply' the publisher of GW2? As far as I've seen from videos and interviews, the game is developed entirely by ArenaNet in their own offices.

    Given the evidence that I can see with my own eyes, there's nothing that says GW2 is underperforming.

    NCsoft is the owner and publisher of GW2. NCsoft west is Areanet. NCwest is the office to be "realigned."

    While NCSoft owns ArenaNet, NCWest is not ArenaNet, though ArenaNet may be a part of NCWest; I'm not sure about that.  ArenaNet's offices are located in Bellevue, NCWest is in Seattle.  Two totally different cities.

     

    Since GW2 is one of NCSoft's biggest money makers, I doubt there will be much "realignment" when it comes to ArenaNet.  This is more likely trimming the fat after shutting down CoH and selling Aion.

    image

    You want me to pay to play a game I already paid for???

    Be afraid.....The dragons are HERE!

  • botrytisbotrytis In Flux, MIPosts: 2,567Member
    Originally posted by FromHell
    Originally posted by clumsytoes44
    Somehow this really does not surprise me.

    ^

    QFT

    GW2 is not performing too well with - well, zero monthly subs.

    And the cost for ads must have been horrendous.

    Where is the data that GW2 is not performing well or is it your own bias? So far, GW2 looks like it is doing fine. Also, A.Net is the devloper and NCSoft is the publisher - 2 different things. Aion is developed and published by NCSoft - there is your difference.

     

    So you are saying that if they had a monthly sub for GW2, NCSoft would be doing well? A very niave and narrow opinion - GW1 is still going and it has no sub.

    image

    "In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
    by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

  • OnomicOnomic TønsbergPosts: 196Member

    Thank god, it was a long time overdue to realignment those offices, i cant say one good thing about ncwest and im truly glad ncsoft have cut that cord.

  • YaevinduskYaevindusk Ul''dah, CAPosts: 1,537Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dragim

    I don't see how GW2 is underperforming.

    Granted, I haven't been playing it lately because of planetside 2, but that aside, the events (holiday or no) generate so much cash.

    In my guild, there were people dropping hundreds of dollars on the cash shop in order to try to get one of the rare "item graphics" for their weapons.  --I wouldn't do it, but to each their own.

    They have had at least 2 events now with special skins and players have dropped enormous amounts of money attempting to get them.

    Granted, these 6+ guildies could be the only ones doing so, but I have a sneaky suspicion that many others do as well.

    I just don't see how GW2 is under-performing, but perhaps I am just missing something, which very well may be.

     

    Guild Wars 2 is the hottest selling game for the Holidays according to various friends of mine that work in retail.  They can't keep the game, nor the gem cards in stock.  Blade N Soul is also doing really well, and it's only been released in very limited locations at the moment.  The recent interview with Colin actually matched with this claim (even if it was mainly just a normal marketing gig, it's still the only plausible evidence we have with regards to ANet), and we still have Wintersday, plus the events scheduled in January and Feb.   I'd say that the least amount of gems bought by friends of mine is about $20 worth (with some even going over 100, and one bragging he spent $500); we're talking at least 100 people who claimed to have bought stuff from the nearly full guilds I'm in (or friends from other MMOs who casually play it like myself).  

    Though as a whole, people who like things want to prove it's great, and those who hate it want it destroyed.  I'm not sure why one would want something someone else enjoys to downhill, but I guess it's just gamer's nature to want to cause pain to others and revel in it.

    NCsoft used to be one of the biggest MMO companies in the world, but have been losing a lot of their thunder.  It's only natural that they downsize a bit now that they're second, or even third in the line, and just focus on their big money makers in the future:  Guild Wars 2, Blade N Soul, and Wildstar.

    Edit: Typo

    When faced with strife or discontent, the true nature of a man is brought forth. It is then when we see the character of the individual. It is then we are able to tell if he is mature enough to grin and bare it, or subject his fellow man to his complaints and woes.

  • TalulaRoseTalulaRose Long Island, NYPosts: 480Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Dragim

    I don't see how GW2 is underperforming.

    Granted, I haven't been playing it lately because of planetside 2, but that aside, the events (holiday or no) generate so much cash.

    In my guild, there were people dropping hundreds of dollars on the cash shop in order to try to get one of the rare "item graphics" for their weapons.  --I wouldn't do it, but to each their own.

    They have had at least 2 events now with special skins and players have dropped enormous amounts of money attempting to get them.

    Granted, these 6+ guildies could be the only ones doing so, but I have a sneaky suspicion that many others do as well.

    I just don't see how GW2 is under-performing, but perhaps I am just missing something, which very well may be.

    Lets see.

     

    NCSoft has to pay monthly for staff (salaries, benefits, overhead for the equipment they use, office space, servers,  etc.)

    GW2 = one time purchase.....no money coming in monthly

    A poll on this site showed that 70% of the people didn't spend money in the cash shop) 

    GW2 relies on NCSofts other games to make up the difference much like GW did.

    Other games aren't doing so well.

    Not to mention that GW only made up approx 3% of NCSofts revenue since 2009. Wouldn't be surprised if GW gets shut down.

    I am guessing that since most of GW2 profit was realized the first week or so after launch that sales has dropped, and factor in the F2P crowd who say its the best game of the year but don't support it....they have to do something.

  • PyukPyuk Eugene, ORPosts: 691Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by DMKano

    The insider word on the street was that GW2 was underperforming, this pretty much confirms those rumors. 

    I hope all those affected land on their feet - layoffs during holiday season is just heartless.

    QFT on all fronts. Not a happy time at all.

    I make spreadsheets at work - I don't want to make them for the games I play.

  • botrytisbotrytis In Flux, MIPosts: 2,567Member
    Originally posted by Pyuk
    Originally posted by DMKano

    The insider word on the street was that GW2 was underperforming, this pretty much confirms those rumors. 

    I hope all those affected land on their feet - layoffs during holiday season is just heartless.

    QFT on all fronts. Not a happy time at all.

    As I said, data for proof otherwise it is just nonsense. I would say that for all the games. Just remember, GW2 was only released for Europe and NA markets - it isn't in Asia yet.

     

    Based on NCSoft 3rd quarter report - GW2 (one month report) was doing as well as B&S (3 months out with sub fee) so I don't know where your 'insider friend' is getting his data.

    image

    "In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
    by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evolver1972
    Originally posted by thetimes
    Originally posted by korvass

    Isn't NCSoft 'simply' the publisher of GW2? As far as I've seen from videos and interviews, the game is developed entirely by ArenaNet in their own offices.

    Given the evidence that I can see with my own eyes, there's nothing that says GW2 is underperforming.

    NCsoft is the owner and publisher of GW2. NCsoft west is Areanet. NCwest is the office to be "realigned."

    While NCSoft owns ArenaNet, NCWest is not ArenaNet, though ArenaNet may be a part of NCWest; I'm not sure about that.  ArenaNet's offices are located in Bellevue, NCWest is in Seattle.  Two totally different cities.

     

    Since GW2 is one of NCSoft's biggest money makers, I doubt there will be much "realignment" when it comes to ArenaNet.  This is more likely trimming the fat after shutting down CoH and selling Aion.

    NCSoft West isn't Arena.net.

    In fact a few years back (2008) NCSoft moved some people from Anet to NCSoft West, most notably Jeff Strain and Patrick Wyatt.which both left in 2009.

     

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • Gaia_HunterGaia_Hunter BristolPosts: 2,828Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by Loke666
    Originally posted by DMKano

    The insider word on the street was that GW2 was underperforming, this pretty much confirms those rumors. 

    I hope all those affected land on their feet - layoffs during holiday season is just heartless.

    GW2s goal was 3 million copies sold until 31st december (Source: NC soft prelaunch). We know that it sold out abou 2.2 million copies a few weeks after launch. It have sold some more copies since so it probably is somewhere near 2.3-2.6M copies right now.

    That is less than target number but X-mas season is up soon so it might sell more or less.

    But even if it "just" sold minimum copies there is no way that can be the real reason beyond massive layoffs, it still have minimum sold 75% of target numbers and unless someone in NC soft had the silly idea that everyone who bought the game would spend $100+ in the itemshop (which would be impressive even for a F2P game and totally unrealistic) there is no way that is a big enough disaster for NC soft to make massive layoffs.

    So lets think a second, is there some other NC soft games out that have underperformed far under expactations the last few years?

    Well, Aion comes to mind first but there are others as well. Korean (as well as Chinese) made games generally do bad in the west and other companies than NC soft have found out this the hard way as well. 

    But feel free to blame GW2 if it makes you feel better, personally I have wondered why they didnt do this before. GW2 is probably NC softs only game that is popular in the West at the moment. Aion didnt go F2P becuase NC soft wanted to be kind, it couldnt support P2P any longer.

    You are mistaken.

    That wasn't NCSoft or Arenanet goal.

    That was a market expert prediction.

    Currently playing: GW2
    Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders

  • evilastroevilastro EdinburghPosts: 4,270Member
    Originally posted by superniceguy

    GW1 will end up being in trouble before GW2.

    There is no point getting into GW1 at all now, for fear of a shut down, and just focus on GW2, but with this news, it does not add confidence but if it is true that COH was shut down to focus on GW2, then GW2 should be quite safe, unless their finaces worsen further, and into bankruptcy

    However, I am not touching a MMO or anything associated with NC Soft again, until they start to become more reasonable. They do business in an unreasonable manner, and it resulted in the closure of Tabula Rasa and Auto Assault, and now COH. They may have needed to close COH but they could have sold the IP to another company to take it over, and they did offer to sell it but it came with unreasonable demands.

    They wont be shutting down GW1 until they shut down GW2, due to the fact that they have linked the two games and the GW2 rewards are cross-promotional for people to go play GW1 to unlock them.

  • xmentyxmenty SingaporePosts: 679Member

    I am not sure what are you guys assuming about?

    Ncsoft and Nexon are looking to buy over a big gaming company.

    Read the news.

    Ncsoft and Nexon are clearing all the unwanted baggage, 

    before they go in cos they have to focus more on that new big company.

    By the end 2013 they will definitely buy / takeover that company.

    Maybe they will buy THQ.

    Pardon my English as it is not my 1st language :)

  • xAPOCxxAPOCx Vineland, NJPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by itstheclimax
    Originally posted by waynejr2
    Originally posted by DMKano

    The insider word on the street was that GW2 was underperforming, this pretty much confirms those rumors. 

    I hope all those affected land on their feet - layoffs during holiday season is just heartless.

     People were saying that when Paragon was closed and City of Heroes closing was announced.  Do we have any real facts regarding GW2 underperforming?

    none at all, but who needs it?

     

    in fact in spite of all the hate and hopes for failure aimed at Anet, the real fact of this situaton is that they are likely merging NCSoft West INTO ArenaNet...lol. 

    image

  • MyriaMyria Lowell, MAPosts: 570Member Uncommon
    Originally posted by evilastro

    They wont be shutting down GW1 until they shut down GW2, due to the fact that they have linked the two games and the GW2 rewards are cross-promotional for people to go play GW1 to unlock them.

    I doubt they'd shut down either, to be honest. If there was a buyer for Fallen Earth there'd sure the hell be a buyer for GW1/2 -- for the right price -- and at this point NCSoft needs money too much to ignore that. Mind you, I doubt anyone here would like the end result, but that's life.

    That having been said, watching the Anet Defense Force becoming more unhinged than usual (Who knew that was even possible?) is amusing, especially given that most of them had Bioware/EA going out of business and ToR shut down in shame over a hell of a lot less than this.

    NCSoft is in trouble, serious trouble, and has been for a while. This should come as a shock to no one that is paying attention the MMO Landscape. Anyone not expecting potentially major shake-ups with their properties -- and, make no mistake, Anet is their property -- is a fool. Does that mean GW1/2 are going under, to be sold tomorrow, or suddenly going to get a monthly fee? Probably not, but, even more so than with Funcom -- much more so, even though Funcom is probably in even more finacial trouble overall -- I would be ready for -- nay, outright expecting -- just about anything from NCSoft.

    They are not a company known for half measures or a fear of fan backlash.

  • TerranahTerranah Stockton, CAPosts: 3,605Member

    Well I hope nothing bad happens to GW2.  It's a fun game that I got a lot of enjoyment out of.  I'd be sad if it...died.

     

    And yes I have very creative toe nails.  Hehe

  • xAPOCxxAPOCx Vineland, NJPosts: 869Member
    Originally posted by xmenty

    I am not sure what are you guys assuming about?

    Ncsoft and Nexon are looking to buy over a big gaming company.

    Read the news.

    Ncsoft and Nexon are clearing all the unwanted baggage, 

    before they go in cos they have to focus more on that new big company.

    By the end 2013 they will definitely buy / takeover that company.

    Maybe they will buy THQ.

    Could that company be XLGames?

    Just playing conspiracy theory  =)

    image

  • FromHellFromHell NY, NYPosts: 1,311Member
    Originally posted by botrytis
    Originally posted by FromHell
    Originally posted by clumsytoes44
    Somehow this really does not surprise me.

    ^

    QFT

    GW2 is not performing too well with - well, zero monthly subs.

    And the cost for ads must have been horrendous.

    Where is the data that GW2 is not performing well or is it your own bias? So far, GW2 looks like it is doing fine. Also, A.Net is the devloper and NCSoft is the publisher - 2 different things. Aion is developed and published by NCSoft - there is your difference.

     

    So you are saying that if they had a monthly sub for GW2, NCSoft would be doing well? A very niave and narrow opinion - GW1 is still going and it has no sub.

    I'm not saying this. In fact I think GW2 would never work as a sub game.

    Fact is they don't earn a lot of steady money each month because there is no sub fee and player numbers are rather dwindling.

    The heavy cash shop focus might work for some, but I doubt the broad masses buy treasure chest keys and the other stuff they are selling.

    Secrets of Dragon?s Spine Trailer.. ! :D
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwT9cFVQCMw

    Best MMOs ever played: Ultima, EvE, SW Galaxies, Age of Conan, The Secret World
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2X_SbZCHpc&t=21s
    .


    .
    The Return of ELITE !
    image

  • FromHellFromHell NY, NYPosts: 1,311Member
    Originally posted by xmenty

    I am not sure what are you guys assuming about?

    Ncsoft and Nexon are looking to buy over a big gaming company.

    Read the news.

    Ncsoft and Nexon are clearing all the unwanted baggage, 

    before they go in cos they have to focus more on that new big company.

    By the end 2013 they will definitely buy / takeover that company.

    Maybe they will buy THQ.

    oh god I hope they buy some korean studio and not another US studio to further implement their businessmodels on the western market

     

    Secrets of Dragon?s Spine Trailer.. ! :D
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwT9cFVQCMw

    Best MMOs ever played: Ultima, EvE, SW Galaxies, Age of Conan, The Secret World
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2X_SbZCHpc&t=21s
    .


    .
    The Return of ELITE !
    image

  • botrytisbotrytis In Flux, MIPosts: 2,567Member
    Originally posted by FromHell
    Originally posted by botrytis
    Originally posted by FromHell
    Originally posted by clumsytoes44
    Somehow this really does not surprise me.

    ^

    QFT

    GW2 is not performing too well with - well, zero monthly subs.

    And the cost for ads must have been horrendous.

    Where is the data that GW2 is not performing well or is it your own bias? So far, GW2 looks like it is doing fine. Also, A.Net is the devloper and NCSoft is the publisher - 2 different things. Aion is developed and published by NCSoft - there is your difference.

     

    So you are saying that if they had a monthly sub for GW2, NCSoft would be doing well? A very niave and narrow opinion - GW1 is still going and it has no sub.

    I'm not saying this. In fact I think GW2 would never work as a sub game.

    Fact is they don't earn a lot of steady money each month because there is no sub fee and player numbers are rather dwindling.

    The heavy cash shop focus might work for some, but I doubt the broad masses buy treasure chest keys and the other stuff they are selling.

    Again - where are the numbers dwindling? Who's data? Please elaborate.

     

    Again CS is optional - please get that straight. A.net supported GW1, just by itself fine.

     

    Steady money coming in doesn't mean it is a good or will survive - look at SWTOR as an example of that (not saying it won't survive - but going F2P on a simple level means they are having problems).

    image

    "In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
    by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

  • kitaradkitarad RomePosts: 1,745Member Uncommon
    Would GW 2 have made more money with a sub ?

    image

  • WraithoneWraithone Salt Lake City, UTPosts: 3,593Member Uncommon

    Typical of NCsoft, if you know their past history.  Its not nearly enough to make a profit. That profit has to match up with the bean counters projections.  Oddly enough, the cuts usually tend to be in western properties...

    Thats why I really worry about WildStar. 

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